"Placeholder Sign [I can't think of a name]" (Spell Card Help Topic IV)

[xForeverFanaticx]

Wtf is Orin's third nonspell? I see some pattern there, but still cant get it

EDIT: Assuming that you're talking about SA stage 5.

Basically, there are a certain number of wisps that she fires omnidirectionally, the angles of each are probably either random or relative to your position. Either way, you'll notice that the wisps shoot omnidirectional bullets while they themselves move outwards slowly. The way I deal with it is not to try to stay beneath Orin as much as possible, but rather to always position myself in the general path of a wisp (if that makes sense). The bullets there are much easier to dodge because you deal with them moving in one direction instead of 2 (you would be facing 2 if you were between the paths of 2 wisps, where the wider moving bullets converge from the 2 adjacent wisps).

To sum it up:

-Orin shoots wisps in all directions
-the wisps shoot the actual bullets
-stay near or at the bottom of the screen
-position yourself "in front of" or in the path of the wisp
-do NOT stay between the paths of 2 wisps
-don't worry about Orin's HP as much, it's fairly low IMO

[MMX]

EDIT: Assuming that you're talking about SA stage 5.

Yes. Her 3rd boss nonspell.

-position yourself "in front of" or in the path of the wisp
-do NOT stay between the paths of 2 wisps
-don't worry about Orin's HP as much, it's fairly low IMO

Err.. I still don't get it. Once i try to look wich way those "wisps" go, i miss some bullet coming my way and die :ohdear:

[Zil]

It's a static pattern but aimed randomly. It's kinda tough to memorize, but that's what you'll want to do. Personally I find (on Lunatic) that standing right between the paths of two wisps is easiest. (So as the wisps keep moving I will be at an equal distance from each.) That way you get diagonal bullets converging in front of you, and then you zip up between them once they cross. It's easier to see the symmetry of the pattern thet way. It may be very different on Normal, so just find and memorize a good path.

[Random]

I like going in the middle for Normal, but here's a replay with both for Normal:

http://www.replays.gensokyo.org/download.php?id=19190

[xForeverFanaticx]

Urgh I can't explain well xD

basically, the paths of the wisps (or rather, the direction they're going in is much easier to understand with this) can be seen from the bullets. They will fan out, and you should be able to see a few distinct points on the entire screen.

this picture should help:


the dark green circles are where the wisps are located
the light green/yellow arrows are the paths of the wisps
the pink circles are the 3 blue bullets that I personally use to indicate the paths

I use those 3 bullets because IMO they're easily noticeable. Just look for the 3-point "head" of each path, and then you'll know the path's direction. Squeeze into it (or stay close to it but around it if you want) and dodge there.

I personally don't like dodging 2 diagonals by dashing up and down >~< The symmetry is a little hard to follow sometimes when you're between 2 paths, and it's on a bad angle :\

And don't worry, the wisps won't reach you. If you've seen replays and such, you'll notice they disappear shortly after spawning.

[Esper]

It's a static pattern but aimed randomly..

...GENIUS.

[Kanade]

Sorry to butt in but any tips for hard Ichirin's last spell card (forgot the name)? I just can't do it for some reason...

[Byaaakuren]

Is Orin's Blazing Wheel doable without bombing on Ultra?

[Zengeku]

Sorry to butt in but any tips for hard Ichirin's last spell card (forgot the name)? I just can't do it for some reason...

The giant fists are aimed at your vertical position so you can misdirect them by moving up a bit when the fists are about to strike. Then you back down and dodge the lasers there. It isn't too terribly bad once you know this because it gives you better room to dodge the lasers.

[MMX]

xForeverFanaticx Oh thanks. Last night i was tired and sleepy, and when i tried it today i've got the point. When i see a clusterfuck coming down i get closer to it and dodging the rest becomes easier.

Also i vote for "Needle Mountain" as one ofe the most successfull trollcards ever. I know, those ghost wheels are kinda aimed at player, but in some weird way. And i cant see the shit coming while focused on dodging slow pellets.

And one more question: Does Orin have a hitbox on her last spell? :wat:

[Zil]

Nope, no hitbox on the last spell. She we also stop shooting shuriken if you get close enough to the source.

