Author Topic: Labyrinth of Touhou 2 -12F  (Read 219461 times)

Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 2 -12F
« Reply #690 on: May 17, 2014, 11:46:09 AM »
I did the 1m yen achievement after I am able to comfortably mash floor 20b mini-boss mooks (and also because I didn't had Super Kappa during the time).  Floor 19 is rather nasty to grind at due to those very speedy tops hitting your troops hard.  That and I got my first game-over when i got triple Ether-flared by those floating "eyeballs" of light.  Not even Komachi was left standing after that. 

Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 2 -12F
« Reply #691 on: May 17, 2014, 12:27:08 PM »
I'm pretty new at this game (just played a month ago) and I'm still confused with organizing stat of each members. Is there anyone who mind to give me a description for that (ex: What should I do for Reimu? Maximizing it's HP, MAG or SPD?)?

Serela

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 2 -12F
« Reply #692 on: May 17, 2014, 02:03:11 PM »
Characters who play more of a supporting role should concentrate on their defensive stat, either DEF or MND (since you can freely move your levelup bonuses, which one isn't too important) and eventually you might consider putting a few of the points into HP since the return might start looking good. At the start of the game you might want almost everyone to invest in MAG or ATK since you have limited party members and -need- offense, though. Keep in mind healing spells mostly use ATK+MAG combined, but a few (I think Reimu's and Minoriko's) only use MAG, so if you're not healing enough...

Late in the game, in random battles, you might decide there's no choice but to put a lot of levels in speed so enemies don't all go before you and destroy your party. I just hit 19f and the randoms are getting overwhelming.
<mauvecow> see this is how evil works in reality, it just wears you down with bureaucracy until you don't care anymore

ZXNova

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 2 -12F
« Reply #693 on: May 17, 2014, 04:21:12 PM »
I'm pretty new at this game (just played a month ago) and I'm still confused with organizing stat of each members. Is there anyone who mind to give me a description for that (ex: What should I do for Reimu? Maximizing it's HP, MAG or SPD?)?

Depending on the character, someone like Reimu should be investing most of her level bonus points into her HP, MND, and DEF, and the rest being in MAG/SPD.
Someone like Minoriko should probably invest more in SPD because Minoriko is quite fast, but of course you invest in your defensive stats first.

Lot2 is quite flexible with how you build a character, so you might wanna try out somethings. (Beware, you have a finite amount of Tome of Reincarnations in this game, so if you wanna test things you might not want to save, or at least create a second save file.) Of course you don't wanna try out some blatantly stupid things like Warrior Marisa, or Guardian Patchy (lol).

Also @ Serela, I thought all of Reimu's spells were composite.

Serela

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 2 -12F
« Reply #694 on: May 17, 2014, 06:16:09 PM »
(Beware, you have a finite amount of Tome of Reincarnations in this game, so if you wanna test things you might not want to save, or at least create a second save file.)

Also @ Serela, I thought all of Reimu's spells were composite.
Reimu's attacks are composite, but I think her heal might be magic-only. It'd probably be clear if I just READ IT'S DESCRIPTION but I'm lazy.

You can infinitely reassign skill points and levelup bonuses for free, so you can mess with builds. You can't reassign the special stat boost gems, training manuals, or library-bought levels without using a Tome of Reincarnation, but if you buy 10~20 library levels in stats early in the game the money lost is basically nothing later on anyway.

Keep in mind you can either make a character do damage, OR make it be a tank. You can make offense characters durable, and it's a good idea, but if you want to actually make them a tank/support then later in the game (which becomes necessary for characters whose job isn't attacking) this means they -will- deal 0~1 damage, so spreading out levelup bonuses all over the place isn't a good idea. It probably works alright early in the game, but.
<mauvecow> see this is how evil works in reality, it just wears you down with bureaucracy until you don't care anymore

Axel Ryman

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 2 -12F
« Reply #695 on: May 18, 2014, 01:44:44 AM »
Doing a bit more progress now. Grabbing some items, leveling up a bit, and gonna try to beat Iku now.



http://www.twitch.tv/axelryman/


Edit:

Finished. I didn't need to do much grinding at all actually, just get some more items I missed on Floor 7 and 8. Also fought the Wind Crystal for the Card Ruler of the Heavens so I can have more Wind Resistance. Wriggle was able to tank and survive nicely. Barely survived though when Iku started using her physical attack, but Poison helped secure the kill.

