Tic-Tac-Toe Mafia - GAME END

[Serela]

I think I should shut my dirty mouth because I can't make decisions this game.

I can always change my mind later though, so again, for the sake of hopefully having some kind of choice instead of outright "yeah zak's dead meat"

##Unvote ##Vote Raikaria

[WHMZakeri]

I think a Raikaria lynch is viable.

No thank you, saving me really isn't worth Raikaria since I think he has the better chance of convincing everyone to go after Dan tomorrow.

But if people do go down that route for some reason, then I'll take it over a NL (Which I don't think it going to happen with me at L-2.)

[ActionDan]

speaking of pressure, I don't think Dan actually answered my question about the difference between CF7's mind change and why he saw it as scummy compared to other players who have done the same type of mind change in shorter time spans.
That I'm having a real bad run this game, which to be honest I already am.
At this point I'm going to switch gears and ##Unvote: Sky Paladin
##Vote: ActionDan

I think I'm starting to agree with the fact that his vote and wagon start on CF7 was too forced. His only real reason for voting CF7 was the fact that he backed down on his vote on Dormio after Dan had encouraged him to make it, and Dan has shown in later posts that he was able to forgive blatant contradiction in peoples posts on account of them being allowed to change their minds. Basically he's forced out logic that he doesn't believe in to get CF7 lynched.

Comparing the contradictions of CF7 and Sky Paladin is comparing apples to oranges.  Sky stated that both Dormio and Serela were scummy with Serela being scummy for thinking Dormio was scummy (tunneling all game) which is the source of the contradiction.  I thought that apparent contradiction was acceptable.  CF7 dropped the Dormio vote arbitrarily after calling Dormio bad because Dormio got to L-1, and then called him town.  That I found unacceptable.  The time difference only strengthens the disparity because in 27 posts worth of content none were discussed inbetween CF7's change of opinion.

I didn't particularly expect anything more than this from Zak though.  it's obviously the only attempt at a cw he has.

[Polaris]

Can't Believe This Is Happening Again Vote Count:

ActionDan (2): Raikaria, Zakeri L-2
Raikaria (2): Dormio, Serela L-2
Zakeri (2): Dr Rawr, ActionDan L-2

Not Voting (1): Sky Paladin
With 7 alive, it takes 4 to lynch.

Like 2 hours left.

[ActionDan]

Actually he could have chosen to go Raikaria I suppose.  possible 3 votes there + maybe serela

[Sky_Paladin]

Zak, while what you are saying is music to my ears, you're actually responding to Dormio and myself, and not really establishing why you're voting for Dan. 

I don't blame Sky for voting me earlier, since two hours is kind of a long time to wait for a post.

Actually, it was more like 24 hours. 

I unvoted because you were at L-1, we had a lot of activity all of a sudden, and I didn't want a surprise hammer to drop. 

I feel like your surprise last minute appearance is more of a not me over me vote, which I can't support a lynch on Dan with at this stage. 

[ActionDan]

I sorta want to test to see if Zak immediately hammers if I were to vote Raikaria right now.  If I were Scum!Zak and Raikaria was town, I'd do it.

[Sky_Paladin]

Dormio, the case on Zak -

Dan's case
Rawr's case

I don't have a specific case.  I think he has poor interactions and is detached from the game and shown low effort.  I agreed with what Bard said on day 1.  Bard also hammered you and I in this same post, coincidentally. 

[ActionDan]

I'll be back approx. 1/2 hour to deadline

[WHMZakeri]

The Short of it is that I feel like Raikaria's case makes more sense, and that it's true that a majority of Dan's arguments against CF7 were just wagon urgings and a few points that look good but don't flow together. I don't see what the difference is that made CF7's mind change unacceptable when Sky's was. For the record, I think both of those shifts in thought were reasonable town reactions, and I feel like CF7's was more reasonable because it was a standard paranoia reaction to seeing a wagon grow so fast. Stating that logically it doesn't make sense doesn't work because human feeling doesn't always have to coincide with logic, and even if you did adhere to that, Sky's switch would be even worse because the logic was headbutting up against itself, rather than CF7's switch. I feel like Dan's decided it arbitrarily, and it was the only real point Dan had against CF7.

[Sky_Paladin]

I think we need claims from Zak and Dan.  Raikaria already claimed VT. 

Dormio, what do you think? 

I kind of feel that if I voted for anybody, Serela will just hammer them. 

[Serela]

Because clearly with several people townreading me I should just claim scum while in no danger of being lynched.

[Sky_Paladin]

I won't stop you if you want to go ahead :3  But I was referring to Zak and Dan, actually. 

[Serela]

That's not the part of your post I meant. ;_;

[WHMZakeri]

Vanilla Town.

I think Serela was referring to quickhammering, not roleclaiming.

[ActionDan]

I see no need to claim.  back in 15 min

[Serela]

So deadline is in 30 minutes, I think? We obviously are lynching -someone-, so, can we at least get them at l-1 so I can make sure someone is hammered?

[Serela]

I actually forgot I'm still voting, but Zakeri is most likely the one getting lynched anyway (and I'm not voting him atm), so w/e

[Sky_Paladin]

Alright.  Here's my dilemma. 

