Author Topic: "Placeholder Sign [I can't think of a name]" (Spell Card Help Topic IV)  (Read 212235 times)

Re: "Placeholder Sign [I can't think of a name]" (Spell Card Help Topic IV)
« Reply #840 on: April 25, 2012, 09:04:41 PM »
Note that I only have some experience in Lunatic and almost none in lower difficulty settings. Though from little experience in lower difficulty setting, the general location of safespot is still the same, but the size of it is larger substantially, making it somewhat safer and easier to milk graze.


Thanks for the help, its quite straight forward, maybe a bit difficult with others with bigger hitboxes. Now its just about timing and getting in position after she moves.

Chuckolator

  • ex-perfecter, good times
Re: "Placeholder Sign [I can't think of a name]" (Spell Card Help Topic IV)
« Reply #841 on: April 25, 2012, 09:36:32 PM »
Mystia's 2nd nonspell is the only thing stopping me from perfecting her. Any real strategy, or just destroy the familiars and hope you don't get completely walled by the green waves?
Aiming to perfect every stage in Touhou. loljk don't care anymore You can find my perfects here or here.
Best perfects so far include UFO 6, MoF 4 and IN 6A.

formerly known as Seiga Kaku

Re: "Placeholder Sign [I can't think of a name]" (Spell Card Help Topic IV)
« Reply #842 on: April 25, 2012, 10:33:13 PM »
The green walls will never wall you. Just shoot the familiars and in case you miss a few, be prepared to dodge their bullets.

Re: "Placeholder Sign [I can't think of a name]" (Spell Card Help Topic IV)
« Reply #843 on: April 26, 2012, 01:46:08 AM »
UFO Hard:
What's the best way to approach Shou's first three attacks? The main idea of all three is "a bunch of stuff flies at you at once," so I'm never sure where I'm supposed to be looking and end up dying on the first or second wave.

GFW Lunatic B1:
Is there a pattern to the blue bullets in Lily Black's second attack? I can barely see them sometimes, they're so fast  :ohdear:

Re: "Placeholder Sign [I can't think of a name]" (Spell Card Help Topic IV)
« Reply #844 on: April 26, 2012, 07:21:43 AM »
UFO Hard:
What's the best way to approach Shou's first three attacks? The main idea of all three is "a bunch of stuff flies at you at once," so I'm never sure where I'm supposed to be looking and end up dying on the first or second wave.

GFW Lunatic B1:
Is there a pattern to the blue bullets in Lily Black's second attack? I can barely see them sometimes, they're so fast  :ohdear:

Don't you mean C1? B1 faces Daiyousei as a midboss in Stage 1, then Star in Stage 2 and Luna in Stage 3.
If you do mean C1, then you can watch this. There isn't any pattern. You'll just have to read n' dodge.

Lepetit89

  • Deranged Collector
Re: "Placeholder Sign [I can't think of a name]" (Spell Card Help Topic IV)
« Reply #845 on: April 26, 2012, 07:57:51 AM »
Probably got Lily White and Lily Black mixed up since Lily White is the B1 stage 2 Midboss. The blue bullets in that one are, as far as I remember, at the very least not directional. While charging up, more often than not you're too slow to get away unless you focus 100%. It's one of the more annoying patterns, yes, but the high speed of the bullets and the length of the streams makes it easy to create a track of ice all the way up to Lily White from the bottom of the screen for massive damage. Just have a finger ready to bomb.

Re: "Placeholder Sign [I can't think of a name]" (Spell Card Help Topic IV)
« Reply #846 on: April 26, 2012, 09:17:33 AM »
Well yes, it seems you already know how to approach it.  ;)
The blue lines are completely random as far as I can tell so you'll just have to keep your wits about you. At least be happy that you are dealing with straight lines. They do come at you pretty fast though so keeping a bomb ready is probably not a dumb idea.

Zil

Re: "Placeholder Sign [I can't think of a name]" (Spell Card Help Topic IV)
« Reply #847 on: April 26, 2012, 09:42:11 AM »
I could've sworn that each of the new lines was aimed right between the previous ones.

