Maidens of the Kaleidoscope

~Hakurei Shrine~ => Touhou Addict Recovery Center => Topic started by: Nekomata-chan on February 25, 2012, 08:00:09 PM

Title: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: Nekomata-chan on February 25, 2012, 08:00:09 PM
Well, I heard this rumour just a few days ago, and I wanted to run it by you all.

It is known that Rumia hates sunlight.
So does Flandre.
The reason Rumia-Flandre keeps her arms spread (mostly) is because she stashed her wings in her sleeves, and it causes her great discomfort if she moves them.
There was also a conspiracy that "explained" why Patchouli was the Extra Stage midboss in EoSD.

"Since Patchouli is rather clever, and possibly took pity on Flandre, she gave her the means to go outside without being recognised or in danger of destroying anything. Therefore, a seal was placed on her in the form of a red ribbon-amulet, which also masked her powers and temporarily replaced them with the powers of darkness. She also gave Flandre an extra outfit of Koakuma's so as not to spark suspicion in Gensokyo's residents. This caused Flandre to trust her, and in the Extra Stage the heroine comes across Patchouli just as the latter was making their way to assist Flandre in another daring escape."

It's a very well thought-out theory, if I'm truly honest.

There is another piece of "evidence" supporting this. Rumia's Night Bird spellcard is apparently an extremely toned-down version of Flandre's Maze of Love, which would explain the seal placed on her power.

What are your thoughts on this theory?
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: OkashiiKisei on February 25, 2012, 08:13:00 PM
> Rumia has relatively short hair
> Flandre has long hair in a side-ponytail
> Reimu and Marisa first meet Rumia and then Flandre in the time-span of a few hours.

As you can imagine, I'm kind of skeptical about this theory, unless vampire hair grows like weed on crack.
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: Tengukami on February 25, 2012, 08:17:27 PM
Yeah, apart from what Okashii said about the hair, what I'm really wondering is this:

Flandre seems to be totally OK with, or even prefer, to stay in her room. Why would she agree to go through this elaborate ruse just to play outside?
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: RSFiye on February 25, 2012, 08:25:23 PM
I find the idea of changing her power to be a bit tough to swallow.

Not to mention the fact that the two have the profiles in the game.
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: Tiamat on February 25, 2012, 08:29:27 PM
Patchouli is the extra stage mid boss not because she's close to Flandre, but because she's keeping Flandre confined to the mansion via a rain spell. This is shown in the extra stage prologue story in the text files, and it's also shown in Patchouli's in-game dialogue that she's rather annoyed and frustrated with the situation of Flandre trying to get out.

Why would Patchy give Flandre a disguise to go outside when Patchy is clearly shown to canonically do whatever she can to keep Flandre inside?
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: Maiden Synnae ミ☆ on February 25, 2012, 08:46:52 PM
This discussion won't get anywhere, flandre IS NOT rumia, end of story.

They have completely different spellcards, themes, backgrounds, appearance, personalities, etc... this theory about flandre being rumia is really nonsensical, I must say. Zun never even gave a word about this, unless he proves otherwise I'll never believe such thing. Some features alike between them are mere coincidence.

It's as stupid as saying "Suika and Yuugi both are onis who like to drink, do parties and fight the others" So, does that mean Suika is Yuugi as well?
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: Nekomata-chan on February 25, 2012, 08:57:42 PM
Let it be known this is NOT my theory.

I don't believe it myself, and where I heard it escapes me, but there are crazier same-person ideas in Touhou like Mima and Sanae.
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: Paper Conan on February 25, 2012, 09:09:24 PM
Let it be known this is NOT my theory.

I don't believe it myself, and where I heard it escapes me, but there are crazier same-person ideas in Touhou like Mima and Sanae.
I was about to post about Sanae = Mima, but I didn't

out of kindness. :I
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: Nekomata-chan on February 25, 2012, 09:18:18 PM
I was about to post about Sanae = Mima, but I didn't

out of kindness. :I
It's been done into the ground. I've even done a mini-thing on Mima = Sanae, in this thread. (ftp://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,11151.msg739002.html#msg739002)
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: Tengukami on February 25, 2012, 09:19:01 PM
Zun never even gave a word about this, unless he proves otherwise I'll never believe such thing.

