Author Topic: Adorable Game of Mafia (Everyone wins!)  (Read 100411 times)

Shadoweh

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Re: Adorable Game of Mafia (Day 3 start!)
« Reply #570 on: August 09, 2012, 05:52:19 AM »
Current reread says I don't find huh what's play suspicious when compared to past games. Maybe I would have more confidence in this if I were ever able to read huh what correctly.. but he's definitely not afraid of bussing Serela, and I feel he hasn't been as emotional this game as he usually gets as scum. Three suspects.. Rereading has remindded me that KilgaTown likes applying the vote to the Shadoweh. It's kind of surreal to read you being the one telling me how insulting it is to suspect you killed Pesco. asfhdggs. If one of you is scum I don't feel like I can figure it out yet.

I may be generically high on your list from game-to-game, but I don't think there's any question that Pesco came out of Day 1 townier than I did.
Can you please explain this to me so I can understand it. I DO NOT UNDERSTAND WHY HE IS DEAD. You can accuse me of lying about my scum meta but it's not like I can erase past games. All you need to do to see it is look. (this is clearly vampiric hypnotism at work, OOoOOoOOooo read my past gaaaAaAaaammesss)

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See, the thing is that I can't really tell the difference, precisely because of the lack of accompanying "why".
If I knew why something was weird at the time it wouldn't be weird. Mafia is still a team game. If I can't understand something, there's a chance someone else will havve an idea of what's bugging me about something if I hold it out. It's nice to have reminders for myself, but if I'm posting it it's because I want to see what people's opinions of someething are.

This is me acknowledging that colors are semantics and we just seem to think differently about them.

Re: Why not obvtown; I was more interested in the activity part then asking why game-state wise you wouldn't be. Not posting doesn't excuse an inactive vote, but  there wasn't really any time you could have put the vote on Serela (I checked this time).

Part 2
You're not gonna get to me with that AtE, missy. :V I'm not a huge fan of this, any way I read it sounds more like excuse-making for the lackluster Affinity case than anything else. Please do at least realize how incongruous the strengths of your Day 1 and Day 2 cases are. (For the record, I do at least not blame anyone for wanting to get NKed, since I find myself praying for it more often than not regardless of the circumstances. >_>)
I'm aware there was a difference in strength, but that's to be expected when the first subject is relatively obvious scum and the second one was a townie, making any points against him wrong in the end. It wasn't as strong because I wasn't as confident, it's as simple as that. (I like being alive, usually. It's just a matter of pride.)

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Scum don't always think about that sort of thing. I remember watching you doing highlighted wagon analysis on Day 3 of Swords Girls Mafia and thinking "y'know, maybe we should have paid closer attention to the wagons when deciding who to kill and who to suspect." (For all that none of our kills were in our control in that game, anyway.) This is also at least part of the reason why I am surprised your vote is not on BT, because your opinion of his vote seems a lot less positive now.
Scum not thinking about it is a point. The only thing keeping me from BT at the moment is remembering Serela's semi-defense of him combined with exploring how possible you and huh what being partners is. (as in rereading you both equally) I don't think I ever expressed a positive opinion of BT's vote.

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Again with the lack of addressing the "why"s. I'm not going to speak for the dead rabbit but I at least tried to put forward my rationale on why the counterclaim was a bad idea, which you either didn't notice or did and didn't care. You could very well have discussed why my rationale was good or bad while still not having any reason to think Pesco or myself town. Not doing so and simply blowing us off in this fashion instead was not a townie approach to the situation.
Perhaps if I outline my thinking at the time it'll be clearer. I did not want a counterclaim either. I was exploring why Serela's behaviour was scummy due to the fact that a cop in an open setup should consider themselves confirmed town because of how counterclaiming works, and Serela was acting the opposite of confirmed town. Pesco took that as a reason to attack me mistaking my intentions as stating that the cop should claim. Since that's not what I was arguing at all, I took it as a strawmanning push and your name just being used to support an attack on me. Your rationale from a theory standpoint could be argued either way. I didn't care because I wasn't trying to argue against you.

