Author Topic: Labyrinth of Touhou 2 -13F  (Read 184245 times)

Hawk

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 2 -13F
« Reply #330 on: August 13, 2014, 03:16:01 AM »
The results screen doesn't reflect the bonuses, but you *do* get them.  This is easiest to see with money totals.

It's silly.

Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 2 -13F
« Reply #331 on: August 13, 2014, 03:31:10 AM »
Ah ha.. interesting, and confirmed.  I concur on the silliness factor.  Thanks for the info!

Veto

Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 2 -13F
« Reply #332 on: August 13, 2014, 10:21:05 PM »
I should get the 1.202 or 203 patch? i already got the game with the 1.100 patch, cant find english translation trought

Validon98

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 2 -13F
« Reply #333 on: August 13, 2014, 11:42:16 PM »
1.203 is the most recent version, and there is an English patch for it if you look through the translation thread over in Touhou Projects.
Derping at Touhou since June 2012, derping at RPing Touhou since Feburary 2013.

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 2 -13F
« Reply #334 on: August 14, 2014, 01:06:41 PM »
Okay, now that everything runs smoothy, what are the mechanics i should know in Labyrinth 2? Like any new debuffs or stuff changed? I cleared Labyrinth 1 and killed WINNER once

Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 2 -13F
« Reply #335 on: August 14, 2014, 03:11:50 PM »
Okay, now that everything runs smoothy, what are the mechanics i should know in Labyrinth 2? Like any new debuffs or stuff changed? I cleared Labyrinth 1 and killed WINNER once

There's a battle chain system, win battles in a row for rewards. new status ailments terror (lose mp per turn and die instantly when hit by the move terror eater), shock (current atb is halved then lose shock status), heavy (can't be form changed), silenced (no spells). there's a skill point system where each character gets their own set of skills which can be added to by tomes or stones of awakening. There's also a shop and crafting system so that you don't have to rely on just item drops and chests. there's also an achievements to go after for more good stuff. 
« Last Edit: August 14, 2014, 03:15:16 PM by Shivanic »

Garlyle

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 2 -13F
« Reply #336 on: August 14, 2014, 04:02:31 PM »
Okay, now that everything runs smoothy, what are the mechanics i should know in Labyrinth 2? Like any new debuffs or stuff changed? I cleared Labyrinth 1 and killed WINNER once
The big changes, aside from character specific tweaking/balancing (some characters are changed only a little for balance, some are changed a lot - don't assume every character is the exact same value/function as they were in LoT1)...

MP: Unlike LoT1, MP for casting spells grows extremely slowly.  Lategame LoT2, you won't be able to infinitely spam your high-cost spells the way you could in LoT1 - cost will matter throughout the entire game.  The good news is, the normal attack formula is at least passable now, and you can actually use it with several characters (of note, it will either use ATK or MAG depending on which is higher, and be Physical or Mystic element to match).  Still, you'll still have plenty of MP with regularly party switching/Concentrate too, and still be using spells 95% of the time.

Accuracy and Evasion: Unlike LoT1, Accuracy and Evasion are actual, functional things.  These stats do not change naturally with level - but a variety of passive skills and gear can enhance them.  Pump up evasion on squishy characters and the results can actually be quite surprising!  Similarly, be careful about neglecting accuracy - while it won't usually be an issue you don't want it completely neglected...

Game Overs: Getting Game Over'd in the dungeon is no longer a loss of time - you just get sent back to town.  If you were at a boss, you can even immediately retry.

Chain Bonuses: If you fight several battles in a row in one dungeon dive, your EXP, yen, and item drop rates will all increase slowly.  Going back to town (and I think running?) will reset these, however.

Skills: Every character has 3 points at level 1, and 1 point per level.  You can sink skill points into a variety of effects, with a variable cost/max per skill.  Every character has access to a small number of stat boosts via these skills, as well as some EXP enhancers.  Past that however, every character also has the ability to spend skill points to level their Spellcards (enhancing formulas, buff/debuff effects, ailment success rates, MP costs, sometimes even new effects, etc.), and a variety of character-specific passive abilities that help to make each character more unique (For instance, Marisa can invest to get stat boosts when Alice is in reserve, to get some affinity piercing, etc.).

Elements: There is precisely one true "non-elemental" skill in the entire game, and the character using it is post-game only.  There are two new elements as a result - Physical, which covers most generic physical attacks, and Dark, which several formerly Mystic skills were moved into (Mystic still remains as the "neutral magic" element).  These can be resisted as normal with affinities.  Not that elemental resistance is now indicated by the color of damage numbers - if it's turning blue, it's being resisted; if it's redder, it's a weakness.