ZUN never said a word about pretty much any fan theory that steps outside of canon. That's why they're called fan theories. And they're supposed to be fun - you can find evidence to support them, evidence to refute them, but in the end they're unprovable either way.

OK, usually unprovable either way. Some of them are so ridiculous they are demonstrably false. I think this theory, while a bit on the silly side, has pieces to support it and pieces to refute it, but can still be fun to play around with.
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: Nekomata-chan on February 25, 2012, 09:21:31 PM
OK, usually unprovable either way. Some of them are so ridiculous they are demonstrably false. I think this theory, while a bit on the silly side, has pieces to support it and pieces to refute it, but can still be fun to play around with.
Definitely a subject for those multi-sided arguments that are renowned to exist in fan culture.
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: iK on February 25, 2012, 09:51:24 PM
I'm still convinced Nue is EX-Rumia to be honest.
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: Starxsword on February 25, 2012, 10:11:08 PM
It's a fun theory. It is most likely false, but it is fun to think about. They both have blond hair, eat people, etc. Similar to the Kaguya and Star Sapphire idea.
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: Zil on February 25, 2012, 10:15:51 PM
I like the part about stuffing her wings into her sleeves. That alone makes me wish it were true.
I'm still convinced Nue is EX-Rumia to be honest.
Everyone knows Nue is really the LLS Extra midboss. BV
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: Nekomata-chan on February 25, 2012, 10:18:32 PM
Nue is everything. Everything is Nue.
Nue is HAX. HAX is Nue.
Nue is Nue. Nue is Nue.
You know this fries your brain: Nue is everything you know and ever will know.
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: Starxsword on February 25, 2012, 10:23:38 PM
Youmu is known to shoot Nues.
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: haoreos2 on February 25, 2012, 11:10:57 PM
Younue*.
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: Nekomata-chan on February 25, 2012, 11:13:35 PM
Younue*.
Or, even better: Numu.
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: iK on February 26, 2012, 12:23:24 AM
You know this fries your brain: Nue is everything you know and ever will know.

OH NUUUUUUUUUUUEEEEEE!
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: shadowbringer on February 26, 2012, 12:40:22 AM
my thoughts are:
Flandre, Patchouli and Rumia are different... dolls. Alice's actually controlling everyone (or most people) in Gensokyo and making people think they're real people. Since Alice's intelligence doesn't have canon restrictions, it's possible for her to simulate the behavior of people better than the Matrix can simulate a world's environment.

.... I admit that I'm trying hard to come at least close to being this (http://shmups.system11.org/viewtopic.php?p=738823#p738823) creative.
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: Ex-Nue on February 26, 2012, 03:23:20 AM
Nue is everything. Everything is Nue.
Nue is everything you know and ever will know.
*Ex-Nue Approves
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: YukkuriPaste on February 26, 2012, 04:18:52 PM
I'm still convinced Nue is EX-Rumia to be honest.
Well, Rumia can conceal things in darkness, and one of Nue's spellcards involved little bullets appearing from darkness.

This theory must be investigated!!  :getdown:
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: Nekomata-chan on February 26, 2012, 05:22:28 PM
Well, Rumia can conceal things in darkness, and one of Nue's spellcards involved little bullets appearing from darkness.

This theory must be investigated!!  :getdown:
Your drugs must be confiscated  :derp:
Seriously, Nomz, hyper as always.
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: Tiamat on February 27, 2012, 03:20:55 AM
Me personally, in all seriousness, I'd think that if two different characters were actually one and the same person, ZUN would put a ton of symbollic clues into the names of the characters.  Something really REALLY major about a character like that character actually secretly being another or having a really big unknown secret would usually be in the name (although Touhou being light hearted as it is, I can only really think of two examples of this in the canon. Kaisen and Maribel, of course.  Sakuya is another "big unknown secret", but the problem there is that Sakuya isn't even her real name.  Well, IMHO, Alice Margatroid also qualifies because I'm pretty sure her last name is meant to clue you in on her involvement in Dolls in Pseudo Paradise but whatever)

Thus, if I were to personally ever take Rumia and Flandre being the same as a serious theory, there'd have to be a connection in the names of the characters at the very least.
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: Unassuming Squid on February 27, 2012, 04:52:12 AM
Nue is everything. Everything is Nue.
Nue is HAX. HAX is Nue.
Nue is Nue. Nue is Nue.
You know this fries your brain: Nue is everything you know and ever will know.

