Diablo Mafia (Prime Evils win)

[Decade]

@Barb: He's tripping over his claim to try to set me up to look bad if he managed to survive.

I do realize this is quite possible. It could be a logic failure regardless of whether he's telling the truth or not. But might as well grill him (Especially since I'm on the side that wants Bremm dead more today, even if Eyeback will follow tomorrow. It will also give him another chance to track someone and give us info that may or may not be useful depending on whether Eyeback is actually scum or not.)

[Den-O]

Yes, let the claimed likely scum power role live longer. THAT'S intelligent.

[Skull]

Back up a second.
Why did you track Bloodwitch?

This is so retarded. Town's priority is to eliminate anti-Town elements. Survivors are not pro-Town.

I've already stated why I have trouble believing Sorc and her party were "Anti-town" elements. I wasn't against the sorc lynch for information purposes, and I'm not crying over Beetle's death by any means, but I don't think, given the information that we have that the last survivor is of higher priority than, say, people whom the town win condition actively needs to be dead. I get what your point is, but it just doesn't apply in the current scenario.

Raka: No, I'm not a lyncher. It'll all make sense after the game. Probably.

8 Cuts: Eyeback, stop being angry and fucking around.

[Ouja]

Possibly, but I couldn't know. I figured trying to get something out of Fire Eye was the easiest way to do things. Turns out it's nothing to do with Extra Fast. Outside of scum powers or just anti-town Tracker abilities all I can think of is if my Spectral Hit hit an immunity and changes the element of my actions, too.

Because that's what Spectral Hit does. It changes the element of my vote. It may also affect Open Wounds and if "reduced effectiveness" means "lol ure roleblockt" when I attempt it on one then... what is this nonsense etc.

On Bloodwitch at least I got a proper result which says she targeted no one.

But yeah, I'll let you guys figure out this mess because you're so convinced my ideas that Third Parties deserve death is completely scummy and that I can't be a Town Tracker it's honestly making my brain hurt even more than it already did way in D2 when I stopped being able to make sense of all this.


And yeah, Barbarian, listen to Rakanishu. She can't be wrong, after all. Aggressively pushing without ever producing a case and arbitrarily deciding scum... if she's Town, she's harming Town more than Scum so far. If she's Scum, well, noose and lynch.

I should probably look into it. Scum pushing hard for Town Power roles to get lynched isn't so uncommon, especially if there's zero justification (and no, UK, "he quicklynched a Survivor" is not justification) and all the zeal of something silly.

Fire Eye, since you mentioned it: I call Nihlatak and co lazy and opportunistic because opening a day with ##Vote The Guy Who Quicklynched pretends you're actually doing something. You assume a quicklyncher has no reason to do what he does and will not come forward with an explanation. You presume that someone who quicklynches is completely and utterly unaware of how much MOTK hates people who do things like that and assumes he'll be let scot free for it.

The case on me is lazy and opportunistic because they're jumping at something that would naturally be explained by the offender, and I had honestly expected Town to realise just how goddamn lazy opening the Day with ##Vote Obvious Target and nothing else to say.

I'll save it for the post-game, then, and make this my last Mafia game.

[Ouja]

And no, I remain angry. Because you guys are not thinking. You're putting on blinders and pretending that there is absolute scum in quicklynching a goddamn third party. You pretend that it's a perfectly valid, self-evident case and throw all other things out the window. It's obvious who I am, I should think, given my way with language.

Do you honestly expect anyone on MOTK, though, would be so dropdead retarded as to quicklynch someone and not understand the consequences? It's a nulltell, ffs.

[Ouja]

In fact I'll ask all of you who vote me for quicklynching the goddamn third party: explain how scum benefits from this movement, and why scum know they can get away with it. If I am scum, then clearly there are scumbuddy connections.

Town!Eyeback lynched because he worried Town would do The Stupid Thing and suffer ITPs to live in some naive assumption that ITPs are pro-Town.
Now I want to know what Scum!Eyeback gains. Yes, I'm invoking WIFOM. Deal with it, you're pretending it's a scum move, I want you to explain it now.

