Welcome to Justice Juice Mafia, Raikaria! You're Admiral Apple. You have a thing for oceans. By that I mean you have full control over the water element and species that are closely related to it. Ever seen heroes riding on dolphins to the crime scene? That's you. You went with the flow and decided to help the goodies' endeavor, and so here you are.
Your role is Vanilla Town. It seems to your dismay that the evildoers are waterproof. The best you can do is support your teammates vocally.
You win when all evildoers are eliminated.
/in.... I guess???????????Good job with that self-fulfilling prophecy btw
i better not regret joining as soon as the game begins
##Vote: Dormio For being delicious.Do you lot see this declaration of war on our humble collective efforts of fruits and vegetables? For what other reason would Shadoweh attempt to consume the delicious flesh of a fresh fruit or vegetable if she were not rotten to the core? Even one as disapproving of gambling as I is willing to wager that it is through the process of consuming the juicy flesh of young fruit and vegetable that Shadoweh maintains her deceptive appearance with which she infiltrated our ranks, despite being of old enough age to produce a foul odour otherwise.
## unvoteYou are so precious.
## vote no lynch
This will be my last post tonight - I'm putting in no lynch so there's no surprise hammers involving me while I'm sleeping. Tomorrow is another day.
Dormio: You called me a vile fruit. But the fruit are the townies, not the scum. Scumslip much? I rest my case. Lynch the venomous vegan!You're a rotten fruit. Old, mouldy, expired. Past your prime. Killing and eating your more youthful brethren in order to appear like them. A cannibal like you that lives on a diet of young fruit and vegetables could be nothing but the vegan we are trying to eliminate.
16) Don't even think about discussing flavor. It's purposefully nonsensical and you won't find anything there. "Rocky Rock" is a plausible nameclaim as far as you're concerned.
18) This game's ~*~thing~*~ is the effort bar. It looks something like this. (this totally isn't recycled, at all) (http://i.imgur.com/EYRbp8p.png) Each 24 hours during the day automatically add 400 words to your personal bar. Each word in a post (I can ignore posts that abuse this) erases a word from the bar. The bar doesn't go negative. If you hit over 800 words, you're replaced. If you hit over 1200 words, you're modkilled. You generally shouldn't be worried about this rule if you plan on playing the game.
Votecount 1.2
Shadoweh (4): PX, Dormio, SB, Darkninjaabc
PX (2): CF7, Validon98
Dormio (2): Shadoweh, Serela, Cheez8
No Lynch (1): Sky_Paladin
Not Voting: (2) Kilgamayan, Polaris
Day 1 lasts 72 hours and requires a majority of 7 votes to lynch.
(Countdown) (http://www.timeanddate.com/countdown/generic?iso=20131103T08&p0=676&msg=Day+1+End)
Note: Brown is my color; as the counterpart to Maroon; do not steal.
CF7 is clearly lying about being the tastiest fruit (that's me)I'm a potato. Nice to meet you.
You're not suposed to count the words yourselves guys, just let the pain flow naturally.First post.
Also I was asleep, my blankets were sooooooo comfy!
##Vote: Dormio For being delicious.
You are so precious.Answer to Sky_Paladin post. Who actually voted no_lynch.
Dormio: You called me a vile fruit. But the fruit are the townies, not the scum. Scumslip much? I rest my case. Lynch the venomous vegan!
Basically shadoweh told us was that''you guys shouldn't jump on wagons''.As far as I'm concerned this is the correct attitude to have. Thinking is better than jumping on a wagon without thinking. Jumping on one AFTER thinking about it is different, but after thinking about it, I see no reason to jump on the Shadoweh wagon.
But meanwhile i must clarify that i am not pushing day end. Through speculation and accusation one reveals information of the one being. And theres that you are taking everything i said at face value.Understood, I'll reconsider as well. Sorry to say I'm still going to keep my eye on you for a bit, since I still have a bit of suspicion towards you. It's nothing I'm willing to act on yet though.
They are not.
Moreover speculating who the scum are is radically different from ending the day. Arey you actually aruging for that we should all keep our reads to ourselves?Haha, no. That would be dumb. I'd question where the heck you got that idea but unless you're not convinced I don't see a reason to make a debate out of something we agree on.
I would also point out that i have cancelled my vote against shadow. So that was an empty accusation on your partTrue, but you did say you're still suspicious of her and mostly want to avoid quick hammers.
CF7, if you think that Dormio is scummy for spamposting, why are you not voting him for it? Same with Cheez on Dark. You should really get an avatar btw.
I have outed the vile and foul Shadoweh and exposed her true rotten core. You, and any others that may or may not be somewhat confused so as to regarding the current state of affairs, should simply believe in the one that shall be heralded as a champion for decades to come and assist me in my endeavour to slay the poorly fermented Shadoweh.
You are so precious.
Dormio: You called me a vile fruit. But the fruit are the townies, not the scum. Scumslip much? I rest my case. Lynch the venomous vegan!
Dormio's still talking far too much for what he's saying though.Also, Cheez8 is clearly unfamiliar with Meiya.
Also, Cheez8 is clearly unfamiliar with Meiya.Somehow I get the feeling I don't need to be familiar.
As for the mister... cheez... why are you partaking in this silly little wagon on dark?I have a very weak reason to be slightly suspicious of Dark. So far, I have less reason to be suspicious of anybody else. Far as I can tell it doesn't really matter, though I guess it's a little bit inconvenient that between the time I realized I wanted to vote for him and the time I actually did vote for him two other people did the same. I wouldn't call it a wagon though, and if it does become a wagon before I'm convinced enough you can bet I'm taking my vote back.
Of course, I'm not ready to vote on any of these. D1 has always been a "take things with a grain of salt" thing for me, seeing as it always seems we manage to lynch town instead of scum D1 over something silly or that appears to be scummy but really isn't.
##Unvote
Until there's more content to parse that's preferably not RVS-related stuff, I won't vote for anyone.
##vote dormio again for being meiyaAs much as I hate to point it out, despite being a Godmother Meiya was Town. Are you actively voting for town, Serela?
okay no
But yeah all the things I can see are either A.Making a vote that I can explain but seriously do not believe in at all (Example:Dark taking obvious jokeposts seriously and doing silly stuff as a result) or B.In addition to being A, it relies on useless and easily-circular logic (Voting SB for saying Dark's posts are bad, voting PX for voting SB for saying Dark's posts are bad)
I'M JUST GOING TO KEEP VOTING MEIYA
Noting Serela's refusal to make any real opinion of his own.For what it's worth, this post bothers me enough to suspect Dormio over anybody else right now. Guess I should start bringing my opinions up sooner.
Also noting that I might be late for class.
For what it's worth, this post bothers me enough to suspect Dormio over anybody else right now. Guess I should start bringing my opinions up sooner.
This feels like a false accusation that could be interpreted as true if you aren't paying enough attention. Seems minor, but not as minor as everything else is.
I'll mull it over while I eat, I guess.
Vaaaaaaaaalllllllliiiiiiiiiidoooooooooonnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnn is that all :(
Serela, specify your opinions please.I wasn't talking about other's opinions as much as ones I could be attempting to have myself (and why I wasn't interested in any of them)
I'm def. gonna look through the new stuff before I go to bed though and try to create real opinions
but Serela, by that point you will have already been torn to pieces.To my utter joy people's reactions have been "it's just serela being serela"
Well, to be honest, I thought both PX and Mirai voting for Shadoweh right off the bat was kind of suspicious. I didn't want to vote for PX because they hosted the last game. Mirai has been posting a lot too but it's mostly been..uh...padding the word count. Normally I would think scum wouldn't want to get that kind of attention but behaving in a 'townlike behaviour' to try and throw off suspicion is a strategy, too.
The votes for Shadoweh came in right at the start before anybody had really said anything, so they could easily be called joke votes. Except Dormio's vote is still there. Maybe they thought "Lets try and lynch a skilled player" but when there wasn't a bus, PX switched off.
I don't know, maybe it's just a coincidence. But it's the only semi-scum reading I've got.
##unvote
##vote Mirai
Also, it seems Serela's vote counts for 0? I guess we're not a democracy~
And this entire exchange now that i think about it is pure weird. Cheez somehow agreed with the point that joleposting seriously is scumtell.False. When did I do that?
Yet all that time he was basically taking what he calss "a misinterpreted and wrong argument". This paradoxical defend was what made me scratch my head ao hard. Then i assumed hes an enthusisatic scum. Who is also bouncing around wagons. Then it apl makes sense.Oh boy. I'd be worried for myself except I'm pretty sure nobody's buying your argument that Shadoweh is scum, so this is completely invalid.
If anything i would really appreciate if you can first assume shadoweh is scum. Then see cheez as paranoid scum swooping in to defend him.
If it helps, Dormio's a pretty close second. Most of the reason I went with Validon instead is because I'm hoping to see something substantial from him soon, and if that happens I might be able to trust him enough to change my vote.Cheez, why aren't you voting for Dormio right now?
...
Cut by another Validon vote. Not sure I like it being a parrot when I wanted to see where Cheez's Dormio suspicions would go, as much as I can't disagree with Validon votes right now.
Cheez is not null anymore, and my policy is to lynch nulls.are you a jester or something
And guys you really want scum to quickend d1 right.
Validon can very well be killed before he can retaliate so there.
But I think I'd rather vote Dormio for his eagerness to vote me for noncontribution while I've stated I was about to make a post of it and then even showed some sign of apparently being in the middle of really getting it done.
The despair I experience when my hopes are crushed will be delicious.I was right? Really? N-No way... That's just...
Brushing it off as Darkninja just being hard to read is pretty bad.dude do you find that guy easy to read?
CF7 - 652
PX - 598
Polaris - 487
Shadoweh - 452
Everyone else - 400
And my vote on Serela is genuinely because I believe that he's scummy. To have voting restricted in a 12p setup? This means that we have only 8 townvotes, assuming theres three scums. I can hardly imagine he to be town less he has some bastardly powerful duo ability. Which he needs to clarify less we just lynch him. End of story.So you think having restricted vote makes him scum despite how scum would be more affected by this? He said both votes count, so we still have 9 votes in theory. We don't need him to claim whether he's uber or not. That's something the scum should be worried about.
CF7, if you think that Dormio is scummy for spamposting, why are you not voting him for it?Because it's D1. And we have "post a lot of stuff or get out" rule. So for now it's ok.
Of course, I'm not ready to vote on any of these. D1 has always been a "take things with a grain of salt" thing for me, seeing as it always seems we manage to lynch town instead of scum D1 over something silly or that appears to be scummy but really isn't.Blank unvote for the it's too early too vote seriously reason.. I'd say scummy.
##Unvote
Until there's more content to parse that's preferably not RVS-related stuff, I won't vote for anyone.
Everything always happens while I'm asleep, zzz. I guess it's my fault for living in the wrong hemisphere.You have no idea.
SO LETS GO WITH THE JOKE VOTES!Does it make you all warm and fuzzy inside?
I missed out on lynching CF7 last game so I want to get a shot this time.
##unvote
## vote CF7
On a related note, I totally pushed for Shadoweh's death and I never got to kill them last game :/ Life is full of missed opportunities. Maybe I should vote for Shadoweh instead. Choices, choices. But in my deepest darkest heart of hearts, I have to admit I don't have a reading either way and I'm just screwing around. Sigh.And this.
dude do you find that guy easy to read?Hell no. But I'm not the one making a case against him.
SB: Couldn't tell you why. I guess it's because his posts seem... well, very self-assured, if I'm being perfectly honest. Not sure why that would be something I distrust, except maybe it makes me feel like people are being played or distracted from certain parts of arguments because of it. I can't really support this very well though which is a sign that SB is very good at being scum and we should lynch him now! That, or I'm barking up the wrong tree entirely.
Dark: I want to think he's a misguided townie but he just doesn't stop.
I like how multiple people have fewer votes than names attached. FOR SCIENCE! ##Unvote, ##Vote: Kilgamayan
SB are you Carthrat in disguise ?_?
Cheez is not null anymore, and my policy is to lynch nulls.
Note that my stance has never changed but just that there's no imminient risk of quickhammer I assume that its safe to Vote.
And guys you really want scum to quickend d1 right.
Validon can very well be killed before he can retaliate so there.
But I think I'd rather vote Dormio for his eagerness to vote me for noncontribution while I've stated I was about to make a post of it and then even showed some sign of apparently being in the middle of really getting it done.
And back to my policy of d1 scumhunting.
I guess some people are confused on why we should lynch nulls when we could.
Null reads are most likely town power roles
This doesn't mean I stop trusting my guts, having someone to jump out and defend you despite the person in question has not even made a response is pretty scummy, plus, the situation back then was basically me telling everyone to drop the wagon temporarily and give shadoweh time to response, having that cut off by someone else (cheez) is outright weird. Paranoid scum can explain that in the form of wanting to dispell more suspiction from forming round his scumpal when it is still so early with an apparant lack of material.
I mean null reads are most likely targets of town power roles.
Null reads alone can toy with town psychology by just not posting or with minimal material.
Was this just to test the votals?
But I'm not the one making a case against him.Neither am I Dormio >_> Or does complete dismissal in "but anyway I have no idea how to read dark so, moving on" sound like I'm making a case why he's scum? I'm trying to say things at him in hopes he'll slowly get better!
How does someone defending another player make the player they're defending scummy? Scum can buddy up to townies and townies can defend scum who they think are town. You're using this against Shadoweh when she has no control over what Cheez does and I don't like it.This so much
3 through half of page 5 mattered, I did several timesthrough half of page 4*
To shadow: i am questioning the entire validity of his claim. Therefore i am assuming t on the premises that he is lying.
Sadly I can't even vote Dark over this because last game proves he could very definitely be doing this as town.
How does my confidence distract people from arguments exactly?Mostly by implying "the part of this post that I'm focusing on is what's important to focus on, not the rest of the stuff." Like I said though, I have no idea why you worry me. As far as I know you could be focusing on the right things for the right reasons.
What makes you think misguided townie?
If you dont fullclaim you just stated out a fact which we would figure out at the end of d1.A.There's no reason town should need to worry about it for that long. You said it yourself; you'd figure it out at the end of d1. So why bother waiting until then when people are going to get distracted with it?
You yoursellf has been thrown with scum!dormio in the same fucking neighborhoodwat
and unless it says outright inyour pm you both are town it tells absolutely nothing about both your alignments.so why does it make me scum then (unless you're talking about the dormio neighborhood thing which I don't understand)
The thing that you arr actually bringing this up means that you are self concious of that your status is doubtfull. Sure by this logic polly might also be scum instead of you but why should we not lynch you who is running around telling us you arent scum becayse you said so? Wtf>And since you claimed why your vote doesn't work this makes you scum, because you wanted town to be more informed and it was harmless to do so
you yourself had firsthand experience in linked roles and its time to know that they dont imply anything.I never said they did.
And the entire reason i am asking you to fullclaim is because you read scummy enough for any lynch to go through its just that i want you to convince me otherwise. Fine if you dont appreciate theoffer.Sorry but that's not how claims work. Not just one person, but a majority of the playerlist (aka, enough to secure a lynch) needs to actually want me lynched. And your reasoning for wanting me lynched is super ridiculous.
Sb. In his wall post he went "its okay to lynch town if we out scum". This proc me to read him thoroughly over. The current situation and the oldness of the post you quote as reference and all thr associated things wrong with the statement "its ok to lynch town. You know full well a quickhammer can occur at l1, l2 and whatever while the only thing tracable is similar posting times. Basically you are never going to use this as ammo to lynch scum.Meanwhile, in post #57 (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,15788.msg1038266.html#msg1038266)...
This statement itself given the current game time is bizzare. D1 is the only time where town avtually has the most freedom in lynching for the game impact is relatively little. Aka skill and information revealed by flips can compensate for one or two power rolesSuspecting SB for holding the same sentiments you held earlier really doesn't help your case. At this point I really want to vote for you but... actually, no, I am voting for you.