Equipment: You now have a Main Equip slot in addition to the standard three equip slots.  The Main Equip slot is mostly used to influence MP, TP, or MP/HP Recovery rates - but you'll come across some later that add ailments to all attacks the character launches, or also directly modify the character's base stats in some way.  There is also actual money, instead of just SP, and a shop where you can buy equipment (or turn material drops from monsters into equipment/cash).  Also, a number of lategame gear have more 'eccentric' effects than just stat boosting now.

Permanent items: Unlike LoT1, there are a number of items you'll come across that can be used to permanently enhance characters - either adding skill points, enhancing base stats (with a limit per character), or unlocking new stat-boosting personal skills.  These come in limited quantities, but they're valueless if you're not using them, so spend them on characters you love.

Subclasses: Later in LoT2, you'll unlock Subclassing.  Every Stone of Awakening you find lets another character have a subclass at a time, so until postgame you can't have one on everyone in your party (though you can reassign who has them easily).  Subclasses slightly enhance a character's stats, but also give them access to new skills to invest in - both passives, and new generic-use Spellcards around a variety of roles (eg Enhancer gives passives that amplify the effects of buffs, cause healing on buffed targets, and gives spellcards for specific buff types)

Resetting: Unlike in LoT1, very little is permanent.  You can freely do a Skill Reset at the library now - this will reset all of the skill points you've spent on a character, and also remove their subclass.  You can also freely redistribute all the level up stat bonuses at any time you choose at the shrine.  Only the stat gems/unlock books mentioned previously are permanent, and there's an item (available in limited quantity) that can be used to reclaim those as well.

Boss Levels: Every boss has a level written on its symbol on the map.  If you successfully defeat that boss with a party whose average level is equal to or lower than the displayed value, you'll recieve extra items after the battle is over.  If your party is too high level, you can temporarily de-level your party at the Hakurei shrine.

Hard Mode: Available as an option at the start of the game.  Hard Mode just places two caps on your party: the first is that your individual stat levels at Voile cannot exceed [Level *1.2], and the second is that the above 'boss level' indicator is no longer a suggestion - your entire party must be at or below the level indicated, or you can't fight the boss.  This is removed after defeating the final boss anyway, and is completely optional, but a good way to test your skills.

Ailments: Ailments in general are resisted far more, but are often more potent and many characters have ways of getting around resistances now.  Of note...
*Poison damage on enemies seems to be proportional to the target's max HP, while poison on allies is determined in strength by what causes it.
*Silence can now be inflicted on enemies; it doesn't block spells but does reduce their Magic/Mind.
*Heavy (New) either prevents a character from being swapped around, or slightly reduces enemy stats (predominantly speed)
*Terror (New) temporarily increases spellcard MP costs, or slightly reduces enemy stats (and is used in a few character mechanics)
*Shock (New) is an 'instant' status effect.  Whenever it lands, the individual (enemy or ally) instantly loses half of their current ATB gauge

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« Last Edit: August 14, 2014, 04:45:46 PM by Garlyle »

Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 2 -13F
« Reply #337 on: August 14, 2014, 05:43:47 PM »
That reset thing sounds like the best feature to me so far besides the going to town/retry boss, saves alot of time and you cant actually mess up your build anymore, thanks for the detailed post and explanation.will try to pass F1 and see for myself now

Yookie

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 2 -13F
« Reply #338 on: August 14, 2014, 05:48:22 PM »
*Silence can now be inflicted on enemies; it doesn't block spells but does reduce their Magic/Mind.
*Heavy (New) either prevents a character from being swapped around, or slightly reduces enemy stats (predominantly speed)

Those two can be really important ailments to use against some bosses since Silence reduces Mind to the point that enemies that would be practically immune to magical attacks can be downed with them pretty easily.
Same goes for Heavy, which mostly reduces enemy Def. Don't know about Speed myself. Never noticed it, but that I wouldn't put it past myself to overlook such things.


*Terror (New) temporarily increases spellcard MP costs, or slightly reduces enemy stats (and is used in a few character mechanics)

Terror doesn't actually increase your Spellcard costs but instead drains 1 MP every time the afflicted character takes a turn.

And another thing about resetting characters with "Tomes of Reincarnation": In addition to refunding Books/Gems this also resets the Library Levels and gives you all the money back.

Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 2 -13F
« Reply #339 on: August 14, 2014, 06:51:52 PM »
I think terror reduces your Mp by 1/10 your max mp cause I seen it drain more then 1.

Garlyle

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 2 -13F
« Reply #340 on: August 14, 2014, 07:33:31 PM »
Right, my mistakes.

