Maidens of the Kaleidoscope
~Beyond the Border~ => Rumia's Party Games => Mystia's Stored Games => Topic started by: Chaore on February 11, 2011, 11:33:55 PM
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Ladies, Gentlemen, Kittens, Poleaxes, Dolls, And other assorted household objects, Let's Play MAFIA RPG.
How do you play? Good question! Exactly like Mafia. Except instead of there being Mafia and... Actually this is pretty much just mafia with a bunch of stupid flare, numbers and esoteric quest lines that really don't matter. At least the flavor is kind of funny. Thing is, this is a one-player game! Which means you can...pretty much just stage the game for some reason. It's like the person who made this never played Mafia. Anyway, Watching me play this game alone would be boring, so I've decided to steal the souls of 12 of you unlucky bastards and make you play the game while I pull all the strings! Once the game is over I'll... well, I guess I'll try and get whoever is still alive outta there. Anyway I'm rambling.
You're all a party of 12 adventurers. Except SOME OF YOU ARE EVIL. Hunt monsters, fight bosses, collect sweet loot, and kill eachother blindly until you figure out who is actually evil! Good luck!
Rules:
1. Days will last 48 hours or until a lynch is met. If no lynch is met in that time span, no lynch will occur. The first day is an exception and will last for 72 hours.
2. Once LYLO, and ONLY LYLO occurs, there will be no time limit for days. A lynch must be made to end the day.
3. Night phases will last 24 hours, and all actions that occur during the night must be sent in during that time.
4. Do not quote or screenshot your role PM or you will be fired. Out of a cannon.
5. Discussion of the game outside of the game unless permitted is grounds for execution.
6. Deletion or Editing of a post will cause god to smite you with lightning. This is your ONLY WARNING.
7. Dead players may 'BAH' exactly once, and can not discuss the game itself in that post. Any posts other than that single BAH post will be punished.
8. All talk ends during night phases. Before I post that night has hit, any post may be made.
9. All votes must be bolded and preceded with ##. Same with unvotes.
10. The moderator may be questioned at any time, including night, inthread.
11. Any variation of 'God damnit Chaore!' may only be said once.
11.5- Rules can be modified at any time depending on clearances needed to be made.
12. Confirmation will start after all role PMs have been sent.
Living-
1. Holywhat
5. Kitten4u
6. Revelske
11. PX
Dead-
13. NeoSerela Townie Gamebreaker, Killed N0 by an insane clown and ascended the god-tiers to Co-modhood)
9. Conqueror Town Useless NPC, Lynched Day 1 by having a safe dropped on him.
1. huhwhat Town Jesus died for our sins on Night 1.
2. Hanged Hourai Town Bi-Polar Cop was shot in the face on Night 1.
8. Sect Town Useless NPC was not replaced and modkilled Day 2.
10. iliekmudkips Town Useless NPC was hit at highspeed by a bathtub, getting Lynched for Day 2.
12. Bardiche Town Musicboxman was killed with his own musicbox Night 2.
7. Schezo Mafia Godfather was lynched Day 3 by having the fucking sun dropped on that asshole.
3. Pesco Town Useless NPC was dead in a ditch by the time the Final Day came around!
4. Zakeri Town Defense Attorney was killed by a terrible song on Night 3.
ROLE PMS ARE NOW BEING SENT. A SECOND POST WILL BE MADE TO INFORM YOU THAT ALL PMS ARE SENT AND CONFIRMATION CAN BEGIN.
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ALL ROLE PMS HAVE BEEN SENT, CONFIRMATION PHASE WILL NOW BEGIN.
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Tally ho!
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profirmed
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First one to
/confirm
EDIT: Damn
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I has confirms.
So many confirms
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/appear
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Confirmed.
1. Days will last 48 hours or until a lynch is met. If no lynch is met in that time span, no lynch will occur. The first day is an exception and will last for 72 hours.
Shouldn't it be the other way around? :s
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confirmed.
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I think I just confirmed. In my pants...
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;_; I'm already dea- oh wait I'm god-tier that's totally not dead, awesome
also yeah what huhwhat said, are you sure you didn't mix those two up
ModEdit: I mean exactly what I said. First day is 72, Every other days is 48.
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God dammit NeoSerela.
I'll save the one-shot god damning of the other mod for when it counts.
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/confirmed
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My body is ready.
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/confirm
Edit: Oh look I'm not the last one. :derp:
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Don't edit your posts.
/confirm
And sticky the topic yourself god damnit Chaore.
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ALL PLAYERS HAVE CONFIRMED. LETS HAVE A FUN TIME!
Day One has started. With 12 players alive, 7 votes are required to lynch!
The day will end exactly 72 hours from now, or once a lynch has been met.
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Sir, sir, he made a provocative comment. :moogy:
##Vote: iliekmudkips
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Let's get it on.
##Vote: huh what
It only takes a shift to capitalize your name.
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I'm sticking with nothing for now. I dont wanna actually vote off some PR, or god forbid look scummy.
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Tally ho, adventurers! Ol' Sect's got a li'l favor to ask of ye: I just need ten bear asses to make me world famous stew! Can ye do that fer me?
Rewards: [Rusty Longsword]; [Moth Eaten Loincloth]; [Ring of Thanatopic Doom +5]
Accept Quest / Accept Quest
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Huh, this is quest-like eh?
So you want me to hunt TEN bears without me first knowing what my equips are? >.>
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Tally ho, adventurers! Ol' Sect's got a li'l favor to ask of ye: I just need ten bear asses to make me world famous stew! Can ye do that fer me?
Rewards: [Rusty Longsword]; [Moth Eaten Loincloth]; [Ring of Thanatopic Doom +5]
Accept Quest / Accept Quest
Decline
I could probably break down the components for the Loincloth, but I'm afraid if I do that, I'd just get a sheet of Zettel.
Huh, this is quest-like eh?
So you want me to hunt TEN bears without me first knowing what my equips are? >.>
You should be able to check your equipment in the inventory. What you can equip depends on your class. I can only equip pens, for some reason.
##Vote: iliekmudkips
u herd ron.
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Don't edit your posts.
FFF good thing that wasn't an actual post. I'll make sure not to do that in-game.
I'm sticking with nothing for now. I dont wanna actually vote off some PR, or god forbid look scummy.
Does this look scummy to you?
##Vote: iliekmudkips
:V
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I'm sticking with nothing for now. I dont wanna actually vote off some PR, or god forbid look scummy.
You will almost always risk voting off a PR every time you vote.
Unnecessarily detailed explanation of absolutely nothing, sounding rather forced/paranoid followed by a response to a flavoured post to try fit in.
##VOTE: iliekmudkips
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let's kick it into overdrive.
##Unvote: iliekmudkips
##Vote: reVelske
-adding to a formed bandwagon
-substituting bad play for scum tells
in other news, Kips, please don't do anything to make me vote you because I absolutely hate typing out your full name.
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##Vote Pesco's cat
obv lurkscum
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##VOTE: ReVelske
Third on the wagon is always scum.
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@Bardiche
I was third on the wagon. Nice counting.
##Unvote: iliekmudkips
##Vote: Bardiche
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So you're saying you're scum? Well, we've got our lynch for the day, people.
##UNVOTE
##Vote: Conqueror
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Now, now, why don't we all just settle down? That young'un Mudkip is just new to all of this, I ken tell: that username the tyke has is sumthin' he came up with when he got on his elder brother's account, and the spiky hair 'n unwieldy blade is jest sumthin' that he saw off one of them "JRPGs". If someone could just tell him that he ken get to that equipment screen by pressing "I", then "Tab", then type "Material Wealth", followed by a few strikes of the "F5" button...
Now that Bardiche, on the other hand, he's rather suspect in these ol' eyes. Makin' accusations, then withdrawin' them and accusin' that who called him out.
That, and he only brought back eight of the ten bear asses that I asked for, expecting compensation. This recipe's one that been passed down since my father's time, and his father's time, and it's always been ten bear asses!
## Vote: Bardiche
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Vote Count- The First Campaign!
Iliekmudkips- Schezo, Zakeri, Conqueror, reVelske
Huh what- Hanged Hourai
reVelske]- Zakeri, Bardiche
Bardiche- Conqueror, Sect
Conqueror- Bardiche
Kitten4u- Pesco
4 Players are not voting. There are 62 hours left in Day 1.
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I love how you say that just when I'm posting.
##Vote:Bardiche I'm sure as hell not going to vote myself, ya know. And btw pescos cat is looking scummy. No, srsly, it needs a bath.
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*facepalm*
Danggit Kips, just why?
Why are you voting Bard? What reasoning do you have? We know you aren't going to vote for yourself. Why make yourself third on the wagon when you've seen that people make a big deal out of it? We need to see reasoning here.
And please, give me more of your opinions on Kitte[Z]4U
##Unvote
You better step up your game soon, bro.
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Also, Conqueror,
Do you have any prior experience playing Mafia?
I'm simply curious.
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##unvote
Well, you are right, But there is really no one to vote for without making myself seem scummy, and with a bandwagon on me... that vote was pretty damned stupid.
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How experienced are you with Mafia, iliekmudkips?
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Mudkip, son, let me give you a tip: think before doing anything, and when you do it, stick to yer crossbows. That sort of wishy-washy attitude's gunna get yerself in a party wipe while fightin' that Dark God of the Sorrowful Sigmatism, Yog-Sissasusliss, especially if ye don't have a hearty helping of me famous stew. Provided, of course, ye get me them the ingredients I require.
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I've played one or two forum games, just the standard mafia. And those were about a year ago.
I'd say I'm pretty damned rusty >.>
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Sect; more accurately, I'm voting the one who really was third on the wagon. After he so elegantly pointed it out to me (and voted me for missing a count, lol), I thought it would be nothing short of civil to correct myself and place my vote appropriately.
How is this "accusing who called me out"?
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Kips,
You need to ask questions, form theories with reasoning, and follow through on what you do.
Also, avoiding questions is bad.
And please, give me more of your opinions on Kitte[Z]4U
What was up with throwing out a random scum accusation?
Trying to spread chaos is what scum does. Why in the world do you just blurt out something like that?
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Sect, just curious, what's your mafia experience?
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Asking questions? Well sure.
Why are you giving advice to someone with little-to-no experience at all, when you could just hop on the bandwagon and vote me? And why are you helping someone who has a one in 1/12 chance of killing you and just playing the newbie act? Or how do you know I'm not some PR? And how do I know you arent just trying to get me on your side whilst you could be scum?
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Hourai, are you seriously trying to push a blatant misrepresentation like that so hard?
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@Bardiche
Well, how civil of you. :)
@ilmk
##Vote:Bardiche I'm sure as hell not going to vote myself, ya know.
But why did you suddenly vote Bard when you could have voted anyone else?
@Hourai
I've played a few forum games and quite a few in-person games (but those are pretty different from forum-style Mafia). I also used to lurk the hell out of Mafiascum, but I never joined a game there because I wasn't able to make the time commitment. Actually, Mafiascum is where I first saw Zakeri and Pesco. (http://67.222.17.61/forum/viewtopic.php?t=12414)
Also, I was a bit confused until I realized that "Pesco's Cat" was Kitten4u.
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##VOTE: ReVelske
Third on the wagon is always scum.
So you're saying you're scum? Well, we've got our lynch for the day, people.
##UNVOTE
##Vote: Conqueror
That answer your question? Well, In his first two posts, He votes, unvotes, then votes again, with a stupid reason or no reason. If anything right now Schezo's scum for lurking/first post, but then again, he might not even be on sooo....
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1.Why are you giving advice to someone with little-to-no experience at all, when you could just hop on the bandwagon and vote me?
2. And why are you helping someone who has a one in 1/12 chance of killing you and just playing the newbie act?
3. Or how do you know I'm not some PR?
4.And how do I know you arent just trying to get me on your side whilst you could be scum?
1. This is a game. The goal is to play to win and play to have fun. I want you to be better for everyone's sake. If I make you good now, then in future games, I won't have to facepalm whenever you post.
2. You want me to vote you? Sure. What I did though, was give you the basics of how to play the game.
3. I don't.
4. You don't. You need to decide for yourself and play the game.
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@Bard
I want this guy to be aware that his actions and words have consequences. So yes, but I don't find it damning in his case. I'm willing to give a newb pass to him this one time. The kid reminds me of me.
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The headache continues.
Kips, the first post of D1 is not scummy enough to convict someone of scumliness.
What about our other 3 players who haven't even checked in since confirmation?
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Asking questions? Well sure.
Why are you giving advice to someone with little-to-no experience at all, when you could just hop on the bandwagon and vote me? And why are you helping someone who has a one in 1/12 chance of killing you and just playing the newbie act? Or how do you know I'm not some PR? And how do I know you arent just trying to get me on your side whilst you could be scum?
I don't understand this post.
That answer your question? Well, In his first two posts, He votes, unvotes, then votes again, with a stupid reason or no reason. If anything right now Schezo's scum for lurking/first post, but then again, he might not even be on sooo....
There are few votes currently out there with a good reason backing them. My "reasons for voting" are just as bad as his.
What was up with throwing out a random scum accusation?
Trying to spread chaos is what scum does. Why in the world do you just blurt out something like that?
I'm pretty sure Mudkips there was continuing Pesco's little joke. I'm not sure why you're taking it so seriously.
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Hmmm.
Well, nice way to put it bluntly. All my newbish/rustyness aside, I brought sect those last two bear asses he wanted. At the cost of my pinky toe.
And god damn I always hate first day in mafia.The headache continues.
Kips, the first post of D1 is not scummy enough to convict someone of scumliness.
What about our other 3 players who haven't even checked in since confirmation?
Well, I'm not convicting anyone as scum yet. I'm just saying that bard voting for the third person on a BW is about as smart as voting for someone for first post and a random vote.
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##Unvote
I am now refining my vote into a serious vote. ##Vote: Iliekmudkips
Jokevotes are over. Trying to play the WIFOM game with Hourai's intentions, postulating that you might be scum, saying Schezo is scummy BUT HE COULD ALSO NOT BE. I don't care if you're trying to build a case off of the worst reasoning since jokevotes, but the wishywashiness and flipflopping is harmful to town, and therefore scummy.
Cut by iliekmudkips: third on the wagon is always scum is a fantastic reason to vote what are you talking about. Go scumhunt instead of pretending you're Magikarp.
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I'm pretty sure Mudkips there was continuing Pesco's little joke. I'm not sure why you're taking it so seriously.
I'm not the best at judging joking/sarcasm on the internet.
But what is interesting is that he never responded to say, "That was a joke." whenever I asked him about it. That's what I was waiting for when I was asking.
@Bard, Question:
What is the third on wagon=scum? Is this an actual strategy, or is it a joke?
I'm not the best at judging joking/sarcasm on the internet.
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*facepalm*
Danggit Hourai, just why?
Why are you asking Kips for an opinion on a person who has made ZERO posts? What reasoning do you have? We know things aren't that serious in RVS phase. Why are you acting like Doll from last game?! We need to see reasoning here.
And please, tell me what was going through your mind when you were typing that post
##Vote: Hanged Hourai
You better step up your game soon, bro. (lol, really?)
EDIT: Warning - while you were typing 6 new replies have been posted. You may wish to review your post.
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##Unvote
I am now refining my vote into a serious vote. ##Vote: Iliekmudkips
Jokevotes are over. Trying to play the WIFOM game with Hourai's intentions, postulating that you might be scum, saying Schezo is scummy BUT HE COULD ALSO NOT BE. I don't care if you're trying to build a case off of the worst reasoning since jokevotes, but the wishywashiness and flipflopping is harmful to town, and therefore scummy.
Cut by iliekmudkips: third on the wagon is always scum is a fantastic reason to vote what are you talking about. Go scumhunt instead of pretending you're Magikarp.
Jokevotes shouldn't even BE here. Jokevotes like "haha ##vote hanged hourai for being (insert stupid reason here)" Is even more scummy then anything really. If you want to joke around, please take it somewhere else, this is a serious game.
And yes, Schezo could be scummy or he could not be. There's a 1/12 chance any of us are scum, so how do we determine whos scum and whos not? Hell we dont even know if its a 1/12 chance, for all we know its 3/12. And wishywashingness? Coming from the dude who thinks voting the third person on a BW is a good reason, changes votes every two posts, and accusing everyone else of being scum?
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@Bard, Question:
What is the third on wagon=scum? Is this an actual strategy, or is it a joke?
It's a classic scumtell. It shouldn't be used as an actual voting strategy, per se, but it's a idea that does make some sense and sometimes does catch the mafia. Of course, once something becomes known as a scumtell, Mafia avoid it like the plague, so...
http://mafiascum.net/wiki/index.php?title=Scumtells#Examples:
Jokevotes shouldn't even BE here. Jokevotes like "haha ##vote hanged hourai for being (insert stupid reason here)" Is even more scummy then anything really. If you want to joke around, please take it somewhere else, this is a serious game.
And yes, Schezo could be scummy or he could not be. There's a 1/12 chance any of us are scum, so how do we determine whos scum and whos not? Hell we dont even know if its a 1/12 chance, for all we know its 3/12. And wishywashingness? Coming from the dude who thinks voting the third person on a BW is a good reason, changes votes every two posts, and accusing everyone else of being scum?
Oh god why this post.
Jokevotes always happen on the first day. It's how things get started, with RVS, before someone slips up or gets heated up and actual arguments start coming out. Like what is happening with you right now.
Also, please don't play probability games.
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iliekmudkips: ... we determine by scumhunting. And yes, wishywashiness. Going "Schezo could be scum OR NOT" doesn't serve anyone any bit. Nor does questioning how we determine who is scummy.
Are you actually going to make an effort to scumhunt, or just flail around?
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Why are you asking Kips for an opinion on a person who has made ZERO posts? What reasoning do you have? We know things aren't that serious in RVS phase. Why are you acting like Doll from last game?! We need to see reasoning here.
Because, what he is doing will not accomplish anything at all, and will hurt town later on. Focusing on nothing will result in nothing. And I have been giving my reasoning.
And please, tell me what was going through your mind when you were typing that post
Which post? You said at the end there were new replies.
Oh yeah, I also think it's cute how you ignore Kips completely, not minding his actions at all. =]
You better step up your game soon, bro. (lol, really?)
That's my thing! >:<
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Mudkip, ye need to settle down, son; all them Mountain Dews and Gamer Fuels are makin' ye all jumpity and uppity. Yer startin' to dig yerself inta a hole with yer raid party: if yer one of 'em evil brigands then yer not doing a very good job of hidin' it, and if yer a goodly sort then yer jes' bein' detrimental to yer own side. At this rate, ye won't be slayin' any kobolds, much less the legions of the damned.
I do thank ye for bringin' those ingredients for me, though. Perhaps a bowl of me stew'll settle yer nerves.
As fer ye, Bardiche, I'm afraid that I don't quite tuck with the whole "third person is scum" logic, 'specially when ye choose the wrong player. That said, though, I'mma just gonna 'ssume that's just a sad side effect of partyin' with them "hardcore" raid guilds. So, I'll just go ahead 'n ## Unvote ye fer now.
Now, since you boys brought me the ten bear asses that I needed, I'll just mark ye off as completin' me quest. Too bad that you'll hafta share the reward, though: I'll be nice 'n sweeten the pot fer ye two.
Bardiche and iliekmudkips gain 20 EXP! Bardiche and iliekmudkips gain 10 gold pieces!
Choose your reward!: [Rusty Longsword]; [Moth Eaten Loincloth]; [Ring of Thanatopic Doom +5]
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Dips on the ring of whatever he has. :/
It sounds much cooler then a rusty sword and a damned loincloth.
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I'm pretty sure Mudkips there was continuing Pesco's little joke. I'm not sure why you're taking it so seriously.
Why are you answering mudkips questions for him?
##Unvote
##Vote Conqueror
##Backstab Sect
##Steal Ring of Thanatopic Doom +5
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Why are you asking Kips for an opinion on a person who has made ZERO posts? What reasoning do you have? We know things aren't that serious in RVS phase. Why are you acting like Doll from last game?! We need to see reasoning here.
And please, tell me what was going through your mind when you were typing that post
What. Exaggerate much? He was just referring to Kip's accusation on Schezo for being scummy by being the first to post and lurking afterwards. Don't see what's so hard to understand.
And vote on Kips isn't changing.
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okay what the hell did i wake up to
Not liking Sect very much, as he seems to have surprisingly little solid game-related content. Roleplaying is amusing and all, but when the quality of your fluffiness exceeds the quality of your actual scumhunting, that's rather off. The Bard case was poor, somewhat opportunistic and primarily a mis-rep of a jokevote, and once it was corrected, he left his vote hanging entirely when there should have been enough going on to make a different decision. Sect, is there anybody you would want lynched right now, now that you've unvoted Bard?
kippers is even worse, though, for being guilty of the same sins Sect has (plus a worse wagon jump!) while also wagon-jumping and acting wishy-washy to the extent that I can barely read his posts because they're so bad. Can he summarize his current case and opinions? Because I have no idea what's even going on with him.
##Vote iliekmudkips
This game is pretty headache-y so far, so I don't have much more to say, but uh, while I'm at it: I'm not understanding Pesco's case on Conqueror at all. How is answering questions for kips scummy when we don't know kips' alignment yet? It's not exactly good play, yes, but I don't see why it's scummy as is.
I -do- dislike how Conqueror keeps hammering on kips while hanging onto his Bard vote, though. He'd probably be my third choice for a lynch because of that, and the WIFOM his explanation of the "third on wagon = scum" tell invites does not do him any favors. Conqueror, is Bard really that awful just because he didn't vote you when jokevoting?
Also Schezo, is that Tormod in your avatar?
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Don't question the mindhax. It's Bard approved (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,8255.msg547118.html#msg547118) :V
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Jokevotes shouldn't even BE here. Jokevotes like "haha ##vote hanged hourai for being (insert stupid reason here)" Is even more scummy then anything really. If you want to joke around, please take it somewhere else, this is a serious game.
And yes, Schezo could be scummy or he could not be. There's a 1/12 chance any of us are scum, so how do we determine whos scum and whos not? Hell we dont even know if its a 1/12 chance, for all we know its 3/12. And wishywashingness? Coming from the dude who thinks voting the third person on a BW is a good reason, changes votes every two posts, and accusing everyone else of being scum?
Ok, so what now? We are all supposed to get a divine premonition on who's scum and who we need to vote before the game even starts? No, we have to put pressure on places and wait for some actual discussion to take place before we can stop wondering around in the dark. I really don't know who to choose between you, who took the jokevotes way too seriously and are running a torrent of confusion with your posts not making sense, or Hourai.
Hourai is just helping ilmk and trying to make it seem like he's really pressuring him. But with crazy off the wall evidence (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,8444.msg552263.html#msg552263) that doesn't even make sense. Then Hourai doesn't even put a vote to his words, which feels like he's defending ilmk for whatever reason that feels a bit Chensawish. However we got ilmk just throwing random votes out there when he claims he's against them.
Both of you took the RVS way too seriously and I'm torn between who to vote for. I can kinda see where Hourai is coming from with trying to help but feels off. With Kips wishwashyness it doesn't put him in a good light. I'm keeping my vote there.
Edit: Cut by huh what. Why yes it is.
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I have the strangest feeling I'm going to get lynched. Completely random thought though, totally.
Well, There's not really much for me to say or do at this point in time besides trying to defend my case with an arguement I've already used about three times by now, and I doubt claiming would help in the least, would it? :4
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kippers is even worse, though, for being guilty of the same sins Sect has (plus a worse wagon jump!) while also wagon-jumping and acting wishy-washy to the extent that I can barely read his posts because they're so bad. Can he summarize his current case and opinions? Because I have no idea what's even going on with him.
You could start by not ignoring me.
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My case is point you guys have as much a reason to lynch me as you do for bard. Look at his first two posts. Then look at the rest. He goes from one person to another for the sole purpose of them being the third on a vote, and the rest of his posts are trying to get someone lynched with little to no info, hoping they'll get agitated and slip their tongue like I did.
That sound good?
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Are you trying to push Bard as scum? If so, why aren't you voting him?
Though, I disagree with your case regardless. From my PoV, it mainly seems that you're accusing him because of "not me over me" and that you don't actually have much solid backing to think that he's scum (you mainly seem to be dwelling on jokevotes, etc).
Can you give an example of him adding baseless pressure like you're claiming that he has been doing? Because I cannot find anything from him that feels unwarranted.
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I believe I dont have a way to prove my point, do I? Well, either way.
##Vote:Bardiche
I'm pretty sure thats my final vote. Imma go take a nap.
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Those pesky rabbits, with their backstabs 'n their stealings...
And ta answer yer question, huh what, truth be told young Mudkip is so distracting that a dragon could set it's keister behind us 'n we wouldn't have a clue. Now, I don't believe that the boy is rotten, but I'm not so sure that lynchin' him would be such a bad thing ('n my apologies to ye, Mudkip), if it would make things easier for the whole lot of ye. Not a one of you folk strikes me as being the bad type, 'cept for that rotten rabbit with his thievin' ways...
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@huh what
I'm not actually pushing Bard, if you see my post, even though I hadn't unvoted him. I don't find anything of what he's done yet to be particularly scummy at all. That said:
##Unvote:Bard
I would put a vote here (maybe for ilmk) but I'd like to hear from more people first.
@Sect
I suck at reading flavor, could you post in plain English perhaps? ^^
Also, I'll stop answering questions for other people. It's the mod's job, after all. :X
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kips, the reason I'm attacking your case so much is because you basically just told everyone on your wagon that they have just as much reason to vote Bard as they do to vote you, and yet you are failing to explain why Bard is worse than you.
Honestly, the best thing you can really do in this kind of situation is provide a good alternative lynch (see me getting lynched in D1 of Sakana's Werewolf game for what happens if you don't). But if the best way you can explain your alternative choice to town is by voting them while admitting you can't actually make your point, you're not exactly going to convince anybody to vote the alternative. The fact that you claimed your vote on Bard is your final choice also shows a lack of effort on your part, and that combined with your inability to actually convincingly lay out your case on him makes me feel that you're not really attempting to do the townie thing and scumhunt properly.
Sect, do you have a posting restriction?
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Hourai is just helping ilmk and trying to make it seem like he's really pressuring him. But with crazy off the wall evidence (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,8444.msg552263.html#msg552263) that doesn't even make sense. Then Hourai doesn't even put a vote to his words, which feels like he's defending ilmk for whatever reason that feels a bit Chensawish.
If you're talking about how I gave him advice on how to play the game, I'm scum for wanting people to be better players at mafia? ???
Crazy off the wall? Mountains and molehills, dude.
I wanted an explanation for the reasons behind his vote.
Also, I want to keep my vote open so I don't get tunnel vision like in the last game.
And how am I chainsawing?
*New reply from Kips*
That's it then? You just give up? Your final move is one of absolutely nothing?
Can you even remotely think of anything worthwhile to say anymore?
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Sect, do you have a posting restriction?
Not really, just thought I might as well keep to the flavor. Coupled with Kips, though, and it's just really distracting, so I'm gonna cut it out.
All right, I'll just go ahead and recap my thoughts, for the non-fluff literate :P :
I voted for Bard because I didn't really like his voting for the third on a wagon. Not a particularly good reason, I know, but neither was his.
I don't have anyone that I want to vote for, because Kips is so freaking distracting. I don't think Kips is scum, but he's acting so erratically that I honestly think that lynching him would be doing everyone a favor.
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Not really, just thought I might as well keep to the flavor.
Ah. I was mainly curious because if you had one it would explain the awkward words:content ratio on your part.
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Oh, no, it's because I like vomiting words. Just ask anyone around here.
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neo post a vote count for me i'm lazy
Vote Count- The Second Edition
Iliekmudkips- Schezo, Zakeri, Conqueror, reVelske, Bardiche, Huhwhat
Bardiche- Conqueror, Sect, Iliekmudkips
reVelske]- Zakeri, Bardiche
Conqueror- Bardiche, Pesco
H.Hourai- Golden PX
Huh what- Hanged Hourai
Kitten4u- Pesco
Kitten4u, Hanged Hourai, and Conqueror are not voting. There are 57 hours left in Day 1. iliekmudkips is L-3.
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Whoops, mods missed my unvote: accidentally put a space there. Sorry, Bard.
##Unvote
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This was coming.
##Vote: iliekmudkips
You are too big of a risk to town and your arguments have not made any sense at all the whole game.
Giving up before the day is even halfway through is no way to play the game.
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Okay, some people have been taking RVS too seriously.
kips: Wow, so you just give up? I'll put my vote on him when the time comes since he's basically a beanbag at this point. Provided nothing to aid town, just some WIFOM.
Hourai: In case you didn't notice, I copypasta'd your post. That was the one I was talking about. Now please move away from kips.
Sect: It was explained that 3rd on wagon is a legitimate reason, although you're accusing him over a joke vote. Thanks for no more flavor, that was completely unreadable. So you're accusing Bard, but no vote on him, and your sole reasoning is over a RVS jokevote.
Conquerer: What about other people?
##Unvote
Please bold whenever you're voting or unvoting
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EBWOP:
9. All votes must be bolded and preceded with ##. Same with unvotes.
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Also, I'll stop answering questions for other people. It's the mod's job, after all. :X
You answer the questions to everyone else but yourself. Why did you give mudkips an out by suggesting that what I said was a joke.