Funnily enough, I've said before that Nue is Nyarlathotep from Lovecraft's mythos.

Both have endless disguises or alternate forms.
Both enjoy screwing with people. In Nue's case it's to get food, in Nyarlathotep's case it's because he's an ass.
Both specifically use their alternate forms to screw with people.

Of course it's much more likely that Nue is just a nue but it's fun to see similarities between characters like that, true or not.
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: Lishy1 on February 27, 2012, 09:07:09 AM
All life begins and ends with Nu...
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: Desu_Cake on February 27, 2012, 10:28:38 AM
I still think Rumia is Alice.
And Nue is just Nue.
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: OkashiiKisei on February 27, 2012, 04:08:18 PM
All life begins and ends with Nu...

inb4 Nue is Spekkio, or vice versa.
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: Nekomata-chan on February 27, 2012, 08:25:25 PM
But is it just me, or does Rumia have the same outfit as Koakuma, and the same hairstyle as Alice?
...I think there's a little something going on between those two...
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: haoreos2 on February 27, 2012, 09:56:24 PM
But is it just me, or does Remilia have the same hat as Flandre, Patchouli and Yukari, the same parasol as the latter and Yuuka, and the same hairstyle as her?
...I think there's a little something going on between those five four...


Joking aside, I think Rumia has a pretty straight bowl haircut while Alice's has waves. Having said that, the way she holds her arms out is reminiscent of a puppet, and I am therefore forced to conclude she is shanghai's prototype model.
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: OkashiiKisei on February 27, 2012, 10:42:32 PM
While I certainly don't believe they're one and the same nor related, I am rather bothered by how both Marisa and Yukari have wavy blond hair and golden eyes.
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: Tiamat on February 27, 2012, 11:37:34 PM
Well, if you go by the theory that Yuuka is prototype Yukari before ZUN rebooted for windows, and look at what Marisa looked like before the reboot as well, one can thus come to the proper conclusion that Yukari and Marisa look the way they did because ZUN became enamoured with a woman who looked like that and started a process of converting all his Touhou characters to that look.  However, he got over it before he got around to doing it to Reimu.
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: Gpop on February 27, 2012, 11:47:15 PM
I just believe the whole "ribbon in Rumia's hair concealing her 'true' power" was an idea ZUN originally planned on growing on at first, but later either decided not to and completely forgot about it later or was something he had planned for EoSD already before he thought up characters like Flan and Remi.
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: haoreos2 on February 28, 2012, 12:57:27 AM
Well, if you go by the theory that Yuuka is prototype Yukari before ZUN rebooted for windows, and look at what Marisa looked like before the reboot as well, one can thus come to the proper conclusion that Yukari and Marisa look the way they did because ZUN became enamoured with a woman who looked like that and started a process of converting all his Touhou characters to that look.  However, he got over it before he got around to doing it to Reimu.

ಠ_ಠ

I just believe the whole "ribbon in Rumia's hair concealing her 'true' power" was an idea ZUN originally planned on growing on at first, but later either decided not to and completely forgot about it later or was something he had planned for EoSD already before he thought up characters like Flan and Remi.

Was there anything that actually drew attention to it? I assumed it was just a spin on the EX-Rumia thing.
In any case, I doubt ZUN would've actually planned on using the idea in following games, especially considering she was a throwaway stage 1 boss with no plot relevance.
I could imagine him throwing it in as something for the fandom to go wild with, though.
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: Gpop on February 28, 2012, 02:09:56 AM
Was there anything that actually drew attention to it? I assumed it was just a spin on the EX-Rumia thing.
In any case, I doubt ZUN would've actually planned on using the idea in following games, especially considering she was a throwaway stage 1 boss with no plot relevance.
I could imagine him throwing it in as something for the fandom to go wild with, though.
See Rika (http://en.touhouwiki.net/wiki/Rika)
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: haoreos2 on February 28, 2012, 02:40:37 AM
We meet again, PC-98...
But yeah, I'm guessing you're referring to how she went from stage 1 to EX, which isn't quite what I mean. There's plenty of examples of a character going from a low level boss to a high level one (Chen, Kogasa), but the reason for the boost is treated as a handwave explaining why they're suddenly stronger, then you go on to fight them. I assume you mean some story or plot when you talk about 'growing the idea' of her ribbon being a power limiter (if you just meant "Rumia might have been planned to be the EX boss, with her ribbon being justification for fighting her in stage 1 first", then sure, might be something ZUN would do. I just find it hard to picture him making a story out of it in latter games or EU materials).