I think the only other thing I might have missed is that LoT2 status resistances are what they say they are.  Unlike in LoT1 where the actual resistance was actually like 3* the listed value.

A lot of equipment works on the same kind of listed values as in LoT1 though; along with there being 8 ailment types now, it's actually quite tricky to be completely status immune in LoT2, and characters with really high ailment resistances overall are remarkable for it.

notverycreative

  • The coldest chill,
  • in the emptiness of reason.
Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 2 -13F
« Reply #341 on: August 14, 2014, 08:09:04 PM »
Is there a way to play it fullscreen, or is manually-resizing it to the vertical size of your screen the best you can do?
I need an option, a reason, and some hope.

Serela

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 2 -13F
« Reply #342 on: August 15, 2014, 04:40:16 AM »
Quote
Same goes for Heavy, which mostly reduces enemy Def. Don't know about Speed myself. Never noticed it, but that I wouldn't put it past myself to overlook such things.
Heavy used to drastically decrease enemy def but it was apparently a glitch, I'm pretty sure they changed that in one of the patches
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Yookie

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 2 -13F
« Reply #343 on: August 15, 2014, 06:31:25 AM »
Heavy used to drastically decrease enemy def but it was apparently a glitch, I'm pretty sure they changed that in one of the patches

That's interesting and good to know. I'll look out for that on my next run. With Kanako in my team Heavy should occur often enough.
I guess I did fight Tenshi, who is the most prominent case that I remember to take only 0s without Heavy, on the Magical side last time.

RegalStar

  • Envoy of Balance
Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 2 -13F
« Reply #344 on: August 15, 2014, 10:33:53 AM »
Heavy still reduces defense in 1.203.

Garlyle

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 2 -13F
« Reply #345 on: August 15, 2014, 12:13:13 PM »
Given that the translation patch is nearing completion, I'm tempted to start running through the wiki and tuning up the translations to match the in-game stuff.  I'll wait until the translation patch is "done" though.

Might also be a good time to start revising character descriptions too, since I hear they're a little outdated (y'know, for the characters who even have them).  expect drafts

Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 2 -13F
« Reply #346 on: August 15, 2014, 12:54:43 PM »
Are these gems that increase base stats possible to refund? or they are a one time use? i could wait until i get my static party to use them. reached 2F

Validon98

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 2 -13F
« Reply #347 on: August 15, 2014, 01:48:30 PM »
They're only possibly to refund by using a Tome of Reincarnation on the character who you used them on, although Tomes of Reincarnation come in limited quantities across the game.
Derping at Touhou since June 2012, derping at RPing Touhou since Feburary 2013.

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 2 -13F
« Reply #348 on: August 15, 2014, 02:12:29 PM »
You can grind the final boss for more gems, but i don't think he drops all types of gems. Grinding the final boss 1 gem at a time is a pain thanks to the mandatory cutscenes along with the fact that he gives no exp or money. 
« Last Edit: August 15, 2014, 02:15:39 PM by Shivanic »

notverycreative

  • The coldest chill,
  • in the emptiness of reason.
Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 2 -13F
« Reply #349 on: August 15, 2014, 04:40:30 PM »
Can you eventually get an unlimited number of the skill-unlocking tomes? I'm only 13 characters into the game (I went and got Kasen as my 12th and Parsee as my 13th, so 3F) and I have no idea who my final party's going to be.
I need an option, a reason, and some hope.

Garlyle

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 2 -13F
« Reply #350 on: August 15, 2014, 04:56:15 PM »
Can you eventually get an unlimited number of the skill-unlocking tomes? I'm only 13 characters into the game (I went and got Kasen as my 12th and Parsee as my 13th, so 3F) and I have no idea who my final party's going to be.
I'm not sure.  I know you can farm the final boss infinitely and that drops certain of the reward items, but I'm not sure exactly which that includes.

Either way, to be honest, you probably won't be spending any of them until very late in the game anyway - until then there's already already-available skills you will probably be prioritizing for each character, and it'll take plenty of skill points just to get all of those.

notverycreative

  • The coldest chill,
  • in the emptiness of reason.
Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 2 -13F
« Reply #351 on: August 15, 2014, 05:47:02 PM »
I maxed-out Rinnosuke's item drop rate skill, put him on the frontlines, and it still took me 45 minutes and 60 battles to get another Great Tree Leaf to recruit Minoriko. That's got to be some kind of record.

Does spending money to increase your skills at Patchy's place affect your level-up growth at all?
I need an option, a reason, and some hope.