Vote stays.
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Sorry, forgot the tags when I was unvoting the second time.
##Unvote
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@PX
Why are you targeting me? Why specifically tell me to unvote kips? There are other people voting him if you did not see that.
What makes me special? (other than just being me :3)
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Back from not being able to sleep. :/
Anyways, I'm not giving up, i'm saying my final vote is on bard. As in, I'm not going to unvote and change as I honestly think he's scum. Chances are I'm dead anyways, and claiming vanilla wont really help will it?
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We've got more than 2 days of time still. Put your backbone in it.
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You answer the questions to everyone else but yourself.
I don't recall missing any questions. Which ones? Point them out and I'll answer them again.
Why did you give mudkips an out by suggesting that what I said was a joke.
Well, my bad for giving him an "out", but I thought questioning him on that little point was a bit silly when there were a host of other legitimate reasons to be questioning him, especially since your first vote didn't seem especially serious.
Conquerer: What about other people?
I want to hear more about other people, not just ilmk. The way the convo is going, everyone, including scum, can just criticize ilmk whlie flying under the radar themselves. Anyway, I'd like to at least hear more from Kitten4u and Zakeri before the day is over.
I'll post more later when I have more thoughts on the matter.
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@ Conqueror: I'd talk more about other people if there was more to say about them.
You and Sect (my other two suspects) still aren't actually placing a serious vote down on anybody, so it's a little hard to get a read on either of you. Though I suppose it could be said that that's scummy in itself. Please do something.
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I want to hear more about other people, not just ilmk. The way the convo is going, everyone, including scum, can just criticize ilmk whlie flying under the radar themselves. Anyway, I'd like to at least hear more from Kitten4u and Zakeri before the day is over.
Sounds like you already clearing mudkips as town.
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I post then decide to change my vote immediately after posting it way too much.
##Unvote
##Vote Conqueror
Beyond what has already been said, you have been dancing around getting a serious vote out for way too long. All you have been doing is talking about kips while keeping a jokevote down on Bard, and when PX nudged you to talk about people other than kips, you redirected the question towards everyone else while not actually answering it yourself. The following pressure on lurkers is not actual pressure and does not actually count as opinions on people other than kips. Stop trying to put off contributing.
I think this is worse than kippers' wishy-washiness and convictionless vote since at least kips' actions could possibly be interpreted as having town intent, although I'm not exactly clearing him.
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Sounds like you already clearing mudkips as town.
No, I'm not saying anything like that. Read again.
The following pressure on lurkers is not actual pressure and does not actually count as opinions on people other than kips. Stop trying to put off contributing.
Before your unvote, kips was at L-2. If I voted for him, that would put him at L-1. Anyone could easily hammer that and the day would end just like that. Lynching kips is fun and all that, but wouldn't it be more useful for town to get some information about other people first? But since it seems to bother you so much, I guess I'll put my money where my mouth is. How's that for pressure? L-2 again.
##Vote iliekmudkips
When PX nudged you to talk about people other than kips, you redirected the question towards everyone else while not actually answering it yourself.
I'd talk more about other people if there was more to say about them.
^^This, and also I didn't realize the question was specifically aimed at me - I thought he was just asking for a clarification. I don't really have any strong opinions about anyone yet; this game is a null-tell for me so far. Quick notes on my thoughts:
Sect - Joke(?) vote on Bard which he later withdrew. Otherwise, his opinion is best summarized by "I don't think Kips is scum, but he's acting so erratically that I honestly think that lynching him would be doing everyone a favor." Not sure what to think about this, but judging from what other people have said, they may have this rationale too.
ilmk - A mess of opinions and emotions. Keeps holding to a vote on Bard despite not really having any reasoning behind it. Seems to be making one point but then backtracks and claims another point. However, claims to be a relative newbie at the game. I hope to see more posts from him that I can actually understand.
Hourai - Seems to be tsundere towards mudkips, alternatively trying to help him and pressure him. But anyone could do that.
Bard - Doing his typical thing, it looks like, based on what I've seen from previous games.
PX - A strange joke(?) vote for Hourai based on a stupid post Hourai made, but unvotes later. Has been asking questions, but nothing too serious or deep.
Pesco - Keeps pestering me about kips, but doesn't give his own opinion on kips.
huh what - Seems to be doing a good job pressuring people and asking questions. Well what can I say.
I know, I know, not much in the way of in-depth analysis there. But I'm not getting any reads so far, which is why I'm asking for more posts from other people. Can't say much about the others, as they don't have enough posts for me to go on.
If you want me to elaborate on any of the above, I can do that later
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Crap, I answered the wrong question. Anyway, about lurkers, there's still a lot of time for them to post, so I'm not going to throw a random vote on them just because they haven't shown up/posted yet.
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Anyone could easily hammer that and the day would end just like that.
If kips was town and scum decided to quickhammer him, then that would be awesome because we'd pretty much know who to lynch the next day. Not that I'd prefer a quickhammer to happen, but I really don't think there was much worry of kips dying less than 24 hours into d1.
Also, none of your comments on people actually reveal your stance on their alignment. It's all IIoA, and some of them (your statement about Hourai) could even be considered fence-sitting. I don't think those are the kind of opinions that PX wanted, since they're not actual opinions and more along the lines of recaps.
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Yeesh I'm not ilmk, It's kips. gawd.
Anyways, What part of "Bard's as wishywashy as I am" not make sense?
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The part where it's clearly not true.
Wishywashiness ISN"T "Oh, I voted the wrong person, let me correct that" and then "Well GOSH DARNIT THIS PERSON IS SCUMMIER".
Wishywashiness is "Well, this person might be scum... OR HE MIGHT NOT BE.", "I'm going to vote this person... BUT THEN I WON'T.", "We need to hunt scum... BUT WHAT IS SCUMHUNTING?"... you have not held a single opinion consistently save for that it is not possible to vote someone with right reasons at the start of the game. But to decry people who do so as scummy is circular logic that does not hold any water whatsoever.
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Also, none of your comments on people actually reveal your stance on their alignment. It's all IIoA, and some of them (your statement about Hourai) could even be considered fence-sitting. I don't think those are the kind of opinions that PX wanted, since they're not actual opinions and more along the lines of recaps.
That's because it is IIoA. It's hard for me to make opinions on any of you because everybody's posts, for the most part, don't give me any reason to believe they're one alignment or another. As for clear-cut opinions on other people (besides kips, everyone seems to have an opinion on him) we don't really have that much from anyone. Which, again, is why I'm pushing for people to post more. I mean, I keep posting, whether to my benefit or detriment, and the rest of you can get info and make conclusions from that. I'd like to be able to get more reads on other people, and I'm sure other people would appreciate that too.
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If kips was town and scum decided to quickhammer him, then that would be awesome because we'd pretty much know who to lynch the next day. Not that I'd prefer a quickhammer to happen, but I really don't think there was much worry of kips dying less than 24 hours into d1.
Also, looking at the past games on this board, some townie could easily quickhammer, simply because they thought he was exceptionally scummy. I don't usually see scum quickhammering on day 1, but that's just me...
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And btw pescos cat is looking scummy. No, srsly, it needs a bath.
I keep myself clean thank you very much. >:(
Anyway, what the heck am I reading? Sifting through all this is giving me a headache.
I see there are a lot of newbies in this game, nice. The best way I've found to differentiate newb town from newb scum early on is in CONVICTION! I believe that newb town is more likely to go after people and believe in what they're saying. Fence sitting and wishy-washiness are more likely to come from newb scum from what I've seen. Here are the newbies that don't pass CONVICTION inspection (ordered from not as bad to worst):
PX: Confuses me. I like this post (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,8444.msg552381.html#msg552381). I don't agree with the accusation, but oh man lookit that attacking go. This post (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,8444.msg552539.html#msg552539) however, makes me sad. Unvoting without revoting and a bunch of throwaway comments. Seriously, he doesn't even say if Kips is scummy or just useless town and just goes for the policy lynch. It's not damning, but it bothers me.
Conqueror: Straddles the line. There's a lot of "let's wait and see" and stalling. Enough that it's giving me CB flashbacks. And I keep feeling this weird disconnect between his fearlessness in the RVS and his extreme cautiousness in voting for Kips. I realize they're not really the same, but when I read his posts in isolation it makes me uneasy.
Sect: Hasn't done much of anything beyond amuse me with flavor. Being amusing does not make someone town though. Who is scum?
iliekmudkips: Do I really need to explain? Enough other people have by now. The only thing making me wary is how quickly the wagon formed and that there's no real counter wagon. But between the general wishy-wasiness, overall badness and giving up (common for scum so that they give us less clues) it wouldn't surprise me if his buddies just threw him under the buss. Kips! Who is scum and why!
---
With that said, I want to lynch either Sect or Kips right now. I could be convinced to go after Conqueror, but I don't consider him a priority right now. PX is more at "bugging me" level rather than lynch level right now. I wouldn't support a PX lynch right now, but I'm certainly watching him.
Nothing else is jumping out at me. This post is way too long anyway, sorry about that.
##Vote iliekmudkips (L-1) I can't forgive the giving up. I know you say that you're not, but you are. Declaring a final vote when the day isn't even half over is basically the same as excusing yourself from thinking, and therefore not playing the game. I can understand getting frustrated, but I cannot see townie intent in giving up.
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Vote Count- The One Where Someone Has Reached L-1
Iliekmudkips- Schezo, Zakeri, Conqueror, reVelske, Bardiche, Huhwhat, H.Hourai, Kitten4U
Conqueror- Bardiche, Pesco, Huhwhat
Bardiche- Conqueror, Sect, Iliekmudkips
reVelske]- Zakeri, Bardiche
H.Hourai- Golden PX
Huh what- Hanged Hourai
Kitten4u- Pesco
Sect and PX are not voting. There are 52 hours left in Day 1. iliekmudkips is at L-1.
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Whoops, deleted my post. Oh well, here's the only part you guys wanted to see anyway.
But between the general wishy-wasiness, overall badness and giving up
Kips Votes for bard because he thinks Bardiche is scum (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,8444.msg552238.html#msg552238)
Kips presents the reason why he initially thought Bard was scum. (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,8444.msg552358.html#msg552358)
Kips learns that voting is something you are suppose to be doing, and once again votes Bardiche.
[url=http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,8444.msg552553.html#msg552553]Kips claims that he has no intention to unvote Bardiche. Also, that he's not giving up, just that he has no idea how to put words that sound pleasant to our ears together. (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,8444.msg552477.html#msg552477)
Kips may have a complete lack of logic within his reasoning, but he's definitely displayed the conviction needed to pass the "Newbtown vs Newbscum" analysis you made.
I was hoping to drag reVelske into something, but I should have known better from the discussion he participated in at the begining of Moriya shrine Mafia.
##Unvote: reVelske
##Vote: Conqueror
Call this a gut feeling if you will, but in addition to what I accused reVelske initially for:
Keeping Kips at the top of your suspicion list, but backing off seemingly to say "I'm a townie, look at me doing townie things." Despite the pressure on you, you haven't put anything forth besides the vote on Kips. This post (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,8444.msg552484.html#msg552484) where you unvote Bard saying you're not pushing him, yet put forth no other options besides the one at L-2 doesn't make you look any better. You pretty much read faketown to me (as oppose to Kips who reads fakescum.) And although you never say you feel Kips is town, and do say you want to vote him, I still can't help but shake the feeling in Here (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,8444.msg552555.html#msg552555) that you subconciously know Kips alignment is town. A Lot of things refuse to add up for me, even though there's nothing solid to pin on you.
In a similar note, Kitten4u's latest post describing you was what helped me to reach a conclusion on Conquror. Which makes me see a large disconnect between this and the fact that she ended up voting Kips instead.
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Edit: Missed a /url tag. :ohdear:
Also, Kips, some advice: The reason you can't think of any good reason to convince us why Bardiche is scum is because there isn't one. I suggest you take a look over what everyone's posted, and try again, rather than leave it at "I just think he is."
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##UNVOTE: kips
*whistles and looks about*
##VOTE: PESCO
YOU! You got the face of someone who's ready to be lynched on day one! Submit to your fate!
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Well, it seems like I've got nothing good to say according to y'all, so I might as well sit back and watch the game for a while.
oh, and, btw, gut > logic. Gut is saying to vote bard. That so hard to understand? :/
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@reV
(http://img806.imageshack.us/img806/406/87665dudewtfposters1z.jpg) (http://img806.imageshack.us/i/87665dudewtfposters1z.jpg/)
I... you... why... what... huh?
You jokevoting?
Please explain before my head melts of confusion.
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Kips, please don't post stuff like that. You're letting your emotions get the better of you. Just take a day to cool off.
Anyways, still haven't decided anything, yet, even after rereading everything. The only thing that really stuck out in my mind as being off was Pescoe's initial vote for Conqueror, but Pescoe hasn't said much at all (not that he's needed to, really).
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It's 7AM and I haven't slept, I've tried though, no luck.
And to elaborate, unvoting kips since he has cleared himself on my book, reason I'll keep to myself (sue me).
And as for voting, don't find anyone else particularly attention-worthy, though not a big fan of Pesco's lack of activity and his half-ass attack on Conqueror, and GUT FEELING FUCK YEAH, so free vote for him.
I grow weary of Sect's self-appointed Kips adviser role though.
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Kips, please don't post stuff like that. You're letting your emotions get the better of you. Just take a day to cool off.
Anyways, still haven't decided anything, yet, even after rereading everything. The only thing that really stuck out in my mind as being off was Pescoe's initial vote for Conqueror, but Pescoe hasn't said much at all (not that he's needed to, really).
Emotions? It's moreso the fact that first off, no one wants to be lynched. Second off, if I post pretty much anything I'd prolly GET lynched. And third, who made you my daddy again?
wait
DADDY?!
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No, mudkips, you're getting lynched because people are voting you and your strategy so far is, "Maybe if I pretend to be an idiot people will lay off."
Even scum can be an idiot, and so far I see nothing to redeem the earlier points regarding circular logic, terrible case-building, wishywashiness or anything you've done.
ReVelske makes me facepalm.
There's about six people I'd like to see lynched right now. If only I had six hammer votes to go around. :( Hourai, Sect, Mudkip, ReVelske, Hourai, Zakeri, what the hell are you doing?[/i]
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No, mudkips, you're getting lynched because people are voting you and your strategy so far is, "Maybe if I pretend to be an idiot people will lay off."
Even scum can be an idiot, and so far I see nothing to redeem the earlier points regarding circular logic, terrible case-building, wishywashiness or anything you've done.
ReVelske makes me facepalm.
There's about six people I'd like to see lynched right now. If only I had six hammer votes to go around. :( Hourai, Sect, Mudkip, ReVelske, Hourai, Zakeri, what the hell are you doing?[/i]
Apparently playing better then you.
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So what have you contributed to the game so far?
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So what have you contributed to the game so far?
Well what have you? Both of us have been as wishy-washy as the other, correct? Only I'm the one "not making sense". And it also looks like I'm not getting a break, correct? >.>
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... So, at this point, I guess you don't feel like playing any more, Kips. All right.
##Vote: iliekmudkips
To answer your question, Bardiche, at this point I don't have a clue. Let's just get to Day 2: I'm almost certain that Kips is town, but I'm also certain that this is just draining the life out of me.
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Hell if I was giving up I'd say so.
Do remember who lead the lynch on me, and who hates me the most right now. :4
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There's about six people I'd like to see lynched right now. If only I had six hammer votes to go around. :( Hourai, Sect, Mudkip, ReVelske, Hourai, Zakeri, what the hell are you doing?[/i]
Why you hammer me twice, bro? ;--;
Unless you meant someone else. >.>
But what do you disagree with me about?
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It's unfortunate you don't seem to understand why everyone disagrees with you about alleged "wishywashiness" in my voting patterns.
You're not doing anything to convince anyone voting you to vote, y'know, someone else. Other than "my gut says Bardiche is scum" and "but Bard is just as bad as me!", which everyone so far has disagreed on. Make an honest effort to pro-actively play the game. Or play the game at all.
Right now it just looks like you're trolling the game and resigning yourself to getting lynched.
Sect, you should vote scummy, not lynch people you think are town, but who are acting completely anti-town.
Hourai: I get the impression your vote on Mudkips is because Mudkips is being derp, not because you think they are scummy.
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Sect, why are you voting somebody who you think is town? Are you really incapable of finding anybody else who irritates you at this point? In fact, if you're so sure kips is town, I imagine it would be easier to find somebody who irks you based on that.
reVelske, are you trolling or do you actually want Pesco lynched? I cannot see the point you are trying to make at all, and withholding your reasons for clearing kips is argh.
Seconding Bard on the six hammer votes.
And then he ninja'd me and said the same thing to Sect. <_< But everything else still stands.
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Though... Bard, what do you think of Conqueror that makes him exempt from your hate list?
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Herp derp triple post.
When did you start disliking Zak, too? You never even mentioned him until you talked about your desire for hammervotes.
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Conqueror isn't on my hatelist because I've signed him off as derptown. I can revisit that opinion if you so like, but there's nothing in his posts that I enjoy seeing in a good townie. Making lists of suspicion, throwing hands up in the air going "I can't read anyone!", it's got all the makings of someone who is bad at both bluffing and discerning lies.
It's not immediately scummy to me, and while I am not particularly fond of it it is nothing that I find important enough to raise at this point in the face of the whirlwind of derp that renders me nearly incapable of figuring out just what everyone's plans for this Day phase are.
Other than derpbugaloo around the popsicle of derp a few times.
I started disliking Zakeri around the time he began defending Kips by reporting, then clearing him based on non-descript conditions for "derptown VS derpscum". Also not fond of him saying "There's no reason to convince us Bard is scum" due to buddying up to me, and I don't like that.
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In fact, I think I'm willing to switch. ##Unvote
##Vote: Zakeri
For as much as I find Iliekmudkips' behaviour to be completely anti-town, and his actions to be more detrimental than beneficial, they are also too obvious, too derp to be possibly passable for any scum. I'd rather not waste the town's lynch on someone who does not want to play the game, and had rather the mod deal with it, either by urging mudkips to start playing, by replacing, or by outright removing from the game.
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I'd rather not waste the town's lynch on someone who does not want to play the game, and had rather the mod deal with it, either by urging mudkips to start playing, by replacing, or by outright removing from the game.
Isn't that a little overboard? He has been playing a confusing game, but nothing warrants that sort of reaction. Trying a little too hard to build your pro-town image at the expense of a derpy player?
#UNVOTE
#VOTE Bardiche
@huhwhat: semi-trolling, semi-serious, I meant what i said, Nobody really stood out for me at that point of the game (except Kips), and knowing Pesco is an experienced player, have had the time to read the thread yet chose to not contribute made me question his position.
And he failed to help me topup my net account when I was capped last night, so he must die, I alone am the best. (j/k)
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Who says I'm not playing? I'm clearly posting and I've clearly had an effect on the game. I do believe that is playing bard.
And a side note: You've voted about half the people in this topic at least once. I've only voted you, maybe one other. And I'M the wishywashy one?
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Also yes, There is no way to prove bard as scum, excuuuuuuuse me for trusting me gut, whom I've "known" for 14 damned years of my life over someone I didn't even know for a month. And my gut is rarely wrong.
Now tell me, You go from thinking i'm anti-town, to being too derp to be anti-town. Why's that? And another thing, how are you supposed to prove me as scum? Derpy playing isnt how to tell scum. In fact, you cant tell scum. Do remember, Anyone can be scum. I, a derpster could be scum. Bard, the guy who thinks could be scum. Schezo the lurker could be scum. There's never a single damned way to tell whos scum and who isnt unless theres a cop/investigator. And I'm pretty sure there isnt.
So now tell me: What's keeping you from making up your mind? You vote for me, then someone helping me. Why not just vote me instead?
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No, I'm not saying anything like that. Read again.
The thing that bugs me most is the line
The way the convo is going, everyone, including scum, can just criticize ilmk whlie flying under the radar themselves.
Guess what you were doing about your stance on mudkips? Passing crits and passing it off as contribution. Easily forgettable and doesn't tie yourself too strongly to what happens to him.
Since you believe scum are getting him lynched, I'd like to believe scum aren't bussing one of their own. Why should scum be forced to sacrifice one of their players when there is no damning evidence? We don't have any hindsights at the moment, so I'm feeling your draw-to-attention of scum flying under the radar is fearmongering.
Who says I'm not playing? I'm clearly posting and I've clearly had an effect on the game. I do believe that is playing bard.
And a side note: You've voted about half the people in this topic at least once. I've only voted you, maybe one other. And I'M the wishywashy one?
Bard has suddenly died and is no longer in the game! His body was taken away before we can get a flip. Who is scum now?
And he failed to help me topup my net account when I was capped last night, so he must die, I alone am the best. (j/k)
Get a better ISP that doesn't have its site go offline :V
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Also yes, There is no way to prove bard as scum, excuuuuuuuse me for trusting me gut, whom I've "known" for 14 damned years of my life over someone I didn't even know for a month. And my gut is rarely wrong.
Now tell me, You go from thinking i'm anti-town, to being too derp to be anti-town. Why's that? And another thing, how are you supposed to prove me as scum? Derpy playing isnt how to tell scum. In fact, you cant tell scum. Do remember, Anyone can be scum. I, a derpster could be scum. Bard, the guy who thinks could be scum. Schezo the lurker could be scum. There's never a single damned way to tell whos scum and who isnt unless theres a cop/investigator. And I'm pretty sure there isnt.
So now tell me: What's keeping you from making up your mind? You vote for me, then someone helping me. Why not just vote me instead?
I've known my gut for a presumably equal amount of time and it has never gotten me anywhere in mafia ever.
That said, the return to fence-sitting is not helping your case. It doesn't matter who could be scum, what matters is who is scum, and also pressing them and getting them lynched. I really cannot believe that you expect a definite case on you on D1 of all things.
Also, why are you so sure there's no cop? That seems a bit iffy to me. <_< If there's information you know about the set-up, then withholding it from the town isn't exactly going to help us.
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No matter what the setup, if it's not an open one, never rely on there being any role.
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I'm not? I'm just saying, if kips knows something about the set-up, it's only natural he should share it with the town (especially because it seems like he might end up silenced forever at this rate).
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If I knew about the setup I would obviously not hint at it, as it would make me even MORE scummy. I'm all about "what could happen" in mafia, or "what is possible".
Anyways, Yeah, I'm probably going to die, and the only thing important of me is that i'm nilla. I'm pretty sure I claimed before as well, though I know this wont net me a clear. The only thing I know right now about town is sect cant cook bear asses for shit.
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Uhhh, Pesco?
Did you just answer for kips, providing him with an out? Like what Conqueror did? Isn't that one of the reasons you kept your vote on him?
I really don't like this, not one bit. It seems pretty contradictory to me. :/
Why did you just defy your own logic?
*Warning, kips reply
Welp. My point still stands.
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Vote Count- The One Where Shut up I can edit because I'm a mod
Iliekmudkips- Schezo, Zakeri, Conqueror, reVelske, Bardiche, Huhwhat, H.Hourai, Kitten4U, Sect
Conqueror- Bardiche, Pesco, Huhwhat, Zakeri
Bardiche- Conqueror, Sect, Iliekmudkips, Zakeri, reVelske
reVelske]- Zakeri, Bardiche
H.Hourai- Golden PX
Huh what- Hanged Hourai
Kitten4u- Pesco
Pesco- reVelske
Zakeri- Bardiche
There are 48 hours left in Day 1. iliekmudkips is at L-3. Sect's vote will be removed until he is replaced. Complaints will be met with meteors bearing down on your house.
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I dunno. I think I made a step to deterring a pointless setup speculation debate.
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Actually I WILL complain because as far as the players are concerned, sect will just be lurking until he gets replaced.
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When did Zakeri unvote?
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HW: #98
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kips provides nothing to help town, and is pretty much acting anti-town. Announcing intention to hammer him, but we have 2 days left to sling mud at each other.
Also, if you don't want to get lynched, then try to convince people to get off you instead of just waiting for them to.
Meanwhile...
##Vote: Hourai
So far you've been from trying to get kips to do something, saying you were keeping your vote open while talking only to kips, then giving up on him and planting him to L-2. And everything else I see as passive play, not actively scumhunting.
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Ignoring the fact that it's impossible to hammer him at this point, I... really think doing so this early would be a horrible idea. <_< We haven't even heard very much from a lot of people, and Sect still has yet to be replaced.
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Oh Sect left so that leaves him at L-3... Oh well, if the end of the first day rush piles on kips, I'm jumping on.
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Hmm... Well, I might;'va been wrong.
##:Unvote
Though I feel like I'm making the wrong decision by unvoting, I feel even worse for the latter thing.
##:Hanged Hourai
It makes sense but it doesnt make sense. I still suspect Bard due to my gut, But Hourai seems the most helpful. Now, I'm either making a grave mistake or a good one. Hourai's been trying to help me the whole damned game, And I dont know if its outta the kindness of his heart, but helping me seems kinda stupid on his end. I guess its because i'm rusty and he could gain my trust, therefore cause me to take part in some sorta evil world domination plot. Right now he's either the most scummy outta us all, or the most helpful outta us all. And I cant really figure out which one to choose.
And do remember, I'm only voting hourai for helping me. It sounds idiotic but nothing is true in mafia, correct?
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what
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mudkips is wrathie :ohdear:
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No, seriously, kips, I really have no idea what you're trying to get across. <_<
What's scummy about him helping you again? Others have been giving advice to newbies as well. I'm not sure why Hourai is special.
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mudkips is wrathie :ohdear:
Gah I dont know what to do anymore >.>
Also you still need to make me that yuuka yukurri. >.>
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No I don't. I should pull out my vig on you.
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No, seriously, kips, I really have no idea what you're trying to get across. <_<
What's scummy about him helping you again? Others have been giving advice to newbies as well. I'm not sure why Hourai is special.
Well, what are the odds of joining a mafia game, declaring you are somewhat newbish, and someone helping you? I could understand better if it were in PM's or such giving tips.
Really I dont know what to do anymore. And plus its fucking 3:AM.
##:Unvote
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I'd say fairly well considering this is Hourai's second game
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Also, on the topic of wrathie, does anyone have links to some of his posts? I feel like seeing how bad he is.
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I would actually support a kips vig, if only because it would likely lead to a more productive lynch today (we'd be able to look into his flip right now) and his play is giving everyone a headache. Possibly a bit of a harsh move to pull on a newbie, but I honestly think it would clear things up a lot.
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I would actually support a kips vig, if only because it would likely lead to a more productive lynch today (we'd be able to look into his flip right now) and his play is giving everyone a headache. Possibly a bit of a harsh move to pull on a newbie, but I honestly think it would clear things up a lot.
Meh, i'm fine with it. I've always sucked at mafia anyways.
Note to self: Dont attempt to be a wiseass. >.>
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Start posting sense then.
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So far you've been from trying to get kips to do something, saying you were keeping your vote open while talking only to kips, then giving up on him and planting him to L-2. And everything else I see as passive play, not actively scumhunting.
Yes, I was trying to keep an open mind. Then he went and gave his final, unchanging gut vote. That kind of stuff changes opinions.
5 new replies
wtf
I....
2 new reples
wtf
And kips, talking about the game outside the thread is forbidden unless you are specifically allowed to.
Pesco claiming vig?
2 new reples
If there is anything wrong on instructing people on the basics of basics, please tell me.
1 new reply
Yeah, a vig kill would help clear up a lot of confusion and let us get on with the game.
1 new reply
Note to self: Dont attempt to be a wiseass. >.>
That logic is sorta true for everything in life.
1 new reply
aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa :getdown:
So. Many. Posts.
Gonna post this before i get ninja'd once more.
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Start posting sense then.
At 3:AM? I can barely post sense past noon. Besides I'll prolly be dead by the time I wake up.
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Don't worry, nobody should be stupid enough to somehow get 3 people to ninja hammer you in a span of a few hours when we have 2 days left.
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##VOTE: PESCO
YOU! You got the face of someone who's ready to be lynched on day one! Submit to your fate!
But his face always looks like that.
not a big fan of Pesco's lack of activity and his half-ass attack on Conqueror, and GUT FEELING FUCK YEAH, so free vote for him.
...But his face always looks like that. :v
Conqueror isn't on my hatelist because I've signed him off as derptown.
Except he is neither derp, nor town.
I started disliking Zakeri around the time he began defending Kips by reporting, then clearing him based on non-descript conditions for "derptown VS derpscum". Also not fond of him saying "There's no reason to convince us Bard is scum" due to buddying up to me, and I don't like that.
Whoo, you clearly did not read my post. I was responding to Kitten4u, if that helps your reread.
Cat said "The difference she's noticed between derptown and derpscum, is that derptown is more likely to have convictions about a single person." Cat then went on to vote Kips for not having any convictions. I then went and pointed out all of the posts where Kips had shown evidence that he had strong convictions. This is what people call a "contradiction." The point of the post was that by her own analysis of derptown vs/ derpscum, she should have read Kips to be town, but instead ignored all of Kips posts, and focused only on what you accused Kips of doing.
Also, Buddying? Really? You're going to try and call me out on the fact that I claimed there was no legitimate case to be made on you? I suppose you also missed when your BFF Conq (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php?topic=8444.msg552607#msg552607) said the same thing in his IIoA against Kips?
