Author Topic: "Placeholder Sign [I can't think of a name]" (Spell Card Help Topic IV)  (Read 212213 times)

xForeverFanaticx

  • Bomb ALL the Spellcards!
Most of Youkai Laser can be misdirected

Urr... Isn't the easiest (and possibly the cheapest) way to misdirect to the upper corners? Or just plain above her, at an angle? Just learn the timings of her shots (as in, learn to move at the right time after her charge sound effect/animation, or else her aim will still follow you part-way) and the spell's pretty much redundant.

Misdirect to the upper left, quickly move out of ALL the lasers so you can misdirect to the upper right and also move out of all the lasers. Rinse, repeat. Homing shottypes (don't really recommend ReimuA still due to her weak homing. SakuyaA does better imo, even though her knives only aim upwards) work best, as you can get your shots in even at awkward non-straight angles.

Now, if only Yukari's Mesh of Light and Darkness could be done that way... xD kidding~ It's much more fun that Fox-Tanuki Laser, so I'll do it the normal way~

EDIT: Feel like I asked this before, but is St. Nikou's Air Scroll static? If not, how does it work? O.o"
« Last Edit: May 22, 2012, 11:56:08 PM by xForeverFanaticx »

Lepetit89

  • Deranged Collector
Speaking of Lasers and Yukari, is there any way not to be completely obliterated if you so much as get hit even once by the lasers in Yukari's penultimate Spellcard in IaMP? Unless I'm missing something completely obvious (and I must be, some basic command or whatever) this Spellcard screams "Bullshit" in all kinds of ways, seriously. I get hit, fall to the ground, I get up just in time to be hit by the next wave of lasers. Unless the timing changes for some reason or the lasers just so happen not to cover the ground, I'm hit again, which then repeats until my healthbar has been depleted completely.
« Last Edit: May 23, 2012, 01:09:18 PM by Lepetit89 »

チソウ タイゼン

  • tarzan cheetos
  • you'll thank me for the cropping later
Uncaps plz



Chuckolator

  • ex-perfecter, good times
Uncaps plz
Dodge more bullets.

What, you want more specific answers?

Hell Thrust: center, left, center, right, repeat.
Hook Combo: right and up, left and up, left and up, right and up, repeat.
Ghost Ship's Port: Anchors are aimed based on your position, try to be under her when she shoots so that she has a chance to move directly above you once you move.
Vajra: This one's tough, but staying close to the center means less tight spots, so try to do that when you can.

Can't help you on the other two, I'm still 0/~30 on those. >_>
Aiming to perfect every stage in Touhou. loljk don't care anymore You can find my perfects here or here.
Best perfects so far include UFO 6, MoF 4 and IN 6A.

formerly known as Seiga Kaku

Zil

PSM - safespot
Hell thrust - You can misdirect the first wave to the corner.
Shou's stuff - bomb

I have no name

  • Dodge ALL the bullets
Parasol Star Memories: Use SanaeB.  Be at 4 power.  Have easy capture.
Hell Thrust: use SanaeB.  shotgun the beginning.  have easy capture.
Murasa, Shou: basically just bombspam, you should capture Shou's second spell though, but don't be afraid to bomb everything else if you have one.

Made it all the way to Miko's final non-spell in TD Lunatic. Much closer than before, but still quite a ways to go. Here's a breakdown of the run:

Stage 1:
Didn't get enough spirits to trance the mid-boss. Didn't trance during the boss battle because I tend to not get enough before the next stage.
Stage 2:
Tranced the fairies after the blue-kunai enemies. Bombed the mid-spell because it keeps clipping me. Tranced too early at the end and missed the purple spirits.
Bombed both boss non-spells because.
Stage 3:
Bombed the mid-card, then bombed it again because she wouldn't get over here.
Tranced Poison Nail, then died on the next non-spell.  It's either one or the other.
Stage 4:
Bombed the mid-non-spell. Got walled by the spirits after the spell and bombed. Guess I should have stalled a bit on the spell first?
Bombed the last spam wave because. Tranced at the end, but missed the last two fairies.
Timed out the first card because that's easier than trying to keep track of Seiga's position, as well as the next non-spell because you can't stay under Seiga.
Died then bombed twice on Tongling Yoshika because it wouldn't die.
Died at last non-spell. Died at last spell. Kept going even though I had no chance of succeeding now.
Stage 5:
Bombed mid-non-spell because I messed it up. Tranced at the end.
Bombed first boss spell and the next non-spell because.
Died on Eighty Sake Cups >:(
Stage 6:
Tranced for bomb parts.
Bombed first non-spell, first spell, second non-spell, and third non-spell because.
Tranced Chaotic Dance.
Final death on last non-spell.

