Author Topic: Urist Fortress Mafia - Night 3  (Read 94934 times)

DNAbc

  • mafia is suffering
  • but I don't exactly hate that
Re: Urist Fortress Mafia - Day 2
« Reply #720 on: January 16, 2014, 05:02:34 PM »
serela and since it doesnt seem like that you are gonna response soon heres some food for thought.

maybe you should imagine whats could be the best case scenario for town to understand the modding philosophy instead of dismissing everything because scum HAZ THE ROLES. serela.

a somewhat best case would be all three scums getting shot in the face. with vig. joat. and sk. which would mean instant gameover....oh shit

well it might seem like that conq can really be theorized as scum in this case.
>Link to my Steam Account: Add me! http://steamcommunity.com/id/9898981-02
--------------------------------------

DNAbc

  • mafia is suffering
  • but I don't exactly hate that
Re: Urist Fortress Mafia - Day 2
« Reply #721 on: January 16, 2014, 05:07:43 PM »
but anyway, i just dont like you diismissing the notion entirely because *its  possible*.

i personally did post in my scumread wall that i agree with that its possible for cheez to be jailer depending on scumflips
if anything i just thought that i want to hear more other than the *its possible* argument.

but really, can conq be scum? i might have to read through this whole thread again. because oh boy i just dont believe any mod would let instant gameover be a possibility.him suggesting strongwill also seemed obscene and out of the blue. give me some time to chew it over. gd night
>Link to my Steam Account: Add me! http://steamcommunity.com/id/9898981-02
--------------------------------------

Cheez8

  • Derp Imminent
Re: Urist Fortress Mafia - Day 2
« Reply #722 on: January 16, 2014, 05:35:32 PM »
So for the nail in the coffin. Cheez, you told us the reason you thought it was okay to not claim because you genuinely believed Jailer can tie in with Doctor.

As I have told you, it is a balantly impossible mindset which must not have occured. Because for it to happen you have to be entirely unaware of role balance, role interaction and such. Worse still, even those who do not fully grasp the precise logic  balance properly should have a sense of ''hey something is wrong with two unlimited protection roles i should claim to clarify things for us''.
Yes, this went through my head, but it was counteracted with "hey something is wrong with three roles that get to kill every night, there's a chance Darkie is telling the truth after all so maybe I shouldn't let scum know who else can protect people." And while I can't say I'm fully aware of role balance, I know enough about it to believe that two protective roles in a setup with 3 nightly kills plus extra is definitely not outside the realm of possibility.

I agree it is unlikely though! After all, if I was fully convinced you were a doctor, I wouldn't have voiced my suspicion of you,

Quote
But no, you demonstrated you have a keen awareness on how roleshen works (imo). And you not even asking nor claiming is unacceptable because you essentially confronted me without any material crumbing to a mindset of a conflicting protective role. Everything which relates to you being Jailer can only be seen in posts after your claim, I (personally) am incapable of seeing your posts through day 1 & 2 before your claim yield the perspective of you being conflicted in any way, shape or form, enlighten me if you can actually tell me why is that.

Oh, and who are you planning to target anyway?
I think you'll find that my discussion with SB at the bottom of Page 17/top of Page 18 would come from the mindset of a Jailer, at the very least. In fact, that was when he convinced me to counterclaim you. I wanted to make sure you had a claim that you would be forced to stick with though because 1) I could see you fibbing about the semantics of your role even as town, and 2) I thought that if you were a town doc, you'd have at least some sort of drawback to balance out the existence of a Jailer as well. I guess I thought you'd be back a lot sooner than you actually were though.

I don't know who I'm going to target yet because SB hasn't decided whether he wants to test my claim by shooting me or copping me. I'm fine with either, but if I don't have to jail him, I'll probably go for... Either Serela or Conq, I guess. Serela I trust as a townie and if he's a VT I won't be keeping anybody from helping. Conq I don't know whether to trust, but if he's telling the truth then I'll protect him without any loss, and if he's not then I'll end up roleblocking him (and hopefully not accidentally save him in the process.)
Someday, I'll have a clue what I'm doing.