I'd rather not waste the town's lynch on someone who does not want to play the game, and had rather the mod deal with it, either by urging mudkips to start playing, by replacing, or by outright removing from the game.
I, wait-what? You want to lynch me instead because kips can't hunt scum? He's not going to get modkilled or replaced you know. He may have the problem of putting his emotional baggage on display in a game where you need to conceal your reactions and feelings, but I doubt he's going to just drop out of the game. That's just his way of dealing with the pressure of being at L-1 within 24 hours of the game. This looks to me like a half-assed excuse for switching your vote from someone who can't hunt scum to someone who can. This entire post has launched you up my lynch rankings to second place. Even higher than my initial suspicions of K4u.
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So anyways, this game is such a headache to read.
Hourai: Ok so reading you I'm getting a strange feeling with your association with kips. You were helping him earlier in the game, and finally decide to vote him, but your post doesn't have much conviction (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php?topic=8444.msg552530#msg552530). Almost as if you wanted to help him but decided to pull out and slap a vote on him, least you start looking suspicious. You replied plenty of times to kips and finally decided to put your vote on him, but the reasons of your vote don't seem to point to him being scum, It feels like something else.
Kips: Is just a torrent of confusion that I would be willing to jump on at the end of the day.
Bard: I would like to know why Conqueror just got a clear from you.
Conqueror: Seems to be very dodgy in his first few posts. He has been passive-aggressive the whole time and tried to write some of the things he did off as contributing when he really didn't. After his big IIoA (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php?topic=8444.msg552607#msg552607) I find it hard to believe he didn't have an opinion on anyone else at the time after laying out all that information, which he confirmed later. (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php?topic=8444.msg552634#msg552634) That, and his actions just seem off because they aren't particularly attention grabbing but they aren't completely in the right either.
##Unvote:
##Vote: Conqueror
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I reread the thread and promptly forgot what I was going to post.
mudkips is still wrathie (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php?topic=7.0). It's a lot of derp but as long as he's not alive at LyLo, town's got this. Basically he'll screw up on his own if he's scum.
Conq putting the L-2 on mudkips feels pretty wrong. The post (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php?topic=8444.msg552607#msg552607) words it like a pressure vote and if we go by intentions, it's a weak one IMO. I get the feeling of throwaway vote from it. Compared to Kitten's L-1, she's given her reasons for the vote and I reckon as long as it wasn't the hammer, she'd vote mudkips no matter how many he had on him already.
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@Pesco I am about to make a longer post after this, but before that, perhaps the post you were about to make but forgot about was on this topic:
No I don't. I should pull out my vig on you.
Is this some sort of joke?
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I reread the thread and promptly forgot what I was going to post.
mudkips is still wrathie (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php?topic=7.0). It's a lot of derp but as long as he's not alive at LyLo, town's got this. Basically he'll screw up on his own if he's scum.
Conq putting the L-2 on mudkips feels pretty wrong. The post (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php?topic=8444.msg552607#msg552607) words it like a pressure vote and if we go by intentions, it's a weak one IMO. I get the feeling of throwaway vote from it. Compared to Kitten's L-1, she's given her reasons for the vote and I reckon as long as it wasn't the hammer, she'd vote mudkips no matter how many he had on him already.
Actually I'm always derpy on day one. Because theres no one to really vote or anything.
Also how the fuck arent I dead yet wat.
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@ Schezo: Previously, you had your vote on kips because of kips' wishywashiness. What changed between then and your most recent post that made him seem okay? You never mentioned anything that indicated you find Conqueror worse than him, so the complete switch of attitude regarding kips feels a little bit jarring.
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Is this some sort of joke?
Wanna rolefish?
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I didn't clear kips or anything if that's what you're thinking, he's still my 2. I don't know why you say I find him ok. Because he doesn't have my vote when I find another more scummy? I just found what Conqueror did a lot more alarming than what kips has been doing and he seems a lot more scummy to me right now to make me put my vote there.
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Alright, noted. It's just that your post gave me the impression you were giving him a pass for being a "torrent of confusion".
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Wanna rolefish?
Wanna answer Hourai's question? (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php?topic=8444.msg552935#msg552935)
Seriously, I don't know what kind of game you're trying to play. Threatening Kips with a joke in poor taste? Or are you making some sort of insinuation? What the hell is going on here?
Also, massive wall of text in process of being typed up, please wait warmly.
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Hourai: Ok so reading you I'm getting a strange feeling with your association with kips. You were helping him earlier in the game, and finally decide to vote him, but your post doesn't have much conviction (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php?topic=8444.msg552530#msg552530). Almost as if you wanted to help him but decided to pull out and slap a vote on him, least you start looking suspicious. You replied plenty of times to kips and finally decided to put your vote on him, but the reasons of your vote don't seem to point to him being scum, It feels like something else.
Guys. Really? I'll say it again. I was helping a newb with the basics of the game. If you see fit to kill me over that, then fine.
As for the feeling you're getting, I don't know. I suppose I pity him and can sympathize about being a newb in a scary game of mafia, but that does not change certain actions of his.
But giving a final, unchanging gut vote is something I am not a fan of at all. And unvoting while channeling wrathie's spirit does not make me like him any more.
But for right now,
##Unvote
I am in no way clearing kips and I am hoping for a vig kill on him soon. If that doesn't occur, then I am indeed open to the idea of lynching him at the end of the day.
As of right now, I want to see Conqueror's text wall before I say anything else.
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So wait, you go from helping me and defending me to being ready for me to be killed at the end of today JUST because it might make you seem scummy?
Seems a bit more scummy to me.
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Actually I'm always derpy on day one. Because theres no one to really vote or anything.
Also how the fuck arent I dead yet wat.
Because people have dismissed you as derptown based on this post (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php?topic=8444.msg552914#msg552914)and others. Regardless of whether you are scum or town, your play is generally anti-town because it is confusing and no one knows what to think of it. In any case, you could stop talking about how you're going to get lynched and start talking about why other people should be lynched instead.
Since you believe scum are getting him lynched, I'd like to believe scum aren't bussing one of their own. Why should scum be forced to sacrifice one of their players when there is no damning evidence? We don't have any hindsights at the moment, so I'm feeling your draw-to-attention of scum flying under the radar is fearmongering.
commenting on my quote:
The way the convo is going, everyone, including scum, can just criticize ilmk whlie flying under the radar themselves.
I said nothing of the sort. I said that given the ridiculous amount of attention on kips, anyone could just fly by criticizing kips without contributing much else. Said people could be scum or town. What I was suggesting was that people start looking at other votes besides just kips. Anyway, this seems to have already happened organically.
Guess what you were doing about your stance on mudkips? Passing crits and passing it off as contribution. Easily forgettable and doesn't tie yourself too strongly to what happens to him.
Let's take a look at Pesco's contributions so far.
#26 (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php?topic=8444.msg551965#msg551965): Joke vote.
#58 (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php?topic=8444.msg552423#msg552423): One liner questioning me on answering for kips.
#61 (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php?topic=8444.msg552450#msg552450): Throwaway comment.
#80 (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php?topic=8444.msg552543#msg552543): Repeats his point about me answering for Kips.
#84 (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php?topic=8444.msg552554#msg552554): Tells Kips to hang in there.
#87 (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php?topic=8444.msg552566#msg552566): "Sounds like you already clearing mudkips as town." Even though I was doing nothing of the sort.
#122 (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php?topic=8444.msg552859#msg552859): Pesco's first substantial post, where he again trots out the line where I said "The way the convo is going, everyone, including scum, can just criticize ilmk whlie flying under the radar themselves." It's a fair point which I have responded to above. The rest of the post consists of a prod at Kips and a throwaway comment aimed at reVelske.
#124 (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php?topic=8444.msg552863#msg552863): Answers huh what's query to Kips on roles, by stating the completely obvious. "No matter what the setup, if it's not an open one, never rely on there being any role." I'm pretty sure huh what knows this. What was the point of this post? Why did you answer for Kips?
#129 (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php?topic=8444.msg552897#msg552897): "I dunno. I think I made a step to deterring a pointless setup speculation debate." Except there was no speculation debate. There was a question aimed specifically at another user and for some reason you stepped in. You know, sort of like what you kept prodding me on.
#130 (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php?topic=8444.msg552898#msg552898): Complains about Sect being replaced.
#138 (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php?topic=8444.msg552917#msg552917): "mudkips is wrathie "
#141 (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php?topic=8444.msg552920#msg552920): "No I don't. I should pull out my vig on you." Either a joke in poor taste, or some sort of massive mindscrew I don't even know what. Is there something you're trying to imply here? Or were you just being crass to the newbie?
#147 (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php?topic=8444.msg552934#msg552934): Another one liner aimed at Kips. "Start posting sense then."
#153 (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php?topic=8444.msg553225#msg553225): Pesco's second "content" post. "Conq putting the L-2 on mudkips feels pretty wrong. The post words it like a pressure vote and if we go by intentions, it's a weak one IMO. I get the feeling of throwaway vote from it. Compared to Kitten's L-1, she's given her reasons for the vote and I reckon as long as it wasn't the hammer, she'd vote mudkips no matter how many he had on him already." --> I'm a cautious person by nature and I don't like going closer to the edge than is necessary. As I have stated before, I was not going to be one of the last two votes on a derp wagon where there were other people to be questioned, etc. In any case, this is a pretty weak post, IMO. Compare this to the votes on me from huh what (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php?topic=8444.msg552576#msg552576) and Zakeri (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php?topic=8444.msg552755#msg552755), which were both more substantial than yours. What's more, Zakeri and huh what have scum hunted around other people besides me and Kips. You have not.
#157 (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php?topic=8444.msg553399#msg553399): Avoids the question, accuses me of rolefishing.
I know you're an experienced player, Pesco, but so far your contributions have been seriously lacking. Your attempts at scum hunting have consisted of half-assed questions aimed at Kips and, in my case, "passing crits and passing it off as contribution."
Are you just being lazy, or is something else up?
Also, do answer Hourai's question.
##Unvote
##Vote:Pesco
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Best way to answer such a question is with results.
Wall of linked posts, so what? All you've done is tried to buff up an OMGUS.
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@ Conqueror: I seriously cannot draw any conclusion from that wall of links. It's pretty much more IIoA and if the links are meant as examples then they aren't really working, because I do not understand what you are trying to get across about Pesco. I'm not even sure how any of your complaints about him make him scum, because you didn't explain how his actions are actually scummy. It's just a bunch of reportering.
Personally, I've found Pesco's contributions to be fairly substantial, though it would be nice if he could talk about somebody other than Conqueror and kips.
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Kitten is lurkscum and my proxy for the bofh policy lynch at 3P-Lylo :V
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So wait, you go from helping me and defending me to being ready for me to be killed at the end of today JUST because it might make you seem scummy?
Defending you? I have not told anyone else to not vote you or anything along those lines.
And I was ready for you to be killed when I first voted you.
*Conqueror Wall o' Text *
...So it's basically an OMGUS vote restating everything we've seen with some of your opinions? I'm not feeling it.
And why do you keep saying it's my question when you're the one who's been pursuing it more than me? Gives off the feeling that you want to know, but don't want to seem responsible for being the one having the person claim.
And on a reread, most of your game has been defense and minimal scumhunting. I don't like it and I get a scum feeling from it.
##Vote: Conqueror
3 replies
Yous guys be ninjas.
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Best way to answer such a question is with results.
Okay? ??
Wall of linked posts, so what? All you've done is tried to buff up an OMGUS.
Nice, but I don't really care that you're voting for me. What I do care about is that you. an experienced player, are calling me out on not scumhunting properly when your scumhunting has been rather light. I'm also looking at several other players but they're more mixed bags, so making an opinion on them takes longer.
@ Conqueror: I seriously cannot draw any conclusion from that wall of links. It's pretty much more IIoA and if the links are meant as examples then they aren't really working, because I do not understand what you are trying to get across about Pesco. I'm not even sure how any of your complaints about him make him scum, because you didn't explain how his actions are actually scummy. It's just a bunch of reportering.
What would you have me say then? That I think Pesco is scummy because of such and such conjecture or because I have a GUT FEELING? I gave my opinions in the post above. What kind of convoluted stuff do I have to say for it not to be classified as IIoA or reportering?
Personally, I've found Pesco's contributions to be fairly substantial, though it would be nice if he could talk about somebody other than Conqueror and kips.
The problem is that he hasn't talked about any other people, and for the two people he has talked about, his contributions are hardly pioneering nor especially probing. He doesn't really give any strong opinions, preferring to question others without passing some sort of judgement, save for his vote on me. His post at #153 where he "analyzes" me barely makes sense. Also, it would be nice if he didn't just off-handedly classify my post as OMGUS without responding to any of the few points that I tried to make in that post. I want substantial posts like the one huh what just posted, not one-liners.
Yes, I am probably guilty of the same thing that I am accusing Pesco of. But Pesco is not a relative newbie to the game, Compare his contributions to those of any of the other "regulars." Why does he get a pass?
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Vote Count- The Spiritual Descendant of Wrathie Is Revealed (and then mass unvoted)
Conqueror- Bardiche, Pesco, Huhwhat, Zakeri, Schezo, H.Hourai
Iliekmudkips- Schezo, Zakeri, Conqueror, reVelske, Bardiche, Huhwhat, H.Hourai, Kitten4U, Sect
Bardiche- Conqueror, Sect, Iliekmudkips, Zakeri, reVelske
Pesco- reVelske, Conqueror
Zakeri- Bardiche
H.Hourai- Golden PX, iliekmudkips
Huh what- Hanged Hourai
Kitten4u- Pesco
reVelske]- Zakeri, Bardiche
There are 29 hours left in Day 1. Conqueror is at L-2.
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Still dunno who wrathie is.
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From what I gather, he is a notorious player from before your time (and also from before mine).
Pesco linked to a game he was in.
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Tired. Sorry if this is incoherent.
Kitten is lurkscum and my proxy for the bofh policy lynch at 3P-Lylo
B-but. :( You can hardly blame me for wanting to lurk/play DotS in this game.
:wikipedia:
Um...I suppose it's nice that he passes your conviction test? He does not pass mine. Tunneling relentlessly on someone for no apparent reason is not conviction. Voting for reasons that look more like what he should do if it was the end of the day and the two main wagons were him and Bardiche is not conviction. (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,8444.msg552238.html#msg552238) This is not conviction. (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php?topic=8444.msg552288#msg552288) This is not conviction. (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php?topic=8444.msg552372#msg552372) This is not conviction. (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php?topic=8444.msg552386#msg552386) Do I really need to go on? I have no reason to believe that he really thinks Bard is scum. It all feels very fake to me.
I'm very disappointed that the wagon on him has completely dissolved even though he hasn't really done anything to redeem himself. There has only been flailing. He has spent the whole game being more concerned about looking scummy rather than finding scum. He has spent the whole game telling people to get off his wagon without presenting a decent alternative, or even trying to look for scum. The closest was the thing with Bard, but even that looks horribly fake (just look at how he words his arguments) and Hourai (for helping...and the vote was the wishy-washiest thing ever, so this vote also looks fake). The fact that his wagon dissolved in an instant and a lot of people are cheerleading it anyway is making me feel a lot more confident about his alignment as well. It is nice to see that it looks like he is at least willing to try again though. Please read through the game again with this in mind: there are (generally) two factions in a game of Mafia: the town and the mafia. The town wants to find the mafia and get them lynched. The mafia wants to get any townie lynched and they want to avoid getting them and their buddies lynched. Look through peoples' posts and try to figure out why they said the things they said. Mafia is not a random game of probability, it's a game of psychology and reading. Start playing it. This is why I said you gave up before. It doesn't matter if you keep posting if you stop thinking.
Everyone else: can you explain why Kips isn't scum? I understand that his play has been...rather odd to put it mildly, but I feel like all of you are dismissing him as too scummy to be scum.
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Conqueror's recent posts have been unimpressive. The overly wordy OMGUS case is pretty bad. Rolefishing is also bad. I'm not understanding his case as I've been fine with Pesco's content so far. Willing to vote for him.
Hourai's unvote of Kips is bothering me. Not just because I think Kips is extremely likely to be scum, but because it was done for no apparent reason, there was no revote, and the timing of it is a little strange (Kips wagon almost gone, Conqueror wagon taking off). I was happy with is content before then (well, the rolefish is questionable), so I'm not really getting this. Not willing to lynch him right now, but that post bothers me a lot.
That, and his actions just seem off because they aren't particularly attention grabbing but they aren't completely in the right either.
I don't understand what you mean by this. Can you elaborate?
I feel like I'm forgetting something, but I can't remember what it is. I'll skim the thread again to see if I can remember.
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Hourai's unvote of Kips is bothering me. Not just because I think Kips is extremely likely to be scum, but because it was done for no apparent reason, there was no revote, and the timing of it is a little strange (Kips wagon almost gone, Conqueror wagon taking off). I was happy with is content before then (well, the rolefish is questionable), so I'm not really getting this. Not willing to lynch him right now, but that post bothers me a lot.
I still want him dead. I'm hoping that a vig will do the job and we can focus on others, but if that doesn't happen, then I am very open to lynching kips.
And Conqueror moved up my scumlist with his flimsy rolefish. And then when Pesco called him out on it, he promptly started saying Pesco was ignoring me, conveniently forgetting that he was the one to bring it up.
And before someone says, "But you were the first one to bring it up! bluh bluh bluh"
It wasn't a serious question. I was going wtf? from kips's wishywashy voting and unvoting. Everything was headacheingly going too fast.
So yes, I changed votes because someone got scummier to me. I didn't immediately revote after unvoting because I was specifically waiting for a good explanation from Conqueror, which I didn't get. The timing was coincidence TBH.
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Um, excuse me?
How does someone become more scummy then I am in your eyes? According to you all, All I've posted is senseless dribble that makes me seem guilty of everything, yet somehow someone whos only posted a few times is more scummy then me? And what about YOU? "Oh durr i'm fine with kips dieing durr". (dies next night) "OHEY LETS LYNCH HOURAI."
I thought you were pro, bro/sis.
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Who was that aimed towards, kips? I really can't tell.
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Was aimed towards hourai.
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Aw shit, what I meant to say was:
"It was aimed towards hourai.
I'm also pretty fucking tired right now, so I might go to sleep soon".
Apparently the post cut off for whatever reason. The sites being a dick to me.
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Hourai isn't really pro. This is his second game, I believe.
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RE:K4u
Yes, There are a hundred textbook reasons for why everyone should vote for Kips, but the thing is here, because there are so many textbook reasons compared to actual reasons, The case on Kips can very easily be faked. Even those who are scum can jump on it with little to no consequence provided they give a large enough portion of reasons.
The Conqueror case however, is pretty much exactly the same as the case on Kips. Lack of Conviction, standing by the sidelines and cheering on their favorite lynch, voting and unvoting when provoked by other townies. The only difference however is that Conqueror is staying in the shadows trying to be ignored, while Kips is in the foreground, trying to be heard and understood even though he has no idea how to get people to understand him. This is primarily why I'm being so warey of K4u.
more importantly, I would much, much prefer a Conqueror lynch over a Kips lynch because of the information inherit in those lynches. With Conqueror's flip, I can use that to determine Bard's alignment by a lot, Hourai's alignment by a bunch, and K4u's alignment by a little, etc. etc. Meanwhile, with Kips' flip, all I'll learn about the interactions that happened on day one will come from whoever gets nightkilled.
Of course I don't want someone as emotionally charged as Kips having having a vote in Lylo, but I also don't want there to be a lynch based seemingly solely on the emotional charge he's giving to other people as a result.
Um, excuse me?
How does someone become more scummy then I am in your eyes? According to you all, All I've posted is senseless dribble that makes me seem guilty of everything, yet somehow someone whos only posted a few times is more scummy then me?
Critical thinking is the key to success.
Open-mindedness is one of the key values of Critical thinking.
The ability for people to change their mind is a gift. One that can be used to help us lynch scum instead of forcing us to lynch the first person that says something we don't like.
Please tell me if knowing this fact helps you understand. You don't have to punish people for not having lynched you despite being voted to L-1.
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This is a polite request: Mudkips kindly vote yourself and leave your vote there if you insist on being a useless piece of shit.
@Kitten: As much as we want mudkips dead, even if we lynch him today I don't see him being worth much even as an info-lynch. It's too easy to say that he's being a derp and deserved the lynch. What good wagon analysis can we get out of it?
@Conq: Experience levels mean absolutely nothing on the value of post volume or content. Bard, rev, Zak and Kitten are pretty well experienced, while Hourai is pretty inexperienced. As long as someone is posting enough sensible stuff that people don't see a reason to vote them, you're pushing a weak case.
And because your case is weak, I regard it as OMGUS. If I didn't start the pressure on you, you were likely going to coast all day without committing to a harder stance than off-hand comments. Prior to HW's callout (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php?topic=8444.msg552564#msg552564) you weren't voting anyone when (I believe) there should be no reason to have not put your vote down after unvoting Bard. Why I find this relevant is because you only came up with the promise of a larger post when PX asked (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php?topic=8444.msg552555#msg552555). Townies should be doing that without needing people to tell them to. The post where you voted mudkips is terrible. I've said it before so let me put some more into it. You voted BEFORE giving your supposed analysis. It makes your vote weak because you've assumed scum before finding evidence. It's a poor choice of words for me to say mudkips was the easy wagon, but that's how it looks to me. Scum don't scumhunt because they aren't out to get themselves lynched. The parked vote before analysis shows the lack of serious scumhunting.
There's just honestly nothing of note to really say on the other people. At most I can only say Schezo and PX aren't very memorable and rev is a jerk should post more himself instead of being a hypocrit.
Cut by Zak channeling Pesco :V
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@Pesco. Alright, fair enough, that makes sense.
Anyway, quickly looking over my last posts it looks Iike I shot myself in the foot rather thoroughly multiple times. :colonveeplusalpha:
Anyway I'll just leave a last few comments.
I find it hilarious that Bard quickly signs me off as derptown. I'm not sure whether I should be insulted or suspicious of this.
Eh I forgot what else I was going to say. I'll post it later when I get back.
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This is a polite request: Mudkips kindly vote yourself and leave your vote there if you insist on being a useless piece of shit.
Sadly I'm helping more then you can fathom. You'll see most likely when I eventually die.
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Sadly I'm helping more then you can fathom. You'll see most likely when I eventually die.
Please elaborate on what you've done so far other than create mass confusion.
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If I did say it'd ruin everything. You'll just have to wait and watch for it.
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I, wait-what? You want to lynch me instead because kips can't hunt scum?
No, because mudkips is incorrigible in his bad behaviour, whereas one could expect better from you. Fine, so you were responding to Kitten4u by telling her she was wrong and should've interpreted actions differently, and by that interpretation of yours would have to vote elsewhere. So far Mudkips' conviction has been to do absolutely nothing in the face of impending doom except by saying "I'll die anyway =/" and "my gut tells me something, trust me" (both times paraphrased, but the basic messages boil down to it)
How does this exactly improve your standing? It doesn't. It just makes you look worse, and twisting my allegations against you as "voting someone who can scumhunt" is a silly contortion.
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Well, the day is ending in a few hours, and I do not want a Day 1 no lynch again. And Hourai isn't going to die anytime soon.
##Unvote; Hourai
I'm still up for some open discussion, but the evidence for Conq's lynch makes sense with me
*senseless bandwagon jump*
##Vote: Conquerer
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Okay, I am not touching anything Kips has said so far, because I'm 90% certain anything more said about Kips will result in giving scum a bastard mod flavored advantage (not that I'm not certain Kips isn't already handing it out himself.)
Fine, so you were responding to Kitten4u by telling her she was wrong and should've interpreted actions differently, and by that interpretation of yours would have to vote elsewhere.
Okay, so now that you've conceded this point, what exactly does the rest of your case on me amount to?
..."voting someone who can scumhunt" is a silly contortion.
It's not a silly contortion. I'll admit, it is a slight contortion, but it's a rather logical assumption for a good little paranoid townie to make. Your case on me as far as I can understand it is because I was the first person to bluntly state my refusal to believe Kips was given a scum role just because he's (by now officially) trying to get himself lynched. I don't see any natural progression between you showing dislike for my actions, and those actions being worthy of a vote. The hole opens up even further when you say in the post voting me (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,8444.msg552820.html#msg552820) that you agree that Kips isn't worth making the lynch of the day.
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Okay, I am not touching anything Kips has said so far, because I'm 90% certain anything more said about Kips will result in giving scum a bastard mod flavored advantage (not that I'm not certain Kips isn't already handing it out himself.)
I... what?
I feel like I'm locked out of the loop about something here.
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I... what?
I feel like I'm locked out of the loop about something here.
I don't know enough to claim an accurate guess, but I do know enough to actively expect the worst of the worst when it presents itself. See also: This game's designated name.
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I'm still confused, but okay.
Confusion aside, I feel like I haven't really had much to say since the first 24 hours of the day. Let's see if I can make up for that with something that has been bugging me for a while.
Is it just me or is PX taking a "sit back, do nothing, then wagon-jump" mentality? First of all, see this post (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,8444.msg552539.html#msg552539), where he unvotes without revoting while suggesting he'd be interesting in voting kips later on. It comes off as if he's leaving his vote up in the air so he can slam it on a wagon when the time comes, and his intention of hammering kips in #133 and his recent Conqueror vote support this. His only other contribution has been a shaky vote on Hourai that involves accusations of Hourai being passive and not scumhunting, when PX had barely been scumhunting himself. I really haven't felt any townie intent from PX so far, and the complete lack of stances from him about the major cases beyond "I'd be willing to jump on them" doesn't make me think any better of him. Honestly, it feels kind of like he's barely contributing anything at all and is mainly staying in the shadows while waiting for a wagon to jump on, which is rather bad.
Regardless, it's obvious PX is not getting lynched over Conqueror at this point, but I'm still finding his behavior rather irksome and it doesn't help that people seem to be forgetting he exists. Comments?
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Vote Count- That One Wagon Edition
Conqueror- Bardiche, Pesco, Huhwhat, Zakeri, Schezo, H.Hourai, Golden PX
Iliekmudkips- Schezo, Zakeri, Conqueror, reVelske, Bardiche, Huhwhat, H.Hourai, Kitten4U, Sect
Bardiche- Conqueror, Sect, Iliekmudkips, Zakeri, reVelske
Pesco- reVelske, Conqueror
Zakeri- Bardiche
H.Hourai- Golden PX, iliekmudkips
Huh what- Hanged Hourai
Kitten4u- Pesco
reVelske]- Zakeri, Bardiche
There are only 9 hours left in Day 1. Conqueror is at L-1.
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I forgot he existed as well.
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@Kitten: Umm, what I was trying to say was that he has been sitting back and hoping no one noticed him while he threw out some stuff that would clear him as town and, it feels wrong.
Now onto PX: Wow, I forgot he existed, hmm. Some of what Conqueror has done applies to him, like his staying in the dark and pretending to contribute. Also, holding that unvote up without a vote so he can hammer it down without much consequence, does look bad to me. The only thing he's really done is this post here, (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,8444.msg552381.html#msg552381) which is ok but not much with all that's been thrown out in this game.
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Vote Count- That One Wagon Edition
Conqueror- Bardiche, Pesco, Huhwhat, Zakeri, Schezo, H.Hourai, Golden PX
Iliekmudkips- Schezo, Zakeri, Conqueror, reVelske, Bardiche, Huhwhat, H.Hourai, Kitten4U, Sect
Bardiche- Conqueror, Sect, Iliekmudkips, Zakeri, reVelske
Pesco- reVelske, Conqueror
Zakeri- Bardiche
H.Hourai- Golden PX, iliekmudkips
Huh what- Hanged Hourai
Kitten4u- Pesco
reVelske]- Zakeri, Bardiche
There are only 9 hours left in Day 1. Conqueror is at L-1.
Not voting: iliekmudkips, Sect
Waiting for replacement: Sect
Just clarifying since you forgot them. ;)
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Yay, give me the hammer. >.>
##Vote:Conqueror
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kips confirmed as jester
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I can still post, right?
Judging from what kips posted earlier, yeah, I have the same suspicion. But hopefully Chaore isn't that sadistic. ARE YOU, CHAORE?
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You forgot to rule 11. :V
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I'll save that for when somebody actually flips Jester.
I really hope Pesco wasn't lying about his vig, though.
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I meant Conqueror because I think that was his bah post (?)
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I'm not dead yet, so I can still bah. Saving it for later. :V
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FINISHING MOVE- FINAL VOTE COUNT
Conqueror- Bardiche, Pesco, Huhwhat, Zakeri, Schezo, H.Hourai, Golden PX, iliekmudkips
Iliekmudkips- Schezo, Zakeri, Conqueror, reVelske, Bardiche, Huhwhat, H.Hourai, Kitten4U, Sect
Bardiche- Conqueror, Sect, Iliekmudkips, Zakeri, reVelske
Pesco- reVelske, Conqueror
Zakeri- Bardiche
H.Hourai- Golden PX, iliekmudkips
Huh what- Hanged Hourai
Kitten4u- Pesco
reVelske]- Zakeri, Bardiche
Alright. So, folks, Lets check into our rowdy band of misfits. And by that I mean lets brutally drop a safe on one of them. A heavy one. And they've chosen a target for us, too!
