Author Topic: Genius of Sappherios Zansyo/Weekend  (Read 158037 times)

Serela

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Re: Genius of Sappherios Zansyo/Weekend
« Reply #150 on: September 12, 2012, 07:39:34 PM »
Oh, when I was mentioning Satori, I meant in general, not specifically on those battle; however, Satori can also regen large amounts of MP if you give her an high Patk staff and use certain melee attacks to abuse the drain. And it works right alongside her magic skills too, if you can manage any spare turns to do it with.
<mauvecow> see this is how evil works in reality, it just wears you down with bureaucracy until you don't care anymore

Re: Genius of Sappherios Zansyo/Weekend
« Reply #151 on: September 12, 2012, 08:50:26 PM »
In the end I used Byakuren instead of Satori because I needed that extra 50% divine barrier from her weapon. I'll switch to Satori if Byakuren runs out of MP, which I see happening as she only regains 2 each turn, so unless I can safely skip turns forever, I won't be able to refill her. I doubt I'll see weak enough monster for that in later levels, but it was possible against that reflect barrier casting lion because ti runs out of MP fast.
Done with the first 2 areas, Sakuya is now out of the party due to having no MP gain whatsoever and out of MP. She was also the most fragile in the party due to no barrier or resistance from Plv. I will use Lithos in her place from now on. If she manages to petrify a monster, free max MP for everyone, so I'll try the weapon that can petrify on a normal attack....is what I wanted to do but it's gone, it was used up for making the other weapon :(
I have the materials to make it again, but I can't exactly go to the shop without risking a respawn, can I?

(I'm doing it on easy, by the way. I might try normal later when I already have the all star resist equipment from the chest, but until then, no way.)
« Last Edit: September 12, 2012, 08:53:02 PM by Seravy »

Re: Genius of Sappherios Zansyo/Weekend
« Reply #152 on: September 12, 2012, 11:09:44 PM »
Sanae's poison isn't that strong, if I remember correctly it did 600 last time it worked, when monsters have 10k+ and may kill you in 2-3 turns...
I believe the poison effect on her ultimate weapon is outright amazing, I've seen a video of it being used in the expansion final boss and it dealt 1400 damage on the first turn (!!), which then increased all the way up to 4000 (!!!!) for some reason after three turns. Or something like that.

Re: Genius of Sappherios Zansyo/Weekend
« Reply #153 on: September 13, 2012, 03:46:35 AM »
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I have a question. How much does IND affect buffs? Is it worth wearing IND accessories on Byakuren, will it make any big difference? Because I didn't really notice much of a change when I didn't equip them even though it was like 200 IND.

Yeah, IND affects buff duration and power. You should be able to see a difference on Byakuren's buff if your IND is low and high. Other buffs that do that affected by IND, but you may miss, because it may not feel like a buff are Youmu's stances and Mokou's Regen/Block 1 fatal attack skill.
I do not know if Yuugi's Last Word is affected by IND, but I would assume so, since it is a buff.

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I believe the poison effect on her ultimate weapon is outright amazing, I've seen a video of it being used in the expansion final boss and it dealt 1400 damage on the first turn (!!), which then increased all the way up to 4000 (!!!!) for some reason after three turns. Or something like that.

How'd Sanae's weapon do so much poison damage? I know it starts at 800 and is unaffected by IND. So, I guess they stacked all +% poison damage items? I did not remember the poison damage going up though. Oh and Sanae's poison lasts forever. So, it will be a good constant source of damage if you plan a battle of attrition.

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Sakuya is now out of the party due to having no MP gain whatsoever and out of MP.

Swap to daggers to recover MP. The Messe Dagger and the Orichalcum dagger can recover MP. Sakuya's damage should be high enough for you to net gain MP fairly fast, unless the enemy you are fighting has really high defense.