(This is assuming the whole Rika thing in the extra stage went something like "Sup I brought a bigger tank yo" "K." then they fight)
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: Tengukami on February 28, 2012, 02:57:47 AM
Well, if you go by the theory that Yuuka is prototype Yukari before ZUN rebooted for windows, and look at what Marisa looked like before the reboot as well, one can thus come to the proper conclusion that Yukari and Marisa look the way they did because ZUN became enamoured with a woman who looked like that and started a process of converting all his Touhou characters to that look.  However, he got over it before he got around to doing it to Reimu.

Wrong, it's clear ZUN still carries a torch for a certain short-haired athletic girl who was into photography when he was in high school. He would watch her from afar, twitchy little skinny dude with the goofy laugh that he was, and felt he could never approach her, even with his awesome taste in hats. And so instead, he put this girl in many, many of his games, often giving her the spotlight, and had her interview nearly every single person living in the universe he created (all these people being aspects of himself), re-creating over and over again the kinds of questions he wished his dream girl would have asked him but never did. Touhou Project is basically the unreleased fourth chapter of 5 Centimeters Per Second.
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: Darth_Sirov on February 28, 2012, 04:46:59 AM
Wrong, it's clear ZUN still carries a torch for a certain short-haired athletic girl who was into photography when he was in high school. He would watch her from afar, twitchy little skinny dude with the goofy laugh that he was, and felt he could never approach her, even with his awesome taste in hats. And so instead, he put this girl in many, many of his games, often giving her the spotlight, and had her interview nearly every single person living in the universe he created (all these people being aspects of himself), re-creating over and over again the kinds of questions he wished his dream girl would have asked him but never did. Touhou Project is basically the unreleased fourth chapter of 5 Centimeters Per Second.

Hmmm... Short hair, athletic, photography. Then jokes came about after said character's introduction.
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: Agent of the BSoD on February 28, 2012, 05:35:22 AM
This discussion won't get anywhere, flandre IS NOT rumia, end of story.

They have completely different spellcards, themes, backgrounds, appearance, personalities, etc...
Well....
There is this. (http://www16.big.or.jp/~zun/img/th06/th06_705_01.jpg)

But then again, Rumia would have had this background anyway.
One (http://www16.big.or.jp/~zun/img/th06/th6_04.jpg)
Two (http://www16.big.or.jp/~zun/img/th06/th6_05.jpg)
Three (http://www16.big.or.jp/~zun/img/th06/th6_07.jpg)
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: circle nine on February 28, 2012, 07:38:39 AM
Right...

Next you'll be telling us Satori = Koishi and Marisa = Alice  :]
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: Starxsword on February 28, 2012, 08:11:51 AM
It is possible that Zun was thinking of making Rumia stronger. Since her profile does specifically say she cannot touch the ribbon. Other than that, there is really nothing else I can think of that would suggest her being a final boss of some sort. Rumia's Embodiment of the Scarlet Devil profile:

Quote
The ribbon tied to her hair is actually a charm; she can't touch it even though there have been times when she wanted to take it off.
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: Tiamat on February 28, 2012, 08:36:48 AM
Whether or not ZUN intended a big secret for it, there's a 90% likelihood that ribbon is a reference to a myth or a shout out to something.  Has anyone ever figured out what, though?
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: haoreos2 on February 28, 2012, 10:05:02 AM
The only thing I could come up with was a bit roundabout:
Her symbol in Marisa's grimoire is mistletoe, which was used by british druids with amulets to protect from witchcraft. Since it weakens the effect of witchcraft, it would be reasonable for it to weaken someone who uses it if it's tied to them.
But that there's pretty tenuous, and the amulets probably wouldn't be in ribbon form. Frankly I'm unaware of any mythology/cultural/historical items that ties any great significance to ribbons, outside of things like courtship and marriage.

ZUN did a lot of shoutouts to pop culture like Jojo's bizzare adventure and Agatha Cristie's novels in that game, so if we assume it is a reference, those might be good places to start.
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: Nekomata-chan on March 01, 2012, 04:37:53 PM
Right...