Darkninja - I just can't see how this guy could be scum. He's typing massive walls of text with his iphone or something for crying out loud. That amount of effort...if I was scum, I couldn't be bothered to do it. I'm handwaving as "probably town because he is investing stupidly huge amounts of effort". Somebody that is trying hard. But he doesn't appear to be trying too hard or fake. There are certainly points where I have gone WHAT or I don't agree but my overall feeling is that of an overzealous sheepdog that's smelled a wolf or maybe a fox or maybe some left over shepherds pie, but goddamit if you touch those sheep you are gonna lose an arm....Stop making me uncertain about this guy. I want to stop being wishy-washy, dang it!
My sentiment is that we should lynch the nulls. Because reads are biased.I have plenty of smaller issues with you that have been building up and making me suspect you. This is just the one that finally convinced me you really aren't working towards the town's benefit.
This is if i recall correctly the second time you just throw a vote at me with an empty accusation.
Besides, there are so many things wrong with your argument....Make that "arguments". Two things is not a lot. :derp:
...in fact, the chance that a null-read player is a townie is the same as eversigh
My sentiment is that we should lynch the nulls. Because reads are biased.Sorry, i don't buy it. I'm reading people as null, so let's lynch them. Plus i don't trust my own reads. What kind of mentality is that? On top of your Serela argument, your overall behavior was really not town. So.
Oh. And i am the Peachy Peach. The Roleclop. My ability fails if any other ability is used on the person i target
##Vote Cheez8Suit yourself.
...laughing at how easily town just bought their theory of "well there must be a super retarded scum who cried he would kill everyone in front of them!"for the record, a contradictory stance is more or less the real reason I suspected you, not that first one
...
Contradictory stance is a bigger scumtell any day of the week.
Mostly by implying "the part of this post that I'm focusing on is what's important to focus on, not the rest of the stuff." Like I said though, I have no idea why you worry me. As far as I know you could be focusing on the right things for the right reasons.
Darkie proved in the last game how a townie can act like this on broken logic. I'm fully aware that situations tend to repeat themselves from game to game without regard to alignments, but even then, it's a possibility I can't seem to shake. (Couldn't shake it reading through the last game either, so it definitely goes beyond "he's acted like this earlier".)
Sb. In his wall post he went "its okay to lynch town if we out scum". This proc me to read him thoroughly over. The current situation and the oldness of the post you quote as reference and all thr associated things wrong with the statement "its ok to lynch town. You know full well a quickhammer can occur at l1, l2 and whatever while the only thing tracable is similar posting times. Basically you are never going to use this as ammo to lynch scum. Even if you resort ylto this argument it is still only going to be a small jab. Does that seriously justify a town wanting to lynch anothet town? No.
Then i came to analyze your posts. The majority of your so called contribution was basically nitpicking. You plant doubts which trail off to let us form ou rown conclusions with your directed questions with a dead end negative answer. Your stance is clear only when you actually vote. I didnt notice whoever remarked you as being confident. But what i do persume from you is " stop being ao assertive and stereotyping people out". Inother words. Scum
SB - I haven't seen enough out of SB to form an opinion yet. Last game this was the same and he turned out to be evil scums. So much so that I am going to paint him as suspicious because he is too quiet.
Cheez8 - This one feels try hard. I feel like he is pushing hard and it doesn't feel right somehow. At this point I could vote for them.
My sentiment is that we should lynch the nulls. Because reads are biased.
This is if i recall correctly the second time you just throw a vote at me with an empty accusation.
For one, if there is somebody sending out scumreads left and right, and they have a high chance of being scum,
Right. This is ridiculous.
The entire point of flips is to reveal actually trustworthy info which we can use.
I told everyone my lynch priority because the fact that town should vite scum is fucking obvious. But i announced my policy at the point which there was consoiderably less material to determine a scum and/or a lych target.
That thing was ancient and doesnt fit in the current scenario. Just because i cannot possibly include every fucjing obvious factor in my logic you handwave it. Wtf scum. I clearly announced my intention and stance and reason for voting serela.
Your wannabe rebuttals just involve nitpicking small insignificant details which we should have a consent on. Things like null reads can be eitger side used as an accusation? As if this doesnt scteam enough scumminess against someone. Its just bloody obvious. Null reads of course can be either side but we cannot bear the risk of misfire lategame
Scum are the only people with thia mentality to keep nitpicking on details. It gives them anexcuse to gandwave every single big idea of anu argument easily as long as town doesnt point out how inana and tunnel visioned such rebuttals are. Just because everyone here has a life and wont waste time elaborating the obvious doesnt make me scum. So stop diverting aytention from your cumbuddy.
You know what you actually are the one whom i have the strongeat acumvibe on but just isnt voting due to how obviously biased i might be. I would seriously appreciate if you can crumb for handwaving all our big ideas and nitpicking on the obvious details.
Vote: SB
Guys, he's silently pushing for Dark, all without giving a read or vote on him, while keeping his vote on Validon. Hell, even his vote on Validon (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,15788.msg1038478.html#msg1038478) is pretty damn fishy, as he says why me over Serela. His sights are set on pretty much the 3 easiest wagons he can probably find, and he's in prime position to switch to any of them.
WRT to Cheez's suspicions on me, suspicions I can't refute at all are kind of lame, but I'd like to see if you can figure out why in future....Dern acronyms. Mind if I ask what that one means? :V
WRT to Cheez's suspicions on me, suspicions I can't refute at all are kind of lame, but I'd like to see if you can figure out why in future.Well, thinking about it more... The best I could come up with is that your posts all seemed like they made a lot of sense and I had to remind myself to take everything with a grain of salt more frequently when I was reading your posts.
Shadoweh - Where did they go? After the last game I expected something more.
but it feels strange that he's hardly even acknowledging any others, especially when there were so many people who hadn't contributed much.
Shadoweh I hope you can start being super town extraordinaire because right now you are being super scummy. `_` The only posts you've made are pointless remarks that don't really tell us who your scum reads are. Serela is pretty much on the same level, but I'd say Shadoweh actually looks worse at this point. Isn't it sad, Shadoweh?I might evolve if you bring me a Fire Stone. It's so cold in here I feel like I'm going into hibernation. I might see if I can buy a space heater which should improve my townie performance. It'd be funny if I weren't serious. I don't think I've been stellar either so I don't blame you for calling me out.
Paladin, did somebody actually ask you to claim? Between this and the last thing you said about your role I'm pretty sure I know exactly what you're getting at, but I'm wondering why it's there.
Nobody asked me to claim. It didn't occur to me that claiming vanilla town was in fact claiming. I was under the impression that most players were vanilla town so saying "I'm vanilla town" didn't have any meaning. Apparently it seems I am the rare, actually vanilla town. How sad.Most people being VT doesn't change that the VT's shouldn't randomly claim, because it helps narrow down who isn't faster. >_>
Cheez8Oh.
Nobody asked me to claim. It didn't occur to me that claiming vanilla town was in fact claiming. I was under the impression that most players were vanilla town so saying "I'm vanilla town" didn't have any meaning. Apparently it seems I am the rare, actually vanilla town. How sad.
Validon uses too many words to say he has no real scumreads and yet he's asking me and Dormio to contribute more? What?
Now that the day has actually gotten going there really should be something half-decently scummy for me to find, lesse here
I have no idea what PX anything looks like because I can't remember games where he did much
He literally still has 0 scumreads. I mean, come on.
Like, a complete drop of Darkninjaabc suspicion because he's getting a bunch of flak for it.FTR some of the other people on the Darkie wagon also heel-face-turned going "nevermind this guy is pretty town" >_>
Followed by suspicion of me who Serela admitted to not actually having anything on but is now suddenly suspect.Because, clearly
Also suspicion of Shadoweh who Serela has basically not mentioned up until this point. (lumping her with the other null reads he had doesn't really count as mentioning her)
(I mean I'm trying not to sound like I'm mad at dormio for attacking me because that's not it, but it reminds me of scum!uesugi tunneling on super kindergarten level obvscum kaori in Swordgirls all of d2)
You've been around long enough to do I curse ed1 and go around without scumreads (whilst getting yelled at) as town during it on a regular basis but I guess it's still bad play so w/eto know I curse*
CF7 - 609
PX - 411
Shadoweh - 401
Everyone else - 400
Hi PX, thanks for voting me again. Even though your vote was still on me. Anyway, I wouldn't say I'm exactly being subtle with my Dark push considering that I have actually explicitly said that I found him scummy earlier and continued to push on him up till now.Ahahahahahaha. Oh god, I just read through your posts again. NOWHERE did you say at all was he scummy, or how you felt about him. You just kept throwing a bunch of shit at exploits from his posts. And telling others to vote him. You didn't even bother voting him until there was a wagon. If that ain't subtle then I don't know what is.
And yeah, I have more than one scumread, that isn't a scumtell you know.That wasn't my point. It's okay to have a scumread on an "easy" target if it's because they're deserving of it. It's not okay when ALL your scumreads are pretty much "easy" targets that others have talked about already.
Also you're missing the main point of my Validon vote that he had absolutely no content about how he felt about the rest of the playerlist. I said "why me and Dormio" because it was hypocritical to not be suspicious of someone who's doing the same thing that you're calling other players out on, and there was also the part of the Kilga analysis to my vote. So that's a complete misrep there.
Validon uses too many words to say he has no real scumreads and yet he's asking me and Dormio to contribute more? What? He's also asking us over Serela who's done like nothing so yeah. Also agree with Kilga's analysis.This was your vote on him. Sure, you said he doesn't have real scumreads, but the way you phrased the rest is pretty damn wrong. What's damning about asking others to contribute more? Why did you specifically had to add that in? Why the ask us over Serela? What is the scummy part, the fact that he doesn't have scumreads or the fact that he's asking you and Dormio over Serela? This looks more like an attempt to get attention away from you instead of just saying he has no scumreads, and the Kilga's analysis looks like an afterthought.
What are your other reads by the way?Do I really need to tell you everybody I think is town? That's just useless noise on D1. However, I wouldn't care to see Serela hanging from the noose, it's just that I think you're a much higher priority than Serela.
:V what are you going to do if kilga says you are the scumI guess I would just have to vote myself.
Ahahahahahaha. Oh god, I just read through your posts again. NOWHERE did you say at all was he scummy, or how you felt about him. You just kept throwing a bunch of shit at exploits from his posts. And telling others to vote him. You didn't even bother voting him until there was a wagon. If that ain't subtle then I don't know what is.
That wasn't my point. It's okay to have a scumread on an "easy" target if it's because they're deserving of it. It's not okay when ALL your scumreads are pretty much "easy" targets that others have talked about already.
This was your vote on him. Sure, you said he doesn't have real scumreads, but the way you phrased the rest is pretty damn wrong. What's damning about asking others to contribute more? Why did you specifically had to add that in? Why the ask us over Serela? What is the scummy part, the fact that he doesn't have scumreads or the fact that he's asking you and Dormio over Serela? This looks more like an attempt to get attention away from you instead of just saying he has no scumreads, and the Kilga's analysis looks like an afterthought.
Do I really need to tell you everybody I think is town? That's just useless noise on D1. However, I wouldn't care to see Serela hanging from the noose, it's just that I think you're a much higher priority than Serela.
I would join the SB wagon but I said I would let Kilga tell me who the scum were so I will trust in his trust.
Especially his big post here (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,15788.msg1038981.html#msg1038981).
Like, a complete drop of Darkninjaabc suspicion because he's getting a bunch of flak for it.
...
Basically, Serela is taking a wait-and-see approach where he's just waiting for someone to make some mistake that he can jump on.
I never said your case is invalidated, I just said it was bad, i.e. scummy.
Even if your points on Dormio are completely valid, the way you handled it is all sorts of scummy. It looks like you decided to pick on Dormio first and add a case as an afterthought. It's even worse when you look at the unvote from earlier, because that really just makes you think "Serela really doesn't care about scumhunting, does he?"
It is kinda scummy though how SB is clinging to the DNA vote when everyone else clearly fled the wagon and won't return. >:T
Asking other people to contribute more isn't bad per say, but the fact that he was ignoring Serela who was more guilty of it than anyone else I could think of at that point was bad.
Scum/scum arguments are not unheard of. Obviously you shouldn't go "because it's possible, it must be true in this case," but you shouldn't completely close your mind to the idea either.Don't worry. I keep that in mind all the time, which is why I have so much trouble forming an opinion that I don't end up going back on at least once by the end of the day.
Shadowy, I can't really answer your assertion that "Serela can't multipost as scum." :V I guess I can at least say that I think you made too much of Serela saying fuck, since I don't see him being mad at DNA as much as I see him being incredulous at being asked to claim halfway through D1 when his train isn't too far along yet (and I can see town and scum anyone being equally likely to say fuck in a case like that). I think you casting a completely irrelevant vote is more attention-worthy anyway. You're not trying to scumhunt and might as well not even be in the game right now. This is not townie behavior.We're not talking about 'anyone', we're talking about Serela. It's doubly insulting if you'll subscribe to my Serela dissertation if it supports your scum suspicion, but if I disagree you'll laugh it off as no big deal. Serela can't post as quickly as scum. It's not a matter of multiposting, it's a matter of presence, and he's kind of got it right now. I don't always start by scumhunting anyways, especially if I'm having problems reading teh game. Don't you think if I were scum I'd care a little more about making it look good for you?
since when was dormio even a viable wagonSince never, but he's the only one of the people I'm actually suspicious of who has a vote against them even if it doesn't count.
We're not talking about 'anyone', we're talking about Serela. It's doubly insulting if you'll subscribe to my Serela dissertation if it supports your scum suspicion, but if I disagree you'll laugh it off as no big deal.
I don't always start by scumhunting anyways, especially if I'm having problems reading teh game. Don't you think if I were scum I'd care a little more about making it look good for you?
My SB comment is justified. You even admit it was justified in the same post you accuse me of being scum in.
Every time I read one of Polly's posts I think "If I actually tried to make a case on Polly I think he'd be a scumread" but then I don't actually do it.
wow is it even possible for this to be a town post
Cheez: I have no idea why you think I'm scum. I didn't care the first time because your accuation came with no reasoning or vote, but if it's going to actively interfere with your willingness to vote for Shadowy, I want to know what is up. Why am I scum?It's not really going to interfere with that unless there's suddenly a Kilga wagon straight out of left field, but sure.
##UnvoteStarting off with "This guy is Validon but worse"... Well, I've already established I didn't think Validon should be lynched to begin with. The misrepresentation argument is one I agree with, but
##Vote: Serela
About as lame-duck as Validon in terms of general content. My mind change is twofold; Serela's vote is half-incomprehensible, half-misrepresentation - "eagerness to vote me for noncontribution while I've stated I was about to make a post of it and then even showed some sign of apparently being in the middle of really getting it done" is straight-up rude, given (a) Dormio was changing his vote from his jokevote target to a serious target, and (b) Dormio had expressed irritation with Serela noncontribution before (not contributing in the past isn't magically erased from history by starting to write stuff in the present) - and his notes on Sky Paladin make little sense given Sky Paladin not only has a serious vote down now, but it's on the guy Serela's voting for (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/board,13.0.html). I don't know about other people, but when I'm town I try to pay attention to when people vote for the person I want to vote for, particularly if I'm going to say stuff about those people.
So near I can tell, Serela:
- Dislikes Dormio for deceitful reasons
- Dislikes Sky Paladin for incorrect reasons
- Dislikes Sky Paladin despite Sky Paladin voting for Dormio
- Maybe dislikes Darkninjalphabet possibly kinda? I can't tell.
- Dislikes PX for ??? reasons (I went back and checked the original post on this matter and am having the damnedest time parsing it
- Dislikes no one for legitimate reasons
Apparently Serela lives in a world where I didn't criticize both of his Dormio votes, didn't switch my vote to Shadowy, didn't push Validon as a possibility, and didn't open myself to the possibility of SB as a lynch candidate. Well okay then, that's two people Making Stuff Up about what I've done this game.Kilga what are you talking about?
Speaking of which I really need to look at PX's, like, 3 posts or something.So it's like, he's just trying to start random stuff with Serious Bananas but it's kind of like all he's doing and the random willingness to vote for either me or Serela while basically not mentioning anything about either of us at all or really addressing Serious Bananas' thoughts regarding us is kind of a thing.
serela if you have to resort to picking at every little thing every time dormio posts and saying "look!!! we should lynch him!!!!!!!" then i think it's time for an interventionhe -is- my big scumread y'know
if he keeps posting things I think are scummy I'm going to keep saying they're scummy!Just going to put it out there that I'm pretty sure you were accusing me of being tunnelscum for doing the same thing.