So lets get into Lynching mechanics and- Who am I kidding it's the exact same as every other mafia game. Conqueror, Town Useless NPC, a role that is pretty much just a vanilla town player, was chosen to die. So, Lets drop the safe and get Night 1 underway!
IT IS NOW NIGHT 1. ALL ACTIONS ARE TO BE SENT IN THE NEXT 24 HOURS TO BOTH MODERATORS IF YOU ARE ACTING. DAY 2 WILL OCCUR AFTER TIME IS EITHER UP OR ALL VIABLE PARTIES HAVE ACTED.
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Addendum: If you have a role that can act and are choosing not to act, please PM me #NOACTION.
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Well let's check in on our band of misfits and oh sweet baby huhwhat look at all the corpses what the fuck.
First off, Huhwhat, Town Jesus was killed over night something fierce. I guess he died for our sins?
Following that, Hanged Hourai, Town Bi-Polar Cop was shot to death over night as well!
If that wasn't bad enough, Sect, Town Useless NPC was modkilled for dropping out and not having anyone wanting to replace in.
Ah well. With 8 Alive, it takes 5 to lynch. The day will last 48 hours from this point on.
VOTE COUNT- THE UNEXPECTED EDITION
Golden PX- Golden PX
Everyone else isn't voting.
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Okay, so huhwut was jesus.
wat.
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this entire update
God damnit NeoSerela.
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God damnit one and all.
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What is this I don't even.
Well, good luck town.
May Suwako release her curse gods upon you, Chaore.
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GOD DAMMIT CHAORE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Weak posting with zero scumhunting. (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php?action=profile;area=showposts;u=3456) So that was why you were so forgettable.
##Vote PX
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##vote iliekmudkips
Can we lynch the Scum In Front Of Me now please? I still can't see how this guy could possibly be town.
Beyond that, I like HW's comments on PX, so I reread him. I thought his second post was really weird D1 (it's even weirder now that I notice he never answered Hourai's question (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,8444.msg552552.html#msg552552) over one of the more awkward comments). The rest of his D1 play has been unimpressive.I think HW and Pesco covered everything else.
I also forgot that Rev was playing, which is never a good sign.
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How am I scum again? Do remember, This is my first time playing mafia in a year. For all you know I'm a PR. Look at how the only people who died are normal people, aside from the one cop. So thats three normal town dead, and one town PR dead. Do you REALLY want to take that risk?
And do remember, I've always personally had trouble with day one. Before any of us should be voting, We should be thinking 100% into our actions. If you still think your vote is correct, so be it.
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Pesco's reasons for voting me can be placed onto reV as well.
Other than that, after reading and reading, I've come up with something
I can't come up with a case AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
:getdown::getdown::getdown::getdown:
Also, I'm clearing kips for reasons I'm keeping to myself
*Prepares the suicidal gun*
Well, I'd park my vote somewhere and try to get a case going, but since it's stuck to my face it'd look very weak.
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How am I scum again? Do remember, This is my first time playing mafia in a year. For all you know I'm a PR. Look at how the only people who died are normal people, aside from the one cop. So thats three normal town dead, and one town PR dead. Do you REALLY want to take that risk?
And do remember, I've always personally had trouble with day one. Before any of us should be voting, We should be thinking 100% into our actions. If you still think your vote is correct, so be it.
So fucking what?
I'll happily lynch mudkips today if that's how the majority want to go.
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How am I scum again?
I explained here (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,8444.msg553643.html#msg553643) (are you reading the game?). If that is not clear enough for you I can explain even more.
Do remember, This is my first time playing mafia in a year.
So what? This is my first time playing Mafia in six months, I have these strange issues with my brain that affect my ability to read/understand language and write/speak, gives me a constant headache (IE, I have a headache at all times as long as I am awake), makes me zone out occasionally (typically at least twice a day) and has been giving me severe memory problems. I also think I have the flu and a few other female problems that would be way TMI to go into.
I do not CARE about your excuses for not producing.
For all you know I'm a PR. Look at how the only people who died are normal people, aside from the one cop. So thats three normal town dead, and one town PR dead. Do you REALLY want to take that risk?
Short answer: Yes
Long answer: I will never know 100% that you are scum. That is not how Mafia WORKS. All I can do is look at your actions and try to determine if they are more likely to come from town or scum, and as I have stated I see no townie intent in any of your actions. Therefore I think you are scum and I want you lynched.
---
I really do wish you people (PX, Rev) would explain why you are clearing Kips. It's hugely frustrating for me to see such obvious scum walk because people aren't willing to explain why he is town. :|
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Have you ever thought that I'm doing the one thing mafia wouldn't do? Guess what that is:
Being as scummy as I am.
What mafia. In the whole damned world. Would be acting as scummy as I am? If anything its the people HELPING town/believing they are that are scummy. No mafia would outright be as scummy as me. None. Not even a mentally retarded kid. None.
So now tell me kitten. What makes me scum again?
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A scum move at L-1 with over a day left in Day 1 would obviously hammer himself to prevent town from getting information, of course :V
Otherwise, I'm speculating he has a certain role that would not help town by revealing it. If you want him dead, then you'll have to show that he's the better lynch against everyone else.
Pesco: His initial vote for Conquerer really had nothing backing it up. However, once other people put on opinions on Conq, then Pesco created a reason for his vote on him. Other than that, he really didn't talk about anyone other than Conq, and a little about kips
reV: Everything against me also goes against him. So why is he allowed to be hidden?
##Unvote
##Vote: PX
T_T Whoever immobilized me, fuck you.
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Hidden? What hidden? Game resumed whilst I was asleep.
##VOTE: Kips
Roleclaim, NOW, had enough of your god damn softclaims, was certain you'd die last night with all the fucking PR hints, but seeing that didn't happen, I'm not putting up with another day of "I COULD BE A PR, YOU KNOW!".
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Despite the number of deaths overnight, I'm taking it as a blessing in disguise because it reduces the amount of wagon analysis we have to do.
Zak, PX and mudkips are the uncleared votes on Conq from my end. I'll need to dig around for Zak's vote post but so far it's pretty clear that PX and mudkips had no business going on the wagon they held no conviction for.
Rev: more anal pls.
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Still got my eyes on you and Bard, but I'll get to you two when I'm done with Kips.
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Why so lame? We've got time now.
Zak's vote post (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,8444.msg552755.html#msg552755). Doesn't actually give a clear reason for picking Conq. A reV vote would have made more sense.
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Rev, just goes to show how much you arent in the game.
I think I've claimed before, but if it'll help, I'm a normal townie. In fact, I was kinda reaction testing when I said I could be a PR. You should read back a couple of pages, where I also claimed norm townsfolk.
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@Kips: Are you really using "Too Scummy To Be Scum" as an argument/defense? :|
@PX: Except Rev unvoted between my post and Kips' next post. So, I don't think he really got the chance? Also, no questions, observations or ANYTHING to add?
@Rev: I agree with Pesco, you need to say more stuff. You're totally allowed to question/pursue two people at once. :V Also, what happened to that D1 clear of Kips?
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@Kips: Are you really using "Too Scummy To Be Scum" as an argument/defense? :|
Actually, yes, I am. Is there a problem with that?
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Yes it means you're scum because you just claimed it.
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Clearly, Which is why I said I'm using the "Too scummy to be scum" arguement, which clearly means i'm scum. Clearly.
In case you couldnt tell, I was being sarcastic in the later half.
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No I can't tell. The only thing I can tell is that you're a retard.
I'm just channeling the frustrations of the spectators btw.
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@kips: Oh sorry dear, but with the amount of complete garbage you post, it's hard to read past the first line or take anything you say seriously.
But really? That's it? That's all you have to say about your role? Vanilla townsfolk? Let me know if there's something you wish to add to that.
In the mean time.
##vote: iliekmudkips
Nothing to add ATM (seeing I haven't had the chance for a re-read) aside from how the the choice of nightkill seems odd, both targets I can more or less understand from a vig point of view, but not from that of a scum. I don't see how a huhwhat or hourai kill would benefit the scums in any way.
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Nothing to add ATM (seeing I haven't had the chance for a re-read) aside from how the the choice of nightkill seems odd, both targets I can more or less understand from a vig point of view, but not from that of a scum. I don't see how a huhwhat or hourai kill would benefit the scums in any way.
huhwhat's kill makes sense as the scum's pick and so does hourai's if it's a team of complete noobscum. Why does it make sense as a vig kill?
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Surely you, Zakeri and Bard would be the biggest threats due to player experience? Huhwhat is experienced too from what I can see, but he lacks the aggression and conviction to truly make him problematic for the scums, he reeks of neutrality a lot of the time. But yes well, what makes sense for a noobscum team is odd otherwise. And nothing wrong with vig killing off random suspicious individuals whose death wouldn't affect the overall scumhunting ability of the town all too much.
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Oh and aren't we potentially in MYLO already assuming there are 3 scums and vig fails to get a correct nightkill again?
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Nobody voted huwhat or Hourai all of Day 1, thus there is no chance of them being suspected. huhwhat's play was enough obvtown that he gets an all-round clear. Hourai might have caught some suspicion, but also an impossible lynch.
That reminds me. Zak hasn't died within the first phase cycle, obvscum :V.
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@kips: Oh sorry dear, but with the amount of complete garbage you post, it's hard to read past the first line or take anything you say seriously.
But really? That's it? That's all you have to say about your role? Vanilla townsfolk? Let me know if there's something you wish to add to that.
In the mean time.
##vote: iliekmudkips
Nothing to add ATM (seeing I haven't had the chance for a re-read) aside from how the the choice of nightkill seems odd, both targets I can more or less understand from a vig point of view, but not from that of a scum. I don't see how a huhwhat or hourai kill would benefit the scums in any way.
Ask a simple question, get a simple answer.
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No one killed me last night because they all assumed something else would kill me.
Kitten has dropped down on my suspicions list.
Kips. "Because I am scum" is not adequate reason for people to not vote you. What would be an adequate reason would be if you told people who the scum was, besides "Not me." No one else is going to be able to provide a reason, because the cop died. I know you have trouble telling the difference between something scum would do and something town would do (as evidenced in all of your posts) but please try to at least come up with a short list of names of people who are both style alive, and shouldn't be. Make certain your name isn't on that list.
MODS: is there a statistical chance that the game could end within the next night phase? Will you announce when that chance comes up?
reVelske: I'd prefer it if you didn't wait until we clear the elephant from the room before telling us your case on Pesco and Bardiche. We lose nothing from discussing it now, but we waste time the other way around.
RE: Pesco 221, I voted Conqueror because I knew I wouldn't get anything useful from pressing reVelske on Day one. I've pretty much felt they were both as scummy as one another (positions on a bandwagon not withstanding.) Conqueror edged out later in the day as his posting increased, but content didn't.
PX: I couldn't tell from your post, but who would you be voting right now? Also, are you certain you're immobilized? Try just unvoting and see what happens. I know it's unlikely, but it would be a clever trick otherwise.
-
Holy hell. What is wrong with kips? "I'm too scummy to be scum" really? With all that and the fact that he still hasn't said anything relevant than just defending himself with crazy logic like, "oh, I messed up bad, I better play out this mess that I made." Then, why does PX just randomly clear kips for no reason? This is just so frustrating because if we end up going to LYLO with him dear god.
PX: what I guess happened is you can't change that vote? So what? Why does that stop you from putting any relevant information? After holding your vote up in the air yesterday and then still not doing anything or putting comments out about other people is why I'm so wary of you. People called you out on that on day one (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,8444.msg554169.html#msg554169) yet you haven't done anything about it or addressing it since then. However kips is still the worst thing I'm seeing right now. Also you comment about your actions applying to reV don't really stand because he's started making comments and didn't leave his vote floating around to fall on someone with little conviction.
Vote: ilikemudkips
Seriously this guy needs to go. I'm not even sure if we are at a possible lose situation if two nightkills happen again but this seems like our best option.
Edit: whoa boy getting cut 7 times is fun on a phone. I do like that point Zak made about reV not saying anything about bard and pesco. I'd like to see that too.
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##VOTE: Zakeri
Hey Zak, let's continue where we left off!
My case D1 was apparently not obvious, so let me make it obvious.
Kitten4u had an interpretation of someone's actions.
You interpreted them differently.
You stated Kitten4u had to adjust their interpretations because you had your own, which while not explicitly stated were presented as being somehow better. We all see people's actions differently, there's no reason you should tell someone they're wrong when they can have a wholly different (and in my eyes, reasonable) interpretation of actions.
It's not that I didn't want to vote Mudkips because I'd rather "vote someone who can scumhunt". I just think Kips isn't worth lynching because I assumed the mod would deal with the troll, but since they have not, our only option rests in dealing with it ourselves, it seems. I like to think problems of that scale will be resolved without handicapping town, but since we've been given this handicap, the only thing we can do is really, well, yeah, deal with it.
That you contorted my words to be "vote someone who can scumhunt in lieu of someone who can't" can very well be said it's due to "paranoid town". But it could also be deceitful scum, and my interpretation happens to view it that way.
Pray tell, why would no one kill you because "something else would kill you"?
---
As much as I want a Zakeri lynch today, I recognise the need to dispose of Kips immediately to improve the overall quality of the game, and remove the distractions he provides to the town's overall scumhunt effort. There is not a shred of townie intent oozing from them, so I see no reason to object to the lynch. Especially since it doesn't look like we have an intrepid vigilant on our side willing to exact swift judgment on our distraction.
---
PX, vote someone other than yourself. Prove you're really handicapped and it's not a "self-inflicted" handicap. Waltzing in today going "AAAAH I CAN'T COME UP WITH A CASE" and then flopping down doing absolutely nothing to even prove the vote is stuck is not going to be of help to you in the coming days, so get to it.
-
Regarding Kips, the above post implies but does not explicitly state that I will vote Kips later on to get rid of him. It is now made crystal clear.
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Also, PX? Perhaps you also want to divulge why you clear Kips. I have no idea what could move you to do that to someone so suicidal.
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Either way, Mafias most likely to kill me. If the town lynches me, then mafia has a chance to hit a better target then myself, right?
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You're at L-1. Do you honestly think you'll be NK'd?
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MODS: is there a statistical chance that the game could end within the next night phase? Will you announce when that chance comes up?
There is no chance the game will end in the next night phase. I will announce if Pseudo-Lylo occurs.
Vote Count- While I'm at it Edition
Golden PX- Golden PX, Pesco
iliekmudkips- Kitten4U, reVelske, Schezo
Zakeri- Bardiche
Not voting- Zakeri, iliekmudkips
With 8 alive, 5 votes are needed to lynch. Iliekmudkips is at L-2.The day ends in 25 hours!
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There is no chance the game will end in the next night phase. I will announce if Pseudo-Lylo occurs.
Vote Count- While I'm at it Edition
Golden PX- Golden PX, Pesco
iliekmudkips- Kitten4U, reVelske, Schezo
Zakeri- Bardiche
Not voting- Zakeri
With 8 alive, 5 votes are needed to lynch. Iliekmudkips is at L-2.The day ends in 25 hours!
Excuse me, I'm not voting yet good sir.
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##Unvote
##Vote mudkips
GTFO of the game. Forever (this extends to postgame and future games)
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No need to be so cruel about it.
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No need to play like an absolute derptard. This is just a courtesy for everyone else.
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Oh boy, I come back and kips is dead.
Well, i was thinking that he can't be jester, so either he's scum, or he's a bomb :V
Also, I have mod approval that I am unable to vote, and my vote counts on myself for the day.
And it's not Pseudo-Lylo since I have to reload after firing.
*Claiming Town Vigilante who killed Hourai last night*
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He's not dead, L1 atm. Bard miscounted.
And if it's not even MYLO, guess there's definitely a third party involved.
*still procrastinating on the thread re-read* It's 3:30AM and I really need sleep though. =_= As for Bard and Pesco, I do not have any more on them than what I had on Day One, and with and two nightkills, nothing's really changed, I could dig up some shit to add to my accusations but I highly doubt there would be anything of substance. Will set aside time for lunch time today to go through thread, but honestly, I much rather see someone hammering Kips and get things rolling, it's clear that the guy needs to die.
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I meant 2:30AM.
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Pesco: I clearly stated that I agreed with the votes on Conq. Other than that, I just wanted a lynch on Day 1. Is that really bad?
Bardiche: Has only bashed Kips while putting on a rather nice case on Zakeri. Meanwhile, you forgot this
Bard: I would like to know why Conqueror just got a clear from you.
Also, I'll have the mod prove that I can't vote
##Unvote
##Vote: Kittens4U
*Random vote that means nothing other than to prove I can't vote*
Guess we're waiting for Bardiche to hammer?
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MOD: Votecount, now
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Vote Count- Stop Voting Yourself, Stop Voting Yourself, Stop Voting Yourself edition.
Golden PX- Golden PX, Pesco
iliekmudkips- Kitten4U, reVelske, Schezo, Pesco
Zakeri- Bardiche
Not voting- Zakeri, iliekmudkips
With 8 alive, 5 votes are needed to lynch. Iliekmudkips is at L-1.The day ends in 22 hours!
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ありがとう
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##UNVOTE
##VOTE: Mudkips
And now we can go back to scumhunting.
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And that's a hammer, so please still your tongues and anger, sit back, put up a nice cup of tea and enjoy your night!
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Vote Count- IT'S SUPER EFFECTIVE Edition
Golden PX- Golden PX, Pesco
iliekmudkips- Kitten4U, reVelske, Schezo, Pesco, Bardiche
Zakeri- Bardiche
Not voting- Zakeri, iliekmudkips
Well today was quick. Let's try a bathtub this time!
...and after a quick tubbing, we've our next lynch. iliekmudkips was a Town Useless NPC, meaning he was completely and utterly useless. Well, except for getting lynched.
It is now NIGHT 2. This night will last 24 hours, send in your night actions or #NOACTION if you have the ability to.
-
Let's check back at our body pile and see how it's grown!
Over night, Bardiche, Town Musicboxman was killed by having his music box forced down his throat! Brutal!
With 6 players alive, TOWN IS NOW IN LYL- wait what the hell is that a flying car.
...uh...okay, so, another development!
Huhwhat has returned to the game as Holywhat. I guess he really was Jesus.
So with 7 players alive, It takes 4 to lynch, And town is in Pseudo lylo. As such, this day will last 72 hours.
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Ok PX: Why in the bloody hell (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,8444.msg556470.html#msg556470) would any town vig not shoot kips the first chance you got, considering his awful day one play and how he hampered us and pretty much wasted a day and lynch? That along with the stuff I said yesterday (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,8444.msg555988.html#msg555988) give me enough information to say you are scum. Then in your claim post (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,8444.msg556470.html#msg556470) if you thought he was scum or a jester why didn't you shoot him?! Both of those actions would have been protown and you obviously aren't showing any of that.
##Vote: Golden PX
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God dammit chao-holywut.
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I didn't think he was a jester. I thought he was a fucking bomb. And killing the bomb would be suicide.
Reasons for killing Hourai:
He was not seriously scumhunting at all. Thus, he looked suspicious to me. Also, killing him would force me to step up my own game since I would have started with a new slate.
Zak: I didn't kill you because I thought someone was going to kill you. Anyways, you haven't answered to Bard's case.
Hey Zak, let's continue where we left off!
My case D1 was apparently not obvious, so let me make it obvious.
Kitten4u had an interpretation of someone's actions.
You interpreted them differently.
You stated Kitten4u had to adjust their interpretations because you had your own, which while not explicitly stated were presented as being somehow better. We all see people's actions differently, there's no reason you should tell someone they're wrong when they can have a wholly different (and in my eyes, reasonable) interpretation of actions.
It's not that I didn't want to vote Mudkips because I'd rather "vote someone who can scumhunt". I just think Kips isn't worth lynching because I assumed the mod would deal with the troll, but since they have not, our only option rests in dealing with it ourselves, it seems. I like to think problems of that scale will be resolved without handicapping town, but since we've been given this handicap, the only thing we can do is really, well, yeah, deal with it.
That you contorted my words to be "vote someone who can scumhunt in lieu of someone who can't" can very well be said it's due to "paranoid town". But it could also be deceitful scum, and my interpretation happens to view it that way.
Pray tell, why would no one kill you because "something else would kill you"?
Additionally, you are the only person in this entire game who has not given a single opinion on kips.
##Vote: Zakeri
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PX: Why did you choose to kill Hourai last night?
Hey Zak, let's continue where we left off!
My case D1 was apparently not obvious, so let me make it obvious.
Kitten4u had an interpretation of someone's actions.
You interpreted them differently.
You stated Kitten4u had to adjust their interpretations because you had your own, which while not explicitly stated were presented as being somehow better. We all see people's actions differently, there's no reason you should tell someone they're wrong when they can have a wholly different (and in my eyes, reasonable) interpretation of actions.
It's not that I didn't want to vote Mudkips because I'd rather "vote someone who can scumhunt". I just think Kips isn't worth lynching because I assumed the mod would deal with the troll, but since they have not, our only option rests in dealing with it ourselves, it seems. I like to think problems of that scale will be resolved without handicapping town, but since we've been given this handicap, the only thing we can do is really, well, yeah, deal with it.
That you contorted my words to be "vote someone who can scumhunt in lieu of someone who can't" can very well be said it's due to "paranoid town". But it could also be deceitful scum, and my interpretation happens to view it that way.
Pray tell, why would no one kill you because "something else would kill you"?
Part of scumhunting is comparing interpretations of other people's with your own, and with the facts. There were no facts on day one, so I compared her interpretation with my own, and I felt hers was wrong, and should be worked upon. I was also put off by her steadfast aggression against Kips, to the point where she was asking people why he haven't lynched him yet. My interpretation also included Conqueror being scum, and other people defending Con and putting Kips as the obvious lynch over Conqueror. This was what made me suspicious of Kitten4u. I felt it was only natural to explain not only that I felt she was suspicious, but also the reason why I felt she was suspicious. In short, I was scumhunting as best I could on day one.
A Big part of scumhunting is trying to find, and point out people who are wrong in their accusations, because ultimately, that's what scum have to be if they want to win the game. It's only natural for people with different biases to argue with each other.
I'm not sure why I have to explain basic scumhunt theory to you of all people. I will admit that I was wrong about Conqueror, and that I was probably wrong about Kitten4u (Which is why I said my suspicion on her was somewhat dispelled earlier in the day). Of course, you can go ahead and throw this whole scumhunting theory right back at me, and say that since I was wrong about Conqueror that I am scum. Except you would be basically making the same mistake in voting me as I would have made if I had voted for K4u, in that it would require you to be assuming that K4u is town, and that Kips is mafia.
This is the reason why I initially made that contortion that you were voting me for scumhunting, because that's basically what I was doing. I was following the tactics explained in my theory above. the fact that that is the main reason why you are voting me put me off enough to make that comment. Yes, it was a stupid comment to make, but it was something I felt needed to be expressed.
Also, why are you adding that nightkill comment in your list of reasons? I don't know why people wouldn't kill me. That was just the silliest explanation I could think of.
fakeEdit: Cut by the entire god damn nightphase.
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alright, finally got that out.
Firstly, in response to PX's claim about me not giving an opinion of Kips, feel free to use the fact that I defended Kips against Kitten's rage post as an implication for my true feelings towards him day one and day two.
we know with the vig active, we can currently survive a total of two town deaths. Additionally, we had a town bi-polar cop, which indicates he was technically the third scum. All signs point to there being two scum.
PX has claimed Vig, claimed shooting Hourai. Most of his early game consisted of hoisting a case on Hourai when he wasn't wanting to lynch Kips. his explanation for why he didn't shoot Kips works out. So far, no huge discrepencies. I find it unlikely PX is mafia aligned what with the Mylo at +3 villagers (meaning there could be three kills before next daybreak.)
K4u: You have posted almost nothing on anyone besides Kips. Even then, the mentions you made to other people were worded as "Why are you not voting Kips" as your main reason for suspicion. The only mention of other players that had nothing to do with Kips is a single point of defense against the case of reV, and a single point of support for the case on reV, in the same post, back to back, in passing. Post 223 for the curious. Now that Kips is out of the way, who do you plan on lynching next?
reVelske: Why in the whole wide universe did you ignore everyone and waste the rest of day 2? You said you had cases on Bardiche and Pesco. I want to see both of them. Including the one on Bardiche. I don't care that he's dead and town.
Schezo: You do not even exist. All I have written down in my notes is that you jump on the Conqueror lynch day one, then jump on the Kips lynch day 2, and now you've even borrowed Pesco's entire day 2 reasoning for voting PX. You're basically second on the list for now.
##Vote: reVelske
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reVelske: Why in the whole wide universe did you ignore everyone and waste the rest of day 2? You said you had cases on Bardiche and Pesco. I want to see both of them. Including the one on Bardiche. I don't care that he's dead and town.
Ignore? I didn't, read my last post.
Has been busy with Cosmic Break tourney preparation and office work, haven't really had the time to do the planned re-read, and I would be doing it lunch time today if I didn't forget my laptop charger at home and going waste my lunch going home to fetch that brick. so, I'm sorry, you'll just have to bear with the inactivity.
Regardless, there is very little to work off, we've wasted two days being distracted by kips (whom I was banking on being killed off on N1) and almost everyone went for conqueror on D1, there's simply nothing I'm comfortable bringing up until I've done a thorough re-read.
Buuut... in the mean time...
##Vote: Zakeri
I'd like to this Bard didn't just waste his entire game mis-targeting a townie, sure, that theory failed me two games ago, buuut... *shrugs* whatever.
And how can you be so sure the bi-polar cop counts as a scum? What is a bi-polar cop anyways? Surely it could be an insane cop or a cop with paranoid gun owner role for all we know?
So what does Chaore mean by "pseudo LYLO"? And judging from Chaore's post, we would've been LYLO if Jesus did not revive (6 players), surely that means we have only 2 scums? Otherwise it would've been MYLO instead?
-
"I'd like to
this think Bard didn't..."
"surely that means we have only 2 scums and a 3rd party?"
-
It's possible that Chaore simply can't count :V
Post coming up.
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Ahh, it took me a while, but I finally found to post where you followed through with your discussion on the Pesco and Bard cases you proposed.
As for Bard and Pesco, I do not have any more on them than what I had on Day One, and with and two nightkills, nothing's really changed,
Okay, so your cases on them were exactly the same as your cases all the way back on day one. Well, let's take a look.
##UNVOTE: kips
*whistles and looks about*
##VOTE: PESCO
YOU! You got the face of someone who's ready to be lynched on day one! Submit to your fate!
Trying a little too hard to build your pro-town image at the expense of a derpy player?
#UNVOTE
#VOTE Bardiche
...
Heavy lurker. Attempts to withhold opinions on other players. Provides excuses for lack of analysis. Almost no useful opinions,
I'd like to this Bard didn't just waste his entire game mis-targeting a townie, sure, that theory failed me two games ago, buuut... *shrugs* whatever.
committing bad play while acknowledging it is bad play.
Are you honestly so useless that you have to hold onto a case that never grew past the fact that it was made in the middle of day one? What in the world is wrong with wagon analysis? We have two lynched townies, you could at least narrow the results down to "People with bad or unprovided reasoning for joining the Conq and Kips wagons." At the very least, start attempting to play the game.
If there's a third party, chances are it would be PX, and I would rather save the serial killer for a later lynch at this point. I'm sure whatever his win condition is, it can only be fulfilled by hitting a mafioso tonight.
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I didn't think he was a jester. I thought he was a fucking bomb. And killing the bomb would be suicide.
Reasons for killing Hourai:
He was not seriously scumhunting at all. Thus, he looked suspicious to me. Also, killing him would force me to step up my own game since I would have started with a new slate.
Zak: I didn't kill you because I thought someone was going to kill you. Anyways, you haven't answered to Bard's case.
Additionally, you are the only person in this entire game who has not given a single opinion on kips.
##Vote: Zakeri
I believe the trade-off of yourself dying to take out the derptard would have been perfectly acceptable seeing as you hadn't contributed much anyway.
Your reasons for killing Hourai are scummy. He was scumhunting more actively than me. And you have basically told us that you killed him so that he doesn't press a case on you. U so town :colonveeplusalpha:
Zak did present a stance on kips, That was day 1 where he said kips would suck even as the info lynch.
I'm not sure why I have to explain basic scumhunt theory to you of all people. I will admit that I was wrong about Conqueror, and that I was probably wrong about Kitten4u (Which is why I said my suspicion on her was somewhat dispelled earlier in the day). Of course, you can go ahead and throw this whole scumhunting theory right back at me, and say that since I was wrong about Conqueror that I am scum. Except you would be basically making the same mistake in voting me as I would have made if I had voted for K4u, in that it would require you to be assuming that K4u is town, and that Kips is mafia.
WaffleFOM much? I don't clear you but I find myself agreeing with your next post.
And on that, no clear for my cat either since she has yet to present a new case.
reV: I know you're experienced and surely you can do much better than that, otherwise you're clearly scum. Sucks to have your own reason turned against you doesn't it?
Schezo is pretty meh and PX is the same shit as yesterday.