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- Considering my opinion on all Serela had said about Omba, I was at least inclined to agree with the sentiment that it was unjustified, because I, uh, hadn't found justification.
This sounds like you just agreed because you agreed Omba was scummy, without looking at the case in detail. Is this correct?
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- Why did you not bring this assessment of the best Serela approach up at the time?
Because at the time I didn't read it in detail either. At a glance I already disagreed with the premise of all the cases on Omba, reading further into them wasn't going to convince me otherwise compared to the proof I felt I had from Serela himself.

Your third point is more a complaint of my playstyle again. Perhaps you're right, but I did try to engage you at the time with the proof I had. Your responses to me are filled with as much AtE as anything I've done.

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This implies you were doing it thinking that my "likely" response to it would be to come out blasting you the next day despite the fact that my most recent stated opinion of you was that you were probably town due to the D1 wagon. I think it's entirely possible Scum Shadoweh tried messing with my head while I was obviously frustrated from my pride-and-joy case being blown up by a role claim, yes, because muddying my perception of the game would be good for a scum who has stated she holds my townie game in high regard. That it blew up in said scum's face was simply an unexpected result.
You seem to think that's what I wanted out of you? Your continuous opinion of me has been to question my every move. I can't see how it would be more beneficial if I were scum to talk to you instead of ignoring you until the night phase. You know what's more effective against someone who's townie game you hold in high regard then messing with their head? Bullets!


There is a huge problem for me right now. BT/PX doesn't make much sense. They've been infighting since Day 2. I don't think stop drop and bus is a good scum strategy immediately after a scum lynch. One of you two bastards is scum. And one of them is likely scum. Aaaaaaaaa. 48 hour days are horrible.

At the moment I support either lynch, but Kilga is correct, I haven't seen anything from BT to refute my points. This feels kind of like BR vs Kaori, both of them are fairly absent lurkers. My hammer the PX urges are rising again though so he better post something good or I will quickwagon him off the planet again.

##Vote: BT  :trollface:


Kitten4u: "I'll say it plainly: THERE IS NO WAY SHADOWEH IS SCUM!" - A Balanced Game of Mafia

Edible

  • One part the F?hrer, one part the Pope
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Re: Adorable Game of Mafia (Day 1 start. FROLIC)
« Reply #571 on: August 09, 2012, 06:07:39 AM »
Vote Count: Sleepy Sleepy Sleepy edition

PX (3): huh what, BT, Raitaki
BT (3): PX, Kilgamayan, Shadoweh
huh what (2): NekoNekoRex, Omba

Not voting: Nobody!

You have ~18 hours remaining.  With 8 in play, it takes 5 votes to launch.

Omba has been prodded.
« Last Edit: August 09, 2012, 06:10:35 AM by Edible »

Omba

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Re: Adorable Game of Mafia (Day 3 start!)
« Reply #572 on: August 09, 2012, 06:19:23 AM »
Affinity vote looks subliminally telegraphed from her D1 posts where she talks about him too, but not in the blatant "My thought process is linear and consistent, please don't vote me" scum way either.
I've re-read BT multiple times and waffled on it. The gist of it is that his Serela vote seems too anti-scum and non-telegraphed to be a bus.
I have issues with the use of telegraphing/not telegraphing in these arguments. A little more explanation on the first would be nice, likewise why the second is anything more than a weak indication.

I feel he hasn't been as emotional this game as he usually gets as scum.
There's the thing where I told him about his choice of words after the last game and he drew his conclusions from it, though.

Shadoweh

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Re: Adorable Game of Mafia (Day 3 start!)
« Reply #573 on: August 09, 2012, 06:25:47 AM »
Give me more to work with. I'm waffling in my sleep at this point. Everyone as scum makes too much sense.