Just going to put it out there that I'm pretty sure you were accusing me of being tunnelscum for doing the same thing.This point is so wrong I don't even.
Speaking of CF7, he said he was back and rereading and then dropped off the face of the planet. >:T It sounds like he might be having legit internet issues though, so...Yeah I'd be suspicious of him too if it wasn't for that.
Just popping in here to respond to Serela quickly but it's like, I'm pretty sure that I've said this in a prior game somewhere, but I really don't care about anyone that I'm not reading as scum and I don't see any reason why I should be wasting my time and effort reading about the people that I don't care about when the people I think are scum are right in front of me.But Dormio, what if you choose to read somebody and notice they're scum?
woah I never saw that post kilga made that just got quotedYou should start doing things that help your case
how did I miss that
Kilga what are you talking about?
Did you misinterpret me saying Dormio is useless as me saying Kilga is useless?
Like I literally have absolutely no idea what you're going on about there.Actually no I should just start voting for you
Although I should probably read that quoted post I missed.
cheez are you scummaybe
maybe
are you scum
Serela: Oh hey I might have. Can you rewrite/rephrase the first three or four lines of #310 so that your meaning is clearer? Nearly all of it looks applicable to me (holding on to a vote for you, shouting down the DNA wagon), so."Kilga defending dormio for [insert of bunch of things dormio did] is boggling
I actually have clear opinions on numerous players! And more then one is a scumread!
Anyway, back to Shadoweh, she's still doing almost nothing. (apart from defending me) While I'm happy she's on my side, she's doing almost zilch in terms of scumhunting despite totally being around, The only thing was the single sentence on SB which is pretty darn easy to come up with considering the Darkie wagon immediately built up and burned down with everyone's glaring distaste at it. And unexplanationally voting CF7 but yeah.I dunno a quick skim through your posts again and this is pretty much the closest thing I can find to a scumread excluding the one you have on myself.
kilga, defending dormio, ignoring most of the game in favor of sitting on super-duper-easy vote serela, boggles my mind
> "If I were scum" argumentIf you're going to entertain player meta, I tell people what I'm like when I'm scum all the time as town. ^_^/ And yet people never believe me. I don't know why I keep jumping onto the stove, I know it's hot but I just can't take walking away. As scum I'm afraid of you. As town I consider you a Person of Interest. You underestimate yourself!
If we're actually going to entertain player meta to this degree I think you're generically afraid of me in every game we're both in regardless of your alignment, so no, I don't think you'd do anything different with me specifically in mind whether you're town or scum. Particularly since I'm only one person and I know you're smart enough to realize my vote doesn't count for 7 votes at once.
Maybe instead of Making Shit Up you should be telling us why CF7 should hang.I don't like his face. Sadly I don't have anything else to go on but that and he just generally feels like he's not there. I can at least see it's not going anywhere though >_> I should at least read SB and decide if he's worth voting or if letting Serela 1/2 get lynched would be better. I guess it would at least save LYLO..
I dunno a quick skim through your posts again and this is pretty much the closest thing I can find to a scumread excluding the one you have on myself.I said "more then one", how many do you expect me to have in D1? D; Anyway, CF7 is close to scumread but he fell off the face of the planet in what is apparently a legitimately gone way that we can't accuse him for lurking over.
Point me to where your other solid scumreads are?
I said "more then one", how many do you expect me to have in D1?I don't know that's why I was asking since you made it sound like you had a lot.
Does that help see where I was coming from better?Yes, I can see where you mistook it. Anyway, I'm not mad at you or anything! I'm just glad we got the misunderstanding sorted out. Me doing something like that as town is the kind of thing I could imagine someone getting legit I-don't-really-like-you about, because that would be absolutely terrible!
Shadowy is Serela your scumbuddy? I still remember Gensokyo Holy War where Serela was scumming it up all over the place in the thread and you were all NO HE'S TOTES TOWN.:V In GHW I never tried to justify why I thought he was town (because it was seriously unjustifyable). Voting Serela would have been so much easier then arguing about him and not having any reasonable scumreads.
and his notes on Sky Paladin make little sense given Sky Paladin not only has a serious vote down now, but it's on the guy Serela's voting for (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/board,13.0.html).I don't really know how to interpret this other than having an issue with Serela suspecting Sky Paladin despite them both voting for Dormio.
-and-
So near I can tell, Serela:
- Dislikes Sky Paladin despite Sky Paladin voting for Dormio
scum post imooh noooooo
Cheez quotes posts about me being confused why Kilga is being mad at me, and then says "nevermind I should vote Serela"...Huh? I was focused on how you noticed Kilga's huge post against you for the first time and then proceeded to ask him questions about things that were answered in the post without reading it first.
I don't get how that train of thought is supposed to work >_> Kilga misinterpreted something I said, proceeded to make accusations at me, I was really confused because I had no idea what he was talking about. How does that make me scum?
I guess, looking back on it, it could just be you having a problem with Serela apparently missing every third post in this thread.Sadly I seem to have actually done this for all of early day 1
Shadoweh:I think Kilgamayan is a good enough player and I am an infuriating enough one that he could easily be either alignment and there's much higher priority things to pay attention to right now?You're addressing him pretty clearly as a townie. You can't have misunderstandings with scum. What could possibly be a higher priority then sorting you out right now anyways? You gonna get owned
You're addressing him pretty clearly as a townie. You can't have misunderstandings with scum.Uh, why can't someone have misunderstandings with scum
Is it too late to change our minds that Dark is town? :C
You're addressing him pretty clearly as a townie. You can't have misunderstandings with scum.Even in my current state of not properly comprehending anything I'm pretty sure this is something I wouldn't comprehend anyway
Is it too late to change our minds that Dark is town? :CNo, it's not too late.
but really, you've made weak and ineffective prods at pretty much everyone that has attacked you at some point, saying that they're oh-so-scummy, and then did absolutely nothing about it. how is that not scummy?Polly what the fuck are you even talking about.
Scum want to make non contributing votes on day 1 that appear contributing....?
The easiest way to do that is to vote for an afk - town may switch to afk CF7 and pop! SB will have helped lynch scum, therefore appearing town.
Cheez did you miss the part where I was mostly kidding >_>Yes but it's okay, I don't trust you
Every time I read one of Polly's posts I think "If I actually tried to make a case on Polly I think he'd be a scumread" but then I don't actually do it.
Shadoweh:I think Kilgamayan is a good enough player and I am an infuriating enough one that he could easily be either alignment and there's much higher priority things to pay attention to right now?
Is it too late to change our minds that Dark is town? :C
like, polly says "if you really thought dark was scum you would keep voting him"
did you miss all the parts where I don't really think dark is scum
Serela if you don't think DNA is scum why are you trying to "subtly" suggest that he is?The post is depressingly bad in a scummy way regardless
I'm not seriously suggesting we lynch Dark (...I think) but dear god that is the most blatant scum!coasting I have ever seen. I can expect absolutely anything from dark!town by now, but, still.
I don't think Serela is scum BUT he may be the only viable lynch at this time.
Therefore, in the interests of not giving scum an advantage, I am prepared to sacrifice a probably-townie.
"well I'm going to keep voting serela because there's no time left and we can only lynch serelaActually that first line goes more like "there is next to no reason to change my vote since it's already there because of actual suspicions I have"
besides even if we didn't we'd have to deal with these other people and have to... like... read them"
>___________________________________>
Serela if you're town stop being defeatist and actually push a case on someone else >_>Wow because it's totally not like I haven't been doing that for a pretty long time
My half-joking comments all made people declare me even scummier.By the way I did actually think this over during dinner and realized it was a pretty poor reason for me to stick with
Eliminate the vile scum from the face of our Earth.
Even if its a misfire we can deal with that if its now.
wind because i get to say one of the words myself
Somehow he didn't say anything useful again and the whole post is pretty much just water.
But in my deepest darkest heart of hearts, I have to admit I don't have a reading either way and I'm just screwing around. Sigh.
And then things started happening in her direction and you sat thereNo. Things were happening in Shadoweh's direction and it was still at the point where I seemed to have a decent chance. And I kept pushing for Dormio (with some shadoweh on the side)
Yell at people not voting for her to vote for her over you, maybe?
The reluctance of Serela and Shadoweh to contest each other is really a big red flag for me, especially as they are, now, both up for lynch.ugh
I'm wrong no matter what. Either he's a towny and I should have gone with my gut feeling from the start of the day, or he's scum and I was wrong about my meta reasoning. I don't feel good either way.I do a lot of being wrong about things anyway so you don't really have to worry about that.
It's entirely possible they're scum together and are trying distancing tactics. I would be 0% surprised if they were scumbuddies, Gensokyo Holy War jokes aside.I do realize this now, but I had completely failed to notice what I was saying earlier in the first place and so once I noticed it I posted it like it was some sort of important and meaningful revelation when in reality it was probably what people could observe if their brains functioned properly for about half a minute.
I don't really see how that's supposed to work in this case, and I'm used to yelling at people while they ignore me on a regular basis (kaori/uesugi in swordgirls, rawr in whichever mafia game he was scum that did literally nothing and somehow EVERYONE QUICKLYNCHED ME D4 OR SO BEFORE I POSTED A SINGLE TIME because saying rawr was scum was so terrible apparently, oh yes welcome to nhk)
I could keep going but no point etc
I could ask why PX is voting me over Shadoweh, but when it comes down to it, Shadoweh is a lurker lynch and I've actually done things people can point at and complain about and I can't really defend against them any more then I already have. It's kind of a "decide what you want to lynch" point. I've run out of extra things I can do to try to prove I'm townie through providing content AFAIK
ugh
I am so unreluctant to go after shadoweh
I was voting her before I gave up and only stopped because all interest in her seemed to go down the toilet and numerous people declared a non-serela lynch a lost cause and left.
And it's so annoying how many people saying "serela's not even trying to stop it" when I've been trying like mad the past several hours.
Anyway, there's enough votes for me to hammer myself now, and even after the recent boost of willingness to lynch shadoweh, the two voteswitches onto me seem to have pretty cemented the deal here. >_> There's no way it's not ending like this.
##Vote Serela
Unless maybe if the real lynch flipped scum, because then everyone (except darkie) would probably leave me aloneactually no because everyone is talking about shadoweh+serela scumbuddies ^_______________________________________^
Welcome to Justice Juice Mafia, Serela! You're Bushido Banana. You're the best fighter of your kind, combining tactics, strength and appeal. You also have a thing against those smartasses with the hi-tech machinery, though you plan on pulling your weight here whatever happens. It's obvious that stopping the scumbags comes first.
Your role is Town Best Pal. Having been an acquaitance of [snipped] for a long time, you've decided to crack this case together. For as long as both of you are alive, you must vote the same person for your votes to count. [snipped] is played by Polaris.
You win when all evildoers are eliminated.
CF7 - 982
Darkninjaabc - 582
PX - 468
Validon98 - 443
Everyone else - 400
Welcome to Justice Juice Mafia, SB! You're Omnipresent Onion. You're a potent medium whose power transcends dimensions. Though you may not eavesdrop on conversations, you can communicate with distant others effortlessly. You can basically act like a big transmitter for your own sound waves, but you don't like to think of yourself that way.
Your role is Town Restless Spirit. Should you be sent to the next dimension in the sky by an evil kill, you will still be able to project your votes to the thread normally. (and only votes - don't abuse the system!) As death is kind of a big deal, this will last one full day, after which you'll finally rest in peace.
You win when all evildoers are eliminated.
SB was a prime suspect for being scum. Therefore killing him was probably a vig-hit. Then, where was the night kill from scum? I don't get it. Maybe it went on somebody bulletproof or they were afk (*cough* CF7)....Are you implying that CF7 counted for the entirety of the scum team?
Well SB, try and put in a vote and see if you can - if you can't do it, then we know it was a teamkill, and CF7/Neko is now suspicious.Yeah, SB is kind of a boggling nightkill. Personally, I kind of have to wonder if a bus driver is around (not sure how common they are but I'm too used to them.) If it was the intended scum kill, I dunno. Maybe they realized that SB is pretty smart and figured with so many people suspecting him for some reason they could take him out without running the risk of interference before he becomes a greater threat.
If you CAN vote, then town needs to think why on earth scum would have gone for SB over the many other obvious candidates, eg, half of town who thought SB was scum...
That really just leaves Serela. To be honest I was thinking him as null at the start, but I'm worried about his lack of content that is relevant. Plus I still can't shake the potential of him and Polaris being ITP. Of course, if they were, it would be too obvious, and between the two of the Polaris seems definitely more town. Unless something else comes up with someone else:
##Unvote
##Vote: Serela
My vote is still on Serela for now because I'm not overly convinced by his recent efforts, but I'm willing to change to SB, maybe Shadoweh although I'm not entirely sure about her.
PEOPLE WHO ARE UNSURE ABOUT VALIDON OR DO NOT THINK HE IS LIKELY TO BE SCUM: Please explain to me how the things I quoted in #478 are more indicative of a townie scumhunting and concluding Serela than scum trying to cast a vote for an easy target.Alright, that's a statement which doesnt go anywhere. Kilga already quoted the worst part of validon's fail accompanied with a bias which is a dead end question with only the answer, ''well validon is scummy.''
(ps I am not saying that because SB died it had to be Shadowy and/or PX that killed him. I'm saying that originally I thought they were both extremely unlikely to kill him, but now realize the logic I used to get to that point is flawed, and thus his death is not nearly as indicative of their towniness as I originally thought. OKAY REALLY LEAVING NOW)I also cannot imagine someone like kilga contradicting his case provided with how apparantly experienced he is with mafia.
100% accurate RVS Scumteam: Dark, Serela, Validon
Now watch me die night 1. I'd be in stitches if I did.
Consider kilga's content and his presence. I personally expect scum to be out for his blood.
I don't like how wishy-washy he was about the entire ordeal as if he didn't want to stain his hands or something.
Option 3 - Appears to have good reads on who the scum are.Popping in to say I considered the "now watch me die night one" post as part of the motivation behind killing SB but I feel like that was factored into the motivation as a red herring for the town to focus on. Even though I obviously can't prove it, it's still a possibility.
SB implicated - DNA, Validon, Serela. Serela is dead so let's rule him out.
Option 4 - Will implicate another towny in some way
Not really relevant - we know scum killed SB, not vig, so any of the people who wanted him flipped - myself, Kilga, possibly PX - aren't responsible for killing him. In short, if any of us were scum, we would almost certainly have gone for different targets. Personally, I would have killed DNA as he's stated he has a role and is generally accepted to be town. There's also been no interaction between Dark and myself to link back to me.
Shadowy I know you would want to kill me. But let's pretend for a moment there's a doc in this game, since that's not an uncommon thing. Who do you think they would have protected last night?How about the rolecop?
Not really relevant - we know scum killed SB, not vigWhy do we know this?
Why do we know this?SB can still vote today and he wouldn't be able to do that if a townie killed him. A serial killer isn't out of the question but I'm going to act on the assumption that SB was the mafia kill. If a doctor saved somebody else last night then I'll reconsider (doc shouldn't necessarily out themselves for this purpose though, there's more work for them to do)
Ninja, did you cop SB last night or do you have a result to out?I was wondering about Darkie's investigation too. Kind of figured he'd bring them up at his own discretion, but I guess it doesn't really hurt to ask.
Serela (5): Dormio, Validon98, Polaris, Darkninjaabc, Sky_Paladin, Cheez8Pre lolwagon on me votecount. I'm willing to forgive Kilga for his cross-push on me and Serela that nearly got me outsted since he was successfully doing something. I'm even willing to forgive PX because I liked his earlier posts (he needs to post new targets now that SB is flipped town though.) I cannot appreciate CF7's lack of anything during deadline to the point of flaking. Neko hasn't posted yet, but I'm going to pre-emptively be upset with his slot until he does something good. Or dies. Preferrably dies.