Hawk

  • Babababa~
Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 2 -13F
« Reply #352 on: August 15, 2014, 06:05:03 PM »
You can grind the final boss for more gems, but i don't think he drops all types of gems. Grinding the final boss 1 gem at a time is a pain thanks to the mandatory cutscenes along with the fact that he gives no exp or money.

He does drop all types of gems, and you can get 2 gems per run if you're at or below challenge level.

Can you eventually get an unlimited number of the skill-unlocking tomes? I'm only 13 characters into the game (I went and got Kasen as my 12th and Parsee as my 13th, so 3F) and I have no idea who my final party's going to be.

No, the skill-unlocking tomes are finite, however, if memory serves, you can refund those without a Tome of Reincarnation.

Does spending money to increase your skills at Patchy's place affect your level-up growth at all?

No.  Nothing effects your level-up growth.  Put another way, there is absolutely no way to screw up a character permanently in this game.
« Last Edit: August 15, 2014, 06:06:51 PM by Hawk »

Garlyle

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 2 -13F
« Reply #353 on: August 15, 2014, 06:15:10 PM »
I maxed-out Rinnosuke's item drop rate skill, put him on the frontlines, and it still took me 45 minutes and 60 battles to get another Great Tree Leaf to recruit Minoriko. That's got to be some kind of record.
There's actually a chest on 3F that has all of the Great Tree Leafs you need to recruit her.

Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 2 -13F
« Reply #354 on: August 15, 2014, 06:40:57 PM »
No, the skill-unlocking tomes are finite, however, if memory serves, you can refund those without a Tome of Reincarnation.

I think you need a tome of reincarnation to refund those too.

He does drop all types of gems, and you can get 2 gems per run if you're at or below challenge level.

It's probably faster to just mow him down when you're 50+ levels above the challenge level then trying for a "fair" fight at challenge level. It's still a pain to grind for them anyways.

notverycreative

  • The coldest chill,
  • in the emptiness of reason.
Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 2 -13F
« Reply #355 on: August 15, 2014, 06:54:50 PM »
Quote
Put another way, there is absolutely no way to screw up a character permanently in this game.
Can you build a character outside the box, though? The wiki says gems and the skill boosts affect your growth rate.
I need an option, a reason, and some hope.

Yookie

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 2 -13F
« Reply #356 on: August 15, 2014, 07:05:26 PM »
What's meant by that is that they affect the base-value of the stat. Let's say you equip someone with something that gives +12% Mind then that character gets a 12% increase in Mind of her Base Value, which is the amount before Library-levels and Equip.
The Gems and Stat-skills basically make Equipment/Library-levels more effective. (1 Library-Level is a 1% increase for said stat)

But the character won't end up with a higher value in Mind if you reset her to lvl1, increase her base-values and then put her back to maximum level.


That is at least what I gathered from my experience/testing.

Garlyle

  • I can't brain today
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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 2 -13F
« Reply #357 on: August 15, 2014, 07:17:44 PM »
To put it more plainly, gems do affect retroactively when used.  No need to use them immediately (Although, they're not doing anything if they're just sitting in your inventory)

There is room to build characters outside of the box in this game, yes - at least to some extent.  Mind you, while some characters are very much meant to be build-your-own-character (Rinnosuke), others have personal skills or stat distributions that really push them towards specific playstyles in the first place.

also, man, some of these postgame bosses are assholes.  I've gotten everything up to Knowledge Shadow done but haaa ha hahaha yeah "level 128 recommended" my ass let's not even get started on shredding bullshit
« Last Edit: August 15, 2014, 07:19:44 PM by Garlyle »

Yookie

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 2 -13F
« Reply #358 on: August 15, 2014, 07:47:14 PM »
Ignore the level recommendations.
I guess they set them with you building a very special party just against that boss.

Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 2 -13F
« Reply #359 on: August 15, 2014, 08:34:07 PM »
also, man, some of these postgame bosses are assholes.  I've gotten everything up to Knowledge Shadow done but haaa ha hahaha yeah "level 128 recommended" my ass let's not even get started on shredding bullshit

For knowledge's shadow, your aim is to not let it get two turns by abusing shock (so a front line of orin toxic, reisen magician, and two dark attackers of choice is your best bet). For shredding, build your characters for defense and dark affinity, since it's magic stat is crap. You can two-shot shredding if you run a front line of sanae, flandre, aya and yukari, but flandre needs to be really strong or be wearing genji glove for the 2x damage proc.

Sanae, flandre gambler, aya and yukari Strategist, team line up just kinda works on anything not resistant to fire, which includes 3 of the 4 extra area bosses.
« Last Edit: August 15, 2014, 08:55:54 PM by Shivanic »