Made a return trip to 2F and 3F to kill the FOEs after, then went to 4 and 5 to fight the Serpents and Siren. Both are beatable before Iku I'm sure, and I think their drops may be good(Didn't get them though, may farm them in the future).
« Last Edit: May 18, 2014, 03:05:48 AM by Axel Ryman »

Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 2 -12F
« Reply #696 on: May 18, 2014, 02:57:32 AM »
Depending on the character, someone like Reimu should be investing most of her level bonus points into her HP, MND, and DEF, and the rest being in MAG/SPD.
Someone like Minoriko should probably invest more in SPD because Minoriko is quite fast, but of course you invest in your defensive stats first.

Lot2 is quite flexible with how you build a character, so you might wanna try out somethings. (Beware, you have a finite amount of Tome of Reincarnations in this game, so if you wanna test things you might not want to save, or at least create a second save file.) Of course you don't wanna try out some blatantly stupid things like Warrior Marisa, or Guardian Patchy (lol). .

I'm confused while organizing characters with mid-high stats (like Byakuren, she has versatile stats, but I don't know what to do) and also Support. :|
And just asking, is it possible for us to complete level of all skills for all characters? (Except if the character learn Tomes for other skills)

ZXNova

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 2 -12F
« Reply #697 on: May 18, 2014, 03:30:07 AM »
@ kiddo_san Those kind of characters, it's really up to you. I personally prefer her as a bulky offensive support, others may have her as a tanky support.

Also, by how much does resistances get lowered with Reisen's "intense vertigo"?

Serela

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 2 -12F
« Reply #698 on: May 18, 2014, 03:38:57 AM »
I'm confused while organizing characters with mid-high stats (like Byakuren, she has versatile stats, but I don't know what to do) and also Support. :|
And just asking, is it possible for us to complete level of all skills for all characters? (Except if the character learn Tomes for other skills)
Either pick to focus on her support or for using her as an attacker. If she's support, ignore her atk/mag stats (her passives to buff them are still useful due to her buff-copy moves)

What to do if you're going to use her as a bulky attacker is harder since she still enjoys her passable durability, but you need to at least heavily favor her ATK or MAG (only pick one! Even if she has a composite attack, her non-composite skills will be terrible if you don't mostly choose one or the other with levelup bonuses) if she's going to do enough damage to be worth using offensively.

Anyway, there is no level cap, so yes, eventually you can fully level all skills. I think the current postgame content ends somewhere around lv200, but I haven't done it myself, and the expansion will take things further. Still, I don't think anyone other than Rinnosuke and Byakuren can spend that many points if you tried.
<mauvecow> see this is how evil works in reality, it just wears you down with bureaucracy until you don't care anymore

Ghaleon

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 2 -12F
« Reply #699 on: May 18, 2014, 06:57:50 AM »
part of how you should spec your characters also depends on your other characters that you use too. For example, IMO there should be no doubt that you should spec remi for def/mnd if you have absolutely no tanky characters except maybe 1 single tank in your entire group...but if you have several like a tank, reimu, byakuren, kanako, etc...then there's not much need, so you may want to consider atk-remi instead.

jaxter0987

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 2 -12F
« Reply #700 on: May 18, 2014, 09:33:36 AM »
I'm confused while organizing characters with mid-high stats (like Byakuren, she has versatile stats, but I don't know what to do) and also Support. :|
It's based on how you want to balance your team, with healers, buffers, debuffers, tanks, and attackers. For one thing, you're definitely going to need a pure tank of some sort or multiple bulky characters to compensate for the lack of a tank. Some would argue that you need more bulk than that, but that's really up to the player's play style.

But following this, if the need for bulk, survivability, and buffing is already satisfied, then someone like Byakuren should probably be built like ZXNova's Byakuren (Bulky Offensive Support). This would let her deal damage as well as apply the myriad of debuffs and statuses that her offensive spells come with.

In case anyone's wondering, (I highly doubt people can't figure this out if they were actually wondering but anyway) in terms of survivability:
Tank > Tanky >= Bulky > Frail / Glass Cannon
(Tanky is greater than or equal to Bulky, since I'm sure some people use the terms interchangeably to mean the same thing).

I really have trouble describing my thought process on the fly, unless asked about a specific aspect of it, since most of this team stuff building comes naturally to me. I'll never say that my team or any team for that matter is the best, since it also largely depends on the player's play style.

There are some instances where a player's play style makes the game more difficult than it needs to be (like Ghaleon's policy of not swapping out his chosen 12 just for a specific boss fight) but that's their choice since they get more enjoyment out of the game for whatever reason (like getting more challenge for example). I myself don't like switching up my characters too much after deciding on a team of 12, unless I felt like a different character can accomplish the role I wanted better.