SB (1): PX,
Darkninjaabc (2): CF7, SB
Shadoweh (1): Kilgamayan
Dormio (0): Serela
CF7 (1): Shadoweh
Serela (4): Dormio, Validon98, Polaris, Darkninjaabc, PX..How happy they were to dogpile onto me immediately after. I supose you'll just have to trust that I should be colored in pretty green here, but this is split town wagons.
Darkninjaabc (2): CF7, SB
Shadoweh (3): Kilgamayan, Serela, Cheez8, Sky_Paladin
CF7 (1): Shadoweh
Small clarification on the "factually incorrect" Shadowy case assessment thing: I did accuse her of floating along with barely a presence. I made this accusation exactly once, and it is the only aspect of my case that I didn't press. The useless CF7 vote and Making Stuff Up About SB were far worse an I've focused on them a lot more.But the floating part was probably the most correct part of your case <_< I stand that my CF7 vote would have been a better lynch then Serela. I'm still mad at you for ignoring me.
DNA: Sounds like you were roleblocked. This is exactly why claiming willy-nilly is not good for town, because scum most likely have tools to mess with your roles.So there's a scum roleblocker in this game, then?
NNR - 913
PX - 468
Remember when Darkie claimed his role? He said he was a Roleclop whose action fails if anybody else targets his target.
And the rest is reasoning I don't see any problems with. Right. Onto Shadoweh, then.
Oh. And i am the Peachy Peach. The Roleclop. My ability fails if any other ability is used on the person i targetThis was the entire post where he claimed. Seems pretty hard to miss that second part considering it's roughly half the post, and I have trouble believing you'd forget major details about one of the only roles that has been claimed so far.
Do you really think NNR is going to try harder because he has a vote on him for reasons he literally can't defend against?I supose it depends on what you mean by try harder. I believe it will make it easier for me to get a read on him if he ever posts, yes.
Shadoweh:
Maybe I'm just overreacting, but that last sentence. (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,15788.msg1038611.html#msg1038611) I know it's probably a joke but at this point I don't want to take anything lightly.
Okay... I can see someone wants someone to go Captain Planet. (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,15788.msg1038943.html#msg1038943) Which Polaris faked, considering that even when he did it nothing happened. Also Shadoweh acknowledging her own bad play is kind of worrying. It gives me that "Oh I'm playing bad I'm so sorry I promise to improve I'm totally not scum if that's what you're thinking" vibe. And that's not a good vibe to get.
This post is bad for more than just the CF7 vote. (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,15788.msg1039083.html#msg1039083) I wouldn't exactly call what you typed before an "essay" on how you didn't like the wagon. You were basically like "he might be legit mad at someone, but then again he might not be." The post you mentioned was kind of leaning towards thinking Serela was town but it was waffling a bit, but the transition from "well I think he's town but he might not be" to "OMG GUYS THIS IS STUPID GET OFF HIS CASE" feels weird. I mean, Serela flipped town, yes. But the way Shadoweh acted around the whole thing is... weird. It doesn't fill me with happy thoughts at the moment.
Define "bussing." (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,15788.msg1039999.html#msg1039999) Unless it's just another word for sheeping, but considering you claimed VT but said something like that, uh... yeah, not getting good vibes from that either.
For now, Shadoweh is still up there on my list of people I am willing to vote for. I need to do stuff with dinner and stuff before continuing my reads. Will be back with more later.
Cut: @Cheez: I read that, but somehow that really slipped my mind. I only remembered the roleclop part. <_>;
Cut: @Cheez: I read that, but somehow that really slipped my mind. I only remembered the roleclop part. <_>;Mrrrrh. That's really lame but it's still possible (somehow.) I guess I'll drop this particular case against Validon and let him try to deal with looking suspicious in other ways.
Also, my opinion is that scum have a roleblocker in the game. It's not THAT uncommon, especially with what we have so far.My argument was not that there wasn't a roleblocker in the game. My argument was that immediately assuming that's what happened despite knowing of Darkie's role's weakness is scummy. In fact, I'm pretty sure that IS what happened considering I'm also pretty sure I didn't get targeted last night (or at least didn't notice it) BUT the only people who would actually be aware that Darkie's role's weakness didn't come into play are me and the people who knew he was roleblocked.
I believe it will make it easier for me to get a read on him if he ever posts, yes.
NNR has no reason to care that I'm voting for him but I can't admit that I'm voteparking because it'll expose me as scum further so I'm going to play coy instead
Not really relevant - we know scum killed SB, not vig
Why do we know this?
SB can still vote today and he wouldn't be able to do that if a townie killed him. A serial killer isn't out of the question but I'm going to act on the assumption that SB was the mafia kill.
Cut: ..That's a good catch. You're alright Cheez, you're alright.
MAKE A POST ABOUT SOON. PROBABLY.Apparently "soon" translates to "whenever I'm done falling asleep and waking up a couple of times".
Dormio, I think you're making too much of Sky Paladin's Serela vote. Most of the newbies in this game have been hyper-paranoid about wagons and consolidation and whatnot, and once Sky Paladin saw he had more time than he thought he had he went back to voting someone he thought was scum. I don't think too harshly of him for it.I dunno. Sky Palladium demonstrated competence and a willingness to abuse newbmeta last game.
I live in Japan so I'm on a drastically different time-zoneI live in Australia. Welcome to the club of shitty timezones.
Also:I don't remember it getting talked about besides that SB was alive. Actually it hadn't occured to me that he could not come back.
How was this even a thing? It got discussed at the beginning of the day while you were around, you shouldn't have needed the clarification later. Are you just plain not paying attention to the thread (a possibility that might explain Making Stuff Up About SB)?
I am annoyed with Validon because apparently he thought it would be a good idea to start ISOs off with CF7 of all people, and we all know that CF7 is unremarkable so I dunno what Validon was trying to accomplish there.
Validon, your top priority should be to say "[INSERT NAME HERE] is the scum" and place a vote down on that person.
I was scumbuddies with Serela for defending him too. I'm glad my habit of reading people and finding good traits in them helps you all ship me with so many people.
Moving on, Cheez8.I'm pretty sure I gave somewhat valid reasons for a couple of my votes and reads yesterday, and stuck with them.
It's just like, I read through his D1 and he's got no opinions basically.
I mean the closest thing to scumreads are here (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,15788.msg1039250.html#msg1039250) but he gives basically no reasoning for any of his reads.
I mean I guess technically he has reasoning for his Kilga vote here (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,15788.msg1039319.html#msg1039319) which is mostly about how Kilga was attacking Validon but then if we look at Cheez8's posts today...I noticed this too, and it bothered me.
Like, this one (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,15788.msg1039854.html#msg1039854) for example, suddenly Kilga voting for Validon becomes something that Cheez8 is agreeing with.
(Kinda worries me that most of the people happiest to vote Validon are some of my scumteam hunches from Day 1 but I'll wait and see how things go.)You'll notice that I did wait and see how things go, and decided against voting for Validon.
I dunno, Cheez8's behaviours basically look to me like they're not really following a set thought process and that he's basically just trying to go with popular opinion to stay on the sidelines while having some (poorly thought out) unique reads to make it look like he's contributing.
Or something like that.
Nearly all of my posts in this game have been created with the sole intent of adding to the town's collective information.That and voting. :V
NNR - 1313
PX - 700
Everyone else - 400
19) Taking note of the rule before this one, replacements should be ready to jump in immediately if/when they're needed.
PX - 700
Or is he a town just not directly addressing a newb's voice because he knows that said newb cannot sway the game much?
Maybe it went on somebody bulletproof or they were afk (*cough* CF7).Right, I'm sure all three scumbuddies forgot to act or send partners to do actions.
I'm interested in why SB was killed.Yep, he does. He spends a bunch of time on SB, to the point of making me want to skim his posts. Even if SB was a vig shot, it doesn't tell pretty much anything about anyone's alignment. Scum SOMETIMES NK based on who doesn't like them, but that's usually lame.
Shit, what's going on here? Sounds like the SB kill wasn't expected, and analyzing the nightkill is worthless anyway.Quote
It's always worth considering, even if it ends up with nothing. Not considering something means that an important detail that may have existed is guaranteed to be missed. We don't know until we look.QuoteRight, I'm sure all three scumbuddies forgot to act or send partners to do actions.
I will assume that there is one scumbuddy that can hit, one scumbuddy that can sabotage, and one scumbuddy that can do (some other thing/is bulletproof) when one of their buddies die. Therefore, that's one hit last night. There's the possibility that scums can send in actions for their afk buddies.
I'm going to quote you out of order for context cohesion.QuoteEven if SB was a vig shot, it doesn't tell pretty much anything about anyone's alignment. Scum SOMETIMES NK based on who doesn't like them, but that's usually lame.
Actually last night, it matters a lot. If SB was vighit, it means mafia was afk last night. There was a very small pool of afk players, one of which was CF7, a fact you know very well. If we could pin the lack-of-hit on CF7's afk, the you'd be subbing in to face the lynch today. This was discussed in depth on the previous pages. I want to say "probably you didn't notice it" but apparently you read my posts in depth; therefore, it's a detail you couldn't have missed. I will assume it was deliberately ignored to make your case.QuoteMore Serela remorse... Sky Paladin, are you going to spend any time actually scumhunting?
I don't have remorse over Serela. If Shadoweh flips town, I'll be sorry. But Serela didn't do anything to help his situation and continued to play scummy, right up to attempted suicide. I argued several times that Serela wasn't a viable target and was ignored. Therefore, I would look at the others who voted to lynch with more suspicion than you did with me.
Your post is essentially "I am arbitrarily targetting Sky_Paladin for a number of flawed reasons", including some points that you chose to ignore because they didn't fit your story. I can ignore bad play and I can ignore mistakes. However, you deliberately picked me out for some specific reason and made bad arguments to support it.
Therefore, I'm forced to conclude you're scum trying to buy heat off of Shadoweh.
Shit, what's going on here? Sounds like the SB kill wasn't expected, and analyzing the nightkill is worthless anyway.
Right, I'm sure all three scumbuddies forgot to act or send partners to do actions.
Even if SB was a vig shot, it doesn't tell pretty much anything about anyone's alignment. Scum SOMETIMES NK based on who doesn't like them, but that's usually lame.
More Serela remorse... Sky Paladin, are you going to spend any time actually scumhunting?
I responded to everything I saw that you addressed directly at me. If I missed something, feel free to point it out and I'll get to it when I can (though I'm about to go to bed). Shadowy has all but claimed scum at this point so we have some free time.No, I'm pretty sure I claimed Vanilla Town. I really like my role flavor so I'm sad I can't talk about it. Nom nom everything! I'm seriously suspicious of you for thinking this is my scum game. You really haven't noticed that no one cares about this wagon or is trying hard to start a different one? It's because I'm town and lynching me for being.. not even weird at this point, just continuing the stupid Day 1 Shadoweh Is Scumpartners With Everyone case is super special easy.
lynching me for being.. not even weird at this point, just continuing the stupid Day 1 Shadoweh Is Scumpartners With Everyone case is super special easy.
Endymion, that was a mean trick, telling me how dare I believe Joker's case on you, without ever telling me what exactly was wrong with it. Guilt instead of an actual defense, I understand what scummy AtE feels like now.
I'm not particularly okay with Sky_Paladin implying NNR is her scumpartner.
I will assume that there is one scumbuddy that can hit, one scumbuddy that can sabotage, and one scumbuddy that can do (some other thing/is bulletproof) when one of their buddies die. Therefore, that's one hit last night. There's the possibility that scums can send in actions for their afk buddies.Mafia don't "afk". That simply never happens. Scum can tell the mod to "send Buddy to do ##Action" if they have to, and kills are almost always decided long before the night is over.
I'm going to quote you out of order for context cohesion.
Actually last night, it matters a lot. If SB was vighit, it means mafia was afk last night.
I don't have remorse over Serela. If Shadoweh flips town, I'll be sorry. But Serela didn't do anything to help his situation and continued to play scummy, right up to attempted suicide. I argued several times that Serela wasn't a viable target and was ignored. Therefore, I would look at the others who voted to lynch with more suspicion than you did with me.Your posts all really read "WOW I FEEL SO BAD FOR LYNCHING SERELA" which is a scumtell.
Your post is essentially "I am arbitrarily targetting Sky_Paladin for a number of flawed reasons", including some points that you chose to ignore because they didn't fit your story. I can ignore bad play and I can ignore mistakes. However, you deliberately picked me out for some specific reason and made bad arguments to support it.Where are these reasons even for voting him? I need to go back and reread your D2 posts because I didn't see them.
Therefore, I'm forced to conclude you're scum trying to buy heat off of Shadoweh.
Neko I'm here to help you read 1300 words <^_^> If you're not going to read Day 1, the gist is SB was his usual self, DNA outted himself as a roleclop, and Serela was Town Best Pal with Polaris who we lynched because he was Serela. Taking a look at the player list you wouldn't expect SB to die either, would you?Thanks Shadoweh, this is the best post I've actually yet bothered to read this game (the others only being Sky Paladin so far)
If Shadoweh flips town, I'll be sorry.Here's a cool tip to look town and be cool:
...Are you implying that CF7 counted for the entirety of the scum team?FINALLY someone who understands who moronic that line of thinking is!
NNR is going to try harder because he has a vote on him?HAHAHA NOPE
Am here expect dogpileKinda sums up the case on her. I kinda wonder why she's this scuicidal. She's not scumhunting anyone reasonable. Her best case is on me because CF7 was a lurker, which by itself is usually a laugnable case on its own, especially when the "lurker" is someone who replaced out anyway. If your best case for keeping yourself from death is to vote for the guy who cannot actually be read, then you are trying surprisingly not hard.
[literally anything Dormio says in any Mafia game ever]Quote
DIE SCUM DIE
##Unvote:
##Vote Dormio
##Unvote
I'm kidding, Dormio is p tight with me so far.
Actually I just wanted to see if you'd flip out when you saw why I was voting you.I don't flip out until I have half the votes needed for a lynch.
Which sadly means I'm going to have to make a case on someone else I supose.Also, "sadly"? :smug:
NNR used 'policy kill' instead of 'policy lyncch. Scumslip much?At this point I've given up on questioning your logic but this is just too absurd. What?
FINALLY someone who understands who moronic that line of thinking is!Hey, I thought the same about you just a bit ago! Imagine that.
In all seriousness Cheez needs a vote, he's been sitting on it far too long for him not have at least a vauge idea of who he thinks is scummy, and "somebody" is always better then "nada jack shit". His posts are mostly just setup spec too, which is terribad.Sure thing. Let's see... Well, I still think Dormio is scummy. Kilga concerns me but either he's town or he's good at being scum, because I can't really make a case for him yet. Shadoweh used to concern me but as she posts more I'm seeing less reason to be concerned. Dormio's really the only player who I'm confident in mistrusting at the moment, so I guess that makes my course of action kind of clear.
Validon: I'm totes going to ignore him today, Serela flipped him as a Neighbor or something... heh, and they have shared votes.I'm assuming you meant
Yeah, I'm just going to file him under "town" for now, I'm lazy. Also I was at one point destined to get that role, and I never role scum, so that just seals the deal.
##Unvote
##Vote: [REDACTED to avoid hammer] (Hint it's Shadoweh)
...
DIE SCUM DIE
##Unvote:
##Vote Dormio
##Unvote
Oh heyI'm assuming you meantYeah, speaking of which, I need to read ValidonPalidonPolaris for this, right? The Validon that people are talking about is someone completely different. I don't think you've brought him up yet, actually.
gah too many seven-letter names with the same consonant-vowel pattern
I wasn't aware I was so concerned with the setup. Was I really, NNR?Considering up till now I haven't really read you post anything questioning the motives of others, yeah.
and the fact that I didn't really have anything to add to the conversationThis kind of immediately sends off alarm bells when I read it. There's always SOMETHING to add imo, whether it's just pushing some guy hard or adding more reads to your repertoire. Minor issue but makes me wonder about your motives a bit.
Considering up till now I haven't really read you post anything questioning the motives of others, yeah.I don't know what counts as solid but I can sure give you reasons I suspect him.
Is your Dormio vote due in any solid reasoning, Cheez, or is it just a gut feeling?