Re: Genius of Sappherios Zansyo/Weekend
« Reply #154 on: September 13, 2012, 03:56:36 AM »
Successfully completed the bonus dungeon on the first try. The only downside is that it's already tomorrow morning.
I had all the best character armors and weapons (except the useless ones), and every equipment worthy of use. All characters on 99 except for the most useless ones but even those at 90+. With this, and playing on EASY MODE, completing the dungeon only took
-9 hours of time
-Pretty much every resource on every character except about 3-4 I didn't use.
This is how they each worked out (or not)
Reimu : At the end, down to near 0 MP (she can drain MP when attacking with her gohei so she can't really run out), and 1 bomb. She was one of the most useful members, did good damage, healing and never ran out of MP, although she had to normal attack a lot to refill it.
Lithos : At the end, down to exactly 0 MP. Her natural Divine Barrier was very useful and she was ok for attacking with Kusanagi, but she has absolutely no way to refill MP, so eventually she is down to using normal attacks or has to be replaced.
Nitori: Down to 2 lives, 0 bombs and 8 MP. I used her in the front lines most of the time. She regains 2 MP each turn so it's easy to keep her on max in the first half of the dungeon by passing turns. She was surprisingly durable with 90% divine barrier, I used her most of the time and she had remaining lives at the end. She did nice damage with Rage Eight and elements/slayer.
Byakuren : 0 Lives with 300+ MP remaining. The 2 MP regen each turn is not much but you don't need to spend too much for buffing and can pass a lot. She was quite useful.
Marisa : 0 Lives, 0 Bombs and 78 MP at the end, probably the most useful character in here. Hard to keep her alive, but she does a lot of damage for very low MP costs and gains back MP really fast. Hakkero is really nice here, too. You'll run out of lives before MP so don't hesitate to spend more when she is down to 1-2 lives.
Mokou : 0 Bombs. I used her as a commander and she had 20 bombs at the beginning. Resurrection is always good.
Sakuya : Switched her out around floor 3 when she ran out of MP. She can't recover it and her ability to stop time is pretty much a must have for the last floor if you don't want to skip monsters, so don't use her until then if possible. I guess I should have used the daggers, but forgot she can use them. Never used anything except a 2H sword on her.
Reisen : I used her near the end only, she has a surprisingly high amount of bombs, so if you need to replace a party member with another damage source, she is good. She can do nice damage, too. She was down to 1 MP but still had 7 bombs when I finished.
Youmu : I didn't use her, so I can't say much about her usefulness.
Aya : Didn't use her either. I didn't need to kill the Yukkuris as I had max level already. I think she is useful for the first 4-5 floors at most, after that, all the enemies are minibosses with far too much hp, so it doesn't matter there who gets the first turn.
Alice : Also didn't use her. I wanted as much damage sources as possible to save time. Using her would have made survival easier but slower damage*9 hours to complete without her = I saved several hours, at least. I think she can't recover MP either.
Cirno : I only used her in the last few battles when I ran out of better characters and she was useless. Didn't have enough protection to keep her alive either, and she did uninteresting amounts of damage.
Satori : Down to 0 lives and 0 bombs. She had 111 MP remaining. I used her in the first two Seraphim battles, to learn Punish the Judgement and to turn the land element away from light to disable Seraph's regen, and after that mainly to use PTJ to be able to kill faster.
Remilia : Another character I used near the end only. Unlike Cirno, Remilia did some really nice damage while her bombs lasted, but she ran out quickly.
Sanae : Only used her on the last level when I no longer had Byakuren to buff nor any other character I could use in the back row as a replacement magic attacker. She wasn't as good as Reimu but still quite useful. She still had bombs, MP and lives remaining at the end.
Patchouli : I used her on the last floor mostly. 0 bombs and 11 MP at the end but she had 6 lives so I could make some more MP by reading if I wanted to.
Yuugi :  I didn't use her. She has low MP and Bombs, so I don't think you can use her for a long amount of time effectively.