An example in my case would be me swapping out Satori, which I loved dearly for her spellcard copying, for Renko because at the point of the game I was in, Satori was not able to deal damage to a satisfactory amount. She was mostly just a second source of Reimu's Hakurei Barrier / Exorcising Border without the defensive stats Reimu had. Renko's buff however, was just as strong as Reimu's Hakurei Barrier defensively but it also buffed both ATK and MAG. This meant I could leave the group buffing to Renko while saving Reimu just for the group heal, which means I don't have to risk losing two characters when things get hairy and I need to heal.

I started with 5 Support / Tank characters and 7 Attacking characters and slowly transitioned into the team I have now which consists of 8 Support / Tank characters and 4 Attacking characters. This was due to the fact that I felt like I needed more and more survivability as I neared end game, so I added some bulkier characters / rearranged some from an attacking role to a supporting role as I went on.
And just asking, is it possible for us to complete level of all skills for all characters? (Except if the character learn Tomes for other skills)
Yes, you can max all skills for all characters. It just depends on the characters skill set as for when you can max everything. Some characters have more costly skills / more skills than others so the level at which they can have max everything differs. For example, Alice needs to be level 178 to max all her base skills without the use of Training Manuals.

(She was the one that was the easiest for me to count up since I basically maxed everything I wanted on her base skills. This is why I gave her Transcendent subclass [which needs 46 points to max] to make use of her excess skill points that I wasn't using.)

This is obviously quite far into the game so before you reach that point, you should be prioritizing the skills the mean the most to you. Outside of support characters, I generally never level up the character's spells until I've gotten all the passives that I want. I know that leveling up most attacking skills would increase damage output, but I don't know by how much, so I can't reasonably weigh how much leveling up that attacking skill is worth compared to leveling up a passive.


On a separate note, I like how two simple questions has me going off on tangents about various topics, some of which aren't even necessary in answering the OP's question.


Also on a separate note, I think the Palace of Earth Spirits Synergy group is highly awkward. None of the characters in the group are really suited to be built for staying power, so its hard trying to make use of their synergy passive.
« Last Edit: May 18, 2014, 10:21:55 AM by jaxter0987 »

Axel Ryman

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 2 -12F
« Reply #701 on: May 18, 2014, 10:49:08 AM »
Speaking of Synergy abilities, I'm trying to think if any would even be worth investing in. So far only ones I can make use of at the moment is Team 9 and Together with Mokou/Keine, and I don't use the partner characters for those.


I'm actually wondering if I'm ignoring some possible potential in my team as well...Hmm.

Serela

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 2 -12F
« Reply #702 on: May 18, 2014, 01:55:12 PM »
Speaking of Synergy abilities, I'm trying to think if any would even be worth investing in.
Most of them are good if you use at least 3 members involved in the team, although it's true that Earth Spirits is hard since none of them are exactly tanky. It's a flat bonus to your stats, so if you were at 100% buffs for example, a 16% bonus (most teams give 16% for one partner out) means you'd have 32% higher stats from your base; and that's really significant when it comes to defense and speed.

Team 9 is crazy but Wriggle is the only significantly durable member. If you get them out though, the sheer bonus size itself probably adds a lot to their survival. Cirno's self-buff isn't so useless after all.
<mauvecow> see this is how evil works in reality, it just wears you down with bureaucracy until you don't care anymore

Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 2 -12F
« Reply #703 on: May 18, 2014, 02:50:24 PM »
I've never been so confused before while playing a game :|
But thanks all for the advices!

I saw a pict in a thread about LoT2 which displayed the 6th page of Sub Equipment; is it true? I checked my game and wiki, and all said it's only 5 page for Sub Equipment :|

Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 2 -12F
« Reply #704 on: May 18, 2014, 03:51:12 PM »
Some other synergy team I notice is SDM with (Meiling, Remi, or Sakuya, with Patchy or Flan coming in for hit and run),  Sealing Club with (Renko and Maribel, both whom aren't slacking in survivability and Renko can almost be Komachi-like without the lacking of def/mind), and (Yakumo Family with Yukari and Ran with Chen's hit and run).

The main downside with synergy group is if one dies or is forced to switch out, the others are weakened.  Personally, I mostly invest in Synergy skill is if I notice I use said group more often.


Back to the subject.  One final thing you should note is subclasses complimenting or making up something that you are lacking.  For example, if you have a somewhat lack of heals in your group and you have someone Remi or Komachi on the field, you can opt to make them a healer subclass as even when built defensively, they still have pretty good attack with some investment so they can keep someone, most likely themselves, in good shape.  On the flipside, Hong Meiling, as a tank, can be defender to strengthen her ability as a tank by making her more durable as well as draw aggro from the enemies.