Kitten4u: "I'll say it plainly: THERE IS NO WAY SHADOWEH IS SCUM!" - A Balanced Game of Mafia

Omba

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Re: Adorable Game of Mafia (Day 3 start!)
« Reply #574 on: August 09, 2012, 06:31:25 AM »
For the nightkill speculation: It's entirely possible they just decided to off the player they thought was the most townie looking of the ones people might be willing to lynch. The resulting paranoid chaos we're having fits with this.

Omba

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Re: Adorable Game of Mafia (Day 3 start!)
« Reply #575 on: August 09, 2012, 06:39:28 AM »
The false dichotomy just looks too much like a bullshit saving throw for scum coming out of a day where they were likely to get PoE'd for me to buy into it. If Shadoweh is town and scum!Kilga gets her and I mislynched back to back, he wins.
If you actually think this is him scummily lining up lynches, I'd say that has more weight than what you have on PX. Also don't get where the idea anything could have been PoE'd today is coming from. That was pretty much out of the window the moment the NK speculation started.

Omba

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Re: Adorable Game of Mafia (Day 3 start!)
« Reply #576 on: August 09, 2012, 06:50:09 AM »
We're not going down the lynch BT/PX, if town flip, lynch the other one - road, btw.

PX

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Re: Adorable Game of Mafia (Day 3 start!)
« Reply #577 on: August 09, 2012, 07:02:42 AM »
Well, was gonna post a better case on BT, but Kilga's case just sums it up nicely. That said, just got home and still no computer access until later tomorrow. I'll get to reading others tomorrow, but squarely convinced of BT scum.

And Omba, NNR, I don't think the huh what lynch is happening. Get your butts in here and lynch BT.

Omba

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Re: Adorable Game of Mafia (Day 3 start!)
« Reply #578 on: August 09, 2012, 07:20:52 AM »
And Omba, NNR, I don't think the huh what lynch is happening. Get your butts in here and lynch BT.
That's mainly you saying your lynch isn't happening.

NekoNekoRex

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Re: Adorable Game of Mafia (Day 3 start!)
« Reply #579 on: August 09, 2012, 09:41:50 AM »
Blegh, Thi is the second day in a row I have to choose between two meh wagons, apparently

I still don't really see BT, I'd rather switch to PX if I have to. Still don't like his D1 reasons for starting the wagon on me.

Still want HW to be lynched. Not sure where PX pulled out that IioA thing. I thought it was pretty clear.
HW's D1 was him ignoring stuff on Serela and jumping on me for awful reasons, then continuing to make excuses for Serela's blatantly scummy actions while pounding on me for more awful reasons. Even when he switched to Serela for the claim it wasn't long before e just made another excuse to switch back to me.
Kilga is this right; like is this person seriously the player, and it's not some alias or something that's designed to be deliberately obfuscating? NekoNekoRex. Who the hell is that :C   ~Poya Aaaa (Serela), Bunny Must Die Mafia

PX

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Re: Adorable Game of Mafia (Day 3 start!)
« Reply #580 on: August 09, 2012, 01:55:44 PM »
So NNR, let me get this straight. The sole reason you don't like me is because I made a case and voted you. I will repeat: HOW is that scummy?! How does simply making a case make more sense on me as scum than as town? As for why you want Huh What lynched. Because he... attacked you? And that makes him scum HOW? You see where I'm going with this. You're not saying why the person's actions are scum. You're simply saying what they did and saying that it's scummy. You are not explaining why it makes sense for them to be scum then for them to simply be town. On top of that, you're saying we attacked YOU for "awful reasons". Care to explain how exactly they are awful reasons? Because making a case alone should never, ever, EVER be used as a reason the person is scummy. Even if the person made a case on someone who is mod confirmed town to the entire town, that's not scummy but utterly stupid. So please, explain to us WHY that is scummy, not just say what they did is scummy.

/rant

NekoNekoRex

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Re: Adorable Game of Mafia (Day 3 start!)
« Reply #581 on: August 09, 2012, 02:50:49 PM »
It's not the only reason! I'm just brutally tired and I don't know how to go to bed.
Also there's not much content to go on in the first place, I have to start somewhere.