Cheez8

  • Derp Imminent
Re: Urist Fortress Mafia - Day 2
« Reply #723 on: January 16, 2014, 05:41:57 PM »
I wanted to make sure you had a claim that you would be forced to stick with though because 1) I could see you fibbing about the semantics of your role even as town, and 2) I thought that if you were a town doc, you'd have at least some sort of drawback to balance out the existence of a Jailer as well.
What I mean by this is that I assumed you were either town lying about your role or scum lying more about your role, and wanted to know what your actual final claim would be while ensuring that you couldn't wriggle out of it. I'm surprised you stuck with full doc, honestly.
Someday, I'll have a clue what I'm doing.

Dorian White

  • The most handsome non-vampire diplomat you ever encountered ~
  • With a Gandalf like evolution.
Re: Urist Fortress Mafia - Day 2
« Reply #724 on: January 16, 2014, 06:02:33 PM »
Doctor > Bodyguard
I was pretty sure he was lying about self protecting so etc
Well, I got that much already. What I'm wondering about is the question, is a fancy last minute claim enough to go from ?I think he's lying scum? to ?100% trustworthy, must protect?? I mean didn't you claimed to have high standards when it comes to the use of a protection role?
And then you called him a liar again at the start of the day, just after the night where you decided that you were willing to die in his place. You even called him out for doing the same bloody thing, so once again, could you explain this?
Bella gerant alii, tu felix Gensokyo nube. Nam quae Mars aliis, dat tibi diva Venus.

DNAbc

  • mafia is suffering
  • but I don't exactly hate that
Re: Urist Fortress Mafia - Day 2
« Reply #725 on: January 16, 2014, 06:10:56 PM »
I can't sleep so I woke up, mashocism ho.

Anyway, Cheez, that's very articulate and convincing. And honestly speaking you have lifted much of my initial suspicion on how your logic  works.
Yet however that's not saying the concern of everyone shooting in n1 and claiming thereafter d2 resulting in setup gaming  should be something that slipped the mod's mind. As well as that the worst case scenario for scum could literally result in a instant endgame. So conq's role being a passive bpv have my suspicions on him spiking up like crazily. I still have rereading to do with the thread though! Anyway,  with this settled I can finally go to bed.

I urge everyone to seriously consider conqueror's affinity. Because given if the joat is not faking (sk is pretty much confirmed). There has to be something, preferably can be used blindly during night 1 that will at least ensure scum survival. But maybe its because its late around here so I can't think well, so correct me if I am misguide ty.

>Link to my Steam Account: Add me! http://steamcommunity.com/id/9898981-02
--------------------------------------

Dorian White

  • The most handsome non-vampire diplomat you ever encountered ~
  • With a Gandalf like evolution.
Re: Urist Fortress Mafia - Day 2
« Reply #726 on: January 16, 2014, 07:26:30 PM »
@Ninja: In case you missed this.
...
Disclaimer: This is the first mafia setup I have ever run. Balance cannot be assured. Especially as Prims didn't answer when I contacted him with my revised setup.
This should clearly tell us to be careful about any kind of rolespeculation.
But let us look for a moment to the opposed of your scenario, the worst case: All 5 possible night kills hit town in the first night, which leaves a 5/3/1 situation. Now add the scum doublevoter and two night kills night two, and you got a day two MyLo where town already lost it's vote majority.
Do you really call that balance?


Now a break for dinner and then will I see what I can get out of CF7s content.
Bella gerant alii, tu felix Gensokyo nube. Nam quae Mars aliis, dat tibi diva Venus.