Re: "Placeholder Sign [I can't think of a name]" (Spell Card Help Topic IV)
« Reply #848 on: April 26, 2012, 09:51:31 AM »
Maybe Zil is right. What I posted was only based on what I saw in that video. I rarely ever confirm those kinds of things unless I need to in order to get consistent. (Especially not in Great Fairy Wars where there isn't any practice options.)


Lepetit89

  • Deranged Collector
Re: "Placeholder Sign [I can't think of a name]" (Spell Card Help Topic IV)
« Reply #849 on: April 26, 2012, 10:21:41 AM »
Yes, he's right, seems like the streams can actually bend a little of Lily White moves mid-shooting, though, so you can still get hit if you move just one step for each wave.

Re: "Placeholder Sign [I can't think of a name]" (Spell Card Help Topic IV)
« Reply #850 on: April 26, 2012, 11:10:06 AM »
UFO Hard:
What's the best way to approach Shou's first three attacks? The main idea of all three is "a bunch of stuff flies at you at once," so I'm never sure where I'm supposed to be looking and end up dying on the first or second wave.
Non-spells included?

I don't think there really is much to say about Shou other than read quickly and dodge accordingly. I'd probably just try to bomb them because honestly, fuck you (Shou). Her first spell is static I believe, so I guess you can kinda try to memorize a decent route through that rave party. Second spell is her easiest, what I do is stand in the second column kinda near her and slowly descend while avoiding her thrown balls. When the lasers disappear, quickly go back up to regain some breathing space. She's bound to fly above you so I wouldn't worry about not hitting her.

The Vajira lasers spell is what I call "luck". Try not to move too far from her so that the lasers don't jump all over the place (they aim for your position) and dodge the egg-bullets. Prepare for them to get real fast where you have to fit through a tiny spot while avoiding the bullets. I'd suggest bombing it because why not. Or at least try capping and if you think you can't handle it anymore, bomb it then.

Shou is kinda like the middle finger to UFO if you ask me. Every boss is manageable in their own way but Shou is like "nope" and rapes you with every dirty trick she has up her sleeve. =P

Zil

Re: "Placeholder Sign [I can't think of a name]" (Spell Card Help Topic IV)
« Reply #851 on: April 26, 2012, 01:53:37 PM »
The first spell is not static. The Vajra lasers will always follow you the same way though so you can get that to the point where you at least know what's coming.

Re: "Placeholder Sign [I can't think of a name]" (Spell Card Help Topic IV)
« Reply #852 on: April 26, 2012, 10:06:40 PM »
Probably got Lily White and Lily Black mixed up since Lily White is the B1 stage 2 Midboss.
Oops. I looked more carefully at a video of B1 and it is in fact Lily White. Guess I never noticed since she's covered in bullets the entire time :V It does seem like the blue lines kind of alternate though. I'll see if that helps next time.

Non-spells included?
I actually was including the non-spells there. I've captured her second card and have done the third non-spell twice, it's everything else that's the problem (except maybe the last card. That looks more doable, but I'd probably still bomb it out of safety anyway).

Random

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Re: "Placeholder Sign [I can't think of a name]" (Spell Card Help Topic IV)
« Reply #853 on: April 28, 2012, 01:46:35 AM »
Not for spells, but...

Is there any way to manipulate how long a UFO stays on the screen? I've see its hitbox go out of the screen with its time at 0.9 seconds, 0.7 seconds, and 0.1 seconds. Or is it just random?

Zetzumarshen

Re: "Placeholder Sign [I can't think of a name]" (Spell Card Help Topic IV)
« Reply #854 on: April 28, 2012, 02:07:18 AM »
Not for spells, but...

Is there any way to manipulate how long a UFO stays on the screen? I've see its hitbox go out of the screen with its time at 0.9 seconds, 0.7 seconds, and 0.1 seconds. Or is it just random?
No, there isn't anyway to manipulate that.

Karisa

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Re: "Placeholder Sign [I can't think of a name]" (Spell Card Help Topic IV)
« Reply #855 on: April 28, 2012, 04:27:13 AM »
I thought a UFO in the center of the screen would leave the screen earlier than if you lured it to one of the edges. Is that not actually the case?