[Seppo Hovi]

For the third nonspell, you can safespot it. Either in the middle of everything, on top of Orin, but I think it's rather hard to reach since the nonspell we're talking about starts right after the following Spell Card. For survival, I myself prefer just going in the middle of the bullets-stream-thingies. You don't have to really dodge anything, just look out for incoming bullets, and move if there are any. I'll take some images on the replay here and edit them to this post in a sec.  (You probably shouldn't refer to my replay much for anything else, since it has somewhat horrible everything)

Ok, look. This nonspell tactic I use partially trusts on RNG. Here's what it could be if you had good RNG:


The waves of bullets are coming straight at you, or probably somewhere near you; no need to move much. The "pink arrow" points the way the spirits are going. You should get in the middle of that pink arrow; in the middle of the bullet paths. The bullets are all going to the ways the spirits are going, so you only need to move when you need to change streams.

Sometimes, however, our efforts get crushed by bad RNG, and the spirit streams are too far from you to get into. Then, you might actually have to dodge one or two bullet. Don't dodge them both simultaneously, it's hard and meant for people like Zil who like it hard (no, uhh, offense or puns intended). Or, at least if you have trouble reading bullets from several directions simultaneously, I wouldn't recommend it. Instead, I suggest going "into" the another stream again, but not as deep into it as you could go to be fully safe. You need to go to the outer reaches of it, and now you have some room to dodge into, if you're in the correct place. Good, since you're going to need that when the spirits get too near and the another stream's bullets get to your way. Dodge through them, it shouldn't be too hard since they're not too dense.


This was all really hard to explain with images. Urhg, hopefully the replay is more clear.

[LeviLamprey]

Uhm.
Okuu's Normal cards and nonspells?
That is all.
Aside from Fixed Star, which is easy~
Please and thankyou in advance ;A:

[Zengeku]

The first spell. Know that the sunballs are aimed at you which should be pretty obvious. You'll then have to move back and forth around the balls while dodging the blue bullets. Its not exactly easy nor is there any tricks to really make it easier and its a pretty hard spell by Normal difficulty standards.

The 2nd spell you'll probably want to look for the huge explosions and try to predict ahead where the safe areas are going to be. Still, its much more about dodging than it is about no how.

The 4th spell. Its about paying attention to two directions at once. Position yourself in the center of the screen, under Utsuho between the two suns. Then dodge the bullets the best you can.

[LeviLamprey]

Augh...
So it seems that she really is no strategy and all learning...
Just as I thought ;A;

[MMX]

Speaking of Okuu. I've heard that it matters wich way to stream bubbles on her 2nd and 4th nonspells. Is that so? :wat:
Also, i've just captured Hell's Artifical Sun in practice on my first try That was nothing too difficult, just be careful, dont panic or make stupid moves, and know that red bullets have very small hitboxes.

[Elysia]

Nitori on Lunatic. By that I mean every damn spellcard she has since every single one of them is an instant bomb, and in the case of her midboss card, it's TWO.

At least her nonspells are easy...

[ふねん1]

Nitori on Lunatic. By that I mean every damn spellcard she has since every single one of them is an instant bomb, and in the case of her midboss card, it's TWO.

At least her nonspells are easy...

I'll reference Stage 3 of this replay as a guide.

You shouldn't need two bombs on Hydro Camouflage. Wait until the bullets get closer to you, then deathbomb it. If you're looking for a capture, it's a case of staying in an open space between the rows of normal white bullets while reading the glowing blue ones. The ways the latter spread toward you are admittedly kind of awkward, so it takes getting used to.

Trauma in the Glittering Depths should be her easiest card. Look for where a nearby wave reaches a peak or trough, and stay just above or below that region. Leave yourself enough space to dodge the aimed bullets.

Kappa's Great Illusionary Waterfall is a dodging card. Try your best to find as open a space as possible, and if you find an opportunity to go up above the rest of the bullets, do so. To my eyes anyway, the "additive-blending" effect of the bullets isn't as egregious on this card as it is on some others elsewhere in Touhou, but I don't know how well you tend to see them.