[Pesco]

Ancient Tunnels Votecount

Eyeback (2): Fire Eye, Rakanishu
Bremm (2): Barbarian, Eyeback
Barbarian (1): Bremm

Not voting: Coldcrow, The Summoner, Corpsefire, Bloodwitch the Wild, Nihlathak

10 alive, 4 votes to lynch
55% time remaining

[Decade]

About all this third party lynch debate: Sorc needed to die (Ex:What if she's lying about being a survivor, or about her wincon), but after new information has come up including the stuff her flip confirmed, her partner does not need to die.

Along with Sorc needed to die is Eyeback isn't scum because of hammering. There wasn't a super huge amount of time left anyway.

[Decade]

EWBOP:I don't mean he's not scum, due to having hammered, just saying it doesn't MAKE him scum.

 

[Den-O]

Actually I posted a case Day 2. Maybe if you actually read the fucking game you'd know that, Eyeback. But keep discrediting me. Get angry. Be a fucking troll. That's what scum want, right?

Your AtE is pissing me off because I can't tell if it's fake or real. All I know is it's provocative, which is just as anti town, if not more so, than I supposedly am being, according to you.

[Den-O]

Look, I need to review my case on you and repost it. YOU need to take a fucking breather and come back when you can post something that's not useless chaff.

Deal, Eyeback? I'm honestly starting to question myself here, so I'd prefer not to have to come back to more provocation that's going to lead me to rage tunnel on you.

[Ouja]

I'm not appealing to your emotions, I want you to state a case logically and concisely. You voted me today going only on about my vote on Sorceress and the resulting lynch.

I'll quote your case for you:

Eyeback 216 gives me AWFUL vibes. I mean, is it possible to qualify your statements any MORE than that? "Raka is town but not TOO town because she might slip up so I can mislynch her" "Dead people are dead" "Summoner hasn't done anything today. Let's wait and see if my opinion magically changes." I'll give you that you have solid opinions on Sorc and Beetleburst, but seriously, the rest feels so CONTRIVED. I don't like it at all.

Eyeback or Nih can die in a fire since they're completely unrelated to Sorc, just they look awful.

Misrepresentations (implying I want to 'mislynch' you), and making ridicule of what I said. Oh, and I look awful.

Link me to this magical case of yours, Rakanishu.

[Skull]

I'm fairly certain no one is lynching you for the quicklynch, or for the fact that you were targeting third party anymore. You had by no means a strong presence on Day two, and your quicklynch came in out of no where with no explanation. I voted you because I wanted an explanation for why you felt the day needed to end early. You brought up the issue of the ITP in your defense. Now, you are being Angry, and difficult, and this is what's causing people to think you are scum. You are biting at the people who are still trying to reason with you, and since you refuse to reason back, those people have quickly given up.

Honestly, even if you flip town, I doubt your claim would make me take a sideways glance on Raka.

There wasn't a super huge amount of time left anyway.

At least 24 hours by my count, if activity continued at the rate it did.

[Ouja]

And you ninja me with the promise of making one.

See, the above is why I accuse you of having no case. That's no case. It doesn't say that I am scummy or why. Just that you feel uneasy about parts of it and that you think I look awful. I don't know why or how I look awful and all I get is you debunking my post with twistings of my words and then further parading that I am absolute scum today for no reason other than the hammer on claimed ITP.

I don't care for emotion or whatever. I want a quantified case I can take serious so I can stop thinking you're all falling over yourself locking into a lynch that isn't even supported by logic. I don't want Town to look back on D3 and think, "OK, Eyeback got lynched... Town Tracker, because he hammered an ITP. Shit, no one has a case, are they all scum?", I want Town to be able to look at the solid cases out there on why I am scum and decide from there which one rings true and which one is just crap.

Now, do you understand why I might just be a little bit annoyed people do nothing but relentlessly attack and chant how I am scum, discarding reason and thought?

And I know Fire Eye has been saying more things, but they're nothing more than blind accusations under the assumption I'm scum. Yeah, look hard enough and you can paint a lot of actions as scum.

Demanding I express suspicion as if it is a quantifiable number is also a joke, and refusing to do it yourself is also a joke. Coldcrow applies reasons to accuse people of being scum that apply to himself as well, and deftly avoids answering any questions about it. No one questions it. The crowd voting me is just being silly and frustrating because they make no sense from my point of view.