I'm going to finally address this when I get some rest. Definitely back before deadline.
Kilga is this right; like is this person seriously the player, and it's not some alias or something that's designed to be deliberately obfuscating? NekoNekoRex. Who the hell is that :C   ~Poya Aaaa (Serela), Bunny Must Die Mafia

Shadoweh

  • I will ahn~ vote count for you
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  • The STRONGEST Day Effect
Re: Adorable Game of Mafia (Day 3 start!)
« Reply #582 on: August 09, 2012, 03:06:18 PM »
Blegh, Thi is the second day in a row I have to choose between two meh wagons, apparently

I still don't really see BT, I'd rather switch to PX if I have to. Still don't like his D1 reasons for starting the wagon on me.

Still want HW to be lynched. Not sure where PX pulled out that IioA thing. I thought it was pretty clear.
HW's D1 was him ignoring stuff on Serela and jumping on me for awful reasons, then continuing to make excuses for Serela's blatantly scummy actions while pounding on me for more awful reasons. Even when he switched to Serela for the claim it wasn't long before e just made another excuse to switch back to me.
If you don't like either wagon, ie you think neither is scum, who do you think is scum with Huh what?


Kitten4u: "I'll say it plainly: THERE IS NO WAY SHADOWEH IS SCUM!" - A Balanced Game of Mafia

PX

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Re: Adorable Game of Mafia (Day 3 start!)
« Reply #583 on: August 09, 2012, 03:33:46 PM »
Arregggggghhhgggggg

Can't tell who is the other scum, it could be anybody but Omba. If anything, I'm leaning towards HuhWhat for the last scum, but that's only because of his buddying of BT and that's not concrete until BT flips.

PX

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Re: Adorable Game of Mafia (Day 3 start!)
« Reply #584 on: August 09, 2012, 03:47:55 PM »
I've come to the conclusion that Shadoweh/Kilga can't be scum, so the only one left who could is huhwhat. And I suppose NNR, but that is a very off crapshoot.

Omba

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Re: Adorable Game of Mafia (Day 3 start!)
« Reply #585 on: August 09, 2012, 04:36:03 PM »
PX: Why can't Shadoweh be scum?

BT

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  • People say that I should
Re: Adorable Game of Mafia (Day 3 start!)
« Reply #586 on: August 09, 2012, 05:01:26 PM »
(Yotsuba and Chiyo-chan, Birthday Cake Town)(only the best flavor)

Let's try this again.

@PX #553: The beef I have with your case is that all you did was take a few of my actions and show that they fit scum. Instead of considering the reasons behind my IHNN vote movement, you mention the act as something scummy. Instead of analyzing my Affinity flip-flop, you take my switch's existence as something scummy. That kind of thing. It doesn't look like you actually made an effort to read me and instead skimmed over my posts and found scum motivation for them.

@Kilgamayan #564: When I said PX feels more solid, it was a result of reading his ISO. It wasn't a result of anything recent he'd done. In fact, I noted PX's D1 in my last post as something that made me hesitant to vote before. And that's what happened during LD2. I really hate myself for that switch - I leaned town on Affinity and was willing to reconsider that in a second as part of a *I see the light* thing after changing my mind about PX, only to find PX scummy again today. So much for doing things on a whim. And, uh, the unvote. That's not too uncommon a thing when you realize you might be wrong and want to take a step back to think about things.

@Shadoweh #559: -_- Other than saying that I agree with your case, no, I didn't have much of anything on Serela, but you summarized his measly-numbered posts so well that reiterating things like IHNN was doing (which I suspected at the time as gaining cred off of your case) wasn't something I was planning to do. If I wanted to gain massive town cred by bussing the rolecop D1 I would have been more prominent about it than a simple "I agree". What is wrong with clearing NNR? And why are my "safe" votes scummy? Why are my votes safe at all?