Next you'll be telling us Satori = Koishi and Marisa = Alice  :]
We discussed this already, you know. Nue is everybody.
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: Desu_Cake on March 01, 2012, 05:02:42 PM
Clearly the reason she cannot remove the ribbon is that she cannot reach her head with her arms stuck out like that.
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: Nekomata-chan on March 01, 2012, 05:12:47 PM
Clearly the reason she cannot remove the ribbon is that she cannot reach her head with her arms stuck out like that.
Maybe Rumia doesn't have proper arms and the ones she has are faulty prosthetics!!
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: iK on March 01, 2012, 05:16:42 PM
She's got no arms

To hug you with


;_;
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: Nekomata-chan on March 01, 2012, 11:22:17 PM
She's got no arms
To hug you with
But she has teeth
To nom you with.

I vote for Rumia for the Wolf in Little Red Riding Hood!  :derp:
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: haoreos2 on March 02, 2012, 03:41:44 AM
Maybe Rumia doesn't have proper arms and the ones she has are faulty prosthetics!!

Or maybe she can't bend them because she is secretly Flandre, and sticks her wings in there to hide them! =O

/loopthread
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: Starxsword on March 02, 2012, 07:23:45 AM
Rumia can probably bend her arms.

http://en.touhouwiki.net/wiki/File:Th06SC02.jpg
http://en.touhouwiki.net/wiki/File:PMiSS_rumia.jpg
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: Mеа on March 02, 2012, 07:40:24 AM
Or maybe she can't bend them because she is secretly Flandre, and sticks her wings in there to hide them! =O

/loopthread

Rumia has relatively short hair
> Flandre has long hair in a side-ponytail
> Reimu and Marisa first meet Rumia and then Flandre in the time-span of a few hours.

As you can imagine, I'm kind of skeptical about this theory, unless vampire hair grows like weed on crack.


/We've entered an endless recu(ry
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: iK on March 02, 2012, 09:50:21 AM
Well as long as that's the case, Nue's hair is already about the same length as Rumia's, even when disregarding the fact that Nue can make her hair as long as she damn wants.
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: Nekomata-chan on March 02, 2012, 04:40:09 PM
So much debating!! :getdown:

I thought this was such a throwaway theory and no-one would pay it any attention.

Colour me RAINBOW surprised.
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: haoreos2 on March 02, 2012, 11:19:09 PM
I dunno 'bout everyone else, but personally I'm just joking around o.O
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: Tengukami on March 03, 2012, 01:04:42 AM
(http://filesmelt.com/dl/aya_interested.png)
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: haoreos2 on March 03, 2012, 01:34:56 AM
(http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k508/alex_unisa/Images/Ayashameonaru.png)

This thread is now about MS Paint manipulation, kgo.
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: Tengukami on March 03, 2012, 01:43:23 AM
You are my new favorite poster.
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: Tonepoet on March 03, 2012, 07:23:37 PM
> Rumia has relatively short hair
> Flandre has long hair in a side-ponytail
> Reimu and Marisa first meet Rumia and then Flandre in the time-span of a few hours.

As you can imagine, I'm kind of skeptical about this theory, unless vampire hair grows like weed on crack.


Actually, it has to take longer than mere hours. It's night in the first stage, daytime in the second and at least sunset in the third, if not a future day/night transition. On average, at least six hours seems to be lapsing between bosses.  Since Imperishable Night establishes the use of a normal 24 hour clock within Gensokyo's borders, I'd be surprised if the girls completed stage 4 in less than a day's time and once you reach that point, it's hard to tell because:

A. You're indoors, so you can't estimate the time lapse via lighting conditions
B. Space in the library is warped so how much further you have to traverse is indeterminate
C. You meet Sakuya immediately after that and since she can warp time, it's difficult to tell exactly how long the fight takes. It could be a very short or very long amount of time depending on exactly how her ability to manipulate time works. Granted, I'd think it to be shorter

Furthermore I think it's implied that even more time lapses between the main game and the extra stage isn't it? I don't recall if the exact amount of time is specified though but if it's not, the evidence isn't very conclusive either way. Moreover, the ribbon Rumia seems to be wearing is very suspiciously placed on the same side of her hair as Flandre's side tail. Who's to say she didn't just tie it up to conceal her identity?