[Den-O]

Then show me how that was misrep? You were completely waffly in that entire post. I used hyperbole, but the base point was you literally had no strong opinions in that post at all. And, as Nih says, your presence was fairly not found for most of Day 1 and Day 2.

Secondly, you are appealing to my emotions and everyone elses. You're trying to ridicule me so I get pissed off at you. People who are pissed off make mistakes. Whether it's scummy or not depends on if you were intending to do that. So, you have a choice. You can calm the fuck down, post something reasonable, or you can die for your baiting.

And you ninja me by discrediting what WAS a case. I DO actually say why it's awful. I state it's contrived. I state that your statements are qualified. I didn't SAY they were safe but that's what I mean. So I really have no idea how to make it more clear to you, and I'm honestly getting pissed off at the implication that's not a case.

[Den-O]

EBWOP: Oh, bonus points for misrepping what I said. I said I'd review and repost the case, not that I have to make one.

I can't even read your posts anymore without getting an anyeurism because the way you're seeing things is NOT HOW THEY FUCKING ARE IN REALITY. It's REALLY FUCKING FRUSTRATING to be baited and misrepped, and I AM FUCKING TIRED OF IT

[Decade]

At least 24 hours by my count, if activity continued at the rate it did.

I recall Pesco saying that days end at 12%, which means there wasn't even 15% time left.

Although, I don't think I've ever seen this mentioned in the thread, so it's not impossible he was messing with me. I generally accept that I can't be sure whether he's kidding or not about anything he says in irc.

In the meanwhile, gonna just step away from the thread for a bit while people calm down. Or while they don't calm down.

[Ouja]

Who's baiting? I'm saying you have no case. I never said I wanted to mislynch you. That same line could have been taken for what it is: I think Rakanishu is Town, but I am certainly not married to that assumption; I'm not 100% she's Town.

I threw it out there because at the time I thought my Track showed you targetted no one and I felt it was pretty unlikely scum'd be so devoid of power. If I died for some freak reason, or if I claimed later, I could point at it and say, "See, I softcrumbed it a bit".

Instead, you take it to mean that scum!Eyeback is saying he wants to mislynch you later and throws out that line for no reason.

That's a misrepresentation, because you give only one presentation of the analysis of that statement, which holds true only if you assume I'm scum.

I'm not baiting, nor am I trolling or whatever. You're exaggerating and blowing my actions out of proportion. Yes, I mad, but that's for all the reasons I already stated. People are being stupid without being furious enough already, what makes you think my express purpose is infuriating people so they lynch me? That makes no sense. It makes more sense that I'd be annoyed over how weak the cases against me are and how people are zealously pushing it with no room for possibility that the target is Town, providing little rhyme or reason to the entire ordeal.

[Den-O]

Stop fucking kidding yourself.

You're telling me THAT LINES LIKE THIS: "And yeah, Barbarian, listen to Rakanishu. She can't be wrong, after all. Aggressively pushing without ever producing a case and arbitrarily deciding scum... if she's Town, she's harming Town more than Scum so far. If she's Scum, well, noose and lynch."
"(and no, UK, "he quicklynched a Survivor" is not justification) " (SOMETHING I NEVER SAID)
"But hey, it's a scum claim, why would you argue it with me? There's no possible way I could be Town, right? And clearly when I die it's a non-issue you don't have to worry about. Not like I could possibly be an honest-to-goodness Tracker on Town's side or anything."
"Misrepresentations (implying I want to 'mislynch' you), and making ridicule of what I said. Oh, and I look awful. Link me to this magical case of yours, Rakanishu." (This is more on top of everything else)

Seriously, you think that's not fucking baiting? You don't think that pisses people off? WHAT THE FUCK IS WRONG WITH YOUR GOD DAMN HEAD, EYEBACK!? ARE YOU SERIOUSLY THIS FUCKING DENSE!?

Now, as for your accusations of misrep, you're taking hyperbole seriously, which is kind of fucking stupid. When I said that, I was implying you were keeping your options open on me. Scum have more reason to do that then town. ANYONE WITH TWO FUCKING BRAIN CELLS KNOWS THIS.

I'm done with you. You are literally too fucking stupid or sociopathic to understand what the fuck you're doing, or to comprehend what the fuck other people are saying.