About the areas. First five was not too dangerous, a few random minibosses and some dangerous groups of normal monsters, but most of the time it was possible to find a battle where I could refill my MP. The 6th area has the minibosses from Stage 21 paired up in groups of 2. Some of these weren't too dangerous, but others were a lot more so. Have some light damage ready against the snake, it likes to spam death and untankable 10k+ damage attacks. 7th floor has the bosses from stage 27 and the first one is always the Seraph. Some of these are weak enough to pass or refill MP by normal attacking, but others are very dangerous.  It's best to clean this floor because if you don't, and have to come through it again, then you have to kill another seraph, and those take a long time. The last floor has the demon and elder dragon you know from the 8 star quests although with different names. These are very hard to kill even if you are prepared to fight them and have all your MP and bombs on max, so reset if you encounter them, unless you actually have all characters necessary to beat them (Sakuya for Quicktime, Reimu fro major light damage, Aya to make sure Quicktime goes off when it needs to, etc). Although the demons seems to appear regularly, it's somewhat random, so you can empty the room eventually by letting the yukkuris run away and killing the less dangerous enemies.
That's all, and there is no way I'll ever do this again, especially not on normal, that's for sure.
Good look for everyone else who attempts it, now I'm going to finally get some sleep.

Re: Genius of Sappherios Zansyo/Weekend
« Reply #155 on: September 13, 2012, 04:59:08 AM »
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Marisa : 0 Lives, 0 Bombs and 78 MP at the end, probably the most useful character in here. Hard to keep her alive, but she does a lot of damage for very low MP costs and gains back MP really fast. Hakkero is really nice here, too. You'll run out of lives before MP so don't hesitate to spend more when she is down to 1-2 lives.

This is kind of weird. How is Marisa outdamaging your melee characters? Even with her best non-bomb spell, she does about the same damage as Remilia(Scarlet Spear the Gungnir), Yuugi(Galaxy), or Sakuya's(Nouvelle Ice Sword) regular attack, assuming you have end game gear. If you are willing to switch to daggers, Sakuya's damage should easily trump Marisa's bombs, except maybe Triple Spark with max Master Spark tree.

I am also not sure how Nitori is doing such good damage compared to the real damagers. I have Shade2010 and her damage is not very good, even if I am hitting slayer. Remilia, Yuugi, and Sakuya all hit very hard and should not need to use bombs or mana. Youmu has Death effect, but I don't know how many enemies you can tag with it at the bonus dungeon. Her stance + skill is fairly cheap though, so you can use it for quite a while.

Hanzo K.

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Re: Genius of Sappherios Zansyo/Weekend
« Reply #156 on: September 13, 2012, 05:04:29 AM »
Personally, I don't get how Sakuya's good DPS with daggers.
Am I not skilling her growths right? Or am I just not giving her the right dagger?
If it helps, I've just cleared the Garden of The Sun's first visit, and I've used all the Special Item Codes.
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Re: Genius of Sappherios Zansyo/Weekend
« Reply #157 on: September 13, 2012, 05:25:17 AM »
Her DPS with daggers suck. The only reason to use it is to get mana back. With the Sacred Akiba Cherry Blossom or Orichalcum dagger, you can spam her 1 to 4 hit skill all day long without losing mana. The damage is decent, about 1k x 1 to 4, so it isn't like it is bad. This is near end main game and post game items, so you won't be using daggers anytime soon with Sakuya. For reference, those daggers are 123 and 118 power respectively.

Hanzo K.