It's a lot to take in so may want to start simple first and have your attackers do damage with some HP, your support going full survivability and your glass cannnons go all damage (you should switch them out before the enemy gets a turn).

And yeah there is a 6th page sub-equipment but the items are untranslated.

Thata no Guykoro

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 2 -12F
« Reply #705 on: May 18, 2014, 04:56:19 PM »
The 6th page of sub-equipment only shows up after you beat the final boss, it's all postgame-level equipment.

ZXNova

  • Life is an explosion!
Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 2 -12F
« Reply #706 on: May 18, 2014, 05:24:18 PM »
I really have a thing for bulky attacks, so the way I built my Meiling is as a tanky attacker healer thingy. Cause her heals scale with her attack, you can invest a lot more into her attack while also investing a bit in her defenses. Then when you get buffs on her, then she becomes a fairly decent attacker, especially with Warrior subclass. I invested a lot in Meiling and made her really good.

Also, imo, of all the teams with synergy passives, the most viable one is probably the Yakumo Family/Eientei/Moriya Crew. Three people, one of them is really tanky, and has a lot of potential. Yakumo Family more so than Eientei/Moriya Crew imo. Some synergy passives don't make much sense to me like the Iku+Tenshi one. Really, shouldn't the buffs received be switched around? The Mokou+Keine passive makes sense I guess. Finally, the SDM passive seems a bit hard to work around, but seems overall doable. (You may have to make Remi more tanky)

Yookie

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 2 -12F
« Reply #707 on: May 18, 2014, 06:09:30 PM »
Out of all the Synergy groups the Yakumo Family is unarguably the strongest. They not only have their Synergy Skill like the other groups but Ran and Chen have specific Synergy with Ran being capable of buffing Chen to almost maximum by concentrating once and Yukari's "Shikigami Ran Yakumo+" becoming ridiculously strong if all three are on the field.
All of this stacks and makes them able to wreck any boss prior to post game that doesn't heavily resist physical in a few turns once you've got the setup (and maybe Yuugi with her increasing general physical damage dealt).
In LoT1 most made Yukari rather tanky/bulky with her providing the turn-manipulation support and that mindset seemed to have carried over to LoT2 (at least until it got heavily nerfed) but her offense is nothing to laugh at and she doesn't even become too frail while taking heavy chunks out of bosses and providing good trash clear.

The other ones are nice and can work but do not offer any further synergy apart from the standard skill.

Serela

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 2 -12F
« Reply #708 on: May 18, 2014, 06:33:16 PM »
Uuurrgggghhhh. Going from 19f to 20f is a difficult transition. If you die on 20f, you have to redo all the switches on 19f to manage to get back there... and the relay points on 20f are really far away, and the randoms are scary, plus if a Truth-Seeing Eye appears you just game overed, no questions asked.

Whyyyyy.

There's also the part where, even though I only have the other half of 20f left to explore, I'm 10~15 levels below the challenge level for the boss. Ouch. I'm not leveling up particularly fast and it'll only get slower.
« Last Edit: May 18, 2014, 06:35:27 PM by Serela »
<mauvecow> see this is how evil works in reality, it just wears you down with bureaucracy until you don't care anymore

DA

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 2 -12F
« Reply #709 on: May 18, 2014, 06:42:27 PM »
Uuurrgggghhhh. Going from 19f to 20f is a difficult transition. If you die on 20f, you have to redo all the switches on 19f to manage to get back there... and the relay points on 20f are really far away, and the randoms are scary, plus if a Truth-Seeing Eye appears you just game overed, no questions asked.

Whyyyyy.

There's also the part where, even though I only have the other half of 20f left to explore, I'm 10~15 levels below the challenge level for the boss. Ouch. I'm not leveling up particularly fast and it'll only get slower.

Look this is what I did. I got chen and aya and use them as to run away till I got to both check points at floor 20. like dont have both out at the same time but use aya first for currentied runs and Chen needs to be fast and and as evasive as possible. This is all I can say to make things a little bit easier now if you excuse me I'm gonna look and laugh at my old save data for the amount of grinding I did to get past 249 for everyone.

Edit: btw put alot tp on them but that is probably a given.
« Last Edit: May 18, 2014, 06:46:53 PM by PrinnyAce »

ZXNova

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 2 -12F
« Reply #710 on: May 19, 2014, 01:32:13 AM »
I did a similar thing to Prinny, except by that time I had invested a lot of gold into Eiki/Byakuren, and could OHKO the Ether Flare eye thingy. So I basically had no fear at that point (though those speed drills were really annoying).