Anyway, I have a question-- is there any pattern to the bullets near the start of Touhou 11 stage 4 (from the enemies Orin creates), or is it just random dodging? It seems aimed somehow, but streaming it doesn't seem to work...
« Last Edit: April 28, 2012, 04:28:50 AM by Karisa »

Random

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Re: "Placeholder Sign [I can't think of a name]" (Spell Card Help Topic IV)
« Reply #856 on: April 28, 2012, 04:33:11 AM »
I thought a UFO in the center of the screen would leave the screen earlier than if you lured it to one of the edges. Is that not actually the case?
Not from what I tried.

No, there isn't anyway to manipulate that.
Damn. :ohdear:

Zil

Re: "Placeholder Sign [I can't think of a name]" (Spell Card Help Topic IV)
« Reply #857 on: April 28, 2012, 05:00:59 AM »
Anyway, I have a question-- is there any pattern to the bullets near the start of Touhou 11 stage 4 (from the enemies Orin creates), or is it just random dodging? It seems aimed somehow, but streaming it doesn't seem to work...
Streaming will work if you're slow enough, though back and forth movement is easier. Something like this.

Re: "Placeholder Sign [I can't think of a name]" (Spell Card Help Topic IV)
« Reply #858 on: April 28, 2012, 01:41:58 PM »
Can anyone rate my MoF replay?
I'm planning to 1cc it, but I seem to have trouble, particularly in Stage 4 and 6.
Even though I practically already spammed bombs when I was in pinch, I still died in Stage 6.

Detailed suggestion would be very appreciated.
Here's my replay: http://replays.gensokyou.org/download.php?id=20558

Thanks beforehand :)

ふねん1

  • Scientific editor
  • If you're alive, you can always keep moving.
Re: "Placeholder Sign [I can't think of a name]" (Spell Card Help Topic IV)
« Reply #859 on: April 28, 2012, 02:30:06 PM »
Anyway, I have a question-- is there any pattern to the bullets near the start of Touhou 11 stage 4 (from the enemies Orin creates), or is it just random dodging? It seems aimed somehow, but streaming it doesn't seem to work...
The bullets are aimed in a way, but simple streaming isn't as viable since the bullets are designed to spread out a little by the time they reach you. A long time ago, Krim showed me a way to avoid that problem: circling back and forth around the same spot. It looks something like this.
"Science is more than a body of knowledge. It's a way of thinking." - Carl Sagan

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Makai Butterfly

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Re: "Placeholder Sign [I can't think of a name]" (Spell Card Help Topic IV)
« Reply #860 on: April 28, 2012, 03:40:36 PM »
Can anyone rate my MoF replay?
Detailed suggestion would be very appreciated.
Thanks beforehand :)

Here is my breakdown.  Most of it is just strategy-based, although I would highly recommend using the Faith system to your advantage to gain at least one more extra life before Stage 6 to help yourself out.

STAGE 01
 * As mentioned above, collect items as they're falling down rather than auto-collecting them unless it's pre-midboss or pre-boss.  Your faith counter will stay full and increase more if you don't feel the need to auto-collect as much.  It's a bit of a change from other games, but it will help keep your score high and give you quicker Extends.

STAGE 02
 * Pre-Midboss Hina Fairy Barrage - rather than slow-streaming them at the bottom, try looping around them completely.  Go along the side of the screen up to the top, go along the top, then down the other side of the screen.  All the bullets will miss you and you will auto-collect the green faith stars so you don't miss as many.  It saves a bomb too.
 * Boss Hina, Second Nonspell - This is an easy, static pattern with large gaps that essentially form diagonal lanes.  Spend a little time in stage practice to learn it.  You shouldn't ever need to bomb here.
 * Boss Hina, Final Spell - As the spell gets more chaotic, there should always be a gap somewhere near the middle, but I suppose this one is okay to bomb if necessary.