Nevertheless, I remain skeptical for different reasons. Firstly if fixing the problem was as simple as putting a ribbon amulet on Flandre's hair, why would she still need to be kept under lock and key by the time you meet her? Secondly, it should be relatively well known from her exchange with Marisa that Rumia's something of a living crucifix, more or less. Vampires don't mix with crucifixes much better than they do sunlight, do they?

Just as an interesting side note though: If we were to take a chain of alter egos which lead from Rumia, to Flandre to Nue, it would seem to me that Rumia's the Anti-Saiyen, transforming into multiple forms with black colored hair being more powerful than blonde. :-P
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: Starxsword on March 03, 2012, 10:06:42 PM
Quote
Vampires don't mix with crucifixes much better than they do sunlight, do they?

Both Remilia and Flandre ignore crucifixes and holy water. They have zero effect on them. Flandre throws crosses at people.

From Grimoire of Marisa, Spellcard, Taboo ~ "Forbidden Games":
User: Flandre Scarlet
Notes: Nothing but crosses
Reference Level: ★
A spell card that throws a large number of crosses at you.
It looks like the reason it's crosses is that they have lots of them at their house. Are they cross hunters, or did they belong to the humans that became their food?
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: Nekomata-chan on March 03, 2012, 11:09:26 PM
Another thing Rumia and Flandre have in common is...
In most fanworks I've seen (and written... hehe) they are usually portrayed as moe.
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: iK on March 03, 2012, 11:44:38 PM
Also,

ALSO!

They wear dresses.
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: Desu_Cake on March 04, 2012, 12:09:54 AM
Actually they wear tops and skirts. Not dresses.
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: Tengukami on March 04, 2012, 12:55:12 AM
I want to know who Gensokyo's shoe maker is. Whoever it is, they must make a fortune - half the cast seems to buy from them alone.
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: iK on March 04, 2012, 01:20:34 AM
Actually they wear tops and skirts. Not dresses.

It doesn't help that ZUN's style tends to make them look like the latter no matter what they actually wear.

I want to know who Gensokyo's shoe maker is. Whoever it is, they must make a fortune - half the cast seems to buy from them alone.

They must have opened up shop fairly recently since no one apparently wore shoes prior to IN
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: Starxsword on March 04, 2012, 04:47:40 AM
It's probably Alice. Making shoes seems right up her alley, like making dolls, dresses and other things.

Quote
They must have opened up shop fairly recently since no one apparently wore shoes prior to IN

You mean prior to Immaterial and Missing Power?
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: iK on March 04, 2012, 08:01:42 AM
Ohrite

I forget that IaMP exists quote often to be perfectly honest.
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: Tengukami on March 04, 2012, 06:11:30 PM
Sure looks like they're wearing shoes on the cover of LLS and MS. And Flandre's silhouette on the cover of EoSD looks like there's footwear involved.

Where does this "no shoes before IaMP"  idea come from?
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: XephyrEnigma on March 04, 2012, 06:28:48 PM
Sure looks like they're wearing shoes on the cover of LLS and MS. And Flandre's silhouette on the cover of EoSD looks like there's footwear involved.

Where does this "no shoes before IaMP"  idea come from?

Tiny sprites, and the fact that cutins dont show feet.
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: iK on March 04, 2012, 08:00:59 PM
Quote
Where does this "no shoes before IaMP"  idea come from?
(http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n302/Kink-Link5/Th04Reimu.png)(http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n302/Kink-Link5/Th04marisa.png)(http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n302/Kink-Link5/Sh02YuukaKazami.png)
(http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n302/Kink-Link5/Th06Reimu.png)(http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n302/Kink-Link5/Th06Marisa.png)
(http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n302/Kink-Link5/Th07Reimu.png)(http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n302/Kink-Link5/Th07Marisa.png)(http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n302/Kink-Link5/Th07Chen.png)(http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n302/Kink-Link5/Th07Cirno.png)(http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n302/Kink-Link5/Th07Letty.png)(http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n302/Kink-Link5/Th07AliceMargatroid.png)
(http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n302/Kink-Link5/Th07Lyrica.png)(http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n302/Kink-Link5/Th07Lunasa.png)(http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n302/Kink-Link5/Th07Merlin.png)(http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n302/Kink-Link5/Ran.png)(http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n302/Kink-Link5/Th08AliceMargatroid.png)
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: Tengukami on March 04, 2012, 08:15:13 PM
Are you trying to prove my point or are you suggesting they're wearing plastic bags?
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: Zil on March 04, 2012, 08:35:42 PM
I guess they're just socks or slippers. If they are shoes then they were drawn with monumental laziness.