CF7

  • Can you feel the LOVE tonight?
Re: Urist Fortress Mafia - Day 2
« Reply #727 on: January 16, 2014, 08:49:47 PM »
Spent whole day playing Dragon's Crown. Go me.
Also tbh, i really don't care at this point if i'm lynched or not. After all my "Awesome Ability"? is spent, and after today's day end i'm basically a VT.
##Unvote
##Vote Zakeri

Also i double-voted claimed doc, just to prove my point. It might be illogical, stupid, suicidal, you name it, i'm just fed up with Darkie's BS.
Sometimes rumors are just... rumors

Conqueror

  • Here I am, dirty and faceless
  • waiting to heed your instruction
Re: Urist Fortress Mafia - Day 2
« Reply #728 on: January 16, 2014, 08:54:56 PM »
darkninja, I stopped reading your posts after you switched confirmed scumteams like 5 times. Also, scum probably do have a bulletproof vest or protective ability in some capacity, but it's not me.

Shadoweh, the case on Zakeri isn't "roles." It's really minimal contribution in terms of reads, staying alongside the side of the main flow of the game, and then when asked to provide more, sticks to a rolecase that doesn't take into account any of Cheez's play. And as for his being the source of the missing kill, Utena mafia had a mafia extra kill even without a town vig and sk to "balance" it out.

CF7, that is incredibly unhelpful. What are you opinions on who is scum?


On tue un homme, on est un assassin. On tue des millions d'hommes, on est un conqu?rant. On les tue tous, on est un dieu.
Every saint has a past and every sinner a future.

Conqueror

  • Here I am, dirty and faceless
  • waiting to heed your instruction
Re: Urist Fortress Mafia - Day 2
« Reply #729 on: January 16, 2014, 08:56:50 PM »
doctor + jailer isn't an impossible combination. when I was a watcher in Path of Radiance mafia I had to deal with the possibility of a town tracker being the game and I kinda tiptoed my way around it. The way Cheez poked at darkninja's claim and suggested the possibility of a second doc (this was before massclaim was brought up) means I'm leaning towards his claim being more truthful than not.


On tue un homme, on est un assassin. On tue des millions d'hommes, on est un conqu?rant. On les tue tous, on est un dieu.
Every saint has a past and every sinner a future.

Conqueror

  • Here I am, dirty and faceless
  • waiting to heed your instruction
Re: Urist Fortress Mafia - Day 2
« Reply #730 on: January 16, 2014, 09:02:12 PM »
Also, when I suggested that SB use cop instead of vig, I didn't really mean for him to target Cheez since I don't think that would be productive (it proves very little and gives little info and Cheez is probably town?)

Also tbh, i really don't care at this point if i'm lynched or not. After all my "Awesome Ability"? is spent, and after today's day end i'm basically a VT.
##Unvote
##Vote Zakeri

Not caring about being lynched at this point where there's so much fuckery going around in this game is :psyduck:
If you are town please put some effort into the game.


On tue un homme, on est un assassin. On tue des millions d'hommes, on est un conqu?rant. On les tue tous, on est un dieu.
Every saint has a past and every sinner a future.

CF7

  • Can you feel the LOVE tonight?
Re: Urist Fortress Mafia - Day 2
« Reply #731 on: January 16, 2014, 09:02:35 PM »
CF7, that is incredibly unhelpful. What are you opinions on who is scum?
Maybe Zak, maybe Shadoweh, maybe Doriano. I'm not focused on the game enough after that burnout.
Sometimes rumors are just... rumors

CF7

  • Can you feel the LOVE tonight?
Re: Urist Fortress Mafia - Day 2
« Reply #732 on: January 16, 2014, 09:04:17 PM »
Plus Conq seems town enough. As is Cheez. SB and Oarfish are sort of null... ish.
Sometimes rumors are just... rumors

Conqueror

  • Here I am, dirty and faceless
  • waiting to heed your instruction
Re: Urist Fortress Mafia - Day 2
« Reply #733 on: January 16, 2014, 09:06:03 PM »
Also for everyone saying CF7 didn't react to Dormio's doublevoter claim...
It's my extra vote. It's also stuck on me for a while.
Okay. I'm a little confused. Can i see votecount atm. And
##unvote
for now. Need time to rethink all this.
Hm... Unlimited vig sounds op. Also we can lynch Dormio or DNA. Well, can go back to Dormio. Since i'm not convinced that his role is a town role.
Actually, screw it.
##Vote Dormio.
I'll be around the deadline. Also i still have some doubts.
##Unvote
##Vote Darkninjaabc


On tue un homme, on est un assassin. On tue des millions d'hommes, on est un conqu?rant. On les tue tous, on est un dieu.
Every saint has a past and every sinner a future.