Let's look at this vote count again - day 1. 
23 hours out. 
ActionDan (1): Zakeri
Zakeri (1): Raikaria
Sky Paladin (1): NNR
Serela (2): Bardiche, Dormio
Dormio (3): ActionDan, CF7, Serela L-2
Bardiche (1): Sky Paladin

13 hours out. 
Dormio (4): ActionDan, CF7, Serela, Sky Paladin L-1
ActionDan (2): Zakeri, Raikaria
Serela (2): Bardiche, Dormio
Sky Paladin (1): NNR

6 hours out. 
Dormio (2): ActionDan, Serela
ActionDan (3): Zakeri, Raikaria, CF7
Serela (1): Dormio
Sky Paladin (1): NNR
Zakeri (1): Bardiche
NNR (1): Sky Paladin

2 hours out. 
ActionDan (3): Zakeri, Raikaria, CF7 L-2
Zakeri (1): Bardiche
Sky Paladin (1): NNR
NNR (2): Sky Paladin, ActionDan
Dormio (1): Serela
CF7 (1): Dormio

1 hour out. 
ActionDan (3): Zakeri, Raikaria, CF7 L-2
Zakeri (1): Bardiche
Sky Paladin (2): NNR, Serela
NNR (1): ActionDan
Dormio (1): Sky Paladin
CF7 (1): Dormio

40 minutes out. 
ActionDan (3): Zakeri, Raikaria, CF7 L-2
Sky Paladin (3): NNR, Serela, Bardiche L-2
CF7 (3): Dormio, ActionDan, Sky Paladin L-2

Day 1 end
CF7 (4): Dormio, ActionDan, Sky Paladin, Bardiche L-1
ActionDan (3): Zakeri, Raikaria, CF7 L-2
Sky Paladin (2): NNR, Serela

Now here we are. 

ActionDan (2): Raikaria, Zakeri L-2
Raikaria (2): Dormio, Serela L-2
Zakeri (2): Dr Rawr, ActionDan L-2

***

My thoughts are:
If Raikaria is scum, from my analysis earlier, his most likely buddy is Zak.  Those two have voted together for the whole game, except for a brief period where Zak was voting me. 
It also ruled out Raikaria as a consolidate option for Zak when he saw himself at L-1 today. 

If Dormio is scum, his most likely buddies are Dan or Serela, but Serela is not up for lynch, so he could easily have consolidated on to Zak or Dan by now without issue.  However, we can't rule out Serela as scum, because she has town cleared Dan and won't vote for Dan. 

If Dan was scum, his most likely buddies are Serela or Dormio, but those two are not up for lynch.  Therefore he could easily consolidate on to Raikaria or Zak, because I refuse to believe scum!Dan could be buddies with either of those two. 

If Rawr is scum I have no idea who his buddy is but since there are three people up for lynch and none of them are him, it's safe to say he could have consolidated on to Rai or Dan if the other one was his buddy. 

If I was scum, I would happily hop on to whichever of Zak or Rai was not my buddy, since a lynch of Dan is too difficult. 

I think that's everybody. 

Therefore, I'm leaning to a Zak lynch at this stage.  Dormio, you want to pull my stuff apart and come to another opinion?

[ActionDan]

The Short of it is that I feel like Raikaria's case makes more sense, and that it's true that a majority of Dan's arguments against CF7 were just wagon urgings and a few points that look good but don't flow together. I don't see what the difference is that made CF7's mind change unacceptable when Sky's was. For the record, I think both of those shifts in thought were reasonable town reactions, and I feel like CF7's was more reasonable because it was a standard paranoia reaction to seeing a wagon grow so fast. Stating that logically it doesn't make sense doesn't work because human feeling doesn't always have to coincide with logic, and even if you did adhere to that, Sky's switch would be even worse because the logic was headbutting up against itself, rather than CF7's switch. I feel like Dan's decided it arbitrarily, and it was the only real point Dan had against CF7.

Should I have voted Sky instead? I'll vote the guy with 2 posts demonstrating an arbitrary thought process based off of non-content narrative causality anyday.  I still think Sky's two points headbutting were okay both separately and together.  And no, CF7's reaction was by no means standard anymore than if I or anyone else saw a scumsuspect of theirs rise to L-1 and suddenly felt the need to declare them town, which is ludicrous.     

Re: deadline panic.  If I have to I'll switch to raikaria, which is okay too. 

[ActionDan]

Serela can I ask again who your preferred lynch is. 

or a rough ordering of your suspects etc.

[Sky_Paladin]

Whereas I do agree if Zak is scum Raikaria is probably scum, Zak hasn't flipped yet so I don't feel like jumping to the hasty conclusion and lynching Rai right now.  Out of the two, Rai's been trying much harder, and I've been townreading him all game.  I'd rather lynch Zak. 

##Zakeri

[Sky_Paladin]

sigh

##vote Zakeri

[WHMZakeri]

I already implied in an earlier post that voting Sky wasn't the answer to correcting the problem I have with your vote on CF7, it was not having such an arbitrary reasons as the only actual reason for your vote on CF7.

Can you at least explain to me how it's ludicrous to have that reaction and not just that it is?

[Polaris]

Vote Count:

ActionDan (2): Raikaria, Zakeri L-2
Raikaria (2): Dormio, Serela L-2
Zakeri (3): Dr Rawr, ActionDan, Sky Paladin L-1

Not Voting (0)
With 7 alive, it takes 4 to lynch.

13 minutes left!!!

[WHMZakeri]

Oh well, I feel like kicking myself for even considering this, but not me over me I guess.

##Unvote
##Vote: Raikaria

Sorry.

[ActionDan]

Would you ever immediately declare someone you previously suspected to be town just because they hit L-1 as a reason alone.  I wouldn't. 


cut.  wat.

[WHMZakeri]

If it was early day one and my reason for believing they were scum was a thing that happens in/just after rvs, then yes.

[WHMZakeri]

I'm still hoping that someone it listening to me besides the guy I'm arguing with, I really liked to switch back to Dan if I could.

[ActionDan]

I admit it's tempting to fulfill Raikaria's own prophesy of getting lynched.  before while gone.

cut: the reason had been expanded upon past RVS.