STAGE 03
 * Intro Fairies - Pick up their items slowly and stay on one side only so that most of the others don't die until they fly over you (this is mostly negated with Reimu A's homing amulets, of course).  It keeps your faith counter up and lowers your risk of running into bullets.
 * "Rumia" Fairies - As they create the wing-shaped arcs of bullets, don't bomb.  Just fine a path through them instead and focus on safety first, then picking up green stars second.  They are aimed at you too, so you can always use streaming to great effect.
 * Midboss Nitori Spell - Pay attention to the diagonal lines of blue bullets.  If you stay directly beneath where the center pair crisscross, you will always end up in a nice, open diamond  that gives you plenty of space to dodge the random red bullets without the risk of running into an incoming wall.
 * Wall Fairies - Try to stay near the middle as the lines of bullets fan out.  Going to one of the corners led to a bomb in your run, but honestly, dodging the bullets is an easy task.  They're slow and full of gaps.  Dodge the left ones first, then move right to dodge the other fairies walls.
 * Boss Nitori, Second Spell - These cascading blue orbs can be overwhelming at first, but the spell is actually fairly easy. Stay near the bottom for a while until it starts to draw close and use all that time to judge where the spell is least-dense.  Then just maneuver yourself through bullets going diagonally to the center left or center right to get through each wave the quickest.  If all else fails, bomb it like you did.  This spell is a forgivable bomb.
 * Boss Nitori, Third Nonspell - This is an unforgivable bomb.  This, like all of her nonspells, is a repeating zigzag.  Sit at the bottom and sway slightly right and left and macrododge the incoming orbs before the next set of zigzag lanes reaches you.  If you're consistently bombing this, you're doing something wrong.
 * Boss Nitori, Final Spell - I consider this attack okay to bomb in an emergency because she can really throw some unfair grids of lasers at you once in a while.  You did okay here, all things considered.

STAGE 04
 * First Waterfall - You should stream this section about one character's height above the bottom of the screen.  Once the aimed bullets start getting close, fall back to the bottom of the screen and stream to the other side before going back up to your original height.  This should allow you to misdirect-stream the aimed elements without needing a bomb.  Practice it a lot.  It's at the beginning of the stage, so there's no reason that you can't get away with some stage practice to iron it out.
 * Pre-Momiji Blue Fairies - Start your streaming from a corner rather than the center and work TOWARD the center so that you're lined up with Momiji when she appears and can avoid an immediate bomb.
 * Midboss Momiji - Technically this pattern is learnable and "easy" once you get the pattern.  She's often an auto-bomb for me, though, so I understand if you want to take that approach too.  You'll get the power back soon anyway.
 * Second Waterfall - Same as the first, but be ready to bomb because this one has tighter dodging and more aimed stuff.
 * Spam Fairies Post-Waterfalls - Slow-stream these guys along the bottom because the center blue orb of each barrage is aimed at you, so you can actually create nice lanes to dodge through by moving slowly in one direction rather than scattering them around.
 * Ravens - It is always more ideal to bomb their spam and then collect (or auto-collect during the bomb) back your power than it is to die by failed dodging.  Also, staying near the side of the screen puts you in less danger because you only have to read bullets from one side of the screen.
 * Boss Aya - Your Aya fight looks like most of mine, honestly.  Try to stay between rows of circle barrages to dodge her red bullet-circles easier.  It could save you a bomb.
 * Boss Aya, Survival Spell - If you're going to bomb it, try to dodge as long as possible and then bomb if you're about to get hit.  You may just get lucky and survive the entire attack.
 * Boss Aya, Final Spell - Learn the attack pattern, don't double or triple-bomb it if possible.  Dodge the sine-wave of arrowheads by always keeping yourself between rows of round bullets.  Only dodge horizontally when there are no round bullets to your sides.  It takes some practice though, but once you get the stategy down it's an easy spell.