Possibly Dormio too, since I don't remember him doing much of anything today.My neck and shoulders hurt but I'm here now.
I dunno. Sky Palladium demonstrated competence and a willingness to abuse newbmeta last game.Which I get the feeling was ignored too.
You'll note that my behaviour with not-lynching Serela is the same as not wanting to lynch day 1 in the previous game.And this line?
The first post of his that made me suspicious was #80 (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,15788.msg1038388.html#msg1038388), where he casually points out how Serela didn't develop an opinion yet. This was still pretty early in Day 1, at a time when remotely serious discussion had only begun less than a page ago. First, "no good opinions as of yet" was an ENTIRELY valid stance at the time, though that's not the point. It would be one thing if Dormio had outright accused Serela of being scummy for this- if that was the case, Dormio would be protected with the "bad play =/= scummy play" argument. But he didn't. Instead what he did was bring up a point that could spur people to keep an eye on Serela without making a case out of it himself. That's what really makes this feel like a scummy move to me: bringing up a (flawed) point against Serela without pushing it so that he could get people to start suspecting a townie without being pegged as the person who started making cases against him.Uh, I was in class at the time, which is not the best environment for playing mafia and writing up cases since I'm trying to write down notes.
Sometime shortly afterwards when he votes for Serela (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,15788.msg1038535.html#msg1038535) he says that me "buddying pretty hard to Serela raises a lot of eyebrows" even though I don't think I really buddied with Serela that hard (or at all.) The closest I came to that at the time was when I brought up the first post I mentioned here and pointed out that he's pointed this out about Serela at a time where I could reasonably expect a similar stance from about half the people playing the game. There was a second mention of this when I mentioned some people I had slight suspicions about at that point but that was it. I made no direct mentions of Serela in those posts, and no mention at all otherwise.I don't see why you're trying to cover yourself so much here.
A lot of his posts from there on are replying to or accusing Serela for a while. He also starts trying to look like he's making useful comments in the meantime with posts like this one (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,15788.msg1038645.html#msg1038645) but this sort of thing isn't contribution so much as plain old observation or things that don't contribute anything at all. This is what "fluff" means, isn't it? I think examples like that post are really helping me fully grasp the terms you guys use here.Uh, I don't get what you're trying to say here.
(He also says things including but not limited to "other people covered it so I won't mention it" in that post. I don't think things like that are sufficient grounds to suspect anybody but apparently a bunch of you do, as well as Dormio himself sometimes, so here you go! Feast away.)
I nearly brought up both the way he was pushing the wagon really hard to get it rolling and the way he clammed up and let other people finish accusing Serela for him at the end, but then I realized I was doing that thing where everything somebody does looks like a scumtell if you assume they're scum first. Thinking about it again, pushing somebody you think is scum is completely fine and I GUESS it's okay to drop it and let other people finish up once you feel like you're finished doing your part, but staying quiet for the full last four or five pages of Day 1 seems like a little much. There was a point where one or two people unvoted Serela and it looked like the wagon could turn around. I'd think that a townie going after someone they believe to be scum would be less concerned with how they look or the fact that they're drawing attention to themselves and more concerned about the possibility that a member of the scumteam could get off the hook.I kind of wasn't there.
But I never said Serela was scum
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Cut: ..That's a good catch. You're alright Cheez, you're alright.BT's told us that flavour means nothing in this game.
Also, I refute your argument that Serela not developing an opinion was alright.Because that early in the game it really WAS difficult to come up with an opinion that was worth believing. Wanting more to work with makes sense to me.
Why do you believe this to be the case?
As you mention yourself, there was some serious discussion starting and to simply respond by saying the equivalent of "I DON'T WANT TO READ WORDS TO FORM OPINIONS" is pretty scummy in my eyes.
I don't see why you're trying to cover yourself so much here.I think it was just because you were saying things that weren't true. And uh... actually that's basically it. Still, the only times I brought up Serela were the times I brought up your post about Serela and when I was doing that I was referring to you.
Like, this post is supposed to be about why you suspect me, right?
So why is the entirety of this paragraph an explanation for your own behaviours?
Also, why are you trying to distance yourself from the buddying accusations with weak claims like "I made no direct mention of Serela in those posts" when it's painfully obvious who you're referring to?
Uh, I don't get what you're trying to say here.Nah, CF7's posts had a lot of fluff too. That doesn't say anything about yours.
What's so bad about me trying to get Serela lynched?
And so you don't think that an observation about how CF7 was setting himself up to jump onto wagons if they happen while not delivering any actual content of his own is fluff? Okay.
I kind of wasn't there.For some reason I keep thinking you were there. I guess I can't prove it though.
Also, how does that last sentence even make sense?
Serela kind of flipped town.
Assuming that I were scum like you say I am, how could it possibly be the case that my disappearance at the end of D1 was an attempt to save my scumbuddy Serela?
Because that early in the game it really WAS difficult to come up with an opinion that was worth believing. Wanting more to work with makes sense to me.There was content, you said so yourself, and you can form opinions about content when it's there.
I think it was just because you were saying things that weren't true. And uh... actually that's basically it.
Still, the only times I brought up Serela were the times I brought up your post about Serela and when I was doing that I was referring to you.And, uh, tell me how this is supposed to change the fact that you were buddying up to Serela by defending him at the time?
Lies accompanying a vote don't sit well with me, okay?
Nah, CF7's posts had a lot of fluff too. That doesn't say anything about yours.I think you missed the meaning of my sentence entirely.
Anyway... huh? I don't follow. Yes, Serela flipped town. If he didn't, why would I still be so suspicious of you? My point was that you backed off near the end so you wouldn't become the person pushing for Serela's lynch the entire time. You were saving your image, not Serela. If you weren't a mafia member, you wouldn't have been concerned with that and would have made sure he was lynched, considering you were so certain he was scum.The fuck?
Still at work, won't be home until tonight. But I never said Serela was scum, I said I thought he was town but got cut by him self hammering. Also, NNR is claiming scum. And please, mislynch me if you wish, I need to work on NaNoWriMo anyways. Also, phone posting with a new phone is hard.ahahahahaha what? Are you serious? How do you even infer that from a joke post referencing a past game? How can you even claim I'm scumbuddies with you (essentially what that accusation boils down to) and then turn around and reverse my post by claiming innocent?
Regardless I am interested in hearing what (PX has) to say in full when (he gets) home but I want to see what Shadowy does with her vote first.
I can't believe I'm getting wagoned by the caseless, basless, scum, the inactive, and the chicago voter.
Now I've seen everything
There was content, you said so yourself, and you can form opinions about content when it's there.All town opinions were extremely weak at that point, with most of the opinions that did exist turning up as either null reads or unsubstantiated hunches (or completely off the walls.)
Whining that you have nothing to work with is nothing more than an excuse.
I really don't get why you're trying to push this point so much.
I guess it must be really hard to look for a case when you're scum. :)
And, uh, tell me how this is supposed to change the fact that you were buddying up to Serela by defending him at the time?I'm not hiding anything. I'm standing by my assertion. What's truly clear as day here is that my intent was never to defend Serela and I hardly brought the issue up, so your claim that I was buddying pretty hard is misleading and wrong.
I'll also note that you're still trying to hide this even though it's as clear as day.
I think you missed the meaning of my sentence entirely.Oh.
But whatever.
Cheez8, can you update your line of thoughts to go with Dormio's D2 posts? What do you think about the Paladin case?Probably.
Alright, Neko, I am not really pissed off if scum acts desperate and accuse people to save their own asses. It is only when people actually buy shitty scum arguments (Cheez8's OMGUS d1 crap) when I flip out.I don't think you entirely understood what I meant when I was ask- you know what, forget it, I don't think you're going to be bothered either way.
PX - 1097
Polaris - 741
Shadoweh - 420
Dormio - 410
Everyone else - 400
Clearly he is trying to powerbus his scumbuddy of choice again a la Pictures of Birds
I'm starting to waver a little bit on Cheez, he's made a few role-related word trickeration attempts today that look town-motivated if misguided. I dunno, I might just suck at finding newbie scum. I've liked Sky Paladin for most of the game but a few people seem to disagree there. Regardless, if the remaining two scum aren't some combination of Validon, PX, Dormio, and NNR then I'm going to be miffed.
I can't believe I'm getting wagoned by the caseless, basless, scum, the inactive, and the chicago voter.
Now I've seen everything
4) You've pretty much got all the game focused on Shadoweh now
It's the only way I can parse someone who makes up their mind in the first 24 hours and never has a change of heart even once. There is no such thing as Town certainty.
Serela if you're town stop being defeatist and actually push a case on someone else >_>
C'mon, Shadowy. If you're gonna go down like this the least you could do is try to push your "case" by linking the Downfall video so we can all get a few chuckles out of the whole thing.
Then maybe you should invest time in digging up and rehashing why people should vote Shadowy ahead of you! Polaris is not going to get lynched today, stop wasting time on him! I really shouldn't be needing to hold a townie hand through this process!
Gonna have to wait until I get home before I can properly digest everything NNR has produced, but just based on the volume and him actually being willing to accuse people of being scum I'd at least put him lower on the scum list than Validon and PX. Possibly Dormio too, since I don't remember him doing much of anything today.
I'm starting to waver a little bit on Cheez, he's made a few role-related word trickeration attempts today that look town-motivated if misguided. I dunno, I might just suck at finding newbie scum. I've liked Sky Paladin for most of the game but a few people seem to disagree there. Regardless, if the remaining two scum aren't some combination of Validon, PX, Dormio, and NNR then I'm going to be miffed.
Cut by another Validon vote. Not sure I like it being a parrot when I wanted to see where Cheez's Dormio suspicions would go, as much as I can't disagree with Validon votes right now.
This validates PX's main argument against your Validon vote, I think.
I could get behind any of Serela, Validon, Shadowy, or SB as lynch candidates, in roughly that order.
Polaris, what do you think of Validon? Your last assessment of him was "Null leaning scum, but I would like to see more posts with cases that are a bit stronger" from almost 24 hours ago. How has this changed, if at all?
I still don't trust the slot but who knows, maybe Mitsuki will actually put in the effort PX failed to. :V
Okay, listen. I've been looking at everyone's posts and seeing whether or not they could be scummy. I'm doing the fucking best I can, and I'm not going to go "[INSERT NAME HERE] is the scum" when I have my fucking doubts. I have been getting a LOT of nullreads this game, and frankly it's really annoying when people are jumping on me for not being able to find a solid case. The only cases I had were against Serela and SB, but they both ended up town, so what when do I do? I ISO people who are leaning scum.
I don't think anyone realizes this yet: D1 sucks for me. I am NOT someone who just jumps on little tiny details and expect it to reveal scum. No, I look at what's there and try my best to suss out a case from what's there, but I know I will more often than not fail to do so. I have had a VERY difficult time sussing out any cases this time around, and the ones I DID suss out ended up being wrong in both cases. It also doesn't help that I've been dragged away from the game by school and other IRL shit. So pardon me if my play is subpar. I can only do so much and be here for so long before my head starts hurting and I need to do other things.
I'm tired of looking through posts that don't seem scummy to me. I'm just going to vote for who I currently think is the scummiest, because CLEARLY if I don't then I'M the scum.
I'm tired of looking through posts that don't seem scummy to me. I'm just going to vote for who I currently think is the scummiest, because CLEARLY if I don't then I'M the scum.
No, you should be trying to lynch scum if they make themselves obvious.
Kilga seems to know what he's doing and he's one of the towniest people here, so...
If this was a reply to Kilga, I don't see how he didn't say all of this before.
If he didn't see scummy posts how could he think someone was scum? It's also convenient that it's Shadoweh, who was (and still is) the main wagon.
There's also this, which is just a minor thing but I still think it's relevant. Specifying ?if they make themselves obvious? feels like he's saying that he's scum and not being obvious, because that's someting only scum would find relevant enough to point out.
Actually no, that could be Validon not seeing anything scummy to point out. Except for the fact that he was voting Dark and giving reasoning, so I'm leaning towards the first interpretation.
Why would Validon think that Kilga knows what he's doing if Validon himself is town? He is supposed to be a strong suspect from Kilga's perspective, after all, so at least he'd know Kilga was wrong with this, one of Kilga's main points through the game. Add this to the fact that he plainly ignores Kilga's D2 case on him, as I've explained, and it all only makes sense if they're scumbuddies ? Otherwise Validon would be doing something about the scumreads on him and having different lines of thoughts, but since he relies on his scumbuddy he feels no threat at all coming from Kilga's words.
I've been ignoring the scumreads from him because other people are more of an issue at the moment. In other words, I didn't feel like I needed to argue with Kilga about the scumread on me at that moment because I figured that it would be more important to talk about if I start becoming the main wagon. Granted, I probably should have addressed it, but I was more focused on looking at other people.The finding him townie when everyone else is getting scum vibes from him is a good start. How did he support his cases well anyways? I think he's just putting more effort into his cases. Which well.. he kind of writes huge walls as scum too.
And the "Kilga knows what he is doing" part comes from the fact that I know Kilga is good at mafia and I was getting a townread on him based on his other cases. He supported them well and I didn't see anything really scummy from them.
In short, I don't get exactly why you're associating me with Kilga, because frankly I find him more towny than anyone else at the moment. >_>;
Also quick defense was more drawn out than I thought. Need to do homework and stuff, will be back later to follow-up if necessary.
I've been ignoring the scumreads from him because other people are more of an issue at the moment. In other words, I didn't feel like I needed to argue with Kilga about the scumread on me at that moment because I figured that it would be more important to talk about if I start becoming the main wagon. Granted, I probably should have addressed it, but I was more focused on looking at other people.
I said that didn't seem scummy. In other words, during D1 I wasn't really sure with my reads. It all seemed really null to me with some wagons leaning more towards scum than others. Polaris at that moment was yelling at me for not placing a vote, so I finally just did in response. I placed it on Shadoweh because out of all of the reads I had that leaned scum, my read on her was strongest.
And if I thought CF7 was worse, Shadoweh is just horrible. They have also posted zero content posts, and largely made no effort to even defend themselves. This is such a massive difference from their previous game. It's a big red flag for me.
I'm gonna throw down a vote down and see if people want to change their minds considering I don't want to vote any of the major wagons AS USUAL.
The finding him townie when everyone else is getting scum vibes from him is a good start. How did he support his cases well anyways? I think he's just putting more effort into his cases. Which well.. he kind of writes huge walls as scum too.
Why did you reply to Polaris one day later when you didn't feel the need to reply to him before?
Also, you were the main wagon back then, even if it was just the start of D2, so your reply is invalid. And by the way, not replying even if Kilga isn't your scumbuddy is scummy; scum wouldn't want to reply to avoid attracting attention, which seems to have worked perfectly on you.
How can you have a scumread on someone whose posts don't seem scummy to you?
I'm tired of looking through posts that don't seem scummy to me.
@Cut by like six posts: @Polaris: I know, right? I see you and Kilga both as town, and reading her post on Kilga just kind of made me go "wait what." It's mostly all using the idea that he alternated between pushing on me and not... which makes sense because he was pushing other wagons at the time. It's not like he abandoned the thought that I was scum or anything. Worse, she's using that as an associative read on me. I mean, what?OH MAN HOW DARE SHE NOT BE PART OF THE HIVE MIND
What I think is that she didn't pay enough attention so she misinterpreted what happened and then afterwards she realised about her error. It happens to me a lot and I try hard to avoid it, so I can see that happening to someone else who is clearly not motivated.
i seriously hope you guys aren't going to quickwagon kilga right now because i am going to be so annoyed. this happened once last game and look where that got everyone >_>We could quickwagon Validon instead if you want, he just said he's going afk!
he reason I liked Mitsuki over NNR is as stated: When NNR came in to defend Shadoweh, he did it by directly attacking me, without substantiating a defense on Shadoweh, but using bad arguments. This looks like a scum tell.I think you missed the part where I had literally not read anyone but you up until that point. Saying I "defended" Shadoweh is like saying that I had a townread on PX up until he posted on D2.
Welcome to Justice Juice Mafia, Shadoweh! You're Gluttonous Guava. Your digestive abilities are unparalleled as you can swallow pretty much anything without feeling any of it down the road. Tastiest of them all are explosives and weaponry - has the added bonus of disarming baddies, which is a nice afterthought.