Why ZUN decided to make Spin the Cephalic Plate a totally different attack from the lower difficulty versions is beyond me. This is a streaming attack at its core. Start off luring Nitori to the right, and once the first wheel spreads out, go through it and then dash all the way to the left of the screen. Stay above the bottom here so the pellets are misdirected away from where you'll be going. When the second wheel spreads, slip through that one and then go back under Nitori. Keep an eye out for any pellets that approach you here. If you're going to dodge them, make sure you won't have to go through another wheel at the same time. Move to a clearer space on either side of the screen whenever you need to do the latter.

[Zil]

Okay, Okuu...

There may appear to be no strategy but there are some things you can take advantage of. Knowing that the suns are aimed on the first spell, you'll want to start out under her doing as much damage as you can, then quickly shift over a bit right before she fires the first sun. (The timing I use here is on Lunatic, but I assume it can be done on Normal.) If I recall correctly, you can use the fading "Caution!" warning to help get the timing. So you move over, misdirecting the first aimed sun, then go right back under her. Now she'll fire another sun at you of course. Stay under her for as long as you can, then move over just a bit to stall for time. As the edge of the sun she just aimed at you falls under the screen, use a bomb and stand directly under her again. Now what should happen is the bomb lasts just long enough to cancel out the next aimed sun and you can sit there shooting her for a good amount of time. Wait until the next sun is about to hit you and reapeat what you just did. If you bomb too early the second time you may need to misdirect the next wave after your bomb. (I realize on Lunatic she firs two suns so the timing's going to be different and you may need to learn different timings, but I assume it can only be easier with less suns to cancel.) Doing it like that should always take only two bombs and takes almost no dodging, just timing misdirections. This is the only video I have of myself doing it, and sorry I don't know how to link to a specific part in the video. There is a link to the beginning of stage 6 in the description though, and I think the spell starts at 16:00. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m6TNEy_IV4Y
Now for her second and fourth non-spells, there is indeed a good way to stream the bubbles as MMX mentioned. For the second one, stream the first wave of bubbles to the right and you will be on the safer side of the screen for when Okuu starts flying around. The next wave should be streamed to the left, and so on. For the fourth nonspell you use the same idea but the first wave is streamed left. If all that's too risky for you, you may try "abusing" those two nonspells like I did in that video. It's very difficult to describe so hopefully you get the idea from just seeing it.
The third nonspell should have a "safe" elevation, much like the spell after it, but it will not be the same as it is on Lunatic.

Nitori...

If you want to use only one bomb for the midboss spell, I have a trick for doing that every time. As you are streaming the fairies before she appears, quickly go to the side and rush up to the PoC just as Nitori arrives. Then quickly dash directly in front of her and sit there for a bit. The "bullet" bullets should loop around you completely, and the circular ones will wave around on top of Nitori before they shoot out. As soon as they do (if you wanna look pro you may time a death-bomb) bomb and start backing up. That bomb will be right on top of her to deal maximum damage, and you should deplete her health before you have to dodge anything else.
For the first boss spell, I try to look for the "valleys" being formed in the streams (the low points of a sine wave graph, if you will) and stand right in that spot, though a bit up to the left. When Nitori fires her aimed bullets, just stream a bit over to the right while staying in the safespot.

It looks like Funen just jumped in before me. I don't wanna delete what I wrote, but yeah, that's the idea there.

[xForeverFanaticx]

*mumblemumble* can anyone describe how Cat's Walk works? I'm just wondering if the rings are semi-randomly generated at static points? Cuz I hate it... @@
On Normal mode btw.

[Zil]

It's random, I think. If you're at full power and you follow her around and then stay in the middle while dodging you should only have to dodge one wave. But yes, it's random.

[Chuckolator]

What do we know about the Hanako-san in the Toilet bug? There has to be something that causes it, I doubt something like this can be completely random. Surprised there hasn't been a patch for it, actually. >_>

And I hate to bump, but

Big Crunch and Open Universe seem to be Marisa's resident life/bomb dumps. Any tips?