SB

  • You are good people
  • Even Dormio
Re: Urist Fortress Mafia - Day 2
« Reply #734 on: January 16, 2014, 09:10:22 PM »
so i was gonna post something but then the massive walls demotivated me and i have homework i need to do

sigh

wasn't gonna cop cheez, there are way too many scummy people for that. no idea who I am gonna target atm. I'm fine with Zak/CF7 lynches happening so it'll likely be the other one of them.

Dorian White

  • The most handsome non-vampire diplomat you ever encountered ~
  • With a Gandalf like evolution.
Re: Urist Fortress Mafia - Day 2
« Reply #735 on: January 16, 2014, 09:41:57 PM »
Unimpressive content is unimpressive. Earnestly, is he always that brief?
I find his sudden turn on Serela and his stance SP questionable but he certainly reacted to Dormios claim by pushing him. I would be also quite interested how he came to the idea that Ninja and Conq could be scum together.

But no, that's nothing that I would vote over Zakeri at the moment.
Bella gerant alii, tu felix Gensokyo nube. Nam quae Mars aliis, dat tibi diva Venus.

Dorian White

  • The most handsome non-vampire diplomat you ever encountered ~
  • With a Gandalf like evolution.
Re: Urist Fortress Mafia - Day 2
« Reply #736 on: January 16, 2014, 09:58:30 PM »
By the way Conq, I think that this was actually his first reaction.
...
I should probably put it out there that I control the Fortress Populous vote.
Curious, actually thought about this possibility. Doesn't make you any less scummy tho, since it can be used by scum as a defensive tactic too.
Bella gerant alii, tu felix Gensokyo nube. Nam quae Mars aliis, dat tibi diva Venus.

Raikaria

  • Do Tank Girls Dream...
  • *
  • Of Floating Eyeballs?
Re: Urist Fortress Mafia - Day 2
« Reply #737 on: January 16, 2014, 10:01:41 PM »
Spent whole day playing Dragon's Crown. Go me.
Also tbh, i really don't care at this point if i'm lynched or not. After all my "Awesome Ability"? is spent, and after today's day end i'm basically a VT.
##Unvote
##Vote Zakeri

Also i double-voted claimed doc, just to prove my point. It might be illogical, stupid, suicidal, you name it, i'm just fed up with Darkie's BS.

THIS WAS THE HAMMER SHUT UP


Votecount of the Very slow Hammer

CF7 (4): SB; Darkninjaabc; Serela; Shadoweh
Zakeri (6): Conq; Cheez8; Dorian; Serela; CF7; CF7
Cheez8 (1): Zakeri

Not Voting (1): O4rfish

With 11 votes in play it takes 6 to lynch. 6 was reached.


http://www.malevole.com/mv/misc/tribute/
I don't even remember who put the above in my sig. [Wasn't me] Nor do I understand why I keep it here anymore.
Those two facts sum me up pretty well.

Raikaria

  • Do Tank Girls Dream...
  • *
  • Of Floating Eyeballs?
Re: Urist Fortress Mafia - Day 2
« Reply #738 on: January 16, 2014, 10:03:53 PM »
Zakeri was hung from a tree!

Zakeri; you are Urist Mc GreenSpearman: Goblin Spearman [Mafia One-Shot Ambusher]
You are not actually a Dwarf, but the Urists are too stupid to notice. You snuck into their military, and they gave you a spear! You?ll be sure to put it to good use... even if it looks a little flimsy. What do you expect of something made by the Urists?