Your role is Vanilla Town. You're dealing with the big guns, which means there are no guns to be found here. The best you can do is support your teammates vocally.
You win when all evildoers are eliminated.
Dormio - 671
Darkninjaabc - 667
Polaris - 655
Cheez8 - 627
NNR - 619
Shadoweh was SLOWLY and PAINFULLY lynched.
Scumteam at this point is three of Sky, Dark, Cheez, and Polaris, as far as my reads go, due to PoE. Kilga and Mitsuki aren't off the table, but the way Mitsuki jumped in the game to attack Kilga off the bat leads me to think they aren't in cahoots....Darkie being scum is a possibility I will acknowledge, but refuse to act on unless absolutely necessary (for now.) Polaris being scum is a possibility I'm pretty hesitant to assume as well.
##Vote Cheez8My motivation for switching to Kilga was pretty shallow. Basically, I suspected him more than I suspected Shadoweh. Since lynching Kilga suddenly started to appear as a faint possibility, I decided I wanted to help lynch him more than I wanted to help lynch Shadoweh.
Mostly a gut feeling for now, still reading. For now, Cheez, what was your motivation for switching to Kilga at the end of the day?
sadface at nnr for not eliminating me from his list :<
Dormio: It's still something small and I get how I could be wrong here, but bringing up a point against Serela for not having forming an opinion at a time when there generally weren't good opinions to form is a bit iffy to me. Mostly because I was basically in the same boat at that point, and seeing someone called out for that made me indignant or something.
Dormio- I still suspect him.
Wow, these sort of Day Ones are more interesting than I thought. Harder, too. I've gone back through the thread a couple times and there's not much I can conclude. All of Kilga's posts, most of SB's posts and some of Darkie's posts make me think "scum", and several of Serela's posts and Darkie's posts make me think "town". That's more or less the limit to what I can gather, at least without a little bit more information. I don't really think I was right in suspecting Dormio anymore, and Paladin is still hard to read but I'm more inclined to see him as town right now. Shadoweh isn't contributing nearly as much as others are (probably less than Validon, though without as many words to show for it) and that has me a little worried.
I have no idea when I'm going to stop going back and forth on everybody in the entire game like this, but I know that at least SOME of these opinions are worth mentioning.
I guess I'll just be vaguely suspicious of Kilga for the time being. Kind of glad to see Darkie's not voting for a null read anymore.
Okay so quickly reading through what I missed, both Dormio and Serela seem like people I wouldn't really have an issue with lynching now.
I wonder what it says when there are two people arguing against each other and I feel like I could lynch both of them. Probably just that I'm not too good at this.
Dormio: I went through an ISO on him earlier and things didn't really look good. I would have no problems following a Dormio wagon if one got off the ground.
...
There you go. I'd happily vote for Kilga, Dormio or Shadoweh in order to end the day, or maybe even one of the four I ruled out if a wagon somehow suddenly forms for one of them, but people are gonna have to start agreeing first. And CF7, SB... get those votes off Darkie already.
Actually, you know what, I'll help spur things along here.
##Vote: Dormio
Oh whatever, I'll hope against hope and leave my vote there for the time being, but if Shadoweh's wagon picks up steam or if we really aren't going to get a lynch any other way I'll switch my vote over to her or Serela.
So Serela's posted enough for
##Unvote
and probably just about enough for a Serela vote soon if he keeps misrepresenting Dormio's posts like this.
Honestly Dormio still sticks out to me as one of the biggest offenders out of the Serela votes (and town in general but especially in light of Serela's flip.) Maybe Validon or PX too but it's not like either of them have really posted enough so far.
I'm also secretly hoping Darkie says something incriminating beyond a doubt because he really does not inspire confidence as a townie. It'd be really convenient for him to slip up but sadly he can only really slip up and prove he's scum if he's scum and that's kind of a long shot.
Wow, these sort of Day Ones are more interesting than I thought. Harder, too. I've gone back through the thread a couple times and there's not much I can conclude. All of Kilga's posts, most of SB's posts and some of Darkie's posts make me think "scum", and several of Serela's posts and Darkie's posts make me think "town". That's more or less the limit to what I can gather, at least without a little bit more information. I don't really think I was right in suspecting Dormio anymore, and Paladin is still hard to read but I'm more inclined to see him as town right now. Shadoweh isn't contributing nearly as much as others are (probably less than Validon, though without as many words to show for it) and that has me a little worried.
I have no idea when I'm going to stop going back and forth on everybody in the entire game like this, but I know that at least SOME of these opinions are worth mentioning.
I guess I'll just be vaguely suspicious of Kilga for the time being. Kind of glad to see Darkie's not voting for a null read anymore.
So Cheez's entire game has been almost zero scumhunting, zero casepushing, and one absolute lame duck of an attempt at a case. At this point in the game we know Cheez thinks Dormio could be scum for bad/no reasons, that I could be scum (or could have been scum prior to NNR's statement, noting the cut) for no reasons, and that's it.I'm not used to making cases built solely off of the way people act. I truly am sorry I can't be as helpful as you would like, but it would appear I just haven't grown familiar enough with psychoanalysis stuff yet. The Dormio case I tried to push was pretty much my first honest attempt. You seem to be fairly confident in his innocence, so I'll acknowledge my argument was poor and limit myself to a strong gut feeling for the time being. That said, if I limit everything to a strong gut feeling (which I've been doing aside from posts in which I briefly point out any specific posts that give me these feelings) I can't very well make a case for anybody.
This post took several hours to write and got cut by a Cheez post that, again, contains no scumhunting. (Though it does contain some useless cheerleading.) Two days of a near-total lack of substantiated opinions, no explained votes, and no attempts to push his alleged scumreads as viable lynch candidates is every indication of scum.
I decided that no, I was not wrong to suspect Dormio for those reasons after all.Yeah, I know, "for that reason" is probably a more accurate phrase.
I'm going back and forth on NNR's declaration because I think a Mitsuki/NNR/??? scum team could guess I'd come out guns blazing against Mitsuki today (which I admit I was planning on doing) and perhaps decided to pull this stunt to get me to look elsewhere? This is based on a lot of role speculation, though, and probably a degree of paranoia on top of that. There's also a lingering degree of massive irritation at the idea that all of Shadowy, Mitsuki, and NNR could be town, particularly given I think Dormio is likelier to be town than scum with that hammer.Shadoweh, Mitsuki, and NNR, huh? That's a fairly interesting conclusion given that one of those three flipped town (not telling you who though, that's privileged information :V)
I'm pretty shocked that Shadoweh turned out to be town.he once again plays up the "Oops! Townie!" reaction again, which is even stranger with his soured gut posts from yesterday. "Oops! Townie!" should reaffirm he really wanted Shadoweh dead, when his lasts posts were reconsidering. Do you want his head? Do you want to reconsider? Make up your mind. Not even going to go into the point that he was asking Mitsuki to reconsider the null read on Shadoweh in the same hour.
Some people have said 'Why is Sky pushing Shadoweh?' because I didn't give a clear case before. I thought that if I did this, it would also give Shadoweh a good opportunity to deliver a solid rebuttalthis is also... really bad and a really poor excuse. You didn't put solid reasoning on your initial Shadoweh vote so that she could... defend herself and get redemption? I'm not sure what to think of this. Would gut a lot scummier if Shadoweh flipped scum, but I don't like how he really plays up the Shadoweh Remorse card while hunting his head.
I know it would be super-bad for doc to put themselves in danger but it would also be pretty cool to learn the identity of two townies. I'll let the doc gauge the risks and decide for themselves though. Actually, would the person who was attacked and saved have noticed it? I'm not familiar with whether or not it works that way around here.uhhh... is this rolefishing? I can't make it out, to be honest. Doc saves usually do not get informed if they were attacked, although BPs sometimes do if they limited charges.
---uhhh... is this rolefishing? I can't make it out, to be honest. Doc saves usually do not get informed if they were attacked, although BPs sometimes do if they limited charges.How'd I miss this?
Also in that same post, Shadoweh then votes for the afk slot - NekoNekoRex/CF7. NNR then had this to say about me (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,15788.msg1040326.html#msg1040326) and I was just incredulous that anybody could have been suspecting me over Shadoweh at this stage. I thought the most obvious answer was that NNR was trying to save Shadoweh, probably because they were scumbuddies. This was largely because NNR straight up focused on me without any consideration of Shadoweh. That's the reason I asked Mitsuki to ISO Shadoweh also. I want both sides of the argument considered. But I don't consider Mitsuki as automatically scum because unlike NNR, she used good reasoning and showed a lot of effort and consideration went in to her post. NNR just copy pasted things out of context and made stuff up. So it looks bad for them, and by association, Shadoweh.I just kind of don't get it, or something.
My motivation for switching to Kilga was pretty shallow. Basically, I suspected him more than I suspected Shadoweh. Since lynching Kilga suddenly started to appear as a faint possibility, I decided I wanted to help lynch him more than I wanted to help lynch Shadoweh.I'm kind of all like "huh...".
I admit I was seconds away from hammering Shadoweh earlier in the day, but that was when Shadoweh appeared to be the only potential lynch other than maaaaayyyybe NNR, but I don't suspect him that much.
Kilga concerns me but either he's town or he's good at being scum, because I can't really make a case for him yet.But it's like, where did this come from?
If Kilga and Mitsuki are the same alignment I'm left in a very confused state because my thoughts on Kilga were wildly wavering but leaning towards scum and my thoughts on Mitsuki were barely formed but leaning towards town. I'm probably going to conclude absolutely nothing on this front, ever.I mean, I like how it's basically a complete ignorance of NNR's claimed results.
Anyway, even if I am as useless as you're making me out to be, I don't see why I'd have to be scum in order to play this poorly.Is pretty cute, isn't it?
I think day 3 we should focus more on the people who didn't scum hunt at all. It's easy to dogpile me because I was wrong. But it's also not right. I made a bad judgement but my reasons were not argued with a the time. Nobody disagreed with me! So I don't think it's fair to jump on me now. You should have done it yesterday. To do it now appears suspicious IMOIsn't this a bit of an overreaction?
Mitsuki and Kilgamayan are the same alignment. I'm inclined to believe this means they are both town.
Ok good to know. I was thinking that even though I was being critical of Mitsuki (perhaps overly so), I don't think she's exactly scum.
but like mitsuki are you scum? :o
because like I seriously don't know how you can just waltz in with scumreads the two people generally accepted as town (kilga and me, sorry for being a pretentious) while simultaneously refusing to consider any of the existing wagons, and adamantly at that. your credibility is decreased because it seems like you haven't really looked at the game properly, which makes me wonder if you're even serious about these cases or if you just made them up because you're trying to look SO HIP and PRO TOWN by challenging a widely held belief.
... are you 100% sure?Let me answer that with another question: Do I have an obsession with catgirls?
Let me answer that with another question: Do I have an obsession with catgirls?The answer is yes
The other posts contain nothing of value either.My entire state of mind contained nothing of value either last night. I already failed at the task of simple observation several times over, so building a case that made any sort of coherent sense was even more out of the question than it usually is for me.
No reads.
Not a single mention of whether or not I, his big case that he's had for the majority of the game, am still scum to him or not.
Just ambiguity and defending himself.
I panicked before I went to work when I saw two votes for me and thought that everybody else would arbitrarily vote for me while I was away from the computer for a few hours. So I voted Cheez8 because it seemed like the most credible wagon to save my selfish neck.Voting for an easy wagon while leaving himself an opportunity to bail yet again if he feels like switching stances or going with the "I knew we shouldn't have lynched them!" route. On top of that I'm starting to suspect that the reason I haven't been able to get a good read on him earlier in the game was because many of his posts either didn't say anything constructive, said constructive things that other people all said first, or said things that only would have been constructive if they made sense.
Like I don't get why he feels the need to justify his relations with Mitsuki and how he thought she was all super lovely and stuff.
I haven't forgotten about Validon (or about addressing Mitsuki's case against me, if she/anyone else still wants me to do it).
NNR and kilga are scums who didnt even bother to kill becauseActually no I'm sorry I can't read posts that even try to employ logic like this
NR and kilga are scums [..]I- I just
NNR subbed in an originally scummy slot.
Kilga seems super protown but slips up at times.
Cheez never had any solid opinion.The listpost
Sky has super detailed insight and crazy insights in na and defends himself only.
Dormio is too normal and that makes him scum? W
Polaris is fufilling a possibly uberscum role impeded only by a town best pal.
Validon is being pushed on hard since d1.
I think that NNR and Dormio are using fake arguments or trying to make assumptions based on 'facts' that aren't proven.Can you care to back this up with evidence?
Darkninja, by voting Kilga you do realize you have to submit to the fact Mitsuki is very likely to also be scum, right?
Cheez: Why was I suspicious for wanting to hear from SB one last time before dropping a hammer? SB was doomed to disappear as soon as the day ended. If there was one person in the game that shouldn't have been cut off by a hammer, it was him.I never said you were suspicious. That was just when you stopped convincing me that there was a reason not to end the day. Prove me wrong if you'd like.
Mitsuki: I would consider buying that defense if Cheez were scumhunting in some other fashion. The problem isn't that his hunting is weird, or different, or wrong, or whatever else. The problem is that his scumhunting is nonexistent. What possible kind of off-site pro-town playstyle involves posting extremely few suspicions without justifying them and needing to be grabbed and yanked around by the short hairs before actually voting for someone? Please describe something sensible in detail, I'm going to rip my hair out if the response to this is something as nebulous and impossible to logically argue as your justifications for thinking Shadowy's actions and Cheez's actions not scummy.
Mitsuki: I would consider buying that defense if Cheez were scumhunting in some other fashion. The problem isn't that his hunting is weird, or different, or wrong, or whatever else. The problem is that his scumhunting is nonexistent. What possible kind of off-site pro-town playstyle involves posting extremely few suspicions without justifying them and needing to be grabbed and yanked around by the short hairs before actually voting for someone? Please describe something sensible in detail, I'm going to rip my hair out if the response to this is something as nebulous and impossible to logically argue as your justifications for thinking Shadowy's actions and Cheez's actions not scummy.I'm not quite sure why this question was posed at Mitsuki.
If we also assume Polaris is town, that leaves four.I really don't get why we should assume Polaris is town. Anyways.
I might have just been self conscious about sheeping Kilga too much.
@Validon: Ok but you better know that we're going to lynch you if you don't start scumhunting at some point ::)
but like mitsuki are you scum? :o
because like I seriously don't know how you can just waltz in with scumreads the two people generally accepted as town (kilga and me, sorry for being a pretentious) while simultaneously refusing to consider any of the existing wagons, and adamantly at that. your credibility is decreased because it seems like you haven't really looked at the game properly, which makes me wonder if you're even serious about these cases or if you just made them up because you're trying to look SO HIP and PRO TOWN by challenging a widely held belief.
^ basically my first impressions of mitsuki. not a fan of nitpicky quotestrippy cases either `_`
It's ok that Mitsuki has unique and interesting opinions but I'm unhappy with her staunch refusal to care about anyone else, which seems unnecessarily stubborn and could border on tunneling. And her cases do give off the impression of tunnel vision and confirmation bias, seeing as her cases are really quotestrippy and it looks like she was selectively reading all the "bad" parts to make a case without looking at a coherent whole, and when it looks like she hasn't read the game properly, it makes it worse. It's how she handled her opinions that are worse than her actual opinions, more than anything.
Well I have to undermine her because her cases are dumb.
So you're not sure about the catgirls after all. \(owo)/I'm not sure if the results I get from my role can be messed with, although I'd like to think not. I'm about 95% confident my results are accurate.