Why aren't Yuyuko, Youmu, and Yukari up there, or are their feet not visible?
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: Tengukami on March 04, 2012, 08:42:57 PM
I guess they're just socks or slippers. If they are shoes then they were drawn with monumental laziness.

ZUN's legs are a pair of parallel lines. I just assumed he was drawing lazy shoes. Unless it wasn't improving art skill that led to better shoes, but rather people in Gensokyo just inexplicably decided to go from slippers to shoes.
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: iK on March 04, 2012, 09:15:59 PM
For the record, Sakuya, Youmu, and Yuyuko do wear shoes.

You be the judge on Yukari, they look like socks over socks to me, but they're more shoe like than the others I guess.

(http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n302/Kink-Link5/YukariPCB.png)
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: haoreos2 on March 04, 2012, 11:07:47 PM
Time to paint-shop shoes onto iK's pictures so we can re-de-re-de-derail this thread.

(http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k508/alex_unisa/Images/shoedreimu.jpg)

By the way, that rapping-parachutepants'd-hippy Yuuka is strangely compelling.
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: Ex-Nue on March 04, 2012, 11:38:55 PM
they're wearing plastic bags

Heh, It does look like they are.
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: shadowbringer on March 05, 2012, 12:12:56 AM
http://en.touhouwiki.net/wiki/File:Th03cover.jpg
http://en.touhouwiki.net/wiki/File:Th03Yumemi.png

:V
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: iK on March 05, 2012, 01:01:41 AM
>Citing examples of characters from the outside world.

Youmu and Yuyuko are the only blatant exceptions to the rule, really. Everyone else that has shoes shown comes from outside Gensokyo.

TH03 cover is hard to really tell being so small and whatnot.
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: haoreos2 on March 05, 2012, 06:03:44 AM
I forget, what's the official line on Sakuya? Is it explicitly mentioned she comes from outside Gensokyo?
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: iK on March 05, 2012, 06:31:25 AM
It's pretty much accepted that the entire SDM comes from the outside world. At least to my [Patchouli] knowledge.
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: Scarlet Bellflower on March 05, 2012, 09:00:28 AM
In reply to the original post, how would Flandre have gotten those darkness manipulation powers if she was truly Rumia?
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: Nekomata-chan on March 05, 2012, 12:10:03 PM
I think the SDM may have come from Europe, because virtually all of them (minus Sakuya, Meiling and... I guess Koakuma, too. if you want to be a perfectionist) have European names.

But let's not go off-topic.
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: Scarlet Bellflower on March 05, 2012, 12:32:41 PM
I want to know who Gensokyo's shoe maker is. Whoever it is, they must make a fortune - half the cast seems to buy from them alone.

A ton of the cast seems to really like combat boots, for example, Eirin and Alice.
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: pineyappled on March 05, 2012, 03:52:23 PM
Koakuma could have easily been from inside Gensokyo.
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: iK on March 05, 2012, 04:47:52 PM
Kaokuma is also not really a character. For all we know there are several little devils working in the library, keeping books in order and whatnot.

They could have easily come into the mansion after it moved to Gensokyo.
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: Zil on March 05, 2012, 06:15:20 PM
Sakuya isn't Sakuya's real name, right? Remilia just named her that or something.

And yeah, Koakuma has no real name. Fans just called her that. Same with Daiyousei.
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: Napalnman1231 on March 06, 2012, 01:31:25 AM
Kaokuma is also not really a character. For all we know there are several little devils working in the library, keeping books in order and whatnot.

They could have easily come into the mansion after it moved to Gensokyo.

but isn't Koakuma a Summon as teories says?, or is it all fanon?
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: Scarlet Bellflower on March 06, 2012, 08:29:07 AM
Actually, where does it say that Sakuya is not her actual name?
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: iK on March 06, 2012, 03:35:01 PM
Actually, where does it say that Sakuya is not her actual name?