And yes, I'm aware this post is just going to piss you off. I'LL FUCKING OWN THAT, UNLIKE YOU'RE COWARDLY BAITING SOCIOPATHIC FUCKING ASSSSSSSS!

[Den-O]

EBWOP: And with that, Mod, replace me out. I don't have the emotional energy nor the ability to play this game.

See ya Eyeback, you'll NEVER HAVE TO HEAR FROM ME AGAIN =D!

[Pesco]

Rakanishu and Eyeback have been modkilled.

Rakanishu was a Superunique.
Eyeback was a Superunique.

Night 3 begins now. 24 hours to send in your actions. Notify me if you aren't doing anything. Day 4 will begin when all actions are in.

[Pesco]

Bloodwitch was killed overnight.

Bloodwitch was a Superunique

It is now LyLo.
7 alive, 3.5 votes to lynch.
100% time remaining

[W]

Why did the day had to end like this? *Sigh* This isn't really helping. Also this is LyLo? . . .

Wait... LyLo than that means...
> Lylo -> 7 alive. What does this tell us? There is equal amount of scum + townies.
> 7 does not make up 50/50 distribution
> 3 - 1 - 3 !
> LyLo confirmed.
> Eyeback and Rakanishu must have been town... which...

Hi Barbarian, let us have a word with you.

About all this third party lynch debate: Sorc needed to die (Ex:What if she's lying about being a survivor, or about her wincon), but after new information has come up including the stuff her flip confirmed, her partner does not need to die. Along with Sorc needed to die is Eyeback isn't scum because of hammering. There wasn't a super huge amount of time left anyway.

EWBOP:I don't mean he's not scum, due to having hammered, just saying it doesn't MAKE him scum.

"Wasn't super huge amount of time left anyway?" ANY information that we could've gotten would have been valuable.  Modco's votecount timer says 26% in #332. It's not huge but neither its TINY.

First, in D1 you indeed totally avoided Sorceress. Sorceress was possible lynch in D1 and when people asked your opinion, you claimed she was uninteresting/Townish. HOW can someone who is suspecting by multiple people be possible UNINTERESTING? You know? I think you are scum along with Nihlatak and Bremm or a sorceress partner. Let's check a vote count check first:

Vote count 1 <-- Sorc is on summoner wagon. You are on Bloodwitch for RVS punishment.
Vote count 2 <-- Sorc unvotes, wagons on Countess.
Vote count 3 <-- You swap to summoner for reason #173

What do I conclude from this:
> Sorceress changes target for her own reasons. Sure, acceptable. We need to hunt scum and Countess was really looking bad.
> Suddenly you wagon on Summoner, a potential lynch wagon which I was pushing the hardest before.
> Opportunistic reads. But makes no sense. Let's check Sorceress claim/flips: Survivor -> Flips as survivor mason -> Must have partner. -> Can use items if she is on the wagon
> Sorceress, on countess sure-lynch. &  Barbarian, on potential sure-lynch. Either wagon would work for you.


Let us check Sorceress lynching day to see how you behaved and start of D2:
Barbarian #243
List of suspects, Sorc leaning town. No cases/reads specified except hard on Bremm and Summoner.

In this post you blame summoner for bandwagon: "....A little bit later one person asks for votes on Sorc and you just go "HOORAY BANDWAGONING" and vote her. It's not condemning or anything, but... this just doesn't feel right." but you bandwagoned HARD on summoner yourself as well. And you didn't even had a solid case on WHY.

"If Bremm is not scum I will eat my hat. Even if I can't explain it terribly well, I'm just so so sure he must be scum. Everything about him just... UNNYYEEEEEEUUUUGGGHGHHHHH SCUM"
> I am so sure > so sure > so sure. How? Why? Where is your case? Where is your case? You have no case! Good job! Being sure about something which rest of us is unsure. And Barbarian doesn't even bothers to help out.

#247
Sorc is... uninteresting? Bear with me? Here, you are trying to move Rakanishu away from the Sorceress wagon trying to prevent her lynch.

#262
Bremm scum scum scum scum. Raka please do not vote for Sorc, and dont focus on Nihla please! ...

In the mean while, Sorc claims and Barbarian drops silent. Not a word. Nothing to comment. Everybody posted something, except Barbarian.