For now, but Polaris was so scummy yesterday and he clearly contradicted himself just now, as I've just pointed out.
uh did you even read? I said that "I was critical of you but I don't think you're exactly scum". if you look carefully the only place I actually use the word "scum" is at the very beginning, because your cases were just dumb, but I never expressed a desire to lynch you. I attacked you because I know your scum reads are 100% wrong (at least, the one on me) and you needed to realize that your "totally clear" scum reads weren't clear at all. Which is why I clarified that I didn't think you were scum at the beginning of the day.
but like mitsuki are you scum? :o
cheez are you scum
But no, I'm not saying that he did all of this consciously. He clearly wanted my cases to look bad, but he genuinely thought they were bad and that the reasons he gave stood. Scum wouldn't agree just like that about what it's been said about them, it's just a matter of pride. And what do people with hurt pride do, like a girl who fears her friend will get the boy she loves? They baselessy critisize the one who threatens them.
and this is just a completely unsupported hypothetical, which ignores the fact that town also has pride that can be hurt, skipping directly to HE MUST BE SCUM SO HE DID THIS (which is confirmation bias)
What pride would have been hurt with my cases if you were town?
honestly I just think Mitsuki is being pretentious right now, because her confirmation bias is intense to the point of no return. the only thing I can think of that'll make her change her mind is going to be my flip
Let's analyze what we have so far: the reasons given to say that my cases aren't valid are that 1- I haven't read properly, the style of my cases is bad, etc / 2- tunnel vision, other biases / 3- My identity is bad
So well, what does this say about how my cases are? Nothing. You could say all of this about anybody else (obviously changing some parts, like ?quotestrippy? to ?quoteless?), it'd contain no actual replies to the cases and it'd make it look like they're terrible.
It made my cases look like shit without actually saying anything about my thoughts.
because I thought I was being the shining light of town and you ruined that ;_;
...Okay yeah, never mind. As much as there is to make me suspicious of Darkie, I really can't shake the feeling I get of a person who's just trying way too hard. Mostly in his earlier posts. Still not too sure what to think of him suddenly dropping the subject and making amends at the end, but that's really not enough to keep me convinced about my vote.
##Unvote
Serela, dang it, you really sound like you're not town but your role makes it sound like there's not much else for you to be. Make up your mind (or just mess up more.)
...wait, that's not a scumtell. That's what I'm doing too.
I can't believe I just now noticed this. Alright I'll go reconsider. I GUESS.
Well, here are the hunches I have, at any rate, even though I can't support most of them:
Darkie- Even though he's wrong, I have very little doubt that he's town.
Kilga- Bad vibes. Not sure why.
SB- Same bad vibes as Kilga.
Dormio- I still suspect him.
Serela: A couple of legitimate arguments have been raised against him, as well as a couple of not-so-legitimate arguments. However, a good portion of the reason I have to not vote Serela right away comes from people who aren't Serela. Right now, I'm against the wagon for him, but at the same time seeing it go through wouldn't bother me too much.
Cheez quotes posts about me being confused why Kilga is being mad at me, and then says "nevermind I should vote Serela"
I don't get how that train of thought is supposed to work >_> Kilga misinterpreted something I said, proceeded to make accusations at me, I was really confused because I had no idea what he was talking about. How does that make me scum?
There are totally other viable wagons but I'm not really that concerned about voting for yours.
Mmmmm...
##Unvote
##Vote Shadoweh
At least because, if Serela's going to get lynched, there'd better be enough people voting WITHOUT Serela's help for that to happen.
SERIOUSLY WITH THE CUTS
I'm also secretly hoping Darkie says something incriminating beyond a doubt because he really does not inspire confidence as a townie. It'd be really convenient for him to slip up but sadly he can only really slip up and prove he's scum if he's scum and that's kind of a long shot.
How plausible do you think either of those scenarios is? That we had dual-town wagons, and not only were all three scum on the same wagon, but they were on the self-destructive vanilla townie's wagon? Do you really think scum would sit there on vanilla Shadowy and make no effort whatsoever to get unclaimed Kilga (someone that half the players in this game have spent time propping as the greatest player that ever lived) to at least claim, if not outright lynched? It's not like they weren't there - all of Validon, Polaris, and DNA (and hell, even Sky Paladin) had posted less than an hour before Dormio hammered. Do you really think that NONE of them would at least fake sudden uncertainty and gutcheck over in my direction to try to draw a claim? The potential for major pressure was certainly there, with at least DNA proclaiming he hated me. But all of them stuck to Shadowy instesad of trying to put me at any risk whatsoever. How likely do you really think that is?
Paladin what are you doing. Polaris is probably town. This is one of the only things I've let myself believe this entire game.
because i felt that your case on me was going to be as bad as the one on kilga so I figured I would say something about your case on kilga
either way my "hurt pride" is a horrible reason to think that I'm scum so please stop using it. and also answer my other question.
Alright, starting off with things, Cheez for the beginning of D1 spent a lot of time arguing with Dark. While I don't exactly trust Dark, all he did was just argue over Dark's opinions on things....Your point? I had nothing else to do aside from joining in the RVS.
If you weren't even sure to begin with, then why bother with the entire case? It's just babbling that in the end means you aren't doing much else. Before then you yelled at Dormio for his earliest posts (which, come on, it was RVS, people can make posts like that, which is why I don't take them into consideration really), which... isn't much either.Had I not bothered with the entire case (aka had a small discussion with him), I would not have drawn enough out of Darkie for me to establish an opinion on him. Are you seriously taking that earliest Dormio vote into account? That was me making a random baseless vote, coming up with some joke reason to put behind it, and presenting it as if I actually believed it. In other words, like you said, it was RVS.
Okay, that last sentence really bugs me. I think by the way the rest of the post this was from that statement in parenthesis was after Serela cut you, but why mention it...? You did a similar thing with a previous post where you were mentioning me not having an opinion yet and then pretty much went "(oh he still doesn't have one too bad)." It doesn't give me warm fuzzy feelings.I'm not playing to give people warm fuzzy feelings. As for why I mentioned it, it was probably to let Serela know that I'm going to suspect him too if he doesn't shape up his act or something. I'm fairly certain several people have done the same to various people, including me.
That unwillingness to get off like that REALLY urks me as well. It's like you're saying " WHOOPS I FAILED TO PIN A CASE ON HIM GOTTA DO SOMETHING ELSE NOW."Do something else? The first thing I did after this was to go back through Darkie's posts to see whether I well and truly believed he was scum. I don't see why that unwillingness should irk you. If anything, it should instill confidence. What if, instead, I had suddenly dropped all suspicion of Darkie and actually DID move on to something else, just like that? That sounds a lot scummier than what I did here, even when you try to make out what I did to be scummy. You're searching too hard, pal.
Yeah... I don't like the fact that you openly admit you can't support most of these. A read without support isn't a read, it's guts and guts aren't a good basis for a case.Well, at least now I know what qualifies as a read. Thanks~
So you didn't like the wagon yet... didn't mind if it went through. If that doesn't scream scum I don't know what does.Yeah, "urgh" is right. Serela was a very unconvincing town read for me at that point. Serela said that after I completely misinterpreted something he said, so of course what I said didn't make any sense. And there's so little context to that last statement. I don't even recognize that line, so I don't know what you expect me to say about it.
A quote from Serela that Cheez quoted, which sums up my opinion on Cheez's interaction with Serela up until now. That whole "I don't like the wagon buuuuut I don't care if it goes through so I'll vote it anyways" really bugs me. If you don't like a wagon, don't vote for it, simple as that.
Still urgh.
So you unvoted and went to another suspicion of yours... because you thought it would only be fair for other people to jump on that wagon anyways? Sounds more like a "I'm getting off of this wagon so that I won't get dragged along with it!" attitude.Serela voted himself. I didn't want Serela to be lynched if the town couldn't produce enough people to lynch Serela without his help.
... I actually still think that you're scum, but even if you weren't yes, I doubt any of those people would try to get yourself killed just like that. It'd look so scummy if it worked, and they wouldn't risk it. And it wasn't going to happen anyways, so why risk it?
What are the reasons you are townreading him?Part of it is based on his role, part of it is based on a lack of potentially scummy actions aside from his insistence on lynching best bud Serela back on Day 1. And that's only a potentially scummy action, not an actually scummy action. I could definitely see a townie acting that way, and it's not too much harder even when considering their roles. Also, Polly is just generally being reasonable.
Also you don't need to keep reminding me that you don't think I'm town, I'm fully aware of that. I've said once that we're assuming NNR's statement is true and that I must be town to you for the sake of this exercise. In fact, there is a second half to this exercise that covers the hypothetical possibilities where I'm scum and how someone in your position must then logically procee.Ooh, this sounds interesting.
In D3 I dunno if he has done any real scumhunting, because his Sky Paladin vote looks kind of appeasement-y to Dormio. I'd have to say Sky Paladin and Dormio being on the same scumreads list is a little strange.I don't really believe I've done much scumhunting this day that has actually established anything, no. I keep putting that off. ^^; And I agree, Paladin and Dormio being on the same list is extremely strange. There's absolutely no way the two of them could be on the same scumteam, as far as I'm concerned. That doesn't stop them from being my main two suspects right now.
There are totally other viable wagons but I'm not really that concerned about voting for yours.Guys! I finally found where Validon got this quote from! It's a miracle.
NK spec
(one of the many posts encouraging Serela to play when he was getting lynched) and
Why would Kilga try to encourage his suspects to play if he was town and really thought they are scummy? I just get the feeling that he's frustrated scum because of everything being too easy to him when he actually wants to put effort and earn his victory.
And anyways, if he really wanted to see more content from them he'd be doing an entirely different thing, like asking them questions about their thoughts. There's also the fact that if he felt he hadn't seen enough from them he wouldn't be voting them with the reasons he's given. (o_o)
And this is Kilga basically coaching his suspect yet again, but the part about the ?townie hand? is so fake that it made me stare at the screen in wonder.
Basic Psychology lessons, part 1: When people praise themselves just like that and out of context when there was no need to do so and it doesn't seem coherent with their personality, DOUBT THEM. It's obvious they want to reinforce a certain impression of themselves with that, and that's probably because they're lying or going to lie at some point.
Another thing I don't like is how he postpones voting Validon both D1 and D2 while still saying he's scummy. After dropping him he doesn't update his case on him either.I'd expect town to still elaborate on their other main suspect, or at least comment on something.
He actually just mentions Validon in one post after the D2 voteswitch:
Which basically just states that he keeps suspecting Validon.
Here he's not happy with Cheez voting Validon, but Cheez updated his reasoning on Dormio and thought Validon was scummier anyways, so I don't understant such a reaction.
Here he's defending Validon.
But that's not the only time he's discouraged votes on Validon:
This could be just a question, but it could still discourage a vote on Kilga's supposed second main suspect at that moment.
Darkninjaabc - 632
Everyone else - 400
Can't really address this much since it's NK spec, though I will say that I personally believe scum will roleblock a known problematic power role instead of roleblock-guessing at who might be a more problematic power role.
If I have a scumread on a townie, I want them to prove me wrong. This seems really, really obvious. Why would you NOT want your scumreads to show you that they're actually town if they're town? This is particularly true of D1 when I'm never really sure of anything.
Validon never gave me good reason to stop suspecting him. I tried to keep the case updated at least until the middle of Day 2 came, when my Shadowy tunnel coincided with the extra-busy portion of my week. I do not like that I haven't gone over Validon in-depth recently and know I need to find the time to do so.
Note that, for one, Sky Paladin isn't colored green on some whim. Why was Paladin even green in the first place?
How plausible do you think either of those scenarios is? That we had dual-town wagons, and not only were all three scum on the same wagon, but they were on the self-destructive vanilla townie's wagon? Do you really think scum would sit there on vanilla Shadowy and make no effort whatsoever to get unclaimed Kilga (someone that half the players in this game have spent time propping as the greatest player that ever lived) to at least claim, if not outright lynched?
Kilga has said a lot of the time how they are such a great player
Do I really have to stand people saying that my cases are terrible without actually pointing out why? Sigh.
... what I meant was not just that, I said that scum would try to kill either you or Dark.
I want my scumreads to answer to me properly and such, but encouraging them to form another wagon is something that I wouldn't even think of telling them to do. What's the point, anyways? It's not like a player trying to form another wagon on request is going to prove if they're town or not. And then you discouraged Serela's opinion on Polaris being scum because he wasn't getting lynched. I remember, and that's one of the actual parts of my cases I never got into.
All of that and the overall tone made me think what I thought.
Unrelated to the above: I want everyone that hasn't already to weigh in on the votecount thing I discussed. The tl;dr version is that, if one accepts NNR's statement about Mitsuki and myself as true, then Cheez has to be scum by the way the End of Day 2 wagons shook down.
I think this is what a lot of people aren't getting when they look at that votecount assessment. I'm not saying the entire scumteam would flop over from Shadowy to me with no explanation whatsoever. I am saying that the situation presented to an alleged scumteam of some three-person combination of Dormio, Polaris, Sky Paladin, DNA, Validon - Mitsuki's large case against me and Shadowy actually finally trying - an incredibly valid opportunity to at least try to pressure me to claim. Why was this not done, assuming that same scumteam? If you think just one person moving their vote to me was "too risky", tell me exactly why, because there was absolutely zero risk involved for DNA (who had just stated a healthy distaste for me) and near-zero risk involved for the rest of them (easy to look like Shadowy's sudden effort and Mitsuki's case made them rethink their stances).If you're part of the scumteam, it would be "too risky" because they'd have nothing to gain from it at all.
What did nnr even say that makes you think hes so right and trustworthy.
[citation needed]Here's the most recent (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,15788.msg1041767.html#msg1041767) example. There's more but I don't have time to go through the whole thread. Mitsuki also called you on it earlier in day 3 iirc.
Reposting this for emphasis. Sky Paladin, in your assessment of this situation, you claim you believe both possible scenarios have Cheez as "likely town". Please directly address #831. Don't just throw out stuff like "it's too risky for scum!" Tell us WHY having even just one member of the scum team move over to me to try to get me to claim is "too risky".
I seriously do not believe either validon nor serela wagon will be scum.Now, I can see where a townie could make this post, and how maybe, maybe the logic behind these statements could be coherent and innocent, just phrased a little strangely. However, let's scroll down to the next post, which is also his...
...
That said, I fully support lynching Serela, claim is weird and his way of sidetracking from what's the important thing (reads) in his posts goes :V . Scummier vibe.
##Vote Serela
Null: polaris, kilga, serela, sb, pxHe thinks Serela is a null read. Okay. That's stretching it a bit, but if Serela's a null read giving off scummy vibes, these posts can still line up. But what's this? Three posts down, in his next post...
And my vote on Serela is genuinely because I believe that he's scummy.Well, that changed fast! Starting off with seriously believing Serela is not scum but voting for him despite that, then going straight to seriously believing that Serela is scum within a few posts. That just feels strange to me. Strange in a "somebody told me that there's no way my reasoning for voting Serela will fly so I'm going to switch to better reasoning and hope people will pay more attention to that" way. And here, I can only imagine one case where there's somebody around to tell him that.
I am saying nnr with his null stance is scummy. What did nnr even sayI read everyone because that's kind of a requirement when I sub in. Do remember I have town reads as well as scum reads. My claim is trustworthy because I don't have any good reason to reverse two gutreads, make up a claim with a known rolecop in play, and because I have a bunch of crumbs. Trying to get one player off a scumbuddy's back by making up a completely arbitrary and vague fakeclaim is an expensive waste of information.
that makes you think hes so right and trustworthy. He went around parading on everyone including me so i remember that well.
Picking through the rest of his posts and trying to differentiate between bad logic and scummy logic would be quite the daunting task.To be fair, I think this is one of the core challenges of trying to find scum in a Mafia game. There's always a possibility of a townie fucking up and getting lynched for it.
To be fair, I think this is one of the core challenges of trying to find scum in a Mafia game. There's always a possibility of a townie fucking up and getting lynched for it.Good point. It just seems more difficult and time consuming in Darkie's particular case.
Unrelated to the above: I want everyone that hasn't already to weigh in on the votecount thing I discussed. The tl;dr version is that, if one accepts NNR's statement about Mitsuki and myself as true, then Cheez has to be scum by the way the End of Day 2 wagons shook down.