[xForeverFanaticx]

Suggestions or tips for a UFO run(normal for now, though I've cleared it already. Planning on using Sanae this time around)? I'm planning on going for the first red ufo, and then stock up on bombs in stage 1/2 and then lives from then on(except for some situations where I'll be mixing it around as improvisation, and in stage 6 where it's bombs all the way unless they're maxed)

btw, I've noticed that the life and bomb stocks max out at one more than they show . _ ." I can stock an extra bomb in regular runs I've noticed(as in I can use a bomb, and then it looks as if it's still full). ANd when I play in practice, I can die once without making a visible difference in my life stock on-screen. Is this normal? Cuz it doesn't seem so O.o

ANd yes, going for a hard run later on once I become more used to Murasa and Shou's cards @@

[Zil]

You can hold one more than the screen shows, yes.

Please don't tell me you are maxing out your bomb stock in a 1cc attempt. Only go for red UFOs. Within reason, of course. A green is better than nothing.
"Stocking up" on bombs doesn't make any sense, and if you are reaching the maximum something seriously strange is going on.

[xForeverFanaticx]

oh nonononono
I get a reasonable amount (if around half-ish of the max, maybe 1 more or something(so around 5 total)? You start with 2/9 anyway), then lives. Is this okay? ALso, once I get more comfortable with the spells on normal, should I begin substituting greens for blues or reds for blues? I'm thinking greens aren't needed as much, provided that I actually bomb when I should xD.

[Byaaakuren]

oh nonononono
I get a reasonable amount (if around half-ish of the max, maybe 1 more or something(so around 5 total)? You start with 2/9 anyway), then lives. Is this okay? ALso, once I get more comfortable with the spells on normal, should I begin substituting greens for blues or reds for blues? I'm thinking greens aren't needed as much, provided that I actually bomb when I should xD.

UFO is a game that requires some sort of plan. For me, I found that going for only reds wasn't a great idea as I tend to clip stuff while chasing a blinking UFO before it turned blue. Instead, I decided to go into Practice and worked my way through the stage without relying on grabbing resources (mainly spamming Blues and Rainbows.) Took me a while to get my first Normal 1CC but I felt satisfied with my clear (even though I summoned more Reds than I wanted)

[MMX]

*mumblemumble* can anyone describe how Cat's Walk works? I'm just wondering if the rings are semi-randomly generated at static points? Cuz I hate it... @@
On Normal mode btw.

Looks like positions of rings are static, while the bullets in them have some random deviations. I do it like this Chase Orin until she crosses the middle second time and stay there. Then dodge rings one by one. Try to look one ring ahead (once the bullets in it get blue it starts expanding). Don't panic and you'll be fine. Also it's possible to go to the left when first of 3 last rings starts expanding, wich makes dodging the rest easier, but it may be risky so look at how strong is this ring distorted. And if it does so, it's better to dodge in the middle. With Reimu A at full power you only need to dodge one wave of rings. Dunno about other shottypes.

[xForeverFanaticx]

I see... Hmm I guess it sorta one of those cards where you just have to go with it because of the random placement of bullets in the static positions? So follow Orin til she is just about to leave the screen(in which case I'd stay in the middle rather than follow her to the edge)? Got it. I'll try that out later, once I get this annoying Geography stuff out of the way @@

[Goldom]

Personally on UFO, I used to prioritize reds for survival, but have been doing much better going for greens and using them liberally. My best game so far in terms of lives left, I basically went 100% green for first 3 stages, then switched to red for most of the rest. Of course, there are some places where another color is basically the only choice. And then there's stage 4 with 20 UFOs bouncing around all day and no way to touch them =(

[xForeverFanaticx]

ikr, the ufo spam in stage 4 when theres the death fairies and the columns of bullets are just... ughhhh y u no let me get ufos? (>; ~ >
But if you do manage to get them and destroy them, good for screen-clears~

And I usually get maxed out with bombs(or almost, maybe 1 or 2 left) by the end of stage 2 if I actually try for bombs the whole time. Dun needs stage 3 to get all bombs. I needs bombs FOR stage 3 (eeeeh. Overstatement. Just for the last spellcard maybe. I need help on the lasers from the eyes)