STAGE 05
 * "Devil's Recitation" Fairies - Stream these halfway up the screen, not at the bottom.  Stay on the center-left and then slip through the pseudo-walls to the center-right once the aimed attacks start.  Fall back towards the bottom when you feel in danger and keep switching back and forth between the center left and center right and back again to misdirect the entire thing.
 * Midboss Sanae, Opener - Learn it.  Simple as that.  Very rarely, the pink bullets might wall you off, so that's okay to bomb, but it's rare.  Often, if you see an incoming pink diagonal wall, the bullets will actually have just enough space between them vertically that you can slip through the wall horizontally, so keep that in mind too.
 * Midboss Sanae, Spell - Gray Thamaturgy is clipdeath hell, so just bomb this if you're going for your first 1CC.  Then, once that's achieved, you can try to learn the spell honestly.  It's still more trouble than it's worth to me.
 * Boss Sanae, Opener - This pattern is static, so learn it.  As with her midboss opener, only bomb if you're about to be walled by the random stuff after the initial wave.
 * Boss Sanae, First Spell - Day Stars has three safepots close to each other in the center bottom of the screen.  One is the direct center bottom, the other two are just to the left or right of that.  It just takes one solid tap in either direction to reach them.  The orange shard bullets will just miss you if you do it right.  Once you learn the safespots, alternate between them as the aimed element starts closing in.  Easy easy spell.
 * Boss Sanae, Second Spell - Stream it slower and more deliberately.  You were moving around pretty wildly here.  Once the arc of the "waves" along the side allows you space to restream, make a quick movement in that direction to give yourself a gap to start restreaming back to the center.  Repeat as necessary in each direction.  Hold focus at all times except when you jump to one side to start your restreaming.
 * Boss Sanae, Third Spell - Bombs away!  I understand completely because this spell is the clipdeath of me.
 * Boss Sanae, Final Spell - If you always stay directly between two of the blue orbs at all times, as the spell starts to expand and the green "lanes" of bullets expand outward, you should never be in harms way.  The moment you stop centering yourself between green waves is the moment you have to bomb.  Try timing it out in practice to get a feel for what I mean.  It's an easy attack once mastered.

Stage 06
 * Spam Fairies - You can technically slow-streaming along the bottom of the screen to completely avoid all the ripple rings, but I tend to bomb this part too out of fear and greed to collect points, so I understand that tactic well.
 * Death Fairy - Just look for gaps and don't feel "married" to the center of the screen.  Dodge wherever there's an opening.
 * Kanako, First Spell - This spell is done with very slow streaming.  Start in the center and follow Kanako's horizontal movement once she makes her first movement.  Then just very slowly stream back to the middle, taking care to avoid the pillars as they come down.  By the time you get penned into the center, the blue amulets will still be aiming at your previous position for a moment, giving you time to start restreaming by lurching a little bit to the other side of the bottom and streaming back to the center again.  Try this youtube video if all else fails.  You honestly don't need to restream so far to the left or right.  Just moving a little bit in each direction before moving back toward the middle is fine.  It will just feel a bit more claustrophobic, but still safe.

Good luck!  That's all I can help you with at this point.  The rest of Kanako is in the video linked above, so use it as a guide and thank Zengeku for the footage. :)
« Last Edit: April 28, 2012, 04:31:58 PM by Makai Butterfly »

Re: "Placeholder Sign [I can't think of a name]" (Spell Card Help Topic IV)
« Reply #861 on: April 28, 2012, 04:14:40 PM »
Well crap, I write a long post of advice and Makai basically does one better.  :V

All I have to add to that is this:

In general, if you're using ReimuA, try to make sure your main shot hits the bosses. I noticed a lot of times where you relied exclusively on the homing shots to deal damage, which basically means the attacks take almost twice as long. That little Enemy marker at the bottom of the screen is really helpful in this regard.

I know this probably sounds weird, but capturing Hina's midboss spell was a mistake. The number of fairies that show up after the spell depends on how quickly you end it, and Hina drops a full bomb's worth of power items after the spell - so bombing here more than pays for itself in both power and faith, and you get extra points on top of that.

Chuckolator

  • ex-perfecter, good times
Re: "Placeholder Sign [I can't think of a name]" (Spell Card Help Topic IV)
« Reply #862 on: April 28, 2012, 06:32:11 PM »
The only thing really stopping me from perfecting TD stage 5 (Lunatic) are those seven fairies that appear at the same time right before Futo. How should I deal with them?
Aiming to perfect every stage in Touhou. loljk don't care anymore You can find my perfects here or here.
Best perfects so far include UFO 6, MoF 4 and IN 6A.

formerly known as Seiga Kaku

Re: "Placeholder Sign [I can't think of a name]" (Spell Card Help Topic IV)
« Reply #863 on: April 28, 2012, 06:41:52 PM »
Not really. It's hard dodging but there isn't really any pattern to it.