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Re: Genius of Sappherios Zansyo/Weekend
« Reply #158 on: September 13, 2012, 05:27:43 AM »
Well, that makes sense. And here I was worried I was doing something wrong.
Guess sticking with 2H is the best bet for a long while.
Essence RO
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Re: Genius of Sappherios Zansyo/Weekend
« Reply #159 on: September 13, 2012, 09:08:35 AM »
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This is kind of weird. How is Marisa outdamaging your melee characters?
Maxed out laser and power tree, 30% master spark damage from broom, 10% MYS damage from armor. Quickened master spark and final laser will do really good damage. Oh, I was using Hyper Library as I usually do, that might be part of it. There are 3 MATK up slots in that but no ATK up, is area heal friendly, so it works well with Reimu at center, Marisa and Byakuren/Patchouli/Satori in the back.
The important part is she can get MP back fast enough so you can reliably use these spells very often, while the physical attackers don't (not sure about the dagger, but it's kinda risky to switch to a weapon like that when you don't know what the next enemy is.).  Normal attacks from physical attackers did like 1, rarely 2k damage, while these spells did around 6k I think.
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I am also not sure how Nitori is doing such good damage compared to the real damagers. I have Shade2010 and her damage is not very good, even if I am hitting slayer.
Her normal attack is about the same as the other physical attackers, but Rage Eight is a low MP cost attack that hits 4-8 times and is spammable if necessary, and you can also hit elemental weakness. The good part is she has MP regen, so whenever you face a weak enemy, you can refill all her MP by waiting. None of the other physical attackers can do that, I think.
Not sure how easy mode affects damage calculation, that might make some difference, too.

Oh and it seems Soleido has no hidden void star resist unlike the components that make it, so it's really disappointing.
« Last Edit: September 13, 2012, 10:12:10 AM by Seravy »

Re: Genius of Sappherios Zansyo/Weekend
« Reply #160 on: September 13, 2012, 09:47:39 PM »
Ahaha something so funny (and sad) just happened to me.
So it was an encounter who ended up as Remilia vs Shuten-Doji because of her perfect dodge and lifesteal, she managed to survive about 4~5 turns then she got her last word.
I used it, he became a Yukkuri King ... I thought victory was mine but he used Total Destruction and she died XD.
> If Remilia wasn't so fast I think I would have won because she would be full hp after using her last word.

Anyway, Mokou is good with a spear (-1 cooldown on stab skills, which includes her spells). At least I'm sure she will kill Mind Flayers quickly.
Remilia is good for dealing with lots of monsters though she's low on bombs.
And Nitori hm ... Rage Eight with Element Bullet is fine but not dealing damage on turn 1 could ... make me loose.
Just tried, about Sanae's poison with her last weapon and +30% poison damage (Poison Lily +10% and Snake God's Robe +20%) she's doing 800~999 / turn.

Still haven't tried melee Lithos with elemental weapon/buff I'm keeping her for later areas.
« Last Edit: September 13, 2012, 10:05:23 PM by Leerius »

Serela

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Re: Genius of Sappherios Zansyo/Weekend
« Reply #161 on: September 13, 2012, 10:01:09 PM »
I was wondering why the hell Remi should ever use a staff (Because Red Magic is her only magic attack, and I guess you could use that and Lifesteal, but it sounds pretty sucky!)

Then I realized, hey, she gets +150 patk in a tree. She gets Defense Ignore [Medium]. She has strong attack skills. Ergo, she can probably drain a very significant amount of mp with the staves 3% mp drain on physical, nifty. I always was kind of frugal with skills when I used her, which was okay because her normal attacks and super cheap skills for AoE were still pretty strong, but that'd make it nice.

I don't know if you can really get away with it in the bonus dungeon, but.
<mauvecow> see this is how evil works in reality, it just wears you down with bureaucracy until you don't care anymore

Re: Genius of Sappherios Zansyo/Weekend
« Reply #162 on: September 14, 2012, 12:27:36 AM »
Not sure how easy mode affects damage calculation, that might make some difference, too.
The damage you deal is doubled, and the damage you take is halved. Also, that thing about status effects from enemies being harder to stick to you.
Maybe I should try a full easy modo run once I decide I want to go through this game a fourth time (:colonveeplusalpha:), just to see how silly it gets.