Unhappyface. I don't think Shadoweh is the scum which means it's somewhere between HW and Kilga, and they're both doing great. It's probably the latter; announcing Shadoweh/HW in that fashion was questionable, especially considering he's mainly going after the former, like he was welcoming people to challenge him on the other side (hello NNR). I think I can point to what I felt was bad about the Omba push at this point, too - a lot of his early points seemed like he was nitpicking on his play regardless of alignment ("fluff" even though he had content alongside it, "antagonizing" and "clouding judgement" when the entire postgame discussions about said things were due to town doing it), and he looked like he was going over the same things and adding in *scumbuddy connections* come D2. His vote on me is a big step down from the "let's lynch a big name" proposal, maybe because it wasn't getting the desired effect. Actually, this applies to Shadoweh too, in a way - if you thought he was suspect, agreeing with his vote and voting me yourself doesn't add up.

Have a "this is a post with plenty of my thoughts" post. HW is generally agreeable this game and I stated my preference of Kilga over him. It's actually pretty irritating because I  think Shadoweh is more town than him pretty much due to VCA, but, bleh. On that topic, his PX case includes a lot of my (already mentioned) thoughts, that I don't have much to add, and PX's latest push doesn't really make it any prettier for him.

Omba, who be yer preferences?

PX

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Re: Adorable Game of Mafia (Day 3 start!)
« Reply #587 on: August 09, 2012, 05:40:05 PM »
:colonveeplusalpha: :colonveeplusalpha: :colonveeplusalpha: :colonveeplusalpha: :colonveeplusalpha: :colonveeplusalpha: :colonveeplusalpha: :colonveeplusalpha: :colonveeplusalpha: :colonveeplusalpha: :colonveeplusalpha:
BT lynch does not look like it's happening, so
Unvote
Vote: huhwhat


Consider this more Not me Over Me, as I don't really have anything solid and prefer BT. 8)

BT

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  • People say that I should
Re: Adorable Game of Mafia (Day 3 start!)
« Reply #588 on: August 09, 2012, 05:52:11 PM »
What

If you feel like my post is solid enough to stop the wagon cold then you're free to admit it. :)

Since nothing happened between your last post and this one.

BT

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  • People say that I should
Re: Adorable Game of Mafia (Day 3 start!)
« Reply #589 on: August 09, 2012, 05:53:37 PM »
Or hell, if you really think HW is the scum and have nothing on him then the least you can do is find something. All you're doing right now from my pov is jumping from one town wagon to another for free.

Edible

  • One part the F?hrer, one part the Pope
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  • It's the inevitable return, baby
Re: Adorable Game of Mafia (Day 1 start. FROLIC)
« Reply #590 on: August 09, 2012, 05:59:45 PM »
Vote Count: YACCHATTA edition (a little nsfw)

PX (3): huh what, BT, Raitaki
huh what (3): NekoNekoRex, Omba, PX
BT (2): Kilgamayan, Shadoweh

Not voting: Nobody!

You have ~6 hours remaining.  With 8 in play, it takes 5 votes to launch.

PX

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Re: Adorable Game of Mafia (Day 3 start!)
« Reply #591 on: August 09, 2012, 06:00:28 PM »
Shadoweh's case on Serela is too perfect. Koromo does not see scum Shadoweh pounding on Serela like that on D1 without noticing her scum buddy, and it caused everyone to get on Serela. Additionally, her Kilga defense are still great, and I just can't see her as scum at all.

BT

  • I never talk to you
  • *
  • People say that I should
Re: Adorable Game of Mafia (Day 3 start!)
« Reply #592 on: August 09, 2012, 06:03:48 PM »
That answers anything how?