You can see a demonstration of it here

Generally, it's kill the middle fairy and then stick to one of the sides.

チソウ タイゼン

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Re: "Placeholder Sign [I can't think of a name]" (Spell Card Help Topic IV)
« Reply #864 on: April 28, 2012, 06:44:59 PM »
Uuu~
Taizen Chisou Returns to Double Spoiler: This Time It's A Bunch Of Crap

And this is at 60FPS :fail:

Okay, so, here are some trouble spots:

All of stage five (except Electrified Nyuudou, which I never cleared in my old file [despite clearing every other one in my old file])
Most of stage four, such as all of Nitori's attacks (not Water Carpet) and Rabies Bite.
Japanese Poison Spider, and.... something else from stage three.

I'm wondering how the hell I got to stage eight last time :getdown:

you guyyyysss


Jx31

  • Hot Garbage
Re: "Placeholder Sign [I can't think of a name]" (Spell Card Help Topic IV)
« Reply #865 on: April 29, 2012, 02:57:20 PM »
Hurr UFO hard mode question, how do I approach Kogasa's first spell card?  Is there something obivous with this attack that I haven't noticed?  The attack is flat out slaughtering me  :(.

I'm using RemuiB btw.
« Last Edit: April 29, 2012, 03:49:24 PM by Jx31 »

Zil

Re: "Placeholder Sign [I can't think of a name]" (Spell Card Help Topic IV)
« Reply #866 on: April 29, 2012, 04:02:46 PM »
Unless you use SanaeB, you'll pretty much to safespot it by standing on Kogasa's legs. Otherwise... yeah. Don't ask why the stage 2 boss has the hardest spell in the game.

ふねん1

  • Scientific editor
  • If you're alive, you can always keep moving.
Re: "Placeholder Sign [I can't think of a name]" (Spell Card Help Topic IV)
« Reply #867 on: April 29, 2012, 04:16:40 PM »
Hurr UFO hard mode question, how do I approach Kogasa's first spell card?  Is there something obivous with this attack that I haven't noticed?  The attack is flat out slaughtering me  :(.

I'm using RemuiB btw.
From what I've heard, ReimuB sucks (relatively) at killing the parasols in that attack. Preventing said parasols from getting too close to you requires sweeping under them when they're still to one side, but it takes good maneuvering between the other bullets to do that. Other than suggesting you use a different shot, I'd say try to make sure the parasols don't get too close, just like I described. Be thankful you actually have the room on Hard to do it like that. :V

Unless you use SanaeB, you'll pretty much to safespot it by standing on Kogasa's legs. Otherwise... yeah. Don't ask why the stage 2 boss has the hardest spell in the game.
ReimuA and MarisaA are not that bad at PSM either. BaitySM was the one who did all the testing with that card ages ago, ask him about it.

And Greatest Treasure says hi.
"Science is more than a body of knowledge. It's a way of thinking." - Carl Sagan

NEW AND IMPROVED YOUTUBE, now with 60 fps Touhou videos! Latest video update: WBaWC Lunatic/Extra no-miss no-bomb no-Roars no-Spirit-Strikes compilation.

Esper

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Re: "Placeholder Sign [I can't think of a name]" (Spell Card Help Topic IV)
« Reply #868 on: April 29, 2012, 06:02:27 PM »
Is Taizou chopped liver or something?

Electrified Nyuudou
Basically, try to predict where the lasers will go based on Unzan's position. It shouldn't be too hard.

I don't have anything else, I'm sorry, I don't remember most of the cards and I'm mentally attached to MoF Extra right now. Gotta break 700 million! :V
My profile picture is whimsy until I feel like adding something else.

Enjoy.

BT

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Re: "Placeholder Sign [I can't think of a name]" (Spell Card Help Topic IV)
« Reply #869 on: April 29, 2012, 06:25:12 PM »
I think the reason no one's answering is because those cards are kind of unmemorable. Like most of StB/DS, unfortunately.