Maiden Synnae ミ☆

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Re: Genius of Sappherios Zansyo/Weekend
« Reply #163 on: September 14, 2012, 01:55:45 AM »
Just posting to ask a quick question...

I got a Trapezohedron from an enemy but my party got annihilated before I could finish the battle... and I don't remember how many I had total. So... did I still get it? I mean, does the game save the item you got even if you get killed before ending the battle?

Sweetness and love~ ♥

Re: Genius of Sappherios Zansyo/Weekend
« Reply #164 on: September 14, 2012, 02:01:12 AM »
Nope. You have to finish the battle if I remember correctly.

Maiden Synnae ミ☆

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Re: Genius of Sappherios Zansyo/Weekend
« Reply #165 on: September 14, 2012, 02:27:23 AM »
Nope. You have to finish the battle if I remember correctly.

...........................I... just... have to... breath and... calm down.

Okay, that's REALLY frustrating. I rarely get my whole party killed to regular enemies, and this have to happen just when I get a rare item...? Blame those mindflayers.

But rage apart, well... I'm still on chapter 18, currently grinding my reimu towards level 51 to help my battle against kagami (Super Duplex Barrier). It's quite annoying that you're forced to split the party between 3... so, in a way or another... you won't be getting a full party everywhere. But at least that urchin girl is pathetically easy if you use Fujiyama volcano and items to resist poison/stun. So... Just Mokou and another party member is pretty enough for that battle. From my experience, I think the hardest one is chihiro, since she has quite a variety of attacks... but what makes the battle tough are those undesirable status effects.

Sweetness and love~ ♥

Re: Genius of Sappherios Zansyo/Weekend
« Reply #166 on: September 14, 2012, 02:29:00 AM »
Little legion plus regular duplex barrier has worked wonders for me.

Re: Genius of Sappherios Zansyo/Weekend
« Reply #167 on: September 14, 2012, 08:13:29 AM »
Kagami has always been the easiest one for me, even without Alice. I don't remember how I did that battle in my not-quite-latest run, but in my latest one all I did was give Aya +EVA stuff, dark resistance stuff, and stick her in the front of a Poison Shield formation, spamming Wing God Hiding in Tree Leaves or something like that... every other turn because I'm retarded and didn't give her a fan :V, but it still worked out beautifully in the end (the killing squad was composed of light explosives to circumvent her elemental resistance buff).

The only sea maid that tends to give me trouble is Chihiro, but even then only because I usually forget about her nuke on the first turn. And then there's Akame who always kills me when the RNG decides to be a dick, so I always need to go for her first.
« Last Edit: September 14, 2012, 08:15:27 AM by homing curvy laser »

Maiden Synnae ミ☆

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Re: Genius of Sappherios Zansyo/Weekend
« Reply #168 on: September 14, 2012, 08:00:28 PM »
I just noticed something weird...

While trying to learn Hyper Armor from shisa on bhava-agra, my satori was level 50 with her "Understanding Tree" maxed. And I used byakuren to cast charm on the enemy and so... he casted hyper armor on my party, satori got buffed but she didn't learn the attack.

I mean... if you max out her understanding tree, she will learn a skill that boosts the learning success rate to +200%, and given that you naturally have 50% chance of learning those buff attacks from enemies, then with that tree maxed the success rate would become 150%, in other words... unmissable, right?

Thus, how come she failed to learn it?

Sweetness and love~ ♥

Sungho

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Re: Genius of Sappherios Zansyo/Weekend
« Reply #169 on: September 14, 2012, 10:40:20 PM »
Because she can't. It's not in the list.
She can learn Starlight Barrier and Reflect Wall from those enemies, though.
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Re: Genius of Sappherios Zansyo/Weekend
« Reply #170 on: September 15, 2012, 03:09:47 AM »
Yeah, Hyper Armor and Hyper Weapon are not learnable skills.