In general I don't have much to add except to say this to Cheez: The thing with this game is that you have to be careful with your wording as both town and scum. As town, you have to write things in ways that don't make you seem scummy while knowing that you indeed aren't scum. Scum has to do the same with the knowledge that they are scum. I recommend trying to pay attention to how you appear to town, because honestly the way you have appeared hasn't looked too towny from what I've seen.Yes, yes... I've learned this quite thoroughly this game. At first, since I was only a vanilla townie, I figured it would be fine for me to stick my neck out like I did, but... Simply being a vanilla townie doesn't mean somebody's expendable. Lose too many vanilla townies and the mafia start to close in on the majority. No matter what role I get in the next game I join, I'll pay more attention to how I act.
Unrelated to the above: I want everyone that hasn't already to weigh in on the votecount thing I discussed. The tl;dr version is that, if one accepts NNR's statement about Mitsuki and myself as true, then Cheez has to be scum by the way the End of Day 2 wagons shook down.'m not good at votecount shenanigans. I know that when I play scum, I just find the scummiest player and peruse them (although I tend to cut my buddies some slack). I don't tend to participate in moving votes for stategery or the like.
i never realized he claimed "some kin dof role ability". Because i kind of used all my limited time durimg thr past two days on conflicting between kilga. Paladin and generally skimming through things.If you were paying any attention to anything involving Kilga, you'd have realized that in roughly half of
I just want to win. If you tell me dark, you fucked up everything. Look at this this an dthis. I will do it. Another mislynch and we in mylo or lylo. At this point i dont even know what to look at. I am blessed with a role and scum screwed it. What the fuck should i do at this point?The scum team didn't screw you out of making use of your role. You did that yourself when you felt the need to announce it to the scum team in the middle of D1. They had no incentive to send their roleblocker after any particular player until you did that.
Validon: I still haven't had the chance to read you over, but I see a fair amount of wishywashyness in that post.
- Do you think NNR is telling the truth or lying? Why?
- If you think NNR is telling the truth, are Mitsuki and I town or scum? Why?
- If you think NNR is lying, do you think Mitsuki and/or myself are scum? Why?
Here's the most recent (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,15788.msg1041767.html#msg1041767) example. There's more but I don't have time to go through the whole thread. Mitsuki also called you on it earlier in day 3 iirc.
Kilga: I thought he was townie for most of the day but some of his content about Serela left a weird taste in my mouth. Like near the end he kept pushing Serela to scumhunt, which is fair enough. But then Serela replied that he was attacking Shadoweh and Kilga replied to push harder for others to vote Shadoweh over him. I mean, what exactly do you want him to do? It felt kind of unfair.
Also at some point I remember him saying something like "Shadoweh represented pretty accurately why I'm still voting Serela" except AFAICR Shadoweh was defending Serela for most of the phase? And IIRC he even made a point about that.
I dunno. Sky Palladium demonstrated competence and a willingness to abuse newbmeta last game.People assumed I was newb. I felt no reason to disprove this, if it meant I could avoid some unjustified suspicion. But his actual response to my defence was a single throw away line here (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,15788.msg1040162.html#msg1040162), where he talked about living in Australia. No attempt to back up his point or rebuke mine. But...there's no vote change. He semi-reads Cheez8 but doesn't say anything in particular, or change his vote.
So, it's like, why is she trying to throw Cheez8 a clear for noticing something with the flavour?in regards to Shadoweh missing my point about the not-vighit, that Cheez8 picked up, and then Shadoweh quoted. That was an alarm bell for a lot of people.
I dunno, it just reads as being super off to me.
This may or may not be related to my Cheez8 suspicions.
I highly doubt that Cheez switched to you with the motive of "forcing you to claim" because I think that's an incredibly uncommon and advanced thought process that I would find few people to be capable of (myself included). Normally it would be a bit bizarre to have all three scum on the same wagon but it's not too incredible in this specific situation with the way the wagons (or wagon, singular) happened and the general experience of the players involved.
Then again, there are other reasons why Cheez could have avoided the major wagon, perhaps to dissociate from his other scumbuddies or avoid taking responsibility for lynching town (which he had prior knowledge of).
hold on i'm in a pokemon battle right now so i can't concentrate on this post anymore so i'll just post it like this
Cheez8, seeing as we're both at 3 votes and I am going to bed *right now*, you'll understand if I don't switch my vote. But if there's your name and atleast one other under Dormio tomorrow, I'll switch mine.Dang it, that's what I meant!
I am actually assuming things now. I will be accepting for now nnr osnt lying. And therefore the analysis that cheez has to be scum stands.That analysis does not stand. While I would prefer not to rule out the possibility of NNR lying, for the sake of debating your reasoning, I will assume that he is telling the truth for the time being. Even better, I'll assume that both BBM and Kilga are town.
What i see now is simple really. Theres a very good chance cheez is scum. And the associative reas which can be deprived will basically out the entirw acumteam. Therefore my vote is clear.Oh? Please, explain my associative reads. If I remember correctly, back on Day 1 my associative reads proved that the scumteam was, beyond doubt, a team of me, Serela, and Shadoweh. Do tell, what are my associative reads now?
'm not good at votecount shenanigans. I know that when I play scum, I just find the scummiest player and peruse them (although I tend to cut my buddies some slack). I don't tend to participate in moving votes for stategery or the like.
If imo you told me why lynching someone else can reveal more info to town at this point i might think more. But what i see is another actiondan style panic coaster by polaria and you.Fine, I'll bite.
I did forget about the bars, by the way, but don't worry. They'll be back.Back, back again.
realized that i've been thinking "sky paladin vs. cheez" for a while now but i don't know if anything denies the possibility that they might both be scumI've been thinking about this too. Cheez and Paladin aren't really pushing each other, I've noticed Paladin isn't pushing Cheez real hard, offering up alternatives like Dormio, and Cheez is only pushing Paladin subtly, also going for Dormio.
I was mostly okay with Cheez but his posts near the end of the day have really pinged me. At first he was like "I can see why town might want to lynch me best of luck guys!!!" which strikes me as super WIFOM, especially as he didn't actually give up at that point. And then his last post had like a gigantic wall of talking about how not voting for the main wagon of the day isn't scummy and he therefore shouldn't be lynched, even though as far as I can tell absolutely nobody is actually voting him for that. If they are, please correct me.1: WIFOM... Er... Well, at least this is probably the last acronym I'm going to have to ask about.
nice to know sky paladin is trying to call the scum team without having properly looked at 2/3 of the people he is accusing.I primarily went with Kilga and Mitsuki's rationalisation instead of rehashing what they had already written. I secondarily went by association. You did the exact same thing Dormio did (dismiss Mitsuki's argument about you while avoiding Kilga's assassination of Cheez8, then vote for me for no apparent reason). What's your reason for voting me, anyway? Last I saw it was because you were playing pokemon.
i ALSO just realized that sky paladin's scum picks are literally the three people that are voting him at the moment. rofl
Cheez and Paladin aren't really pushing each other, I've noticed Paladin isn't pushing Cheez real hard, offering up alternatives like Dormio, and Cheez is only pushing Paladin subtly, also going for Dormio.
Dormio voted for Shadoweh with the salad...rp...thing. Not really important. So, what did he actually do?Uhh, lol?
First, he voted for Serela in D1. Then a few posts later, finally posts his reason (http://).
Dormio's next content post is http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,15788.msg1038887.html#msg1038887 actually just a play-by-play, with nothing new actually posted. Then there's this (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,15788.msg1038999.html#msg1038999) where Dormio accuses Serela of doing no scum-hunting, when in fact Dormio is in the same boat.
Then there's http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,15788.msg1039308.html#msg1039308 this which says nothing. Also, maybe a scumtell? It took Dormio over an hour to write a post about nothing, according to '11 new replies' and timestamp comparison.
Then, this one (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,15788.msg1039329.html#msg1039329) where an additional 14 posts magically appeared for your three sentence post. That means it took you half an hour to make that post and TWO OF THE POSTS WERE FROM DORMIO. A little chronologically confused, imo.
It looks like Dormio is not only putting in no effort but they are trying to fake it to look like they are putting in more than they really are.
There's nothing of consequence out of Dormio right up until the end of the phase. His net effort was to vote for Serela seemingly randomly early in the day, add in some reasoning later, then not change his vote.
Day 2.Deliberately misrepresented?
Dormio starts off voting for me based on this post. (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,15788.msg1039899.html#msg1039899)
I've made my position clear on this a number of times, so it's annoying to be deliberately misrepresented.
Point 1 - Who arbitrarily decided it was no longer RVS time? Actually, it was Dormio (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,15788.msg1038416.html#msg1038416), who, only a few hours earlier, had been posting about brussel sprouts along with me and, not incidentally, pushing for a lynch on Shadoweh.
Point 2 - Dormio decided that RVS had ended (and posted about it on day 1), and then linked back to it in day 2 to say "Hey Sky was still doing RVS at the end of RVS". So providing 'evidence' that they had arbitrarily created and putting forth as the new truth is the Dormio play style? OK :D
Then there's this 'Sky just posted fluff' comment. Bullshit. I explained WHY my vote was RVS, and also that I had put in a serious vote since then. I posted a preliminary scumreading.
I actually responded to Dormio's post, here (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,15788.msg1039957.html#msg1039957). What's his response?I ignored it mostly because your response is bad.
Well actually, he did pick up this - People assumed I was newb. I felt no reason to disprove this, if it meant I could avoid some unjustified suspicion. But his actual response to my defence was a single throw away line here (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,15788.msg1040162.html#msg1040162), where he talked about living in Australia. No attempt to back up his point or rebuke mine. But...there's no vote change. He semi-reads Cheez8 but doesn't say anything in particular, or change his vote.
There's another play-by-play (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,15788.msg1040528.html#msg1040528) here that ignores my defense and just reiterates Dormio's vague arguments earlier. I can't see a town ignoring a valid defence. A towny should have attacked my defense or accepted it - and amended their vote accordingly. Not ignored it entirely. That's a scum play.What defence? All I saw was excuses.
Here's a counterargument against http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,15788.msg1040533.html#msg1040533 Cheez8. It's relevant because I'm going to posit that Cheez8 and Dormio are scums together. Although Dormio ignored my response, he went into detail with this one for no apparent reason; he even says at the end 'back to making words about Shadoweh'. But at this point, he was still voting for me.So? I fail to see how this is relevant to me being scum.
This post (No link, I'm going to assume that it's this one (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,15788.msg1040560.html#msg1040560)) is the first bit of actual scumhunting Dormio has done. There's this:in regards to Shadoweh missing my point about the not-vighit, that Cheez8 picked up, and then Shadoweh quoted. That was an alarm bell for a lot of people.Uh, what the fuck is this even supposed to be saying?
It's clear here that Dormio is 'suspecting' Cheez8, but not doing anything about it. There's some back and forth between Cheez8 and Dormio but Dormio doesn't really talk to Shadoweh at any point.
Then Dormio vanishes until hammer time and then hammers. (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,15788.msg1041060.html#msg1041060) There's no thought process or any mention of reasoning on how he suddenly switched from Sky to Cheez8 (the more credible target) and then Shadoweh. Just bam, you're dead.Uh, what?
Which leaves us with Shadoweh.This post also has my other thoughts on why Shadoweh was scum but whatever.
Firstly, like on D1, I find myself attracted to Kilga's words.
Useless bunnies good only for their sex appeal.
Day 3! The very next thing Dormio does is vote for me again (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,15788.msg1041498.html#msg1041498). No mention of the hammer business. But once again, Dormio pays a huge amount of attention to what Cheez8 says, and pretty much ignores my defence. He actually says "Sky_Paladin is too clean" so I must be scum. That makes no sense. It's also wrong. As I've said...many times...I'm not sorry for Serela. I am sorry for Shadoweh. Stop ignoring what I wrote except for when it suits you. What's you're actual case against me?First, what would I even say about the hammer? How is this meant to be a point against me? Whatever.
Once again, Dormio quotes and argues against Cheez8 (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,15788.msg1041502.html#msg1041502), but where's the vote? Still on Sky.What even the fuck?
Why? Because I believe Dormio wants to make a case of disassociating from Cheez8 if one of them is caught. Which is difficult now, because, both Cheez8 and Dormio are voting for Sky, despite Dormio constantly attacking Cheez8 and basically ignoring what Sky said. Actually, he continues to refer to his own made up conclusions as if they were evidence.
Dormio next appears to say Mitsuki is stupid (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,15788.msg1041783.html#msg1041783) without clarifying why. Perhaps because she's accusing the last potential scumbuddy, Polaris. Who is also, not incidentally, voting for me. Dormio reappears again to reiterate that he thinks Mitsuki is http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,15788.msg1042114.html#msg1042114 dumb without any proof, just arbitrarily 'I think Mitsuki's posts are kind of dumb and I'm ignoring them since Kilga is super awesome and I don't have a reason to disbelieve NNR.' Mitsuki wasn't attacking NNR. She was pursuing Polaris. What's the association between Polaris and Cheez8 at this time? None, except for the one Dormio has in his mind.Uh, because Mitsuki's posts were stupid? I don't really think there's much more to say about them.
You did the exact same thing Dormio did (dismiss Mitsuki's argument about you while avoiding Kilga's assassination of Cheez8, then vote for me for no apparent reason).^ did not read the game
you are the only three who keep saying 'Sky seems suspicious' without ever saying why.^ did not read the game
If you really want to go for Polaris today because that seems to be the feeling of some people I guess we can do that instead.^ did not read the game
But then Polaris is voting for Cheez8, so...I'm pretty sure at least one of my scum picks is wrong. There's the meta idea of, well, Polaris had the best pals thing. We had some speculation that might be a scum role because...well...it seemed right. If it was scum/town, then there was some good reason for scum to kill-off the other town buddy so their guy was free to vote wherever. Would they do it though? It would be a good clear tell that Polaris was scum. But town killed off Serela so we can't know. It's really...a how do you feel. I think Polaris is a good candidate for a 'same as Kilga/Mitsuki team' check. So I will pencil Polaris in as 'not-scum-for-today'.
Dormio's counter argument is basically 'I know I said this before, but it really must be hard for you to make up a case when you're scum, huh?' Isn't that exactly what he is saying about himself :3This is, quite possibly, the most hilarious response that you could have given.
Three posts in quick succession to justify (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,15788.msg1039023.html#msg1039023) their vote against Serela, that coincidentally all defend Dormio. Then as soon as Serela mentions that Dormio is the one who was supposed to come back with the response, Validon has to leave to watch anime. (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,15788.msg1039036.html#msg1039036)...
They're the three I'm picking as scum. There's no reason for them to vote for me except that I've picked them as scum. None of them have presented a case for why I am scum except for that.
Also, "Cheez is scum" is not a valid argument for why Polaris is scum when Cheez is not scum.To clarify, since this is prime material for being taken out of context: "Cheez is scum" is not a valid argument for why anyone is scum when Cheez is not scum.
Sorry, I got Validon mixed up as Polaris because - and this is actually pretty funny sigh - Validon, Palidan, Polaris. So many o's and a's and i's. It was totally Polaris.You have my sympathies.
I dunno what to say about Cheez, Sky Palladium, and Dormio but I figure I should mention them for posterity. It really depends on where things go from here for them. Kilga and Darkninja can also fall under this category. I shouldn't need to say Post More Things but do so anyway so that there's more to look at.
They often talk to each other, focus on each other, and ignore other people.Pretty sure I've talked to a lot of people during this game. In fact, I'm pretty sure I rarely ever discussed anything with Polaris. The only other people I think I've not had much discussion or debate with were Shadoweh, Mitsuki and NNR.
For what reason is Cheez8 voting me? -> Because he is up for lynch, and I am the strongest counterlynch.Well, duh. Why wouldn't I vote for somebody who I believe to be scum?
Yeah okay ##Vote: CheezThank you. I don't understand why nobody else gets this.
Sky's case on Polaris sucks because it relies on associative reads without a flip and sheeps someone I would find scummy if I hadn't replaced into their slot but grr.
Welcome to Justice Juice Mafia, Cheez8! You're Peril Pear. Your friend is intimidation, and rightfully so - not much else can match the fear you inflict upon evildoers. If it's ever needed, you have the physical oomph to match. You're happy with your part of keeping the scene clean of filth.
Your role is Vanilla Town. The evildoes are lurking in the shadows, so your options are limited. The best you can do is support your teammates vocally.
You win when all evildoers are eliminated.