...so yeah, anything obvious I'm missing? Is there a better trance route that's not too much harder to use? What would be the easiest way to save on resources? Etc. A single mistake can mess up the rest of the run, so I want to make sure I have a sound plan before trying again :V



Zil

Here's my own trance route, in case you want to check it. - http://replays.gensokyou.org/download.php?id=19496 (It's designed for being unable to dodge anything, so you may to change some parts.)

If you can't trance the midboss the you should at least bomb trance Yuyuko. Memorizing where the orbs appear in stage 2 and killing them instantly followed by grabbing a few spirits before the kunai spam should easily give you enough trance for when you need it.

If you trance at the right time in stage 4, you can get spirits and still use the trance to kill the midboss nonspell. Delay the spell for a while to avoid the wisps after it. Also don't time out the first card since you lose the spirits.

xForeverFanaticx

  • Bomb ALL the Spellcards!
Not exactly spellcard related help, but I'm posting it here for the sake of not creating an entire new thread.

For challenge runs such as 90 FPS or Pacifist, what exactly are the requirements for such a run?

Pacifist: Are you allowed to die, and if so, are you allowed to deathbomb/bomb?

No Death: Bombs are allowed, right?

No Bomb: Deaths are allowed right?

90 FPS: Everything's allowed, just run the game at 90 FPS, right?

anything else I'm missing?

Random

  • Rice cakes, sea anemones
  • Benzene, benzene ♪
I may be wrong myself, so don't think I'm completely right. Please correct me if there's something wrong.

Pacifist means that you never shoot and never bomb. No shooting means that you never shoot but you do bomb.
No death means that you never die. Bombs are allowed.
Deaths are allowed for no bombs
90 FPS is just running the game at 90 FPS. Anything's allowed.

A couple more:
No vert - you can't move up or down.
No focus - you never press the shift key.
Left side only - you can only stay on the left side of the screen.
Top half - you can only stay in the top half of the screen.

Game-specific stuff:
No trance - not pressing the trance key in TD
No ice - not bombing or using the regular ice attack in GFW
No double tapping - I think this is for either SoEW or PC98 only, but spamming the fire key makes you deal more damage rather than just holding the key. I've only seen Donut make one video with it, and I don't own PC98 games, so I have no idea if it applies to anything other than SoEW.

ふねん1

  • Scientific editor
  • If you're alive, you can always keep moving.
My responses in bold.

Pacifist: Are you allowed to die, and if so, are you allowed to deathbomb/bomb?
"No-death pacifist" would be pretty hardcore if the former were true, even more so if bombing wasn't allowed either. While I could be mistaken, I believe there's no set rule for bombing during pacifist runs. Some will argue pacifist only means "no shooting", others will say it means "no damaging anything with anything".

No Death: Bombs are allowed, right?
If they weren't, the requirement would end up being "perfect run", not simply "no-deaths".

No Bomb: Deaths are allowed right?
Same reasoning as for no-deaths.

90 FPS: Everything's allowed, just run the game at 90 FPS, right?
I don't see why not.
"Science is more than a body of knowledge. It's a way of thinking." - Carl Sagan

NEW AND IMPROVED YOUTUBE, now with 60 fps Touhou videos! Latest video update: WBaWC Lunatic/Extra no-miss no-bomb no-Roars no-Spirit-Strikes compilation.

I have no name

  • Dodge ALL the bullets
Pacifist: Are you allowed to die, and if so, are you allowed to deathbomb/bomb?
You can die, and bombing is fine I'd say.  Intent to bomb through a pattern pushes it though...(read: Mokou's rings of death)

Pacifist means that you never shoot and never bomb. No shooting means that you never shoot but you do bomb.
see I'm a bit more lax about it.  I say it's no big deal if you accidentally shoot in a pacifist run as long as it doesn't change how it'd have played out.  Also I see bombing as fine, but as I said, bombing repeatedly with intent to get through a pattern is pushing it.

Zil

Doubletapping would apply only to SoEW, yeah.

Most stuff is just whatever you define it to be, really. Pacifist is the only that's really up in the air. And "perfect" really varies from person to person, and what their intent is. Personally I wouldn't want to use safespots in a "perfect" run, while other people wouldn't call someting perfect unless they optimized the scoring.