Each night, you may use one of these actions:
##Kill: Perform the mafia nightkill. You cannot do this if some other member of the mafia is.
##Ambush: Lurk outside a target?s room for the night. If they leave their room, you?ll ambush them and kill them. Unfortunately, you?ll get found out if you ?volunteer? for patrol duty twice in such a short time, so this is a one-shot. Even the Urists are smart enough to notice something is up if you volunteer for patrol too often!

You win when your faction can control the lynch without outside assistance. Good luck!

It is now NIGHT 2. You have 24 hours to send commands. No mass activity check required this time.
« Last Edit: January 16, 2014, 10:06:26 PM by Raikaria »


http://www.malevole.com/mv/misc/tribute/
I don't even remember who put the above in my sig. [Wasn't me] Nor do I understand why I keep it here anymore.
Those two facts sum me up pretty well.

Raikaria

  • Do Tank Girls Dream...
  • *
  • Of Floating Eyeballs?
Re: Urist Fortress Mafia - Day 2
« Reply #739 on: January 17, 2014, 06:28:28 PM »
A reminder that there is only 3 and a half hours to send commands.


http://www.malevole.com/mv/misc/tribute/
I don't even remember who put the above in my sig. [Wasn't me] Nor do I understand why I keep it here anymore.
Those two facts sum me up pretty well.

Raikaria

  • Do Tank Girls Dream...
  • *
  • Of Floating Eyeballs?
Re: Urist Fortress Mafia - Day 2
« Reply #740 on: January 17, 2014, 08:38:33 PM »
An hour and a half until action deadlines. Actions sent after the deadline will not count [Although I will not be starting D3 until tomorrow morning if we hit deadline for timing purposes].


Deadline is deadline.


http://www.malevole.com/mv/misc/tribute/
I don't even remember who put the above in my sig. [Wasn't me] Nor do I understand why I keep it here anymore.
Those two facts sum me up pretty well.

Raikaria

  • Do Tank Girls Dream...
  • *
  • Of Floating Eyeballs?
Re: Urist Fortress Mafia - Day 2
« Reply #741 on: January 18, 2014, 12:03:04 AM »
The cause of the late result was the fact I was going out for a 1-day-late birthday meal [Weather was awful on my B/D].

Anyway; O4rfish bled out!

O4rfish; you are UristMcHunter ? Dwarf Tracker [Town Tracker]
You are UristMcHunter, and your skills lie in tracking and hunting prey to feed the other Urists. You work at night, and with the recent events, you?ve decided to keep track of your fellow Dwarves as well in case of betrayal. Every night, you may ##Track a target, and will be told of anyone who that person visits.


You win when all threats to town are eliminated! Good Luck!

It is now Day 3. You have 72 hours to vote.

With 8 alive; it takes 5 to lynch.

Deadline is here:
http://www.timeanddate.com/countdown/generic?iso=20140121T0002&p0=136&msg=End+of+Day+3&csz=1


http://www.malevole.com/mv/misc/tribute/
I don't even remember who put the above in my sig. [Wasn't me] Nor do I understand why I keep it here anymore.
Those two facts sum me up pretty well.

DNAbc

  • mafia is suffering
  • but I don't exactly hate that
Re: Urist Fortress Mafia - Day 3
« Reply #742 on: January 18, 2014, 12:41:29 AM »
who did you all protect
>Link to my Steam Account: Add me! http://steamcommunity.com/id/9898981-02
--------------------------------------

Dorian White

  • The most handsome non-vampire diplomat you ever encountered ~
  • With a Gandalf like evolution.
Re: Urist Fortress Mafia - Day 3
« Reply #743 on: January 18, 2014, 12:47:22 AM »
I guess that's what we all like to know from you, so who was it?
Bella gerant alii, tu felix Gensokyo nube. Nam quae Mars aliis, dat tibi diva Venus.