#317
Suddenly Sorc must die. Out of nowhere! 
> "Bremm and Nihlatak still scum."  <-- we understood your bussing on Bremm, why the sudden Nihlatak? Why was Nihlatak first useless to lynch as he would be not informative and now suddenly scum. Where are your cases.
> In the meanwhile you stayed on the super bus 180km/h, because switching to Sorceress for you is a BAD idea. You didn't had a case anyway. And favourite-wagon jumping would make you suspicious.

Also votecount in D2 <-- Hi Nihaltak, how nice of you to be on the Sorceress wagon. Lets look at your reasoning when you voted for Sorc:  #256 Opportunistic trying to end fast.

#339
"Bremm is still scum so I'm going to concentrate on that at the moment." <-- No case (wtf happened to your Nihlatak scum pointing?). Wagoning with Eyeback hard. (Yay more opertunity to lynch your own scum buddy Bremm. Especially how you claimed you were so sure of Bremm being scum.

Yes, It all makes sense to me now. I know why you knew for sure. Because you are his partner and so is Nihlatak.

Final conclusion: Barbarian scum. Additionally,  FoS on both Nihlatak and Bremm partner.
- D1 D2 & D3 you were bad. 0 cases, opportunistic behaviour. Swaying left to right.
- What irks me a lot is that Nihlatak also tried hard to defend. And you pointed at each other for odd reasons but neither of you had cases on each other.
- Trying to get Bremm lynched so you will come out clean. Super bussing FTW ?
- Nihlatak constantly refuses to play this game while Rakanishu called him out 3834028 times. Flying super man style below radar.

Either way, Barbarian, your GUT =D nulltell non-existent cases and scummy superbussing ends here. Bremms case on you being survivor was cute, but I don't believe it. And Nihlatak only strengthens the oddness around you.

Raka: No, I'm not a lyncher. It'll all make sense after the game. Probably.

Start making sense, now. Because we are in LyLo.

[Ryuki]

Orz, what a way to end the day. Guess I'll go read D3, but an interesting case Fire Eye, and one that I can buy.

Also, two ideas I want people's thoughts on.
1) Mass Claim
2) Survivor Mason Claim

[Decade]

Fireeye is probably scum because he's going after me, of all people, and he's one of the 4 that I don't already feel are town. And LyLo now means there's 3 scum, so, out of 4... yeah.

I'd still be 10x more happy with lynching Bremm today, though! Seriously.

Also Fireeye's case has lots of weird things about it.

> Opportunistic reads. But makes no sense. Let's check Sorceress claim/flips: Survivor -> Flips as survivor mason -> Must have partner. -> Can use items if she is on the wagon
> Sorceress, on countess sure-lynch. &  Barbarian, on potential sure-lynch. Either wagon would work for you.

I can see where you're going with this... if you were making a case that I'm her survivor partner. But you're making a case that I'm SCUM. So this doesn't really make sense anymore.

List of suspects, Sorc leaning town. No cases/reads specified except hard on Bremm and Summoner.

I'm assuming by "specified" you meant "Cases on people who are scum" because I gave lots of town reads and even a bit of reasoning on one or two of them, I think.

> I am so sure > so sure > so sure. How? Why? Where is your case? Where is your case? You have no case! Good job! Being sure about something which rest of us is unsure. And Barbarian doesn't even bothers to help out.

I tried my best to make a case. You saw how that went. You can at least say "And dear god is case is pathetically horrible." But no, you try to say I have no case at all. It feels a little misreppy to me.

> In the meanwhile you stayed on the super bus 180km/h, because switching to Sorceress for you is a BAD idea. You didn't had a case anyway. And favourite-wagon jumping would make you suspicious.

because sorc was like L-1 and 100% definitely getting lynched anyway soooooo what do you want me to do, quickhammer?

Yay more opertunity to lynch your own scum buddy Bremm. Especially how you claimed you were so sure of Bremm being scum.

AHAHAHA last game people jump on me for saying "almost surely" instead of 100% surely and this game it's the reverse now isn't that just hilarious

totally gotta admit that I'm not really making too much in the way of cases this game but :effort:, I really suck at explaining the damn things anyway. I -have- reasons past "GUT =D" but god knows I have no idea to type out what they are.

anyway. If lots of people actually want to lynch me then sure I'll claim and everyone will go "oh" and wagon someone else like, y'know, Bremm.