Kilgamayan

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Re: Adorable Game of Mafia (Day 3 start!)
« Reply #593 on: August 09, 2012, 06:15:36 PM »
Jumping in really quick to say that I prefer a PX lynch to a huh what lynch. They're equals in terms of raw end-of-day positioning but I've felt huh what's cases have been stronger throughout the game than PX's have been. Stuff I brought up near the end of Day 2 also still stands.
[22:40:12] <Drake> "guys i donwloaded esod but its not workan"
[22:40:21] <Drake> REPORTED
[22:40:25] <NaturallyOccurringChoja> PROBATED
[22:40:30] <Drake> ORGASM
[22:40:32] <NaturallyOccurringChoja> FUCK YEAH

[22:28:39] <Edible> Mafia would be a much easier game if we were playing "spot the asshole"

Re: Adorable Game of Mafia (Day 3 start!)
« Reply #594 on: August 09, 2012, 06:48:47 PM »
BT lynch does not look like it's happening, so
Quote
BT at 3 votes
waht

I understand why PX wouldn't just babble on about null reads and such D2 but that doesn't explain a lack of effort looking into Kilga and I as if he really only cared about finding Affinity-scum. He didn't discuss Kilga/IHNN/BT cases as they popped up either. Lack of scumhunting isn't town.

Re: Adorable Game of Mafia (Day 3 start!)
« Reply #595 on: August 09, 2012, 06:57:33 PM »
Seriously what the fuck is up with PX's recent posts?

"HW isn't getting lynched guys" -> counterargument against Neko's case on me -> "WHOOPS I guess BT lynch's isn't happening, here let me vote HW even though he'll have the same amount of votes as BT did"

Do you even read?

I'm off to go take another look at BT and post thoughts.

PX

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Re: Adorable Game of Mafia (Day 3 start!)
« Reply #596 on: August 09, 2012, 07:05:32 PM »
It would be better if those two who are the Towniest would stop staring at huhwhat and actually look at other's cases >_<

But they insist!!!

Waffffflllllleeeeessssss

Re: Adorable Game of Mafia (Day 3 start!)
« Reply #597 on: August 09, 2012, 07:23:04 PM »
Town!PX means that there were literally no scum on Serela's counterwagon FMPOV. I still think that leaving an early counterwagon vote down and not bothering to post when they come back is a convenient way for scum to help prevent their buddy's lynch without actually having visible evidence that they were being scummy.

I understand some points of the BT case but still don't feel his Serela vote looks like a bus (basically untelegraphed swing vote, couldn't be moved which scum would want to be able to do if their buddy was gonna claim cop, looks like it was made by a player just finding a wagon to vote to me - scum trying to bus for cred should be making it noticable) and continue to strongly prefer PX.

There is a huge problem for me right now. BT/PX doesn't make much sense. They've been infighting since Day 2.
Source? PX didn't say shit about BT Day 2. BT switched off PX at the last moment. Them being buddies isn't improbable though I personally think Kilga seems more likely as a PX-buddy since I find him scummier individually.

If you actually think this is him scummily lining up lynches, I'd say that has more weight than what you have on PX. Also don't get where the idea anything could have been PoE'd today is coming from. That was pretty much out of the window the moment the NK speculation started.
PX's D2 scumhunting was literally nonexistant and I think that's pretty heavy. PoE is because according to precedent MotK Town is unlikely to naturally take another look at Shadoweh and I if they think we're town due to bias.

I have issues with the use of telegraphing/not telegraphing in these arguments. A little more explanation on the first would be nice, likewise why the second is anything more than a weak indication.
Scum like to have clear town thought processes when applicable because they don't actually have any. If they're not shooting for that then they're more likely to just look unpredictable. Shadoweh's thought process is there but subliminal instead of in-your-face which makes her easier to understand IMO.

See what I said earlier for BT.

Re: Adorable Game of Mafia (Day 3 start!)
« Reply #598 on: August 09, 2012, 07:24:23 PM »
Or actually not sure about Kilga > BT given his recent PX stance.

Whatever. I'm just saying they're both possible buddies still. Will look into this after PX flips.

Re: Adorable Game of Mafia (Day 3 start!)
« Reply #599 on: August 09, 2012, 07:25:47 PM »
It would be better if those two who are the Towniest would stop staring at huhwhat and actually look at other's cases >_<

But they insist!!!

Waffffflllllleeeeessssss
If there are a few hours left in the day and nobody is switching to me, they'll be forced to pick sides from PX/BT. You should know this. Why did you make the vote switch if BT is your preferred lynch?