If I'm reading the flavour right, I think Holywhat, as god, might be the only one that can damn Chaore and win the game for us :V. I was suspicious of him returning to the game as town, but if he does bring us out of LyLo, then at worst he's a survivor type.
Every one of you derps look like scum damnitChaore
##Vote Zak
I'm going to speculate the NK and you're going to :dealwithit:
Scum don't NK the people who are eager to lynch not-scum. Zak knows me well enough to call that I bluffed vig on Day 1.
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Vote Count- I am never wrong you jerks edition ;A;
Golden PX- Schezo
Zakeri- Pesco, reVelske, Golden PX
reVelske- Zakeri
Not Voting: Kitten4U, Holywhat.
Zakeri is at L-1. The day has 63 more hours left in it.
With 7 alive, it takes 4 to lynch.
-
Standard L-1 Procedure:
Scum as in order:
1. reVelske - Explained above.
2. Schezo - Bandwagons without prejudice, or presence
3. Kitten4u - Only one case ever, and it was on a townie
4. PX - prob, Serial Killer
5. Pesco - built and started several wagons with decent reasoning.
Role claim: Vanilla town.
May the holy grace, huh what, shine his belligerence of justice upon you all.
Kips, this is all your fault. I hope you know that.
-
There, I spent my precious office hour to re-read the thread,
I hate love hate love fuck you all.
Firstly. ##UNVOTE
Because I'm a sucker for roleclaims.
Nothing on Kitten, fuck all, she's like an Affinity all over again. Constructive but infrequent posts, but nothing that clears her and nothing that incriminates her.
---
As for Pesco...
reV: I know you're experienced and surely you can do much better than that, otherwise you're clearly scum. Sucks to have your own reason turned against you doesn't it?
You got more time than me, and besides, I'm "experienced" in playing games where a single day lasts a week or more and scums are all nubs, not this, I need my metas to read off and I don't have enough of those around here still, and I'm too lazy to re-read old games.
And Zakeri, I did post a little elaboration on my Pesco-suspicion, no need to only quote the joke explanation.
Regardless, still getting bad vibes from Pesco, not only do his posts contain a little too much kidding-around for my likings, he spent the entire D1 attacking Conqueror, how he refrained from attacking the lurkers (myself included) came off a little odd. Sure, he explained himself with this post:
There's just honestly nothing of note to really say on the other people. At most I can only say Schezo and PX aren't very memorable and rev is a jerk should post more himself instead of being a hypocrit.
Yet he made no attempt to pressure them to be less unmemorable.
---
PX is cleared on my book with the roleclaim, and attacking Hourai early D1 then killing him off in the night? Seem vig enough.
---
And Schezo, ooooh Schezo...
Regardless, it's obvious PX is not getting lynched over Conqueror at this point, but I'm still finding his behavior rather irksome and it doesn't help that people seem to be forgetting he exists. Comments?
I forgot he existed as well.
Now onto PX: Wow, I forgot he existed, hmm.
Anyway, what the heck am I reading? Sifting through all this is giving me a headache.
So anyways, this game is such a headache to read.
I just love his parroting.
A lot less neutral than his previous game, a lot more conviction and initiative with his start-game targets, but when the game really got going, the parroting began once again. Bashed kips hard when it was fashionable, jumped on Conqueror when that got fashionable. Conclusion? Suspect.
So in other words.
YOU ARE ALL FUCKING SCUM AND MUST DIE, I ALONE AM THE BEST.
No, I dunno, I hate this, the D1 wagon hardly has anything to read off, D2 is a write-off, sooo... I dunno.
Then again, hold on, say if there are 2 scum 1 3rd-party, and if I am to rely on PX and Zak's roleclaims then...
Pesco+Schezo+Kitten can die.
##VOTE: Pesco
Kill scum's mastermind, nice explanation on scum's nightkill reasoning earlier on btw.
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Vote yourself. You're scum by your own measuring stick.
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Indeed, but too bad I'm a self-confirmed town.
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Btw, what part of Zak's claim makes him clear all of a sudden?
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Nothing at all.
Regardless, this is quite simple really, there's hardly any reason for you to bus Zak at this stage of the game, so chance of you and Zak both being scum is minimal. If you flip town, PX can off Zak and keep us in the game... but then if Zak is the 3rd party, it's GG... and his whole "there is no 3rd party, two scums left for sure" post seems suspect...
Hmmmmmm. *rubs chin*
#UNVOTE
#VOTE: Schezo
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No wait, hold on, forgot huhwhat is in the game so it's not LYLO, town is fine even if we lynch the 3rd party... right? I still would like to know what Chaore meant by "Pseudo-LYLO".
##UNVOTE
##VOTE: Pesco
Last post's vote was a null vote anyways seeing how I missed one "#".
-
##UNVOTE
##VOTE: Pesco
herp bold derp.
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I need to reread this game and I have something to take care of today so I'll be back in ~10-12 hours.
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reV you are no better than mudkips except for sensible grammar.
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That is one hell of an insult, you spoony rabbit.
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I'm half-asleep, but I can't sleep. If I don't get this out now I probably won't get it out for several more hours, and that just doesn't work for me. Sorry if I'm incoherent.
You have posted almost nothing on anyone besides Kips.
This is just not true. D1 I gave an ordered list on who I thought was scum (and you even said that you liked some of my points on Conqueror, so I'm not sure how you can say that I have said nothing about other people). D2 I gave opinions on PX and, to a lesser extent, Rev. If Kips had been dead by then I would have gone after PX. I thought this was quite clear by what I said. And I don't think I could be clearer in my first D1 post (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,8444.msg552712.html#msg552712) if I tried.
Even then, the mentions you made to other people were worded as "Why are you not voting Kips" as your main reason for suspicion.
No. Where are you even getting this? I think the only time I said someone was suspicious for unvoting Kips and no other reason was Hourai and that's because it felt like a wagon hop. Everyone else had non-Kips reasons attached to them. If you're talking about my cheerleading comments...um I thought they were cheerleading the wagon? Isn't that what saying "I want X dead, but I'm going to vote this other person instead" IS?
As for why I was asking people why they weren't voting Kips, I felt like I had found scum. Like, I was really, really sure he was scum and I was getting frustrated that people weren't voting him because of ???. I had laid my case out there and people didn't think it was good enough, so I asked them why they thought he was town/not worth voting so I could try to convince them that they were wrong.
The only mention of other players that had nothing to do with Kips is a single point of defense against the case of reV, and a single point of support for the case on reV, in the same post, back to back, in passing. Post 223 for the curious.
Um what? I make two mentions of Rev in that post. The first is a response to PX saying that Kips never could have self-hammered because Rev unvoted. The second is me telling Rev to do stuff. I don't see how either of these things defend him...?
This is one of the weirdest cases I have ever read.
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##Vote reVelske
I would still like to know what changed about Kips between D1 and D2. D1 you said he was clear, but D2 you voted for him. I do not understand this. Explain.
I don't really have anything to add to the case. He's done so little that I was able to forget that he was even playing. His content is forgettable when it's not completely devoid of any sense at all. He hasn't really done anything.
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Oh, I knew I was forgetting something.
PX. I'm willing to clear him because of his claim.
@Mod: Can you confirm Hourai's alignment for us?
I had assumed that she was just a town cop with some kind of restriction, but I can understand the other interpretation. I would like to clear this up. If he was indeed scum then PX is completely cleared in my book.
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I've mentioned how I banked on Kips being taken out on N1, either by scums because his continuous PR hints or by vig because he's useless and a distraction. In case it's not clear enough, the second being the main reason everyone wanted him dead.
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Confirm that Hourai is 3rd scum
Currently it's 5 town and 2 scum (barring any 3rd parties)
If we lynch town, and I misfire and kill town, scum kills town, then it's 2 town and 2 scum, and scum win.
If I don't fire, we go to 5 man LyLo
If I fire and hit, it's 3 townies 1 scum MyLo
If we lynch scum, I'm clear to fire
So if we lynch town today, I'm holding my shot
Fuuuuck, just wasted the extra half hour of sleep I could have gotten before school reading this, more to come when I get back
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Apologies for being late. I was grounded all of yesterday (probably has something to do with playing a game using my role-wise father's name in vain).
Will post something after school, hopefully. I really hope I won't need a replacement.
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PS: Don't have time to fully catch up right now, but my general thoughts are that Zak and PX seriously need to die. I'm still town, by the way, since there seems to be some doubt about that. My role was that I came back as confirmed town after 3 IRL days. Chaore says that this is why the length of the day phases are so screwy, though it didn't matter in the end because of the hammer.
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Question: Will there be an extension in light of the recent forum downtime?
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PX: I didn't think through that we need to lynch a mafia today and not just scum. Zak wants to go after mafia and not kill the scummier then crap vig/SK and that seems ok to me. I still don't like him though and would like to see a PX lynch.
reV: You honestly haven't scratched you head at some of the things that happened in the course of this game? Kips at that time was blowing my mind and it was difficult to wrap my head around why he would do such things. As for my "parroting" that's pretty much just meta that you want to employ on me for a reason for suspicion, and it's pretty weak. I also don't know how I got onto Kips when it was, "fashionable" since I was on him since day one and he was obviously hindering the game. You yourself haven't posted anything relevant.
Zak: You contorted what Bard said earlier as well as majorly contorted what K4U just explained. Why would you try to lead the town in circles unless you weren't town? You did explain the Bard one, after he conveniently died and couldn't retort to what you said. As reV pointed out (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,8444.msg557838.html#msg557838) what is a bi-polar cop? Why would you know that, when there are also other theories out there on what it is (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,8444.msg557953.html#msg557953)? We don't really know unless Chaore confirms it, which may not happen and we'll have to deal with it. Of course it would also make this point moot if he does.
I won't hammer Zak because we still have lots of time for things to happen.
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@Mod: Can you confirm Hourai's alignment for us?
Hanged Hourai was a Town-aligned player. Like it says next to his name. -TOWN- Bi-Polar Cop.
Question: Will there be an extension in light of the recent forum downtime?
Yes. The Day will end 48 hours from this post instead of the 20 or so that would be left from the downtime.
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Zak is at L-2
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Apparently we all can't count this game.
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Needs more people voting scum.
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I suppose I'm fine with a Zak lynch, but I want to hear what huhwhat has to say about all this nonsense.
And perhaps PX, seeing how we are likely boned anyhow even if he doesn't NK. If Zak flips town, scums just have to take out Huhwhat the confirmed town to bring us down the 2, and assuming 3rd party doesn't count to townie's number (which he really shouldn't), it's game over.
So PX, you HAVE to fucking NK and hopefully not kill the 3rd party/town.
And fuck it, might as well roleclaim. I'm the Paladin, I can feel people up lay on hand on a player during night to prevent him from dying and reveal the attacker, I wasted the ability last night on PX.
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And 3rd party, seeing how you are boned one way or the other, how about roleclaiming for the greater good of it all :V
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5. Pesco - built and started several wagons with decent reasoning.
Wrong. Sure, he started the wagon against Conq and me, but for Conq, he had a very half assed reason and justified his vote using the OMGUS and other people's reason. And he used huh what's post against me.
Otherwise, his D1 consists of joking/serious posts, and talked only about Conquerer. Serious lack of scumhunting.
##Unvote
##Vote: Pesco
Also, new speculation on Hourai's role. Read this (http://mafiascum.net/wiki/index.php?title=Traitor). If he is the traitor, then I saved town from being scouted by scum. Who cares if he was Town when he died, he would have become Scum if he was NK'd. Also reading flavor, if I were a serial killer, I would have stabbed him or Chensawed, not shoot. Also, mod doesn't reveal role info. :V
Zak: His response satisfied me
reV: Claimed doctor. Either he is scum or he's doctor. Who did you protect N1?
Nighttime: Okay, I take back what I said. Who I shoot is my secret though :3
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I think Hourai might have been a cop variant that switches from getting sane and insane results every night, with the RNG deciding what his sanity starts on. I've seen something like that before. Whatever, doesn't matter now.
both targets I can more or less understand from a vig point of view
Love you too. <3
##Vote Zak
I'm going to speculate the NK and you're going to :dealwithit:
Scum don't NK the people who are eager to lynch not-scum.
If that was entirely true, Bard would have died N1 instead of me, considering he wasn't gaining much more suspicion than I was and is a better player overall, not to mention that it seemed less like he was tunneling on Zak back then than it did on N2.
If there's a third party, chances are it would be PX, and I would rather save the serial killer for a later lynch at this point. I'm sure whatever his win condition is, it can only be fulfilled by hitting a mafioso tonight.
Why, so there can be a second kill tonight? <_< You forgot that if we lynch scum today, he'll be able to fire at will and still win.
Leaving PX alive for too long is generally a bad idea because of how easily he could screw us over later in the game if we're not careful. But for now, PX, I fully expect that if you are town, you will not shoot another player tonight regardless of whether we lynch scum or not on the grounds that it could easily ruin our numbers advantage and head us towards a loss. If you fail to do so, you need to be lynched as soon as town can lynch non-scum without losing the game.
I don't think I need to say much more about him than that, though, I already covered the basic reasons for why I dislike PX on D1, and everything bad about him since then has already been covered.
Anyway, Zak looks pretty horrible with the flips of both Conqueror and kips. This entire post (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,8444.msg552755.html#msg552755) looks rather like he's trying to flip the wagons around to ensure kips as a D2 lynch, considering that he's pushing Conqueror to 3 votes while attempting to take steam away from the kips wagon. kips' very existance pretty much benefited scum because of how iffy kips' play was, while Conqueror was intelligent enough that there was a chance he could have stepped his game up and escaped the lynch spotlight. Additionally, if kips' lynch was pushed to later in the game when everyone was fed up with him, it would be harder to analyze kips' wagon after he flipped town, making it easy for Zak's buddy to push for a townie lynch without gathering any hate. As a result of this, Zak's jump on Conqueror + defense of kips looks like an attempt to build a foundation for scum on the later days, or at least it does to me. (Not to mention that kips didn't actually have that much convinction, making Zak's defense of him look pretty forced.) Everything else has already been mentioned by Bard, I believe.
Other people, while I'm here -
Pesco: Been getting townie vibes from him all game, actually, but I don't necessarily agree with his Zak vote. I would like him to elaborate on his NK analysis more, since his one sentence of it seems to be his main backing for voting Zak and yet it looks rushed and doesn't make very much sense.
reVelske: His play has been pretty dumb but it reads to me more like mislead town. Claim is pretty... eh, considering that we already have a defensive role (me!), already have a cop (Hourai), and also the part where that role is ridiculously fucking overpowered. All of this could easily be attributed to having a bastard mod, though. By the way, reV, who did you target N1? You never actually mentioned this, are you hiding something?
Schezo and K4U I don't know about, as they have been pretty forgettable this game (which is bad). Will need to re-read them soon.
I'll refrain from voting for now, as I don't really want to worry about speedhammers after what happened D1. I do intend to vote Zak some time before the day ends, though.
Ninja'd by PX, by the way. Did he just confess to being third party? <____<
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Wow, I suck at formatting.
Being confirmed town makes me put less effort into my posts, I think. If anybody wants me to re-elaborate on something, point it out and I'll do so.
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reV: Claimed doctor. Either he is scum or he's doctor.
Why would I possibly bother to claim doctor if I was a scum at this point in time? I'd just have to stay low like Schezo or Kitten and wait for a Zakari lynch, or if Zak is my scum buddy, I could've claimed something else to incriminate Pesco further, no? Claiming doctor doesn't help Zak's case, no?
And how am I a mislead town? :V
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I would have stabbed him or Chensawed
Honk honk.
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I guess mislead is the wrong word. :s More like confused. Your waffle between Pesco and Schezo gave me that impression, anyway.
honk.
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Also, again, who did you target on N1 and why did you target PX on N2?
I can pretty much guess who you targeted N1, but I want your confirmation as to make your claim more believable.
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Oh derp, I just realized that Zak only has one vote right now. No reason to hold back, then.
##Vote Zakeri
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I claimed Town Vig, not 3rd party :V
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Vote Count- I forgot I'm supposed to do these sometimes >:
Golden PX- Schezo
Zakeri- Pesco, holywhat
reVelske- Zakeri, Kitten4U
Pesco- reVelske, Golden PX
The day has.. uh... a lot more hours left in it? 34 hours left! With 7 alive, it takes 4 to lynch.
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Your post gave off the impression you did. As town, what do you have to gain from hiding your targets from the rest of us?
Regardless, I fully expect that you won't shoot tonight if you really have our best interests in mind.
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OH WAIT I'M DUMB
reV, was your ability one-shot?
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You know, if you just shut up about it, there'd been a chance of the scums offing me instead of you.
Oh well, your loss.
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<_____<
So why did you target PX N2? He seems like he would have been the last person somebody would NK at that point in the game. Definitely not worth wasting a one-shot watcher+protect X2 combo on. Seems pretty illogical to me.
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His vig ability could potentially buy us another chance in what could've been LYLO situation.
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:|
Well, I believe you, at least. I don't really agree with your action, but whatever.
Anyway, Pesco is irking me a bit after skimming the topic. I'd like him to step up and respond to my post some time in the near future, since it seems that I probably won't be able to save anything for after Zak's flip at this rate.
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Well as of now I'm not liking rev's dodging of the question. And claiming doc is standard scum play. Just look at how many times bofh got away with it. Adding to this is his insistence on PX shooting again. Just because we have a vig it does not mean we need to have him shoot in the dark and hit town.
I would switch to a rev lynch at this stage.
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Are you going to answer me about your awkwardly-thought out NK analysis or not?
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He NEEDS to NK if we hit a town, plain and simple. And you are the best candidate if Zak flips town.
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He NEEDS to NK if we hit a town, plain and simple. And you are the best candidate if Zak flips town.
Um, no he doesn't?
There are only 2 scum at this point, otherwise it wouldn't have been plain LYLO before I came back on a flying car.
If we lynch town and a town dies tonight, there will be 3 town and 2 scum, assuming there are no 3rd parties in this game.
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I forgot to.
The established players here know that I don't need to be NK'd N1. I'll get myself lynched as the game goes on. The people alive that know this is Kitten and Zak. Given that mudkips was enough of a distraction to force us to waste a day lynching him, scum could relax in who they target for NK. Bard didn't make much impression on D1 while you did. So what do you think is the better NK: someone who is active and scumhunting or someone who doesn't output as much? N1 NKs are just like D1 lynches. Scum take out whoever is giving off the best townie vibes.
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There has to be, in a 12 player game? And only 2 scums? No way in hell. Besides, without you it would've been 4v2, and that's a MYLO, not LYLO. 3v1v2 WOULD'VE been a LYLO though.
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Discussing 3rd party is stupid. 3rd Party doesn't matter in Town win condition. And it would have been 4 town, 2 scum, meaning MYLO. However, MyLo is just Lylo with the option to No Lynch, so stop trying to read that. Anyways, answer the damn question. Who did you save N1?
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^ Fucking facepalm. That's what I saved.
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In fact, he's avoiding questions, and now he's trying to convince us there's a 3rd party? Also, you thinking I need to kill someone tonight or else we lose is illogical, as I can not shoot and we'll still end up with 5 person LyLo. Also, scum claiming doctor is perfectly logical.
##Unvote
##Vote: reV
fakeEDIT: Cut by reV
Oh, it's a one shot. Well, forget what I said about the avoiding question part. Still keeping my vote
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IMBECILE.
Fine, sure, keep believing this game has only 2 scums, a game that has shown 5 town power roles.
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In fact, you could have lied and sacrificed yourself for the Town good.
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I don't lie in a mafia game, as stated in the previous game.
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Can I hammer mudkips ver2 yet?
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My avatar with my last post :*
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@GOD DAMNIT CHAORE: Perhaps a noob question, but would you have differentiated between MYLO and LYLO when announcing the possible end game?
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@ Pesco: Reasonable enough. I'm going to drop the complaints I had about you irking me because they were pretty illogical after thinking it over again. For now, anyway. ALSO PLEASE DON'T HAMMER, I'M ADDING THIS SENTANCEIN AT THE LAST MINUTE BECAUSE ARGH
@ reV: 2 scum, 1 SK and 9 townies seems pretty reasonable to me (see PoS), and was actually what I was assuming. I'm not sure why you're so confident PX is town. Regardless, whether or not a SK was alive is aside the point, the point being that Chaore wouldn't have said town was in LYLO if there were 3 scum alive before I revived. The game would have already been called.
Sooo, other people. I'm think reVelske is likely town at this point, and the wagon growing on him rubs me the wrong way because of this. His gambit to keep me alive does seem to have town intent at least, and the way he went about it makes it appear as if he was actually a townie withholding role information to keep another player alive rather than scum faking a gambit to get townie cred. This is mainly because I believe him being transparent about the gambit rather than actually claiming he used his doc N1 and lying has townie motivation due to LaL, etc. His confusion-waffle between Schezo and Pesco reads as sincere to me as well, hence why I was thinking that he is confused town. I don't believe scum would have made up that thought process for the Schezo jump, it likely would have read odd and drawn attention.
I would also be suspicious of K4U if Zak died and flipped scum, as her arguments with Zak have felt forced to me and the way she has consistently jumped on Kips seems in line with my earlier theory about Zak trying to push kips' lynch to a later point in the game. It also seems like Zak was attempting to set up a bus on her if kips flipped, notably due to how he starts ignoring her when D2 pulls around and never even seemed to push her that much in the first place beyond his initial post D1. Little conviction, etc.
The same goes for when he pressed K4U earlier today over a misrep about her tunneling Kips that he should have actually known was false (K4U herself pointed this out), which leads to K4U making a post consisting entirely of attacking Zak over his case... before swerving over to reV and voting him for little more than what had already been already been stated, which is rather confusing to me. Were it not for the ##s, I would think that she was going after Zak in that post. She certainly had more reasons to target Zak than she had to target reV, after Zak had just pushed an awkward case bordering on misrep that even K4U said was "one of the weirdest cases (she) had ever read". It does not help that Zakeri was seeming to be the most likely lynch target and that point in the day, and the reV also seemed like the best alternative to him as well.
I know that none of this holds up at all if Zak is town, but seeing as I derped up reV's gambit it seems unlikely I'll be around to say anything after we get a Zak flip (whenever that is). I'm just getting this out now in case Zak really does turn up scum.
One million ninjas argh.
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I'm not sure why you're so confident PX is town
Because I'm too naive with roleclaims, been questioning myself on my trust in PX since the last few posts though.
I really don't like Pesco's joke-insults he's been throwing me the last two pages, good job discrediting me with little to no effort, no opinion on my roleclaim or setup analysis? Just gonna keep discrediting me with insults? Surely you are better than that, Pesco.
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@GOD DAMNIT CHAORE: Perhaps a noob question, but would you have differentiated between MYLO and LYLO when announcing the possible end game?
Not in the least. Mostly because I forget MYLO exists.
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Well then. Was it MYLO before I came in on a flying car?
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Technically MYLO can't exist as town must lynch at LYLO-point, Which encompasses MYLO.
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^ LYLO encompasses MYLO? I'm lost. @_@
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I believe what he's saying is that PX isn't town.
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In fact.
Anybody up for a PX lynch? The mod essentially just implied that his kill is not in town's best interest, and his selfish shot (killing Hourai) makes him sound even more self-aligned. I would feel a lot safer about PX dying than reV dying, anyway.
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Though, I'd prefer Zak die the most, if that's not clear from me not changing my vote. <_< I just think PX would be a better choice than reV.
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Yeah, what the hell is reV doing? Coming up with insane ass theories and dodging questions. Also, the way huh what has taken it feels like reV's gambit may be doing what he wants it to, sucking up to huh what to not get a vote from him, otherwise that would make no sense to claim doctor as town but it does for scum . His entire play just is Arg so yeah, he needs to die as he flat out admits again he is gullible for claims too but first.
With what huh what just brought up, I think a Zakeri lynch would give us more information to go off of. It irks me that he still hasn't responded to anything and I can't tell where to go from here because a lot of stuff has been put up against him and we don't have an explanation from him yet. I would like to see something.
I feel reV, Zakeri and PX all need to die at this point, PX gets no clear in Lou of what Chaore just explained.
edit:I'm still ready for a PX lynch wherever you guys what to do it.
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Schezo: You do realize this is psuedo-LYLO, right? Informative lynches are probably not in our best interest here if PX chooses to fire.
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You know what yeah, we can't trust PX to keep his word that he won't nightkill tonight if we hit town, especially with:
Nighttime: Okay, I take back what I said. Who I shoot is my secret though :3
I'm willing to bet he is going to shoot someone tonight regardless of what happens so he can have a better chance to win. We can't follow through with huh what's, "you will be lynched as soon as town can lynch non-scum without losing the game." unless we for sure hit scum today, and even then it's too late. However if we get rid of this extra kill over night it will put us in two consecutive MYLO instead of a chance of for sure loss if we don't hit scum today. This is all worst case scenario and that not a single scum gets hit today but it can still happen.
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##Unvote
No hammer for you Pesco
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Yeah, what the hell is reV doing? Coming up with insane ass theories and dodging questions.
DODGING WHAT QUESTION? WHAT INSANE THEORIES? All my theories have got valid reasoning to them, if you want to argue them, ARGUE, not come shit on them and look away like Pesco. Oh wait, hi parrot-chan.
And what the hell, everyone wants a roleclaimed doc dead when there is next to no scum benefit to the claim and when he wasn't even under pressure. EVERYTHING IS BACKWARDS. MY MIND IS FULL OF FUCK.
Anyhow.
Hm, call me slow but, I'm needing a little explanation as to how you come to the conclusion that PX is the SK, since I don't really understand what Chaore just explained.
And also, I assume "Pseudo"-LYLO is pseudo due to what the SK/vig could do and scums could potentially mis-kill SK?
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The last bit of questions were for huhwhat, of course.
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Also, I am holding my damn shot.
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Well let's see. PX asks you a question and you insult him without a straight answer (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,8444.msg558637.html#msg558637) that you still haven't answered. The scum benefit could be that that is so stupid that you want us all to just look away. Another insane theory is that you want a pretty much proven SK to live and get away with another kill tonight.
cut by PX: and we are just supposed to believe you?
Let's look at it this way, worst case scenario :
We mislynch and hit a town today
Scum nightkills town
3rd party/vig nightkills town
town lost and we can't hold PX to his word.
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MYLO = LYLO would mean that even if we No Lynched, town could lose. Likely due to a SK screwing us over. Though, due to the possibility of the SK killing scum, it would really only be Potential LYLO. Maybe Chaore is just being a derp. <_<
It's likely we'll be better off if we stop playing the set-up. I still think PX is self-aligned, though.
Psuedo-LYLO is because if PX holds his shot after we lynch town then we'll still have enough players alive that scum won't outnumber all other factions. Though, it -would- result in D5 being a kingmaker in the best case scenario.
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Kingmaker is the wrong wording.
Town vs. SK. vs Scum is what I mean. Basically, town can't win.
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...in that particular scenario, I mean. <__________<
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Also, he did answer. Just not as direct as I wished.
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By the way, how is reV wanting the SK to live any worse than Zak wanting us to save the SK for later? It's effectively the same thing as far as I'm concerned, except Zak has been more subtle about it.
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PX asks you a question and you insult him without a straight answer[/url] that you still haven't answered.
MY FUCK.
The scum benefit could be that that is so stupid that you want us all to just look away.
When nobody was really looking towards me and it was pretty obvious that Zak was heading for a lynch?
Another insane theory is that you want a pretty much proven SK to live and get away with another kill tonight.
Note how I've made no real comment on PX after huhwhat's explanation, but asked for an elaboration instead? And proven SK? Like hell would you have deduced that.
Try harder, scumface.
@huhwhat: Fair enough, though I'm still not absolutely certain if that is what Chaore meant (It sounded like him commenting about MYLO as a concept rather than in our scenario), but yeah well, far too over it to spend more time thinking on this, PX's insistence that there is no 3rd-party kinda reinforced your accusation. Isn't PX still relatively new? I also wouldn't be surprised if he's trying to more or less copy Affinity's semi-false claim from last game.
Not really sure what to do at the moment, ie. not certain if lynching the SK would be the better or worse option to take at this point, and I'm still not comfortable with Zak lynch. He needs to pop in to say something, along with Kitten. Pesco also needs to stop being a jerk.
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@huh what: Yes, Zak's case was one of the weirdest things I've ever read, but considering Zak hasn't looked scummy to me before that I'm at least willing to wait to see what he has to say. Regarding the PX SK thing, I think you're reading too much into what Chaore's saying. x: It says in the rules that town MUST lynch in LYLO so...
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Here is why I don't think PX is SK. First, having a SK that cannot shoot every night is just cruel (seriously, after playing one in MSR I know how friggin hard and annoying it is, and someone even asked Kilga if he planned to give my role to someone he hated, and I had a whole slew of other abilities). Lying about not being able to shoot every night is just silly. It makes winning considerably harder because you have to live longer, and just living as SK is really, really hard. Second, as much as I hate to say it, I do find his target reasonable (if not hair-pull worthy). I didn't see anything that would make me think that Kips was a bomb (for the record, the right way to play a bomb is to be extremely townie so you get NKed and if you fail at that it's to claim bomb so that town gets 2 lynches), but I'm willing to chalk him thinking there was up to inexperience (I don't think there has EVER been a bomb in an MotK game). So, shooting someone that he found scummy as to not die seems reasonable to me. And because no one else has claimed the Hourai kill I am willing to believe his claim and clear him.