Karisa

  • Extend!
  • *
  • High scores are meant to be broken.
Does anyone have any advice regarding Legendary Flying Saucer (for the purpose of finishing off a 1cc, not necessarily capturing)? The Lunatic version is giving me way more trouble than the lower difficulties did...

Lepetit89

  • Deranged Collector
Pretty much all you can do is to be good enough to dodge enough of it for whatever resources you have left to make up for the rest.

Byakuren has extreme damage resistance whenever you're invincible, whether it's because you used a Bomb or because you got hit. After using a Bomb, you "can" try to advance right behind a new wave of bullets, then slowly move downwards to squeeze out some damage free of danger, but I'd say it's quite likely you'll get hit due to the increased bullet density in Byakuren's direct proximity. What's more, once you reach the bottom of the screen, you'll more often than not have lost track of what's going on, so you'll either get hit or use another Bomb.

Your own invincibility frames are actually one of the most dangerous factors, I think. Even when you're invincible, you can't afford not to keep going along with the pattern or you'll just be in for a bad surprise once you're vulnerable again. Never stop reading the pattern, it's the one thing you cannot afford to do, invincible or not.

If I recall correctly, there was some kind of trick where you had to wait a little before making her switch to the next colour in order to decrease the overall difficulty, but I never looked into that, so I have no idea, though it seems like that's the only thing that comes close to a trick.
Before that, I'd definitely say practice it on lower difficulties, try to go for a time out, use DS 12-7, but if there's one Spellcard in the entire series where there are no cheap tricks, it's this one. Kanako comes close, but hell, at least you could go for maximum damage output and end it quickly - LFS is easily the most brutal final Spellcard.

ふねん1

  • Scientific editor
  • If you're alive, you can always keep moving.
If I recall correctly, there was some kind of trick where you had to wait a little before making her switch to the next colour in order to decrease the overall difficulty, but I never looked into that, so I have no idea, though it seems like that's the only thing that comes close to a trick.
You must be referring to the transition between the last two phases as ReimuA (possibly other shot types, not sure). If you don't stop shooting at all, the purple and red waves at the end of the card will be rotating in the same direction, creating a near wall of amulets near the bottom-center. Phar showed here that by stopping your shooting until the second purple ring appears, the pattern becomes less complicated. Of course, you can also alleviate this problem by going a bit to the side during the offending pattern.
"Science is more than a body of knowledge. It's a way of thinking." - Carl Sagan

NEW AND IMPROVED YOUTUBE, now with 60 fps Touhou videos! Latest video update: WBaWC Lunatic/Extra no-miss no-bomb no-Roars no-Spirit-Strikes compilation.

Lepetit89

  • Deranged Collector
Ooh, I see, so that's what it was. that particular part certainly is quite hard due to the walls. If I recall correctly, surviving that one usually did set me up with good enough of a flow to deal with the rest of the Spellcard, so decreasing the difficulty there sounds quite nifty, thanks for the explanation!

Jx31

  • Hot Garbage
Question for the posters here.  On the first wave of Lunatic Jeweled Pagoda "Radiant Treasure Gun"  which direction do you typically go when dodging?  I typically attempt to go left but I get blasted out of the sky every time and the right side seems even scarier.  I can't really tell though since I die when I try to go right as well lol.  I wanted to know how people felt about that since I can't really judge which side would be the easier dodge atm.

Also on the second non-spell, do I really have no choice but to wait for the lasers to straighten out and dodge+read on reaction?  Is there a pattern to it?  I couldn't really see one.

Edit:  Forgot to mention that I'm referring to the third wave onward for the second non-spell.
« Last Edit: May 31, 2012, 07:35:23 AM by Jx31 »

BT

  • I never talk to you
  • *
  • People say that I should
Any especially good / consistent Red UFO routes for Lunatic Stages 4 and 5?

I think that optimization there, even somewhat, would get me so much closer to that 1cc.

MTSranger

  • =.=
Question for the posters here.  On the first wave of Lunatic Jeweled Pagoda "Radiant Treasure Gun"  which direction do you typically go when dodging?  I typically attempt to go left but I get blasted out of the sky every time and the right side seems even scarier.  I can't really tell though since I die when I try to go right as well lol.  I wanted to know how people felt about that since I can't really judge which side would be the easier dodge atm.
I usually go left to kill it asap since I don't want to dodge many waves of that damned thing.

Also on the second non-spell, do I really have no choice but to wait for the lasers to straighten out and dodge+read on reaction?  Is there a pattern to it?  I couldn't really see one.
Yup, you need supreme reaction speeds cuz the lasers are unreadable until they straighten out.
There is a relationship between the third wave of lasers and the white round bullets, but it's probably easier just to react to that too.