人間にしては強力過ぎる能力が吸血鬼に買われたのか、自分から志願して紅魔館のメイドになったのか、まだ正確には判っていない。   

It's still unknown whether the vampires sought out the services of her extraordinary powers, or whether she herself asked for the position of head maid at the Scarlet Devil Mansion.

さらに、今の名前は吸血鬼に付けられた名前で本名ではないという。   

In addition, it is said that the name she bears now was given to her by the vampires, and is not her true name.

From PMiSS
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: Tonepoet on March 06, 2012, 03:51:03 PM
In a somewhat serious attempt to get this back on topic: Black socks are uncommon and red socks may even be downright rare. Why is this relevant?

On an off chance, I had paid attention to the character's feet before and while it's hard to tell from the in game imagery (http://www.spriters-resource.com/fullview/33547/) since the feet are, as previously mentioned, rather quite small. Still to me it kinda looks like Rumia's probably wearing shoes.  Red high heels to be specific, since her feet are kinda pointy.

If she is, where did those shoes come from? Obviously, like everything else in the world, they must have been made in China. The only other character visibly wearing shoes on that same sprite sheet looks to be like Hong Meiling, the scarlet devil mansion gate guard. Perhaps it's possible on her way out, Meiling gives Flandre a pair of her shoes out of concern that the decorative silk socks will become dirty and worn out, if left unprotected and exposed to the elements of the great outdoors. Naturally, this being a Scarlet sister, Meling lent out her very best pair. (Few other people wear shoes at this point because coming from the outside world, they are quite rare and valuable but since socks often seem to be lost in between the gaps quite often, it's possible Yukari has more socks than she knows what to do with and gives them away freely...)

Either that or Rumia's not wearing shoes per se but Ruby Slippers because she's Dorothy from Kansas/Oz. It wouldd explain why she got in a fight with the local witch; gotta finish off the last of the wicked witches, as designated by the black pointy hat. I mean hey, why not? It's not that outlandish a possibility, considering that we have Alice from Wonderland. The darkness surrounding her could even be the interdimensional tornado responsible for landing here.
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: Savory on March 06, 2012, 04:04:21 PM
Quote
Rumia = Flandre?!

This theory is
(http://cdn.bulbagarden.net/media/upload/thumb/f/f8/083Farfetch%27d.png/150px-083Farfetch%27d.png)
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: game2011 on March 06, 2012, 04:05:43 PM
Isn't Koakuma's name officially adopted by ZUN already when he said that not all devils are powerful?
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: iK on March 06, 2012, 05:37:16 PM
ALTERNATIVE theory: Gensokyo is the place all those left socks go in the dryer. This explains the abundance of socks in the country, and explains why they don't have linoleum floors.
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: OkashiiKisei on March 07, 2012, 02:37:58 PM
Koakuma could have easily been from inside Gensokyo.

As a demon, Koakuma would most likely have been born in Makai. Thus, she'd be a foreigner as well.
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: Tiamat on March 08, 2012, 12:19:18 AM
I don't think demon are exclusive to Makai. If anything, UFO describes it as a place filled with youkai (in Sanae's bad end), not demons, which means that it... well, has all sorts of things.
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: Nekomata-chan on March 11, 2012, 10:29:19 AM
ALTERNATIVE theory: Gensokyo is the place all those left socks go in the dryer. This explains the abundance of socks in the country, and explains why they don't have linoleum floors.
Speaking of that, 80% of the socks I have are odd socks.

Damn it, Yukari!!

I also want to relay the fact that this Flandrumia (yes, I may have made up the name) theory is not mine. I may have said this before, I just want to remind people of that.

It was actually made by my friend who is also on this site: YukkuriPaste.
Yeah, she's nuts :V
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: Gpop on March 11, 2012, 04:51:33 PM
ALTERNATIVE theory: Gensokyo is the place all those left socks go in the dryer. This explains the abundance of socks in the country, and explains why they don't have linoleum floors.
No Pesco stole them all
Title: Re: Rumia = Flandre?!
Post by: YukkuriPaste on March 11, 2012, 06:43:37 PM
It was actually made by my friend who is also on this site: YukkuriPaste.
Yeah, she's nuts :V
Oh, don't say you didn't consider the theory. You even posted it on here :derp:
But yeah, this theory did emerge over coffee a couple of weeks ago. I'm actually surprised it got posted on here, y'know.

Also, I read that Koakuma was summoned by Patchouli to help in the library.