Now, regarding Rev's claim. That is a very convenient claim. I do not believe it. First, not only does town already have one investigative role, but there have been craptons of other PRs out there (spoilers, I have one too). Second, his target makes no sense. I don't really understand why he would pick PX over, say, Bardiche (who he himself said was a good NK target). And saying that people weren't looking your direction is not true. I am voting you, Zak is voting you, Pesco is looking in your direction, Schezo was looking in your direction...Yeah, clearly you had no chance of being lynched. :V
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Yes, I do have a PR. I'd like to keep it secret until tomorrow to keep scum in suspense, but I can claim now if absolutely necessary.
Also, regarding PX's vig. If we lynch town today I think he should hold it, but if we lynch scum I think he should shoot. At worst he kills a scummy townie (which is always good for town, but it's especially important in LYLO imo), and he may just off the other scum if he shoots.
Warning - while you were typing 8 new replies have been posted. You may wish to review your post.
GDI
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It's like I staring at a wall of scums.
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Now, regarding Rev's claim. That is a very convenient claim. I do not believe it. First, not only does town already have one investigative role, but there have been craptons of other PRs out there (spoilers, I have one too).
No arguments there, but, wouldn't it also reinforce the idea of a SK? To balance the roles out? Hell, without my role, it's still plentiful.
Second, his target makes no sense. I don't really understand why he would pick PX over, say, Bardiche (who he himself said was a good NK target).
You must've forgotten how Bard and Pesco were my main suspects at the time, I said, based on player experience, people like Bard/Pesco/Zak should've been the first NK target, that's all there is to it. I, as stated, believed PX's claim wholeheartedly (reasons were given), and seeing how were were potentially heading into a MYLO/LYLO, it was better to have him around as our backup option. I honestly do not see what's so confusing about that choice of protection.
And saying that people weren't looking your direction is not true. I am voting you, Zak is voting you, Pesco is looking in your direction, Schezo was looking in your direction...Yeah, clearly you had no chance of being lynched. :V
Eh, no Schezo wasn't? And I was in no shape or form under pressure or threat of being lynch, at the rate Zak was going.
Also, regarding PX's vig. If we lynch town today I think he should hold it
ie. you believe that there ISN'T a 3rd party? I mean, you do understand that it's 3v1v2 if we lynch a town, and scum kills off huhwhat and it's game over? Right?
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No arguments there, but, wouldn't it also reinforce the idea of a SK? To balance the roles out? Hell, without my role, it's still plentiful.
SK tends to hurt scum more than help, so that wouldn't help with balance at all.
I honestly do not see what's so confusing about that choice of protection.
It confuses me because I think PX had almost no chance of being NKed. He still looked fairly scummy, so even if people didn't think he was mafia they could still push that he is SK. Hell, they might even think that he is SK and that would make them even less likely to shoot him since they tend to be bullet proof.
Eh, no Schezo wasn't? And I was in no shape or form under pressure or threat of being lynch, at the rate Zak was going.
Oh, I misremembered when he started to be suspicious of you. My bad. However, how you can look at this and say that you were not a viable lynch is beyond me (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,8444.msg558578.html#msg558578). You were totally the counter wagon to Zak. (yes, I know that was the vote count after you claimed, but I believe the number of votes on each of the main wagons was the same because PX unvoted and HW voted).
ie. you believe that there ISN'T a 3rd party? I mean, you do understand that it's 3v1v2 if we lynch a town, and scum kills off huhwhat and it's game over? Right?
No. If there is SK it has to be PX and I've already explained why I don't think he's SK.
So wait, do you believe there is a third party? Who and what do you think it is?
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PX:In which post? I'm having a hard time reading through his sarcasm.
HW:He's not. Which is why I want both of them dead. I posted that it may have been ok in my 286 as long as we hit scum for sure because I didn't think through what would happen if PX was left alive, other wise worst case scenario ensues and town loses.
But while we're at it, let me make my next point. It is imperative for us to lynch PX today. I find him SK because he killed one of the more active scum hunters at the time, even with his reason, which kinda made sense but it involved Kips so there's not much to go off of there. But he has shown anti town play throughout the game by read: not doing anything. It has been weak scum hunting at best with his one conviction post of Hourai (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,8444.msg552381.html#msg552381) but the rest of the game there hasn't been much of anything so, it's hurting town one in the same. We really can't let him take out another townie tonight, regardless of what he says, because you know he won't say, "If we hit town, I'm going to shoot tonight m'kay!" Even though that's exactly what he wants to do to get closer to his win condition which isn't in the favor of town.
If it wasn't for the obvious threat PX poses to town tonight you best believe I would be voting reV right now. Your reasons for clearing everyone who comes forward with a claim is that you are a sucker for them, and the one you gave PX is that he attacked Hourai and then viged him? Yeah, he could have planned that one out after he went after Hourai for semi-weak reasoning and then viging him in the night so as not to get much suspicion with his roleclaim which was bound to come out. I also "deduced that" he's pretty much proven SK though I didn't say for sure he was, yet you just took that the extra yard; when, with what your posts are saying, you agree there is a 3rd party, yet I get the blame for it, for coming out and openly saying he's SK?
I also see the questions arising from people in that you were adamant on the first nightkills being experienced players, Bard/Pesco/Zak, why didn't you protect them because PX was getting crap from people earlier that day, making it really unlikely that PX would be the night kill over the people you claim it should have been.
hnng:cut by kitten
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reV's PX protect seems fairly sensible when you consider that he was calling kips as the N1 kill. :|
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And fuck it, might as well roleclaim. I'm the Paladin, I can feel people up lay on hand on a player during night to prevent him from dying and reveal the attacker, I wasted the ability last night on PX.
reV, was your ability one-shot?
You know, if you just shut up about it, there'd been a chance of the scums offing me instead of you.
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SK tends to hurt scum more than help, so that wouldn't help with balance at all.
I suppose not, but the point of there being plentiful of roles as it is still stands. That's 5-6 roles and 2-3 vanillas regardless of the nature of our claims.
It confuses me because I think PX had almost no chance of being NKed. He still looked fairly scummy, so even if people didn't think he was mafia they could still push that he is SK. Hell, they might even think that he is SK and that would make them even less likely to shoot him since they tend to be bullet proof.
A matter of perspective, a vig, to me, is a wildcard, whereas townies can be manipulated, controlled and directed, scums have very little control over a vig unless they try order him around during day. When they are about to go into a MYLO/LYLO in a situation that is as comfortable as it is (of course, NOBODY EXPECTS THE HOLYWHAT INQUISITION), their only problem, their only blindspot, would be the vig.
You were totally the counter wagon to Zak.
Sure, after I took him off L1 just to have my own wagon built up, does that make us both scums? But wait, I was second on his wagon! How does that work?
Regardless, I still honestly don't see how most of you would've moved off Zak for me.
So wait, do you believe there is a third party? Who and what do you think it is?
Oh no I totally don't believe there's a 3rd party, I've been ranting and raving about a 3rd party possibility since D2 just for shits and giggles. What makes it even better is how everyone except huhwhat took it as a fucking joke without even trying to discredit it with some logical explanation.
No, I have no clue who it is, and I'm not totally convinced PX's the SK either as stated few posts back, even less so now since your explanation against that theory does hold merit. Right now, I couldn't give a damn about who's the 3rd party, as far as I'm concerned, he's just another scum that needs to be lynched.
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reVelske: While you're here, why do you feel uncomfortable with a Zakeri lynch at this juncture?
There are more things I want to say about Zak and it's making me sad that everybody on his wagon jumped ship suddenly, but I'd like to see him get another post out before I make my move.
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Because how everyone else seem scummier and scummier to me the more they post (Schezo and Pesco mostly), this is why I'd really want to hear him say something.
And how quickly Zak reached L1 is alarming.
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How is it alarming? The only people who could really be considered as "pushing him to L-1" were you (second vote) and PX (third vote), and from your PoV one of those is town. You can't seriously think Pesco was attempting to push Zak to L-1 when he was only the first vote. If anything, you're the one who allowed it to happen. I'm a bit confused why you find it alarming as a result of this.
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Oh, right. All it took was three players to bring him to L1, thought it was at least four -_-. And yeah, no I did not bother to read back before posting that, said it just for the sake of making my post look a little more substantial than it really is.
No more post until I've had some sleep or until Zak posts I suppose seeing how I've been up all night and it's 8:34AM.
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huh what, you mixed up me and Pesco. I was first vote, Pesco was 3rd
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Oh, blame Chaore for messing up his votecount then. God damnit NeoSerela.
said it just for the sake of making my post look a little more substantial than it really is.
You're really not helping your case right now, y'know?
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Well hey, when you are tired you say shit, it happens. when I derp I derp, at least I'm honest about it. Real man has no need for lies and deceits, not even in Mafia.
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Glawd I want to lynch Schezo now. The way he's pushing PX lynch based on possibility instead of evidence is just rhcbjghghhjjjnjn.
Currently need
- Vote count
- Zak post
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Unofficial Vote Count: Better than the mods!
Golden PX- Schezo
Zakeri- Golden PX, reVelske, Pesco, holywhat
reVelske- Zakeri, Kitten4U, Golden PX
Pesco- reVelske, Golden PX, reVelske
Schezo- reVelske
Not Voting: Golden PX
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OMG WHY DOES REV AND PX HAVE 4 VOTES?!?!?
Use italics, can't see bold on my phone.
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Unofficial Vote Count: Better than the mods! Redux
Golden PX- Schezo
Zakeri- Golden PX, reVelske, Pesco, holywhat
reVelske- Zakeri, Kitten4U, Golden PX
Pesco- reVelske, Golden PX, reVelske
Schezo- reVelske
Not Voting: Golden PX
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##Unvote
##Vote Schezo
I reread and there's definitely something wrong with him wanting PX dead. SK/vig getting a lucky shot to off scum is the biggest thing they have to worry about since it's one person's choice instead of the majority's. Playing up the possibility of him shooting is beyond us even if we want to hold him accountable. Town would simply have no way to win in any case if he's really SK.
If Schezo flips scum and PX is SK, we can be assured of 2 dead townies overnight. 4 people left, scum will have to kill PX to secure their win. It's all up to luck in that case for a crosskill.
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Town does have 2 ways to win out of all that can happen right now, and one of them is really iffy.
Ok, so we can deduce there are only 2 mafia otherwise we would have been in LYLO earlier and have been screwed already. If there
s a SK at this point is has to be PX. That's because he has been acting scummy this whole game and he's the only one who could have made the extra kills. The only thing I can see is I was trying to figure out the Hourai kill and why PX would shoot a person he found scummy from a rational standpoint and I ended up in just conscious awareness. That's the only thing that's bothering me about the SK case.
But let's take a look at every scenario that can possibly happen at this point.
If he's SK then there is: 4town, 2mafia and 1SK, which makes some more sense to the SK theory making 3 scums for town to hunt.
This is what can happen if town lynches town today:
We could have 2town 2mafia and 1SK and town can't win that even if SK doesn't shoot because the next day, even if mafia is lynched we have 1town 1mafia 1SK so if SK decides to shoot, he wins.
Again if town is lynched, we have 1town 2mafia 1SK, if SK shoots or 2town 1mafia 1SK that town still can't win because if we lynch mafia, SK wins and if we lynch SK, mafia wins.
Now if Mafia does get lynched today:
We have a possible win condition but relying on it would be rather dumb: We get 3town 1mafia 1SK if SK doesn't shoot! That would require we all place our trust in PX (which is dumb) and we could go on to town lynching mafia again leaving 2town 1SK or lynching SK leaving 2town 1mafia on the last day.
But if SK shoots we get stuck with 2town 1mafia and 1SK and town cannot win. But if SK does shoot mafia we are left with 3town and 1SK which is winnable, leaving the game completely up to a cross kill or a stupid SK.
But the one I keep harping is if we lynch SK we get 3town and 2mafia and town can win with that.
So really town has to for sure hit mafia today or the SK if he does exist. However it is a lot safer for town to go after SK so we can place the game in our own hands instead of relying on a third party to win the game for us.
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Long story short, we lynch the scum that's trying to lynch the possible-SK.
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Okay, so, did Zakeri disappear off the face of the earth or something? (fake edit: okay, apparently not, he's online right now. still going to post this.)
If not, I'd like to ask him who he would have voted D2, seeing as he somehow got away with not putting a vote out on that day and never gave any particular indication of who he intended to vote. I seriously thought somebody had already pointed that out when I made my original post today, but I guess not. While this could be excused by the day's premature ending, the response to Bard that he posted after the night ended still lacked any particular indication of who he would have gone after that day.
Will re-read Schezo in a bit. Not really agreeing that he should be voted for just because he wants the potential SK dead, though. It's not like scum couldn't take PX out via nightkill, so scum could probably take out a different PR instead if they wished. Though I do think Schezo is overreacting about the "we don't know if PX will keep his word" part, since if PX is SK then it's in his favor not to shoot if a townie gets lynched today.
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alright, two days is enough recovery time, even if one of those days was free in terms of gametime.
Yes, Kitten4u does make mentions of other players, but my main issue with her posts is that there doesn't seem to be any focus on anything other than lynching Kips. That's not to say there's nothing else in her posts, just that the parts that have nothing to do with Kips turn into a haze. The first post mentions PX's style "bothering her," and Conqueror's stepping back "making her uneasy." The only strong accusation I would count in the post besides kips is her asking Sect directly who scum is. moving onto 172, Conqueror slides from bothersome to acceptable target, along with the mention of her suspicion on Hourai (which I will buy as explained in her recent post for now). All of this has a tenancy to fall by the waste-side when you take a glance that K4u has been viciously targeting a townie for two days in a row.
Also, I must have seriously misread the first part on reV in your post 223. I didn't realize it was referring to Kips self-hammering.
Still, I don't consider spending the whole game tunneling on a single townie because they were certain that person was scum to be a particularly strong scumtell. Especially considering Bardiche's flip. I still think reV and Schezo are scummier.
Schezo:"You did explain the Bard one, after he conveniently died and couldn't retort to what you said."
Not my fault Bard hammered and night came as I was typing that up. If I had released it was night time before starting up the entire post, It at the very least would have been written with the changes that occurred over nighttime in mind - namely that Bardiche was now dead.
Schezo:"As reV pointed out what is a bi-polar cop? Why would you know that, when there are also other theories out there on what it is? We don't really know unless Chaore confirms it, which may not happen and we'll have to deal with it."
What kind of role are you accusing me of, assuming I'm privy to people's roles? Even scum are only told if other people are the same kind of scum they are or not. And Hourai started out and died as a townie, even if he had a traitor-role.
Congratulation to Huh what, for being the first person to actually build a case against me that makes sense. I admit, it's scummy as hell, but I still felt back then that Kips was town somehow, and spend more time trying to talk his way out of a paper bag then succeeding at it. I made it a point not to go after Kips because of all of my previous experiences with going after and lynching someone for being the stupidest person to grace mafia that week (with results that varied from lynching a vanilla townie, all the way to lynching a town bomb that killed another townie that was voting for him, and nothing out the other side). It's to the point where I automatically assume people like that are town, due to -if no other reason- Murphy's Law. I also see in your recent ninja you're asking me who I would have voted for, and to be honest, I probably would have been provoked into voting Bardiche is he hadn't hammered. Without Bardiche's bad case on me, however, I would be going after reVelske for the same reasons I started out voting him today.
I honestly have no idea what reV is trying to do with his roleclaim. I'm almost ready to take it a face value for how optimally that was played.
As far as I'm concerned about the SK/Vig theory, Either PX is town, in which case he is fighting for town victory, and knows what to do based on the flip of whoever we lynch, or he's third party, in which case if he doesn't do what's good for town, we lynch him and he loses anyway. The key point about having a SK is that once he's revealed his ability to shoot, even if he's claimed Vig, we still have him under the town's thumbnail. You can play probabilities all you'd like, but only the mafia has a reason to off PX now, and that's because they're the ones most at threat by the vig/SK. Additionally, Mafia would really want to lynch him because in the chance that he is an SK, he's probably bulletproof as well, and the mafia couldn't deal with it themselves. Personally, I'd rather vote mafia today, and we can't really do that if we vote PX instead.
Really, this is enough to edge out Schezo as the better lynch in my opinion.
##Unvote: reVelske
##Vote: Schezo
L-1 Alert.
Also, PX, I've forgotten who you thought was scum, and I don't feel like combing the backlog of posts once again, so since you aren't voting, could you at least give me a short list with reasons? Thanks.
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Vote Count: The Prettifuls Edition
Golden PX - Schezo
Zakeri - holywhat
reVelske - Kitten4U
Pesco - reVelske
Schezo - Pesco, Zakeri
Not Voting: Golden PX
With 7 alive it takes 4 to lynch. There are 9 hours left in the day.
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self-confirmed for cannot count tier
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"since if PX is SK then it's in his favor not to shoot if a townie gets lynched today."
I don't see this, SK has nothing to lose because
1.) If town gets lynched today town has lost if PX is SK, what with
4town, 2mafia, 1SK
Town is lynched, SK doesn't shoot
2town, 2mafia, 1SK
Town cannot win that.
2.) If mafia gets lynched today, town can only win if PX SK is stupid or crosskills.
I don't see how I'm scum because I want to take the best route for victory.
Zakeri, town doesn't have PX under our thumb if we let him live today because the only way SK won't screw us over is if:
1. PX can't shoot every night
2. PX crosskills or
3. PX is a derptard
and #1 is taking in to account we all have to trust a 3rd party member. :|
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Augh, I've been putting off re-reading Schezo forever because the first two days of this game are absolutely painful to read. Regardless, here goes:
- Schezo's D1 case on kips in #62 is surprisingly minimal and it feel like his Hourai case has more meat to it. kips was pretty horrible throughout D1, so the vote itself isn't too illogical, but I'm not sure I like how Schezo took the bandwagon option over the case he seemed to verbalize stronger.
- Switch to Conqueror in #152 feels like a jump from a dying wagon to a stronger one from the standpoint of pure wagon analysis, but the vote itself is solid. Schezo putting the kips case on the backburner feels a bit less iffy to me than it did when I called him out for it on D1 now that I realize how minimal his kips vote seemed. Not liking how Schezo was still putting his Hourai case on the backburner for wagons, since the way he words each of his cases makes it seem like the Hourai case is his strongest one. Schezo, why did you think Hourai was not worth voting?
- D2 kips jump (#235) is reasonable enough, or at least it is in my eyes. I honestly don't think the D2 kips wagon is worth analyzing at this point because of how inevitable his lynch was (though the same does not go for the D1 wagon). It's interesting how Schezo drops his D2 PX case completely today and instead is just voting him because he's probably the SK, though.
- Schezo's point in #333 about reV's claim being an attempt to escape my scumdar is pretty ridiculous, considering that I already thought reV looked townie at the time it was claimed to be a gambit. Feels a bit hypocritical considering that he was accusing reV of conspiracy theories in the same post. The question dodging was a misrep on reV as well, and it feels odd that Schezo suddenly shot up reV to his second choice instead of Zakeri because of these weak reasons.
- I've already stated that I disagree with Schezo wanting to lynch the potential SK scummy, but after thinking it over a bit, I don't think Schezo's PX vote is that great, albeit for different reasons than everybody else does - mainly that he is not going after somebody for being scummy. There is no substance to his PX vote beyond playing the set-up, which is a very convenient way for scum to park a vote on somebody who they know to not be of their ranks. He's essentially shoving an actual logical lynch founded on scumhunting to tomorrow, meaning scum has time to remove somebody from the discussion as well as wait for more townie slip-ups to base their votes on.
So. All things considered, I think I would indeed be up for a Schezo lynch today, due to his wagon-happiness D1 and the manner in which he is currently parking his vote. Or at least, I'd be up for it more than I'd be up for a reVelske lynch. I'd still prefer Zak die today, however, so I will not switch my vote to Schezo until we're closer to the end of the day, just in case it's still possible to get a Zakeri lynch.
Speaking of Zak, I still have a post of his to respond to. Let's see where that takes us.
If you were so sure kips was town, then why did you drop your defense of him completely on D2 when it he was a major target? You did not even provide any sort of alternative to his lynch, and even if you were not on his wagon, the complete indifference towards the impending doom of somebody you thought to be town looks quite scummy and falls under the sin of omission. Aside from that, I'm honestly not sure I believe you about voting reVelske, mainly because of how little you have pressured him over the game until recently. Sure, there was your vote on him from the start of D1, but you later admitted that it was a vote to corner him into contributing (which I assume was because of his meta) before dropping it completely. That was the last time you actually pressured reVelske over anything until D2 and the last time you even insinuated that you thought he was scum until the same post, in which you had little-to-no reasons for voting him layed out on the table, even though you claimed that he was just as scummy as the wagon you were voting on during D1. Pray tell, why did you completely delay forming a decent case on reVelske until your other suspects (Conqueror and Bard) were dead? You pressured reVelske when he procrastinated in sharing his cases with the rest of the town, so I fail to see why we should let you get away with the same thing.
It is seriously painful to watch how the entirety of town has essentially been ignoring Zak completely since D2 and especially D3, after the flips of kips and Conqueror should have cast suspicion onto his past actions in hindsight. I really cannot see townie intent in the way he swung the wagons D1 and allowed kips to live on to the future while diminishing any potential analysis stemming from kips' flip, the latter of which being especially damning when you consider that Zakeri himself claimed that a kips flip would be difficult to gather information from before proceeding to help push it to a time in which it a kips flip would become even less useful for analysis. Combined with very little contributive D2 content (he didn't even vote) and a lack of well-explained cases on any player other than K4U and Conqueror until he was forced to come up with them for LYLO, Zakeri is easily the scummiest person alive right now and it is unnerving that everybody started discounting him as a possible lynch after the first half of the day.
tl;dr I am willing to switch to Schezo at the end of the day because his D1 and D3 actions are indeed rather scummy, but please stop ignoring Zakeri completely argh.
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hi 6~ hours
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Uh huh...
Yeah, you do realize that you're completely ignoring the possibility that I am a town vig and not a SK. And if I were a SK, then scum would definitely want me dead.
Also, are you calling me dumb? :(
Scumlist?
1) Schezo
Holy crap, his D3 went from: Continue D2 case on me, then lynch the scummier person than the actual mafia, then to lynch the vig because he will lose the game for town by being derp, to lynching the *Possible* SK because that's more important than lynching mafia.
2) reVelske
Failed gambit, doctor claim. Read post 317 (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,8444.msg558645.html#msg558645). Only reason I unvoted was because Pesco was threatening hammer.
3) Pesco
Wrong. Sure, he started the wagon against Conq and me, but for Conq, he had a very half assed reason and justified his vote using the OMGUS and other people's reason. And he used huh what's post against me.
Otherwise, his D1 consists of joking/serious posts, and talked only about Conquerer. Serious lack of scumhunting.
If Schezo is mafia, Night Targets. You guys vote :V
1) Me (Yes, I will suicide)
2) Zak (Info lynch)
3) reV (Number 2 on scum list)
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2) Zak (Info lynch)
(Info lynch)
Do you people even read my posts? That said, it should be obvious who I'm voting for.
Also, it's not reV's fault his gambit failed. I'm not sure why you're counting that against him. <_<
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And why are you unwilling to kill Pesco?
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This is only if the day lynch flips scum, otherwise no Night Kill.
And you guys decide who I kill.
Also, edit to Night Kill choice #1
1) Me (PERSONAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA ) :colonveeplusalpha:
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That... doesn't answer either of my questions. How would Schezo's death clear Pesco as townie enough to not be shot at all and Zakeri as not worth stabbing for any reason beyond an info kill?
You'll have to bare with me, it's just a little irritating to churn out a post about why somebody is scum only for the next player to imply that said person would only be worth lynching for information.
By the way, you never talked about this, and I'm a little curious (I don't think it would exactly benifit scum either). What's the flavor for your role? reVelske was able to share his role info openly, I don't see why you aren't.
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Oh ffs that should say "to bear with".
What am I even doing.
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Actually, I'll clarify even more
Self Kill = Most town action
Zak kill = 2nd most town action
reV kill = Killing scummiest
Pesco kill = Selfish kill
cut by Huh What:
Oh, hm...
I'll get back to that in my next post. Otherwise, I'm a sniper.
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I don't know why you say that I completely dropped my day 2 case on PX for the most recent stuff I've brought up. I guess it wasn't crystal clear that in addition to the whole SK thing that I have explained, he has done nothing all game still, like I addressed in my 235 post and if I kept bringing it up when I already stated it today in 257, I thought it was covered. He is acting scummier than hell, when he has not said a thing all day or yesterday and people have called him out on it (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,8444.msg555366.html#msg555366) at various points, I guess you all want to just gloss over them and go after me for wanting to put town in a winning position, which I'm sure at least one scum has jumped on me at this point.
About the reV question dodging.
As I stated in my 351 I honestly didn't see the answer to that question, even when it was pointed out, it was just subtle hints that could have been taken any way someone wanted to, which I guess worked for you and PX.
And the reason I didn't vote Hourai is that I knew he was proactive enough in everyone's eyes that there simply was no chance of him being the lynch so I decided to go with conqueror for the reasons stated in my 152.
fakeedit: Cut by PX: God really, that's all you can say is that you'll be a voteable vig for town to use and you want a clear when you are threatening to vig yourself? If you really are town, how will that help the town in any way? That feels like it's indirectly just saying, "I'm not town so I'll shoot myself for town benefit." Would you really? Why? Are you even allowed to do that? I honestly see nothing redemption worthy in all of that, because you still have yet to do anything.
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Zakeri, town doesn't have PX under our thumb if we let him live today because the only way SK won't screw us over is if:
1. PX can't shoot every night
2. PX crosskills or
3. PX is a derptard
1. He said as much yesterday while explaining his role. He reloads every other night.
2. This is assuming we're lynching a townie. Why do you not want to lynch mafia?
3. This is a more significant factor than you admit it is.
Besides, if we kill PX ourselves, scum won't have to choose between shooting PX and shooting Huh what. There's very much potential and reason for a crosskill to occur. If we waste our lynch on PX, that pretty much means it's impossible for town to win without some form of clairvoyance. The kind that we obviously don't even come close to having.
You are not giving the town the edge it needs. You're removing that edge.
why did you completely delay forming a decent case on reVelske until your other suspects (Conqueror and Bard) were dead? You pressured reVelske when he procrastinated in sharing his cases with the rest of the town, so I fail to see why we should let you get away with the same thing.
I don't really have an answer for that except that for the fact that my reread came about just before I started writing up my response to Bardiche. Again, I was dicked over by the fact that Bardiche hammered, and ended the day a good dozen or so hours before I expected it. Everyone pretty much realized the Kips lynch was inevitable, including myself. I didn't vote Kips because I stood by the idea that he wasn't mafia.
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2town, 2mafia, 1SK
Town cannot win that.
Is that so? Now I've never actually played a game with a SK in it, so I'm needing some explanation here in terms of win conditions and whatnot, my understanding was that if mafia total = everyone else total, mafia wins and its game over?
Failed gambit, doctor claim. Read post 317 (http://www.shrinemaiden.org/forum/index.php/topic,8444.msg558645.html#msg558645). Only reason I unvoted was because Pesco was threatening hammer.
Why did you even quote that post when NONE of your reasons actually held any substance? Do enlighten me.
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Like I stated, reV could have lied and sacrificed himself for town's good, but his damned principles apparently get in the way.
Pesco is basically invisible to everyone except me, you and reV. Nobody has even bothered looking his direction.
Now that Zak case, it makes a good sense, but it doesn't make him scummier than the others.
So, can people please talk about Pesco and his cat?
cut by Schezo:
So...... uh..... what?
I admit to that I am acting scummier, but you're conceding that I'm not scum. Or are you saying I'm both SK AND Mafia?
Also, I knew Hourai wasn't going to get lynched. What stopped you from voting and putting pressure on him?
And the most town thing a useless town member can do towards end game is just die instead of wasting a lynch like kips.
GAHHHHHHHHHHH ZAK CUT. POSTING THIS NOW
FUUUUUUUUUUUU REV
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Hm... actually, thinking it over, Zak would be the most useful kill as it gives information pertaining to reV (D3 counter wagon) and Kitten (Main interaction)
Also, going by mafiascum, Serial Killer wins when everyone else is dead. Town wins when Mafia dies, as it says in my role PM, and mafia wins when Mafia >/= everyone else
Fine, I'll concede none of those points (except doctor claim = scum) hold much substance, but what about what everyone else has against you?
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I don't really have an answer for that except that for the fact that my reread came about just before I started writing up my response to Bardiche. Again, I was dicked over by the fact that Bardiche hammered, and ended the day a good dozen or so hours before I expected it.
You referenced that you thought reVelske was scum in your first post in D2, which was before your response to Bardiche, so I don't believe that your reVelske case originated entirely from your re-read. What did you have on reVelske at the time of your first post D1?
Like I stated, reV could have lied and sacrificed himself for town's good, but his damned principles apparently get in the way.
How do his principles make him scum, though? He has played by them across multiple games, it's not like they're a new excuse that he suddenly came up with to cover scummy actions (if you can call failing a gambit scummy in this case). I'm not understanding how what you said makes reVelske scum.