Cheez8

  • Derp Imminent
Re: Urist Fortress Mafia - Day 3
« Reply #744 on: January 18, 2014, 01:01:08 AM »
I chose to jail Conq.
Someday, I'll have a clue what I'm doing.

DNAbc

  • mafia is suffering
  • but I don't exactly hate that
Re: Urist Fortress Mafia - Day 3
« Reply #745 on: January 18, 2014, 01:10:05 AM »
sb
>Link to my Steam Account: Add me! http://steamcommunity.com/id/9898981-02
--------------------------------------

Conqueror

  • Here I am, dirty and faceless
  • waiting to heed your instruction
Re: Urist Fortress Mafia - Day 3
« Reply #746 on: January 18, 2014, 01:14:32 AM »
hmm. want sb to claim his result.

Quote
LYLO and MYLO will be announced. Potential will not be.
@mod, could you clarify what this means?


On tue un homme, on est un assassin. On tue des millions d'hommes, on est un conqu?rant. On les tue tous, on est un dieu.
Every saint has a past and every sinner a future.

BigBangMeteor

  • 60% of the time, I win every time
Re: Urist Fortress Mafia - Day 3
« Reply #747 on: January 18, 2014, 01:26:46 AM »
It means that if it's MYLO, we won't say whether a loss after a mislynch is guaranteed or only potential.

Raikaria

  • Do Tank Girls Dream...
  • *
  • Of Floating Eyeballs?
Re: Urist Fortress Mafia - Day 3
« Reply #748 on: January 18, 2014, 01:27:02 AM »
@mod, could you clarify what this means?

If it is certainly mylo/lylo it will be announced.

If there is a highly specific chain of events that can lead to a game end it will not be announced.

MYLO is only announced if mislynching will certainly lead to a town loss; yet it is not LYLO.


http://www.malevole.com/mv/misc/tribute/
I don't even remember who put the above in my sig. [Wasn't me] Nor do I understand why I keep it here anymore.
Those two facts sum me up pretty well.

Dorian White

  • The most handsome non-vampire diplomat you ever encountered ~
  • With a Gandalf like evolution.
Re: Urist Fortress Mafia - Day 3
« Reply #749 on: January 18, 2014, 02:03:36 AM »
Well, since I don't have a fancy night action to report is it now time for the big picture.

Serela: Town
SB: Null tendency Town (read tonight)*
Cheez8: Null tendency Town (read tonight)*
CF7: Null
Shadoweh: Scum
Darkninjablablabla... : Scum
NNR Dorian: Oh, that's me.
Conqueror: Town

Conq and Serela are clear enough, if someone has a different opinion then they are free to point out why but it should be a good reason.

SB and Cheez didn't do anything that stood out to me so far, * I intended to read them in the night but got distracted, so I'll do so as soon as I had some sleep.

O4rfish gets credit for the way he handled his role/claim but his presence may be thin but I like what I see so far. (not that it matters anymore)

CF7 was the counter wagon to scum and I still don't buy a scum doublevoter but his hammer was a thing that I would like him to explain and his content doesn?t fills me with confidence.

Ninja spend the better part of day two on his role/setup speculation. He took the claim scenario to guesswork is way to questionable conclusions which he then labeled as ?confirmed? to sell them as facts. I think the fact that he gave out the half game as confirmed anti-town that way speaks for itself. Maybe I'm really biased here but the only conclusions I can come up with is that he's either not town or I have not the slightest idea what he's doing.

Shadowehs words doesn't fit together acts as I already pointed out. She suspected Ninja for the better part of day one just to instantly believed his claim, went even that far and protected, and that only to turn around again calling him scum founded on the fact that his role apparently failed. I don't know about you but ?maybe the claimed doc got roleblocked? was a thought that crossed even my biased mind.
Her reason to vote CF7 over Zakeri is also questionable but maybe she can offer a more satisfying explanation than what she had so far.

So far, so good, any question?
Bella gerant alii, tu felix Gensokyo nube. Nam quae Mars aliis, dat tibi diva Venus.