Jx31

  • Hot Garbage
Yup, you need supreme reaction speeds cuz the lasers are unreadable until they straighten out.
There is a relationship between the third wave of lasers and the white round bullets, but it's probably easier just to react to that too.

That's just plain brutal lol, at least I know for certain now thanks.

My approach is to predict where the gaps between the first set of lasers will be, then immediately thereafter focus on those coming in from the other side. Of course, the third wave they come in pretty much simultaneously so you'll just have to react for that. I don't know if this made any sense but if it does, try it. I've been able to capture it with some 85% consistency since I started approaching it like this. I capture it more than VoPB or RTG.  :V

I have no name

  • Dodge ALL the bullets
Shoot the Bullsh- I mean Bullet, 5-5.
This scene seems random and retarded, is there any trick other than fly around randomly?

Zil

This is how I did 5-5 at 90fps - http://replays.gensokyou.org/download.php?id=20767

My strategy was to guide her into the upper corners, slip out at the last second, then move in a big "U" across the bottom and into the other corner.

That's the best I got. Maybe Malkyrian knows more about it.

Shoot the Bullsh- I mean Bullet, 5-5.
This scene seems random and retarded, is there any trick other than fly around randomly?
It's pretty much just stay as far away from Meiling as possible, and try to have enough charge to take a shot the moment she bursts while close to you. Not much else I can say, you're not alone in thinking the card is luckshit.

Here's a video of my clear, if it'll help.

But yeah, that scene is one of the most obnoxious in the game (I won't give it the worst spot, because 10-6 is a thing). There is absolutely no shame in failing it a hundred+ times.

Jx31

  • Hot Garbage
My approach is to predict where the gaps between the first set of lasers will be, then immediately thereafter focus on those coming in from the other side. Of course, the third wave they come in pretty much simultaneously so you'll just have to react for that. I don't know if this made any sense but if it does, try it. I've been able to capture it with some 85% consistency since I started approaching it like this. I capture it more than VoPB or RTG.  :V

Sorry, I made a mistake with my post when I requested help.  I forgot to mention that it was only the Third wave and anything after that was blowing me up.  Though, your and Kanon's post confirmed what I was fearing about the third wave+.  Guess I have to work on those reactions.

Sorry again : /

crystalgreatsword

  • Spin, Aya, spin!
Failing At ESoD... again
« Reply #986 on: June 01, 2012, 01:34:57 AM »
That Stage 5... I can't seem to dodge the bulletspam that comes at the beginning. And if I do dodge it, all the other bulletspams get me. I'm talking about the white fairy bulletspam.

Also, Sakuya. I can't figure out her Illusion Image "Luna Clock" spell card. I try to read the direction that the green knives go, but I fly into another one when I dodge. >.>

Does anyone have hints that I might find useful?
This is on Normal, btw.

(Also, should I start saving my replays?)
Touhou Normal 1cc's: EoSD, PCB, IN, MoF, SA, UFO, TD
Touhou Hard Progress - EoSD: Stage 6, PCB: Stage 4, IN: Stage 4, MoF: Stage 4, SA: Stage 3, UFO: Stage 2, TD: Stage 4
Touhou Lunatic Progress - Haha, funny.

"I NEED MORE PRACTICE!!!" - Me at 2 in the morning

Zil

Re: "Placeholder Sign [I can't think of a name]" (Spell Card Help Topic IV)
« Reply #987 on: June 01, 2012, 05:50:22 AM »
For Luna Clock you want to move up before the knives appear. That way they appear near the top of the screen.

The beginning is really just random though note that the circle bullets are aimed at you.

There's also this

Random

  • Rice cakes, sea anemones
  • Benzene, benzene ♪
Re: Failing At ESoD... again
« Reply #988 on: June 01, 2012, 05:54:34 AM »
From saving your replays, you can see what you struggle in and make observations as to how you can beat a difficult attack. I recommend doing it.

Byaaakuren

  • Youkai Jesus, Queen of the Monks
    • Animu List
Re: "Placeholder Sign [I can't think of a name]" (Spell Card Help Topic IV)
« Reply #989 on: June 01, 2012, 07:12:17 AM »
Green UFO Invasion of Loyalty:
Are the rice bullets static or are they random?

Same can be asked for Rainbow UFO Invasion of Terror, I guess

I thank my friend for the sig <3
My noob replays :V
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