I don't have much to say about Pesco or K4U, honestly. Pesco has looked pretty townie to me all game, and while his content has not been super amazing, his attitude comes off as if he is acting in town's best interest. K4U I have trouble getting a read on, though I think she would be rather suspect if Zak flipped scum.
reV: What do you think of Zak now that he has made a post? You said you would need him to post before you could get a read on him, and now he has.
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You referenced that you thought reVelske was scum in your first post in D2, which was before your response to Bardiche, so I don't believe that your reVelske case originated entirely from your re-read. What did you have on reVelske at the time of your first post D1?
-adding to a formed bandwagon
-substituting bad play for scum tells
reVelske: I'd prefer it if you didn't wait until we clear the elephant from the room before telling us your case on Pesco and Bardiche. We lose nothing from discussing it now, but we waste time the other way around.
Granted, I should have voting for him in the post day 2. I don't know why I held off voting at all. Town or scum, I should have known better.
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3 hours 49 minutes Remaining
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1. Days will last 48 hours or until a lynch is met. If no lynch is met in that time span, no lynch will occur. The first day is an exception and will last for 72 hours.
Emphasis mine.
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I'm willing to switch to Schezo if it nets us a lynch, but I'd like to see if reV is ever going to answer my question first.
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Though, I guess voting him wouldn't exactly end the day yet.
##Unvote
##Vote Schezo
Still want to hear from reV, though.
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Busy typing, please wait warmly.
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2 Hours 49 Minutes :3
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@huhwhat: I still find him FAR less scummy than the rest. I understand your case against him (or I think I do) but... they just don't seem all that substantial IMHO. Both his defense of Kips and his jump to Conqueror's wagon are within reason that I can understand, and as for his sudden drop of Kips defense in favour of lynch... well, I'm on the same boat, seeing how I wrote Kips off as cleared then wanted him dead on D2, he really DID need to buzz off, seeing how he's been getting on everyone's nerves AND he has made no attempts to improve that on D2.
Now with that aside.
Schezo is full of shit, especially with his "PX must die" crap. He called my theories about there being a 3rd party crazy then all of a sudden goes on a crusade about PX-the-SK-must-die, that's whilst him still looking at me funny. And assuming what PX explained is correct (scum only wins when their number is equal to that of everyone else, 3rd party included), 2v2v1 is not GAME OVER for town contrary to what Schezo suggested, and it is indeed to SK's best interest to not kill anyone. Besides, we still can't be absolutely certain that PX is SK.
And his wagon jumps/attacks on D1/D2 are no better than Zak's IMHO, as mentioned, they are not as neutral as how he played previous game and do carry some good conviction, but they still mostly sounded like parroting.
Kitten still looks like an Affinity, worrying. And her complete rejection of my claim really rubs me the wrong way.
Pesco's lack of D3 contribution is scummy as hell. He starts the day with a vote on Zak with little to no reason, then proceeds to throw joke-insults at me for a period of time as if he's trying to discredit me for my theory on potential 3rd party, then jumped on Schezo with a reasonable post about his bad anti-PX-the-SK crusade. No big post. No analysis on the entire situation we are in. Nothing, just plain lurking when he had the time to post something more substantial during the weekend. His D1/D2 may seem pro-town to some, but I still don't buy that. He focused all his attention on Conqueror the entire day, starting off with a pretty weak question + vote then more or less let Conqueror talk himself into one hell of a mess. He started D2 with a very simple case on PX, proceed to prod here and there at others then went on Kips' wagon like everyone else. He's still my main lynch target at the moment, but... meh, seeing how currently the options are between Zak and Schezo, I'd rather be going for Schezo.
And seeing how I'll be available through out what remains of D3, I'll hold onto my vote for now.
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Seconding Zak getting shot as apologizing for bad actions does not make it right.
PX: What are your thoughts on shooting Kitten? I know we aren't getting much of a read on her but she's certainly not cleared by any means.
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Null tell policy lynch lurker kill? Why not?
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Meh, nothing else anybody wanna add? I know PX is at least interested in Pesco lynch, do we have at least one more? huhwhat? If not then I'm gonna put my vote down on Schezo, just want to confirm.
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I don't really support a Pesco lynch right now.
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Kitten isn't around to post and I don't expect Zak to even show up anymore.
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Well Zak is online now.
Waiting for him to say something before I hammer.
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*off to work, be back in 10-20 mins*
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Well, You've 1 Hour 49 Minutes to wait on that for.
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Zak is at the bottom end of the last active list. Means he's taken himself elsewhere for at least 10 minutes.
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Pretty sure Schezo isn't up to it
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Pretty sure Schezo isn't up to it
Wait, what?
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reV asking for anybody up for a Pesco lynch
Anyways, one game of LoL, if Schezo isn't dead, I'll hammer
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Ugh I warned you all about PX.
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Anyways, one game of LoL, if Schezo isn't dead, I'll hammer
Play DotS you nub :V
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Just pointing out, a K4U kill tonight might not be the best idea, considering she still hasn't come out in the open about her power role like she said she would.
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Give me an english translation that isn't out of date, and maybe I will. :V LoL is terrible anyways
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I have no idea what either of you are talking about!
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Main preference is still reVelske, but I'm not as certain as I was earlier today with this new information. I'd also be good with the anti-null tell Kitten lynch. I care more about alignment than role, so that thing huh what just brought up doesn't phase me.
basically, my scum list is pretty much immobile, and more or less still as I listed it in my L-1 response.
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Back.
You know, it doesn't actually make much fucking sense that I'm going to be voting the same person as my prime lynch target. Of course, I could just be wrong about Pesco.
Fuck it, LET'S DO THIS. LEEEEEEER-##UNVOTE
##VOTE: Schezo
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Suspense!
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Schezo totally has himself to blame if he's town, right? *preemptive self-comforting*
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Vote Count: VOTE AND HAMMER EDITION
Golden PX - Schezo
Zakeri - holywhat
reVelske - Kitten4U
Pesco - reVelske
Schezo - Pesco, Zakeri, holywhat, reVelske
Not Voting: Golden PX
Looks like we've got our next lynch then. Time to tub 'em.
...okay that took the tub, the toilet, and the kitchen sink, but I think I- SON OF A BITCH HES STILL TWITCHING.
THATS IT I'M DROPPING THE SUN ON THIS MOTHERFUCKER, STAND BACK.
...and finally! Ahem, fittingly being an unkillable jerky motherfucker, Schezo was Mafia Godfather.
The night phase will last 24 hours, all actions are to be PMed at this time, and #NOACTION is to be PMed if you are not acting this night phase.
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God Dammit Chaore for not making me completely immortal. You weren't supposed to bring the sun into this. >:|
(at least I died a cool way)
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Ladies and gentleman, it is time for our finale! But first, the body pile!
Pesco, Town Useless NPC was found dead in a ditch today!
At that, Zakeri, Town Defense Attorney was shot through the heart, And you're all to blame! You all give love a terrible name!
WITH 4 PEOPLE ALIVE, IT TAKES 3 TO LYNCH.
TOWN IS IN LYLO. TODAY IS THE LAST DAY TO WIN OR LOSE THIS GAME. GIVE IT YOUR ALL!
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Well. I think it's pretty obviously reV, but I'll wait and hear K4U's claim before analyzing/voting/whatever.
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Oh wait, I forgot PX was alive. I'm a retard. <___<
Well then.
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PX is cleared as not scum, by the way, unless we seriously have a scum role who can kill twice in one night, and that would be ridiculous and I would petition for Chaore to be banned from hosting forever if it were true.
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CURSES. WHY DID I SWITCH TARGETS?!
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Just to be clear, I aimed for Kitten last night. About... 2 hours ago, I switched to Zak :ohdear:
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...Zak claimed vanilla townie my ass.
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Had Zak not died I would have gunned for him today and probably lost us the game. Don't beat yourself up over it.
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PX, while you're here, what was the flavor for your D2 immobilization? Nobody ever came out in the open about it, so I believe it to be the result of a scum action, especially considering that the only player alive back then who has not currently claimed would be K4U, and based on her posting I believe she would have targeted kips instead. As a result, I'm pretty curious about the source of that immobilizing power.
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Yeah, it said I misplaced my vote and it was found superglued to my name
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Noted. Can't think of any ways in which that information would be helpful, though, beyond how it certainly doesn't seem to involve Defense Attorneys or Musicboxmen.
I suppose it is possible that Hourai copped you N1 and caused the misplaced vote as a side-effect (which would explain the red in his role name, as the immobilization is a rather scummy action), since you would have been a logical cop target for Hourai, I think.
Although, I guess set-up speculation doesn't really matter too much at this point beyond solving curiosity. I'm a bit less satisfied with my previous opinions on reV from the day's start after thinkings things over, though I still do think I know who I am going to vote at this point barring something amazing happening (won't drop names yet now that I'm still thinking it over). I want to see posts from reV and K4U ASAP, though.
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:derp:
Oh, Kitten is on.
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You know what? Fuck it.
##Vote: Kitten
Has been hidden this entire game, had a case against a townie, and that was it. COMPLETELY disappeared D3 after putting a vote on reV, and looking back, Kitten and Schezo essentially NEVER MENTIONED EACH OTHER. Not once. Also, I'm channeling Pesco's mindhax
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Also, saying you have a PR and keeping it secret is extremely helpful for scum, as now you can claim as ANYTHING and there would be absolutely no way to prove or disprove it.
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My thoughts on her are similiar to yours, though I may or may not consider her worse than reV.
I would think that it is better not to reveal our opinions completely as this point, since the day is essentially reV vs K4U and the way we post about them could affect the claims of the one that is scum.
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...They killed Pesco instead of huhwhat? What.
I knew I was gonna be the top suspect at this point unless I was lucky enough to get NK'd, so I totally prepared for this in my head before I sleep, except I can't actually remember my defense...
Now, just one thing.
Why, oh, why, would you NK Zak, PX? Surely his D3 lynch on Schezo would've fucking cleared him? There was NO reason for Zak to bus Schezo if they were both scums, Pesco was the first vote on Schezo, if Zak truly wanted an easy way out, he'd have done me in instead seeing how everyone has me as 2nd option at the very least. Now, obviously I still believe there is a 3rd party, but say if me, Schezo and Zak were ALL scums, he'd still would've bussed me rather than the godfather surely. A Zak kill was just completely and utterly uncalled for.
Still nothing on Kitten beyond the fact that she smells like last two games' Affinity, and her lack of interest to actually be around for what could've been the endgame is suspect. And again, her complete rejection of my roleclaim is odd.
That aside.
What is there for me to defend myself for, let's see things that could incriminate me.
1. OMG LACK OF CONTRIBUTION IN D1/D2, SO NOT PRO-TOWN: Funny enough, I actually did put in some, if not a lot of effort. Hell, it was a lot more than last game. D2 I did ask for time for a re-read (no different from last game), but well, we all saw how Kips pissed on everyone's battery and nobody wanted to wait around with him still causing shit.
2. Crazy ass 3rd party theories: I don't think I need to explain this, they had valid reasons.
3. False roleclaim: Nothing much I can say beyond the fact that I was not under enough pressure to do it. My main reason to roleclaim was actually just that it was possibly the last day of the game AND my role is redundant at that point, might as well do something with it... oh wait, I could possibly save huhwhat with it, might as well. Sure, if I waited until I was under pressure to claim, it would've been a lot more suspect, so as a scum, it could've just been a preemptive measure, but... *shrugs* there's no defense to that, aside from the fact that I don't lie in a mafia game :V , if I do have no issue with lying, surely I would've just said something about N1 action anyways?
4. Wanting Pesco dead: I've explained it enough yesterday.
5. Schezo being on my option 2 only and I've shown not enough interest in voting him, even go as far as asking for an alternate option at the end of the day: Well, I could've gone for a Zak lynch rather than try work my ass off for a lynch that was looking nigh impossible. I could've maybe tried to discredit Schezo a lot less and stop trying to attack his bullshit, and I've temporarily vote Schezo when I miscounted middle of the day. I don't think I have anything else to defend myself on this unless there was something I thought of last night that I've forgotten.
So, undecided about PX and Kitten, PX needs to give an explanation to his NK.
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Now, just one thing.
Why, oh, why, would you NK Zak, PX? Surely his D3 lynch on Schezo would've fucking cleared him? There was NO reason for Zak to bus Schezo if they were both scums, Pesco was the first vote on Schezo, if Zak truly wanted an easy way out, he'd have done me in instead seeing how everyone has me as 2nd option at the very least.
I disagree. I had been pressuring Zak about his case on you, so if Zak were scum and you were town, he might not have want the town to see your flip. Though none of this matters when you consider that Zak was town, anyway.
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Not to mention that going into D4 with cred from being on the Schezo wagon would have looked better than going into D4 with cred from being on the reVelske wagon (again, this is assuming you were town and Zak was scum). So yeah, I think the Zak case held up after D3 ended.
I forgot to put this in my previous post because I stop thinking halfway whenever I write things. <_____<
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Yeah, confused on the Pesco kill as well. I was fully expecting a huh what kill.
Okay, the K4U initially sent was a nulltell kill, and if she flipped town, we would get nothing out of it. I started getting scared.
Zak, if flipped town, would help others on their analysis as he was pretty much the only connection to K4U, and he was your counter wagon until obvscum Schezo came.
Cut by huh what posts
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Also, fun fact. More often than not, if it's a 3 way Lylo, and a townie has to choose who dies, the more town player is usually scum.
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Also, fun fact. More often than not, if it's a 3 way Lylo, and a townie has to choose who dies, the more town player is usually scum.
So ignoring me being alive, you're basically saying you're scum? :V
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Like scum could kill twice.
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Well, if you are scum who can not only use a night action while going on the kill, but have said night action be a nightvig of all things, then that's something the Godmothers should be taking care of postgame instead of us.
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Every scum kill the target has been found dead. Every vig kill I claimed, gunshot. I'm obviously not lying about the vig claim. Anyways, Kitten, your defense?
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Okay, so claim time:
I am ye old charming rogue. So yeah, I was the one that stuck PX's vote in his face (at least I was nice enough to give it back to you after I stole it <3). But my ability has one more side effect. I also take their power for one night, just as it is (this is important). As far as I can tell, they will be notified that their vote is stuck, but they will NOT be notified that their ability has been stolen for a night. When I steal their ability I get a flavorless description of what it does (well, I do get a LITTLE flavor, but it's inconsequential; I will NOT be able to tell a person's alignment or flavor role based on the info I get). I can only use this on odd numbered nights (vote steal will show up on even numbered days, I'm just supposed to use whatever I stole on the even numbered nights) and my vote steal does not work in LYLO. The other ability, however, does. If my target dies then NONE of my abilities work.
List form for convenience:
-On odd numbered nights I pick a target to steal from. I steal their vote and their ability.
-They are informed that their vote has been stolen, but not their ability (confirmed with the mod)
-The night after I steal I can use the ability that I stole. The original owner will not be able to use it.
-The original owner will get their ability back after that. I do not keep it forever.
-My vote steal will not activate in LYLO for balance reasons (according to the mod), but I can still steal abilities.
-When I steal abilities I steal them "as they currently are," meaning I can only use what the owner would be capable of using the next night, and that is all I see as well. Again, I am NOT an effective rolecop.
-If my target dies then nothing happens.
I figured the best use of my ability would be to steal votes from scum and then stick them on themself. That would also cost them one use of whatever their abilities were.
Night 1 I targeted PX as everyone can clearly see. I received a gun that was out of bullets and was therefore completely useless. I wasn't sure if I was capable of stealing the mafia's NK (mod would not confirm), so I wasn't convinced that he was town until after he claimed. So far, everything he's said and done is the same as the little bit of info I received. Naturally, since what I took was useless I did nothing N2.
N2, I couldn't do anything.
N3 I targeted Rev. He is lying scum. I only get info on what I can actually use, so I'm assuming he's some kind of JOAT because I received a one shot redirect and track. I'm betting he used the rest of his abilities already, so I wasn't able to steal them (again the "as they currently are" is important). While I'm not exactly a reliable rolecop I think it's safe to assume that what he claimed yesterday is not what he can actually do.
Now for some explanation of my target choices: Rev I think is obvious. That claim looked really, really fake, especially considering how powerful town was already, and I thought he was pretty scummy. I picked PX because I thought that if there was a town vig that Kips would be dead N1. I didn't pick Sect because I wasn't sure if he would be modkilled or not. I didn't want to waste my ability, so I went for PX because I didn't like his D1 play (I believe I have explained all that already).
I believe I have already gone over why I think Rev's claim is fake and why he is scummy (though I will be more than happy to elaborate for anyone). Combine that with the fact that his claim is not true I am comfortable with doing this:
##Vote reVelske
Oh, Kitten is on.
Give me a second to type man, I type slow. :(
Warning - while you were typing 6 new replies have been posted. You may wish to review your post.
Stop that. ;_;
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I don't agree with Schezo lynch yielding more town cred than that of mine, especially seeing how he was defending his vote on me well enough IMHO. Buuuuut...
Oh well, if PX is SK, he has essentially lost if we take out the scum, and yeah well, if PX is another scum then.... you know, fuck, with the town having... 6 power roles, it doesn't actually seem completely out of question.
But whatever, Kitten it is.
Anything anyone need me to explain? In terms of my actions? I really don't see how i can defend my position any further than I have.
EDIT: Ah kitten posted.
Old charming rogue?
Eh.
I was informed that I was the only non-modern PR of the game.
##VOTE: Kitten
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I was informed that I was the only non-modern PR of the game.
Jesus seems pretty modern to me. :V
Tempted to just hammer reV right now, but will look over the situation a bit more when I'm done with homework.
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Oh wait, PX is still on K4U. <____<
Actually, I've thought this over and I really can't find any holes in K4U's claim, and I believe it for a number of reasons that I don't feel are necessary to explain. Combined with the blatant Jesus contradiction and the inanity of the mod telling a player "hey, you're the only non-modern role in the game" (in Mafia RPG of all things), there's no real point in delaying the game's ending.
##Unvote
##Vote reVelske
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Jesus seems pretty modern to me. :V
Jesus seem modern to me. I'd imagine Chaore is referring to RPG elements, note how Paladin is the only PR that actually fits into the RPG flavoured scenario, isn't it convenient for kitten to come up another one that fits into the game's theme?
N3 I targeted Rev. He is lying scum.
N3 I targeted Rev. He is lying scum.
N3 I targeted Rev. He is lying scum.
N3 I targeted Rev. He is lying scum.
That, woman, is completely and utterly uncalled for. That is the biggest fucking insult I've ever taken for as long as I've been on the net.
You disgust me.
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I can't believe you huhwhat, really? You actually buy all that crap? And surely stealing PX's power in N1 would've still given her the ability to NK anyways?
This is unfuckingbelievable.
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You're all a party of 12 adventurers. Except SOME OF YOU ARE EVIL. Hunt monsters, fight bosses, collect sweet loot, and kill eachother blindly until you figure out who is actually evil! Good luck!
AR PEE GEE ELEMENTS. WAKE UP.
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What kind of flavour did you get from my gun?
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Forget that
:derp:
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I'd imagine Chaore is referring to RPG elements, note how Paladin is the only PR that actually fits into the RPG flavoured scenario, isn't it convenient for kitten to come up another one that fits into the game's theme?
Nevermind that it fits perfectly with what I actually DO. Unless you have a better explanation for how PX's vote got stuck to himself?
And surely stealing PX's power in N1 would've still given her the ability to NK anyways?
I'm assuming this is for balance reasons. The mod probably didn't want there to be a vig kill every night.
What kind of flavour did you get from my gun?
Just that I was able to grab it while you were distracted by super glue, but it was out of bullets, so I couldn't really do anything with it and that I should probably make sure to take some ammo next time I try to take a gun.
Ninja
Well, there you go anyway. :V
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I'm assuming this is for balance reasons. The mod probably didn't want there to be a vig kill every night.
Plus, PX had to reload after firing. It's evident you stole the gun while there were no bullets in it.
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I've rolled the dice about a dozen times. And huh what seems unchanging in his vote, so it's essentially going to be a stalemate. Oh, guess what the result was?
##Unvote
##Vote: reVelske
I want this damn game over now
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Another fucking scum victory from another lurker. I fucking ragequit this forum.
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Another fucking scum victory from another lurker. I fucking ragequit this forum.
Hey, I wasn't lurking any more than I normally do. :(
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Blame huh what, as I pretty much saw no way of convincing him that Kitten was the scum.
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Vote Count: This Is It!
reVelske - Kitten4U, huhwhat,Golden PX
Kitten4u - reVelske
THE GAME IS OVER.
I'd post the results but I don't want Chaore to yell at me. Not that you can't tell anyway.
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I want to strangle someone. WHY DID NO ONE QUESTION WHY KITTEN WAS LURKING ALL GAME?
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First town lynch ever, from someone who accused ME of LYING. This unfuckingbelievable. Nobody here takes any emotions from posts into consideration. Nobody gives a shit about my I-don't-lie claim. Everything has to be based on plain logic when it's clear how that fucking worked out for last two games. IT'S THE SAME SHIT. You stay low, you post infrequently but with something like and constructive, and you automatically sail to victory? God fucking dammit.
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I spent 8 fucking minutes deciding what the perfect way to code that votecount for maximum prettiness was, and then the game goes and ends ;_;
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And that stealing empty gun thing MAKES NO SENSE. SHE IS STEALING A PR, NOT A GUN.
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:s
@ Conqueror: I would have voted K4U before the roleclaim, which was really, really well-thought out and convincing (kudos to her for that), and reV pulling the "I'm the only person with an old-timey role" card came off like desperate scum to me. Had he not done that, I might not have voted.
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Again, I was lurking any more than I normally would as town. 1 - 2 posts is fairly normal for me. I typically only post more when I get into arguments. This is actually me being extremely active as scum. :V
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And for this, PX, you shall suffer my neverending wrath in DotS, prepare for eternal butt bleeding.
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Also, thanks HW. I spent several hours coming up with it. I'm sure I annoyed the mods with my indecisiveness last night. :V
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I have to say, looking at past games Kitten seems to have really well thought out fake role claims as scum. So kudos to her for that.
But argh it's so painful watching from the sidelines. :(
Edit: @Kitten: Even so, it would have been nice if people pressured you a bit more.
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I knew Kitten was the scum! I seriously regret changing targets!!!! But Kitten had huh what around her finger
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Kitten did I ever tell you I love you. :*
That was badass.
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Oh, you're on reV! You're fucking on! Of course, I still don't know the items, so I'm sure I'll still die a lot.
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Fake claims are like the best part of being scum, so I always have a lot of fun with them. :P
Scum QT (http://www.quicktopic.com/45/H/2wqU6JQA7FC) for those interested.
Kitten did I ever tell you I love you.
:3
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oh goodness I was not expecting to wake up to this.
Ahem.
reVelske, Town Paladin has been lynched and killed.
holywhat Town Jesus and PX Town Sniper have lost the game.
Kitten4U Mafia Vote Thief has won the game!
I suppose I'll gather together stuff for the final post then.
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But Kitten had huh what around her finger
If claims were not taken into account, she would have won my vote by a long shot.
But excuses aside, I still didn't do that well this game. Sadface at Zak's flip by the way, I really thought I was onto something with my case on him. Oh well.
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I knew you were a pile of crap Kitten
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I knew you were a pile of crap Kitten
:(
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PX, why vig me? I really seemed like the scummiest guy to you at the end of D1?
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You know what? I blame huh what for this loss.
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You know what? I blame huh what for this loss.
I blame kips. <_____<
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@PX: No I wasn't kidding around, I have every intention to make your game as unenjoyable as possible, I'm really THAT pissed off over it right now. It's just plain fucking annoying how no-one, NO-ONE, takes my sincerity seriously, it's like I'm playing 3 fucking games of mafia with a bunch of heartless computers with no sense of emotions.
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well
I mean I'm supposed to wait for chaore I guess but he doesn't seem to be here, everyone already knows scum won, I can't lock to topic to make people wait, and K4U already gave out the scum quicktopic
oh whatever
Mod topic - http://www.quicktopic.com/45/H/6FmbcDCxFjCZk
Graveyard - http://www.quicktopic.com/45/H/7y6vYB325aqWH
That roleclaim was absolutely beautiful by the way, Kitten.
As for last few remaining roles, K4U was a Vote Thief (no she had no power stealing thing), Golden PX was a vig that had a one-night cooldown, rev was indeed a Paladin like he said, and huhwhat was obviously Jesus.
Musicboxman could kill himself to reverse an action that caused 6 or more deaths EVEN THOUGH THAT COULDN'T POSSIBLY HAPPEN (durr)
and I'm too lazy to do any more plus I feel like chaore might get mad at me or something
Just be glad I made Chaore get rid of the role that was scum except was for ALL INTENTS AND PURPOSES ACTUALLY A TOWNIE GOOD LUCK CATCHING THAT BY NOT COMPLETELY ACCIDENT
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oh there he is derp
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I explained the vig choice back when I claimed vig. Go back to page 6 (If you're using 50 posts a page like you should)
Also, Schezo, I hate you. How dare you call me dumb
Dammit, cut by 2 posts
reV, I dropped everything against you on the last day. I knew Kitten was scum! Blame huh what for everything!
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Huh what, if you never asked for the flavor, then Kitten would have NEVER been able to forge that damn false claim
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Oh and huh what you did it a lot just now on the final day. Stop answering people's question's and give them a chance to goof up before you post what you think is the logical answer. :X
PX: I was scum, I had to make some bullshit up so I could get cases on you people. :(
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I blame kips. <_____<
Well gee thanks.
inb4everyoneblamesmeforscumwin@PX: No I wasn't kidding around, I have every intention to make your game as unenjoyable as possible, I'm really THAT pissed off over it right now. It's just plain fucking annoying how no-one, NO-ONE, takes my sincerity seriously, it's like I'm playing 3 fucking games of mafia with a bunch of heartless computers with no sense of emotions.
Dude, calm down. It's a god damned forum game. Even I didnt flip the fuck out like you are right now, and I'm as bipolar as it gets.
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Reading through the mod topic
I hate you all
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It would have been all you if there wasn't a Jesus, what with Sect getting modkilled.
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And just clearing this up, I was a TOWN bi-polar cop. I don't even know why you guys even debated my alignment.
The bi-polar was something I was not aware of until i flipped. My investigations would go back and forth between accurate and incorrect each night, starting on accurate.
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This game... Was painful to watch. To an immense degree. Every single thing about Kips was headdesk-worthy beyond belief, as everyone knows.
And... Really, ReV? You're complaining about people not taking what you say at absolute freaking face value in MAFIA of all things? Mafia really, REALLY is not a game about who can make the most emotionally moving arguments or whatever. It's a game about freaking trickery of all things. It doesn't matter how honest you genuinely are or how much you despise lying, in this game, people really can't get away with just assuming that whatever people say is 100% true. Why are you playing Mafia if this fills you with so much rage?
PX is PX. I don't think it is necessary to comment on him.
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Oh dear god that initial set-up. Town was OP enough as it is, we lucked out that the cop was nailed N1 I think. x: And that there were a few distractions.
Oh, I suppose I can explain the Pesco kill now. It was pure paranoia on my part. Some resurrection roles can't be killed again (wasn't a problem with Schezo alive, but I couldn't afford to let the game last one more day) and I was afraid that Rev's ability might not be one-shot and that he would protect HW for sure. Pesco was just the next towniest.
Damn all you ninjas!
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Ah well. Well played scum. We sucked at town this game.
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Oh, I suppose I can explain the Pesco kill now. It was pure paranoia on my part. Some resurrection roles can't be killed again (wasn't a problem with Schezo alive, but I couldn't afford to let the game last one more day) and I was afraid that Rev's ability might not be one-shot and that he would protect HW for sure.
I had -considered- claiming bulletproof after reviving, but with theories about me being survivor being thrown around (by Pesco, derp) I didn't want to risk getting accused or even potentially outing a real bulletproof.
Also, I'm totally okay with you winning now because of the Mindfang avatar.
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And... Really, ReV? You're complaining about people not taking what you say at absolute freaking face value in MAFIA of all things? Mafia really, REALLY is not a game about who can make the most emotionally moving arguments or whatever. It's a game about freaking trickery of all things. It doesn't matter how honest you genuinely are or how much you despise lying, in this game, people really can't get away with just assuming that whatever people say is 100% true. Why are you playing Mafia if this fills you with so much rage?
Players' playstyle and other meta are perfectly valid tools to use in Mafia, whereas cold logic can be manipulated (again, as displayed by Affinity for the last two games, and now Kitten), playstyle and various other aspects of a player seldom change. There is no reason why one should not to go with a little gut feeling and try read into people's use of emotions.
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Town tripped all over themselves pretty much until near the end of D3, really.
It would have been ridiculous if PX hadn't changed his vig off of Kitten at the last moment. Most sudden town win ever. Neither of the scum suspected at all until like less then 24 hours before the last day's lynch or something.
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The initial set up had a much stronger town because scum was also much stronger in that they were nigh-undetectable to town. Town would just screw with itself.
This town was similarly strong, but with the strongest parts requiring patience and luck.
Something Town sorely lacked.