Serela

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 2 -12F
« Reply #711 on: May 19, 2014, 03:33:42 AM »
I ended up just clearing it out the normal way (Nitori+Kasen's nature alltargets with a buff from Enhancer Sakuya cleared out most randoms, guardians of heaven are an insta-run though) and now the only irritating part is grinding up like 15 levels. I haven't done grinding in this game until now! I did 5 of them and figured I'd do more later.
<mauvecow> see this is how evil works in reality, it just wears you down with bureaucracy until you don't care anymore

jaxter0987

  • Umiiro Shoujo ni Miserarete
  • Umi is love, Umi is life
Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 2 -12F
« Reply #712 on: May 19, 2014, 05:43:59 AM »
Recently beat the Strengthen Boss Rush. I'm still pissed that I had to throw away 3 characters due to Strengthen Memorized Knowledge, but what I was more pissed about (and completely forgot about) was how annoying the Strengthen Mirror and Strengthen Magatama are. The Mirror was especially annoying, as it managed to take out most of my team. At one point, I was left with just Byakuren, Minoriko, Renko and Marisa, and was forced to charge up Master Sparks to deal any sort of damage. Due to a mistake, Byakuren got knocked out in the midst of the Master Spark charging and I seriously thought I was going to have to redo the entire boss rush, but somehow, Renko was able to tank well enough in her place. Tried the Strengthen Final Boss. Once I lost Komachi to a Black Universe > Some other attack, I was just desperately struggling against the inevitable. I lacked my dedicated tank and one by one, everyone just got whittled down by the max HP attack.
« Last Edit: May 19, 2014, 09:00:38 AM by jaxter0987 »

Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 2 -12F
« Reply #713 on: May 19, 2014, 07:22:57 AM »
OK 14f post disk boss isn't too bad as it is
Spoiler:
mostly a damage race before that thing kills off all of your members one by one with an attack that will kill anyone guarantee (6 digit dark damage and can DEATH Yuyuko herself). 
  However, floor 16 I did not expect to end up fighting
Spoiler:
Culex
of all people.

Ghaleon

  • Long twintail-o-holic
Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 2 -12F
« Reply #714 on: May 19, 2014, 09:33:44 AM »
Yeah, this 19f trash when I haven't spent a skillpoint for 5 floors is purdy brutal....hearing that reaching 20f wont be safe is scary. qq.

Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 2 -12F
« Reply #715 on: May 19, 2014, 05:37:53 PM »
I have a question.


The bottom item allows the user to deal 20% more damage and take 20% less damage.  Would maintenance double that to 40%?  Also would Transcendant stack additively or diminishingly?

ZXNova

  • Life is an explosion!
Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 2 -12F
« Reply #716 on: May 19, 2014, 09:54:37 PM »
I have a question.


The bottom item allows the user to deal 20% more damage and take 20% less damage.  Would maintenance double that to 40%?  Also would Transcendant stack additively or diminishingly?

The item is called Crystal Charm, and yes, I believe that would be the case.

EDIT

I notice that Yuugi gets a huge damage buff from just gaining 10% more atk. So I use knock out in 3 steps on semi-foe tree with 12% bonus atk, does 83000~ damage. Next turn, she has 21% atk, does knock out in three steps again, now it's dealing 150000 damage. Geez Yuugi, blow stuff up much. So I'm guessing buffs would really benefit her then, huh.
« Last Edit: May 20, 2014, 12:13:25 AM by ZXNova »

Trickster-kun

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Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 2 -12F
« Reply #717 on: May 20, 2014, 01:48:55 AM »
Finally got around starting Labyrinth 2~ Thank you for all the translation notes! I hope the project finishes all the way, like Labyrinth 1.  :3

I started blind for a while to see how far I could get... only to get destroyed by the first FOE.  :ohdear:
~Yesterday was all I had. Today is all I have. Tomorrow is all I want.~

ZXNova

  • Life is an explosion!
Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 2 -12F
« Reply #718 on: May 20, 2014, 03:02:55 AM »
Welcome to the land of Lot2. Where FOEs are scary mofos who make you cringe in your bed at night, and every enemy has a physical attack to kill your mages. Please enjoy your stay.

Re: Labyrinth of Touhou 2 -12F
« Reply #719 on: May 20, 2014, 04:26:31 AM »
Does anyone else utilize tactics that involve super-charging one character (ex. Nitori, Yuuka, Yukari, Aya) that their actions are a large contribution to your victories?