GuyYouMetOnline

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Re: Genius of Sappherios Zansyo/Weekend
« Reply #171 on: September 16, 2012, 01:33:32 AM »
Question: in the Kaguya/Eirin fight, can you still make Kaguya run from the battle if you inflict Control on her?

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Re: Genius of Sappherios Zansyo/Weekend
« Reply #172 on: September 16, 2012, 02:14:57 AM »
Yup, Eirin can't even resurrect her.
Which means that Eirin will heal herself quite a lot.
You wouldn't get Kaguya in the Encyclopedia this way, so I wouldn't recommend it.

Which is what the wiki says.
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Maiden Synnae ミ☆

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Re: Genius of Sappherios Zansyo/Weekend
« Reply #173 on: September 16, 2012, 02:36:33 AM »
And besides, you won't get the experience points from Kaguya, but that's still passable... the worst thing is that you won't get her encyclopedia entry.

Anyway... finally managed to beat the three maids as well as the stage 19 boss... and woah! That girl was STRONG. But the strategy I used was enough to overcome her deadly physical blows and render her useless.

I merely used Patchouli/Marisa as elec attackers, Byakuren to debuff her PATK, then sanae to buff defenses and reimu for super duplex barrier in case she'd get regenerated from the debuff... and aya as commander to make the party go first in case she was regenerated and reimu being unable to cast the barrier due to cooldown. Just so I could ensure Byakuren's debuff would go first.


Sweetness and love~ ♥

Re: Genius of Sappherios Zansyo/Weekend
« Reply #174 on: September 16, 2012, 02:47:20 AM »
Question: in the Kaguya/Eirin fight, can you still make Kaguya run from the battle if you inflict Control on her?
I've noticed that in Weekend, the speed of the controlled target is considered if you try to escape, so if you're faster and the only thing left on the opponent's side is a controlled target you will be able to flee before them. However, since you usually can't escape from boss fights, I believe Kaguya would still try to escape after you failed.

As for Anastasis, if you have Satori with Mad Thunder she is a complete non-issue  :]

GuyYouMetOnline

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Re: Genius of Sappherios Zansyo/Weekend
« Reply #175 on: September 16, 2012, 02:50:23 AM »
Yup, Eirin can't even resurrect her.
Which means that Eirin will heal herself quite a lot.
You wouldn't get Kaguya in the Encyclopedia this way, so I wouldn't recommend it.

Which is what the wiki says.

I know, and I know it works in LSH, but I thought they may have changed it in Weekend. Well, I'm at the stage 9 boss, so we'll find out soon enough.

achicken

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Re: Genius of Sappherios Zansyo/Weekend
« Reply #176 on: September 16, 2012, 03:42:02 AM »
I made Kaggy escape for kicks, so yes, it works.

Reloaded because that was doing it wrong. Kaggy's buff spells are sick crazy.

In other news, I had a lucky break yesterday. In the Kanako/Suwako boss battle, On my third try, Suwako was petro'd from turn 1 and never managed to break out, and when I was just 2 characters away from party wipe, Youmu finally managed to land an Instakill on Kanako at ~80% health.

Yes I was specifically going after their weaknesses with cheese, but those 2 don't make it easy to cheese them...





Re: Genius of Sappherios Zansyo/Weekend
« Reply #177 on: September 16, 2012, 08:15:39 AM »
You can't break out of Petrify, it has a permanent duration.

GuyYouMetOnline

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Re: Genius of Sappherios Zansyo/Weekend
« Reply #178 on: September 16, 2012, 08:22:47 AM »
SOme enemies have a chance at the end of each turn to recover from permanent effects. Suwako is one of them.

Re: Genius of Sappherios Zansyo/Weekend
« Reply #179 on: September 16, 2012, 08:55:23 AM »
I don't think you can recover from Petrify at all. I believe allies also have some skill that lets you recover from permanent effects and Petrify is not one of those you can recover from. I could be mistaken on this.