Things I don't like about Fireeye:Tons of stuff about his case on me, process of elimination, also him trying to make a case on the survivor in lylo probably because everyone else is his scumbuddy or Not Getting Lynched

Also yeah since it should be so friggin obvious by now I'm actually just gonna claim being Sorc's survivor mason partner. If you don't believe me, think about this; she flipped PLAYER CHARACTER survivor mason. Who is the other player character? Yeah. Who's the only other person who doesn't have abilities around their avatar other then Sorc? yeeeeeep

Confirmation bias made me just sorta glaze over her posts which is why I handwaved questions on her. I tried to make an opinion and couldn't.

Not claiming my abilities. There are reasons for this. I do share her ability to pick up items from day-end lynches, although it used gotten to be used as of yet. And if you want to lynch me (the survivor) in lylo you're dumb because then you lose.

I really don't have any reason to not claim at this point, anyway. As long as we catch the scums, I'm going to win, pshaw.

##Vote Br oh wait it's lylo nevermind :c

[Decade]

Also going to clarify what Sorc said about our wincon; yes, the Prime Evils must die for me to win.

I'm sorta like town, except that I have to be alive to win.

Although I guess other third parties (Beetleburst) have to be killed for town and not for me, but iunno. Unimportant. *Shrugs*

[Skull]

I understand where you're coming from, Fireeye, but Barbarian is not mafia. He's the partner of Sorc.

Early in the game, I claimed Sorc and Barbarian were scum. This is because they were the two player characters in a list of everyone else being monsters.  Also, being player characters, they could use Items, and since some SuperUniques drop items when they are killed (Like Countess did), I figured this would be part of a win condition or a reward for getting myslynches. When Sorc claimed her role, I believed it because it fit perfectly into the theory I had. She claimed having a single partner, and that both of them could use items that are dropped during lynch, but only if they were on the wagon. This is reinforced by the fact that Sorc flipped "Player Character" as part of her alignment. I'm not sure why I'm the only one who caught onto this, but I guess I'll just have to blame it on my psychic connection with Pesco.

I knew who Raka was from her first day meta, and voted her as one of my two prospected lynches from before the game started. Also, when I noticed her name on the list, and my own name on the two lists, I came up with a theory about who everyone was when they started the game. This isn't important for the game, unless you want to bring people's meta into the game, like how completely useless NeoSerela is.

My gut feeling right now is on Bremm (Still scum since case on Barbarian means nothing), ColdCrow (pushing only the main wagons while only making side comments on current event seems like fluffing posts with low content activity.) and Corpsefire (has the replacement even posted anything yet? He only has three posts, all of which only state that I didn't want to lynch the summoner, which is pure IIoA)

I'll go back an reread Bremm and Coldcrow in depth (I already read corpsefire in depth accidentally, since again, only three posts.)

Cut: Mass claim, knowing MotK town probably wouldn't help the day out at all. Survivor Mason does however need to claim everything that could help us lynch the Primeevils.
Cut: Yay. Psychic vision confirmed. I was totally going to out you if you didn't post, anyway.

[Decade]

Survivor Mason does however need to claim everything that could help us lynch the Primeevils.

Do I really need to? :c

[Punch Hopper]

Wow rereading yesterday is hateful.  At least the LYLO warning confirms what those black flips are.
Barbarian already went ahead and claimed. Playtime trying to lynch the survivor is over, if no one counterclaims he's off limits.
Before we do a Mass Claim, I do have a question for Barbarian (and I see he's already gone ahead and claimed.)
Do you really have no role related reason for believing Bremm is scum? Confirmation bias makes me not believe you when you say it's just a feeling, the same way you just happened not to say anything about Sorceress. :V It would make today so much easier!

[Skull]

yeah yeah, poo on me for not proofreading my posts as I get cut by new ones.
The fact that Bar was so obvious was a large part of the reasoning for why I wanted to switch away from the Eyeback lynch and onto Bremm. Come to think of it, since Eyeback is apparently town due to Lylo, That makes all of the people who piled onto him fairly suspicious. I note FireEye had no sympathies for his role, even though I found it was sensible once I had take a look back at his play all game. What about his role made you call him out on bullshit, Fireeye?