Oh and on K4U's claim- I'm surprised anyone bought it, why would I give someone vote thievery and power thievery on the same night? That's insane. I did have a rogue PR in the original build though.
Anyway, Back to devising something for a final post of content or something.
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Players' playstyle and other meta are perfectly valid tools to use in Mafia, whereas cold logic can be manipulated (again, as displayed by Affinity for the last two games, and now Kitten), playstyle and various other aspects of a player seldom change. There is no reason why one should not to go with a little gut feeling and try read into people's use of emotions.
Gut feeling? That's what I did. Look at where it landed me. DEAD.
Mafias a game of trickery. If you wanna be a sore loser about it, do so to yourself. No one likes a whiner.
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Sorry to butt in as a lurker here, but I've been wanting to say this all game. reV, kindly shut up about refusing to lie in Mafia. It's not something to be proud of. Mafia is a game of deception, and every time you roll scum or some power role that serves the town best by keeping itself concealed, you're playing against your faction by holding your truthfulness over your victory condition. As far as I'm concerned, refusing to lie makes you no better than some chucklefuck that joins the game just to troll. At least Kips has plausible deniability.
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And sure, I play mafia with a strong principle that was no doubt going to screw me over one day, but it doesn't make me any less buttfuckinghurt when it closes on a day with the scum accusing me of being a liar. You try live your life with total honesty than get hanged by being falsely accused of lying.
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Oh and on K4U's claim- I'm surprised anyone bought it, why would I give someone vote thievery and power thievery on the same night? That's insane. I did have a rogue PR in the original build though.
Yeah, that's what I had been thinking while I was reading it; "Wow, this fakeclaim is beautiful, but isn't it a little over the top to be believed?"
...and then huhwhat did believe, which is a testament to how incredibly awesome that fakeclaim was.
If I was as good as Kitten at fakeclaiming, I would have won Moriya Shrine Mafia ): that was like my last good game before I fell into pieces mentally. Was going strong until LyLo night shenanigans ruining my plan and then coming up with a bad fakeclaim that ruined me.
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...frankly it wouldn't take much to have fooled this town.
I'm still amazed you actually got Schezo. Still wonder if Pesco got the Mod QT or something.
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Guys, don't give me vig again. I HIT BOTH TOWN COPS LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL
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Also, I wasn't fooled by Kitten's fakeclaim.
huh what was
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And sure, I play mafia with a strong principle that was no doubt going to screw me over one day, but it doesn't make me any less buttfuckinghurt when it closes on a day with the scum accusing me of being a liar. You try live your life with total honesty than get hanged by being falsely accused of lying.
Not going to screw over just you, but your whole team too, as well as the game itself. That's what's unforgivable.
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@HW Pahaha. :V
I went on a Homestruck binge while sick last week. The original pic was too amazing not to use. I've been waiting for like a week to switch, but I don't like switching avatars in the middle of a Mafia game.
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Reading through the mod topic, you really thought my role was strong? It was basically a one-shot vote stick. I didn't actually find it useful beyond being easily conformable. If I could use it in LYLO it would be strong, but otherwise it was fairly meh.
Oh and on K4U's claim- I'm surprised anyone bought it, why would I give someone vote thievery and power thievery on the same night?
This claim was so hard to devise. I didn't think just vote thief would be strong enough for me to justify calling Rev out, so I beefed it up a bit, but unrestricted it would be really, really strong. I figured the best way to handle it was to make it temporary (which fit in with everything better anyway) and to make it so I couldn't try to steal things again even if I hit a VT or something. Needless to say, I was thinking super hard about all this because I knew I'd be dead if I didn't have a good fake claim.
Warning - while you were typing 4 new replies have been posted. You may wish to review your post.
And that's after reading like 7. Curse you ninjas. :V
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Holy crap the mod thread has me rolling. :]
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This was an interesting game...maybe I'll join again...
Also, while I agree with Rev somewhat, emotion can be played with too in a voice and faceless environment.
Edit: Also Slur, it's just a play style, not every one will be willing to compromise what they believe even if it's for something not serious. Like me, I have trouble blaming people on assumptions.
Also also, you don't need to lie to play Mafia, you just need to word your self properly I think.
Warning - while you were typing 8 new replies have been posted. You may wish to review your post.
;_;
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Well, I guess it was a good game, aside from the sour apples (Myself and rev at the end). Kitten, That was actually one of the smartest things I've seen before. Turning your mafia role, admitting it, but changing it just enough so you seem like a town PR.
Warning - while you were typing 2 new replies have been posted. You may wish to review your post.
fuuuu
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also isn't kitten supposed to be playing :V
Oh you. Like I never lurk through D1 regardless of alignment anyway. :V
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Gut feeling? That's what I did. Look at where it landed me. DEAD.
But that's just you :V
Sorry to butt in as a lurker here, but I've been wanting to say this all game. reV, kindly shut up about refusing to lie in Mafia. It's not something to be proud of. Mafia is a game of deception, and every time you roll scum or some power role that serves the town best by keeping itself concealed, you're playing against your faction by holding your truthfulness over your victory condition. As far as I'm concerned, refusing to lie makes you no better than some chucklefuck that joins the game just to troll. At least Kips has plausible deniability.
It IS something to be proud of, to play a game using what tools there are available aside from the most powerful one. Beside, deception does not necessarily require you to provide others with false information. You really are exaggerating on the need of deception.
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huh what. If you NEVER NEVER EVER came back, we would have won. God dammit huh what
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huh what. If you NEVER NEVER EVER came back, we would have won. God dammit huh what
You would have lost terribly. I'll be blunt about it.
On vote thief: Control the spice, control the world. I probably nerfed it a bit too much in fear, but it would've been unholy if you had it all the time.
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@Chaore: I agree, it was too strong for LYLO, but I think it was too weak for this town. It would have been nice to have a roleblock or something. :P
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reV you're free to play mafia without ever telling a lie, but nobody else in the universe does that, and nobody is going to trust you 100%, ever. Mafia is not a game where everybody tells the truth. Please don't meltdown because people don't treat you different than they would any other player. If you can't handle being called a liar in a game where it is expected that people will lie, you probably should find a different game to play.
that said lmfao nice job town way to blow it in lylo again (yes I realize I'm not one to talk)
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Quoting from the deadthread.
My role was One-shot sane cop, with the stipulation that any other person who investigated the same person I did would get the opposite result that I did.
I wanted to use my investigation on reV since I though he was the scummiest. This was back on the beginning of day 2. I made my first post, and held off voting until I could get the results from my investigation.
Then suddenly, Bardiche posted continuing head strong with the "Zakeri, why do you have a different opinion of who is scum than I and Kitten do?" Case, and completely ignored the fact that we had solid flips to analyze. So naturally, I changed it at the last minute and investigated him. And I got town result.
Then I make a response to him with the knowledge he was town, and I made a reread of the entire game, and organized my scumlist ... and then Bard hammered before I could say anything. And then he died in the middle of the night.
So here I was, without a god damn vote, with barely a clue or a lead, with no chance to post anything about my real conclusions until day three, with a single cop result, on a person who died before I could reveal I was a one-shot cop, with another, completely different cop already dead.
I ended up cursing Bard's name more than Chaore's.
Additionally, Huh what, your logic for persuing me on day 4 makes no sense. Why would I, as scum, suddenly turn on someone who was bulletproof and/or investigation proof when I had the only confirmed townie making the strongest case on me. if Anything, I'd have had Schezo going directly for my own throat, rather than letting him keep pushing the SK/Vig wagon.
Also, I'm surprised K4u had a modest reason for NKing Pesco. I could have sworn it was because he stated his intention to Policy lynch her in a lylo situation, and therefore decided Huhwhat the confirmed town was the less of two votes (which he totally was).
Also, 17 cuts. I dare you to beat that.
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huh what. If you NEVER NEVER EVER came back, we would have won. God dammit huh what
Okay, I'll go back in time and make myself a vanilla townie. Enjoy your D3 LYLO and inability to get Schezo lynched due to a lack of paranoia about you being a SK :V
Zak: I didn't take Godfather being bulletproof into account. :s I suppose you have a point, so apologies for the tunneling I guess
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It IS something to be proud of, to play a game using what tools there are available aside from the most powerful one. Beside, deception does not necessarily require you to provide others with false information. You really are exaggerating on the need of deception.
Handicapping yourself in a solo game can be pretty cool when you win. If you rolled SK and managed to win without telling a single falsehood, I'd applaud your resourcefulness. But when you handicap your whole faction with your refusal to lie, without the consent of that faction, you're just ruining their fun.
Sure, sometimes there's no need to lie, like if you're a vanilla townie, or one with a role that lends itself well to LyLo claiming. But what if you're, say, a bomb? Being evasive with your roleclaim will just make everyone suspicious, and actually claiming bomb reduces the possibility that scum will blow themselves up on you. The smart thing to do there is to lie about your role. To do otherwise isn't something to be proud of, it's just dumb play.
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Also, I'm surprised K4u had a modest reason for NKing Pesco. I could have sworn it was because he stated his intention to Policy lynch her in a lylo situation, and therefore decided Huhwhat the confirmed town was the less of two votes (which he totally was).
I was actually afraid that people would call me out on that despite it not actually being part of my decision. :V
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>Slurpentarius
But... I just... it's so... @_@
/me slurps Serpentarius
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>Slurpentarius
But... I just... it's so... @_@
/me slurps Serpentarius
I can't help it if I'm delicious.
Also, because I don't feel like making a post without any rage in it at the moment, I should also say that playing in such a way as to purposefully establish a meta for yourself is extremely unethical.
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How so? ???
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@Vibri:
As mentioned, it's not so much because I was called a liar, but it was mostly because of the situation we were in. As mentioned before, I have actually never been town lynch before, out of...7-8 games I've played so far, and to end the streak on such a terrible note is quite unpleasant, to say the least.
Handicapping yourself in a solo game can be pretty cool when you win. If you rolled SK and managed to win without telling a single falsehood, I'd applaud your resourcefulness. But when you handicap your whole faction with your refusal to lie, without the consent of that faction, you're just ruining their fun.
You do not necessarily handicap your faction by refusing to lie, there is always a way. Say in the situation of a bomb, I could speak of my role's potency to excuse my unwillingness to roleclaim, hell, I could tone myself to sound rather derpy and noobish.
And isn't it ironic that you call it unethical to play a game with self-established ethics?
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Hey wait a second, isn't it a towns job to be as truthful as possible? Because if they lie and is caught out on it, they'll just seem scummy and thus would hinder town chance by making them think they're mafia instead of trying to find the actual scum.
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Town usually has no reason to lie. Thinking back, fuck. I should have lied about the flavor.
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You do not necessarily handicap your faction by refusing to lie, there is always a way. Say in the situation of a bomb, I could speak of my role's potency to excuse my unwillingness to roleclaim, hell, I could tone myself to sound rather derpy and noobish.
And that will be less effective than simply claiming vanilla, at least in some circumstances.
How so?
It's metagaming. Sacrificing the game you're playing just to give yourself better odds in future games. You should play the game you're playing, not try to obtain the best win/loss ratio you can by sacrificing your performance in the current game. Handicapping yourself as scum so people will be more confident in your towniness when you're town is just kind of low.
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Ah, that's what you mean. Yeah I understand that but I don't think that's what Rev is going for....
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Ah, that's what you mean. Yeah I understand that but I don't think that's what Rev is going for....
Not intentionally. I'm not questioning his motives here. But that's what its effects amount to.
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And that will be less effective than simply claiming vanilla, at least in some circumstances.
So everyone must play the most effective way possible rather than the way they want? The way their personalities want them to play? Hell, let's all play the Affinity/Kitten method, infrequent but constructive post, fuck yeah everyone wins.
Sacrificing the game you're playing just to give yourself better odds in future games. You should play the game you're playing, not try to obtain the best win/loss ratio you can by sacrificing your performance in the current game. Handicapping yourself as scum so people will be more confident in your towniness when you're town is just kind of low.
That is not my goal, I do play the game I'm playing, but you are free to assume whatever you want. There is absolutely no game-sacrificing especially since my principles are not going to change. What I want to establish is my playstyle, when emotion and meta are things I use extensively, it's imperative I start getting people to understand me and try understand other players and their style. Unfortunately, I'm still relatively new to the forum and do not partake on most of the forum activities, so it's been incredibly difficult for me to settle down in this particular Mafia community, but clearly I've been working on it.
And as a scum, I play how I would usually play as a town, that, to me, is the most effective way to play a scum, there is no real handicapping involved.
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Just to be clear, I aimed for Kitten last night. About... 2 hours ago, I switched to Zak :ohdear:
Had Zak not died I would have gunned for him today and probably lost us the game. Don't beat yourself up over it.
Just wanted to point out this little exchange, because it's hilarious in hindsight. :V
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:s
What can I say, I thought Zak was scum. Had I realized that godfathers are usually bulletproof things might have been different, but eh.
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Hey, I thought Zak was scum too up to a point. Just pointing out that PX miraculously winning the game for town would have been mind-blowing, given how badly we played as a whole.
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Look, reV, you don't have to lie if you don't want to, but when you vocally claim that you never lie even when it's necessary for your faction's victory condition, and you attempt to use that as a trump card to prove your role, as you tried to do in this game, people are going to accuse you of sabotaging yourself for the sake of meta. It's just bad sportsmanship.
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Look, reV, you don't have to lie if you don't want to, but when you vocally claim that you never lie even when it's necessary for your faction's victory condition, and you attempt to use that as a trump card to prove your role, as you tried to do in this game, people are going to accuse you of sabotaging yourself for the sake of meta. It's just bad sportsmanship.
This.
Let me go onto say that, as he said, you dont have to lie if you dont want to. Say someone told me I could get a hundred thousand dollars, but I didnt have to if I didnt want to. What would you do, not take it?
Next time when you lose, Dont cry about it. It's a game. However its played, dont complain at the end about it. It'll give you as bad a rep as me. Hell I'm lucky I wasnt banned here the second the game ended because of my shitty performance.
tl;dr Stop crying and go home and be a family man
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You're not banned YET since Pesco hasn't been on since... I sent that second N3 action.
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So I've read the mod and graveyard quick topics.
I did not think that Mafia would fill me with such pure rage and absolute HATRED when I am not participating.
I will not comment on anyone else for this. But Kips should not be allowed near Mafia again ever. In fact I would support more extreme measures than that.
He is an idiot of the highest caliber through the entire game. He then reveals that he ALSO was deliberately being a jerk and screwing things up for town.
The former alone is rage-inducing, but the latter is simply disgusting and cannot go without comment.
I am not going to go into any more detail about how I feel about him or others right now because to be honest I'm just so filled with rage. Yes I know Mafia is a game, yes I know I wasn't even IN the game. Doesn't change it.
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Look, reV, you don't have to lie if you don't want to, but when you vocally claim that you never lie even when it's necessary for your faction's victory condition, and you attempt to use that as a trump card to prove your role, as you tried to do in this game, people are going to accuse you of sabotaging yourself for the sake of meta. It's just bad sportsmanship.
I'm not trying to rub my principle in people's face if that's what it's coming across as, I'm merely defending my principle and explaining why the hell am I raging so hard about this, and I understand perfectly that people don't have to be playing "my" game, but the frustration does really set in after a while.
Let me go onto say that, as he said, you dont have to lie if you dont want to. Say someone told me I could get a hundred thousand dollars, but I didnt have to if I didnt want to. What would you do, not take it?
What? The fuck? Of course I wouldn't take it if I have a firm principle against it, no idea what you are trying to get at.
Next time when you lose, Dont cry about it. It's a game. However its played, dont complain at the end about it. It'll give you as bad a rep as me. Hell I'm lucky I wasnt banned here the second the game ended because of my shitty performance.
tl;dr Stop crying and go home and be a family man
Don't mix me with you, whereas you de-repped yourself for playing like a complete moron, I simply tried to play with a little principle. I've explained how my rage was simply due to me losing my streak on a terrible point and and the accusation that goes completely against the principle I play with, it's not embitterment towards the game itself, don't see me bitching about last two games.
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Leaving that aside, it also does gnaws me quite badly how by simply coming up with a complicated and unique role was enough to win the trust of your fellow town and the approval of fellow players (despite how I pointed out that stealing an emptied gun when you are a rolestealer makes no sense).
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Hey reV, whenever you feel like kicking my ass on DotS, get on now.
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It's 6:35AM for me, heading to work in an hour and half's time. Can't believe I got up at 3AM for this shit, what a great way to start the day, huh?
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Eh, I guess Chaore isn't going to make an end-game post?
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He did, didn't he?
SD: I don't mean this offensively, but is it really necessary to make a post implying that you hate various players of this game when you were not even in it and, as far as I gather, have not even been in very many games yourself? :|
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What is going on in this thread, why are we raging.
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Eh, I guess Chaore isn't going to make an end-game post?
well i was, but neo kinda linked all there is.
unless you guys want me to toss out awards and stuff. i could do that!
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@ Bard: D4 starts on page 15, if you want to find out for yourself.
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unless you guys want me to toss out awards and stuff. i could do that!
Well I don't see why not~
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Bardiche should win an award for actually crumbing Musicboxman, I think that's hilarious.
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I should win an award for not only ALMOST killing both scum, but for actually killing both cops
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SD: I don't mean this offensively, but is it really necessary to make a post implying that you hate various players of this game when you were not even in it and, as far as I gather, have not even been in very many games yourself? :|
Going by a strict definition of the word "necessary"? No, I suppose not. I wouldn't use the word "various" either, as I believe the number is rather small for that term. And no, I haven't been in many games myself. And I'm not remotely going to claim that I did remotely well in any way shape or form either. But that really doesn't change the sheer amount of horrible that was blatantly obvious even to someone who personally doesn't HAVE any appreciable skill in Mafia.
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Yeah I read it.
So basically reVelske is angry and insulted people didn't automatically assume that No, Rev Would Never Lie To Us and, in a game based around deceiving, insinuated he was a liar...
... meanwhile observers are raging at Mudkips as well...
... and the mod is completely absent while some people consider if the setup was really balanced?
Did I catch everything now? Man, you guys. Rev, chill the heck down. This is a game where you're meant to lie and deceive if you are scum. It is not weird people will assume that whatever extremist views you have (and yes, not lying ever is an extremist view to me) would be abandoned in favour of the game, since you choose to play a game based around lying.
I can understand one rage, but your rage, Rev? No, totally uncalled for. You can't blame people for not believing you are the shining pinnacle of honesty never before seen in the world; the world isn't that nice, and neither is this game.
@Huhwhat: Well I figured I should crumble, even though I took the rule as ridiculous and assumed no use out of it. It's a Mafia tradition to do role madness with bastard modding and screw over one or two people by making them vanilla. It's like everyone got a toy but you, except the mod tries to make you think you got a toy.
But just in case a sixtuple killer was around, I wanted to crumble it.
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Aside from kips, I don't think people were that rage-incudingly horrible this game, honestly. Conqueror and Sect were not actually that bad for newbies in my opinion (I enjoyed reading Sect's posts even if I did suspect him), and while PX and reV were pretty ehhhh, they weren't unforgivably terrible to the extent that their play should draw ire.
@ Bard: The mod is around, I believe. Serela posted a link to the mod quicktopic at least, which has the set-up.
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I'm not trying to rub my principle in people's face if that's what it's coming across as, I'm merely defending my principle and explaining why the hell am I raging so hard about this, and I understand perfectly that people don't have to be playing "my" game, but the frustration does really set in after a while.
"Your" game seems to be to mildly disadvantage yourself as scum so you have a trump card to play as town. Whether your reasons are more noble than that or not, it's still not sportsmanlike. If you're too busy playing "your" game to play by the etiquette of ours, you probably shouldn't be signing up in the first place.
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Hmm, I'm wondering, how does role claim work?
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Hmm, I'm wondering, how does role claim work?
You tell others what your role is.
Or you bullshit a claim.
Scum usually does the latter. Town should sometimes. We had an actual role madness game, everyone a role... except one guy was "vanilla". When he claimed he got lynched immediately.
Roleclaim is usually done at LyLo. Anyone insisting you roleclaim without roleclaiming themselves should always be taken with caution. Roleclaim when you're about to be lynched, too; not all mods reveal what your role does, and it's useful to town to know.
Fullclaim also involves divulging who you targeted and why.
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NOOOO, that's NOT what I'm really raging about! FML. /wrist.
For the last time, I rage because I lost my streak of never being town lynched, now it usually wouldn't be so bad, but to end it on such a terrible note and being accused of something that's completely against my principle is like a massive slap on the face. THAT is what I'm raging about. Also, it's partly from the frustration that I am still unable to establish my meta and begin to using it to my advantage, I understand that the attempt itself may very well never work and I do not really expect people to play how I want them to play, it's totally just a side bonus of playing with such a principle, if I don't get that benefit, tough luck, you know. But it does make it a little frustrating, considering I've manage to establish it with ease on different community.
And also how everyone just wrote kitten off because her action is "pro-town", and nobody seems to relate her playstyle to that of Affinity's from last two game and just how easily he won it all.
"Your" game seems to be to mildly disadvantage yourself as scum so you have a trump card to play as town. Whether your reasons are more noble than that or not, it's still not sportsmanlike. If you're too busy playing "your" game to play by the etiquette of ours, you probably shouldn't be signing up in the first place.
Last part was a bit uncalled for, no? I still think you are exaggerating, despite that I can see where you are coming from. The "ettiquette" of yours is no different from the ettiquette of any mafia community, assuming you speak of deception. It certainly does take away scum's main tool of the game, a good example with kitten's final day's play. Despite her constant "pro-town" play with little that can be used to incriminate her, without that final fakeclaim, she'd have been in a whole lot more trouble than how things turned out. I have nothing to argue against that with. It's giving myself a lot more work and, I suppose, putting my faction at a slight disadvantage, but I really don't think it's critical enough to be called "unsportsmanlike". It's as disadvantageous for your faction to join the game as a newbie or as someone who knows that he/she isn't good at deduction and deception.
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When did people say K4U was pro-town? Like I said, I thought she was scummier than you, but was willing to vote you instead because your reactions to her (quite believable) claim came off like floundering scum.
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blah blah blah my streak was broke mad.
That's really all I see.
It's a god damned game, You shouldn't get mad is some "streak" was broken. And I think we all can admit that a little (or a lot) of this game was stupid planning and stupid moves, no? Oh, and to all my haters out there, I love ya. More attention for me. >.>
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@huhwhat: D1-3. I'm pretty certain you've called her pro-town and liked every part of her play sometime during Day 3.
@Kips: You still don't get it do you, refer to the example I've given earlier and try again, ie. honest man being hanged for accused of being a liar, and fine, maybe it's not so much about the streak as it is about the massive slap I felt.
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@huhwhat: D1-3. I'm pretty certain you've called her pro-town and liked every part of her play sometime during Day 3.
I am fairly confident I never did that.
The only person I recall finding particularly pro-town on D3 was Pesco.
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Nobody ever voted K4U
Until the end
...ever
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oh okay right then
SHINY AWARDS LIST
Huhwhat/Holywhat- Town Jesus
Back on the third day- Get NK'd the very first night.
x2 CONFIRMATION COMBO- Not only be confirmed townie by death, but also by having -saved town from LYLO- on your return.
Till the end of the Story- Survive till the end of the game after revival.
Hanged Hourai- Town Bi-Polar Cop
He killed me- Immediately identify who killed you in Dead QT.
Sane Man- Only make Sane Investigations.
In the Line of Duty- Die before even getting your investigation.
Pesco- Town Useless NPC
Only good for saving town- Single-handedly pretty much almost win the game by pushing the lynch for the first scum and suggesting Vig on the second.
Jesus Disciple- Die in Jesus' place.
First Post Mindhax- What was that about kitten being lurkscum again...?
Zakeri- Town Defense Attorney
Cop-Friendly- Avoid managing to mess up Bi-polar's investigation.
Dead Man's Innocence- Have you investigation target die the following night.
I'm vanilla- Summarily get left with absolutely nothing for D3. Ain't it sad?
Kitten4u- Mafia Vote Thief
THERE CAN ONLY BE ONE- Be the last remaining Mafia.
Ninja Kitty- Lurk the entire game. Get away with it.
Friend of Jesus- Decide to let Jesus live after all. Get rewarded by having him support your victory.
reVelske- Town Paladin
Restraining Order- Miss with your ability.
Tank is Down- End the game with your death.
Schezo- Mafia Godfather
Sunsetter- Get the sun dropped on you.
Serial Killer, The real threat!- Try to take advantage of the threat of a third party.
wait what- Get lynched for trying to take advantage of the threat of a third party.
Sect- Town Useless NPC
Tastes like Cherries!- Go as heavy handed with your flavor as possible. If only you stayed in.
Conqueror- Town Useless NPC
Ghost Detective- Piece the entire game together in the Dead QT.
MANIPUL8- B)
iliekmudkips- Town Useless NPC
mudkipz- Like mudkips.
Golden PX- Town Sniper
Town MVP...not.- Get set up to shoot the final scum...only to change targets at the last second.
Cop Killer- Kill all the cops. All of them.
Suicidal Maniac- Offer to kill yourself.
Fake Serial Killer- Shoot the gun. Be the serial killer. Except not.
Bardiche- Town Musicboxman
6x Hammer Vote Combo- Crumb your role in a way no one would ever expect. Seriously, how do you come up with this.
Under the Heat- Attract all the investigations. All of them. Wait, Didn't I do this joke already...?
Neoserela- Town Co-Moderator.
Good Co-Mod, Best Friend- Be the best Vote count bitch there ever was. Love ya!
and that I think, Is all I have to say to wrap this game up. o7
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Ninja Kitty- Lurk the entire game. Get away with it.
B-but. :( I didn't even lurk that much more than I normally would.
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I got a good chuckle out of the acheivements/awards, good job on those. Probably the best thing to come out of this game.
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If bofh could be arsed to even post here, he'd say mudkips is banned from mafia. I know I've got an aye on that call from his protege. Mudkips kindly go learn to play elsewhere before coming back here ever again.
Still not on campus yet for those guys waiting for me. Dunno if I can even get there with potential protest action going on.
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reV, you admit that your principles require you to sacrifice your performance in the current game to get an advantage in later games. That goes about as directly against the spirit of the game as is possible. In a competitive game like Mafia, you should be doing your best to win in every single game. To willfully fail to do so is borderline trolling.
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Principles are very much a part of someone assuming it isn't some lack-lusting makeshift piece of crap that one can toss aside whenever, it isn't what you can call willful or purposeful sacrifice made to disadvantage anyone else, on the contrary, it is there with the best of intentions for everyone else. Regardless, my point is that is is a PART of a person, an attribute, no different from, say, a personal who has an inability to be conclusive, someone who is always two-minded about everything, someone who has a difficult time trusting other (oh hi paranoia), someone whose complicated thought cycle always leads them to come to really far-fetched and unrealistic deduction/conclusion. It's just who they are, who we are. People's personalities and attributes will inevitably affect the overall effectiveness of scumhunting depending on what they are exposed to, a principle is no different in that respective.
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If I remember correctly, SD, you asked for a replacement during LyLO and left town to die due to 'emotional pressure', which kind of voids any kind of credibility you might have on commenting this game.
ReVelske, lying... I suppose, is pretty much a fundumental part of Mafia, no matter what your principles might tell you. You are free to play the game with whatever handicaps you impose on yourself, but the thing is that you cannot blame anyone else or rage about how everyone else isn't believing you... since the majority believe that lying is a fundamental part of the game, especially as scum, and mafia is all about the majority.
And K4U was pretty much 'active lurking' in a game where pretty much everyone was giving their all; she certainly wasn't that hard to implicate.
As for my way being the best 'objective' way to play scum, no, it certainly is not. There is the vested interest of keeping your scumbuddies alive as scum, which is the fundamental objective reason for the differences in the content of scum and town in a game with investigative/vig roles; e.g if FFMaster decided to investigate me earlier in JK9, I would have been toast; I did not want Roukanken lynched, etc. Scum can certainly pretend to be pro-town for a brief amount of time, but they can't be pro-town forever because they would be playing poker with the cops and the trackers if they push for their buddies' lynches without sophistication, which is what I did during JK9. The aim of town is to spot this sophistication in a convincing way; which has been done in past games (FAV's greatest moment in WTC Mafia, etc.). There's nothing wrong with using a little meta in your reasoning, but you must balance it with what is on the topic.
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Hooray, I finally got to watch a Mafia game from start to finish! Now to see how well I did on the At-Home Game:
Scum: Day 3 - reVelske + Zakeri or Kitten4u.. Zakeri gives reVelske pass for meta reV is not following,
Kitten4u wants to lynch 4 town in a row.. ReVelske + Zakeri for first scum pair
Also reV is acting incredibly silly day 1 unlike past games
Pesco gets wild third place for not trying to annoy people to death
PX for Serial Killer because obviously rite
My scumpair wasn't even scum! I thought reV was scum because he didn't seem to be taking the game seriously until day 3. (Voting Pesco because his face was scummy) Sorry for not believing your doctor claim. :( Looking back at day 1 after day 3, if you look at Kitten's list she set up 4 proven townies (or 3 +1SK) to be lynched in order. I would never have caught Schezo :( Good luck next time town :3
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Principles are very much a part of someone assuming it isn't some lack-lusting makeshift piece of crap that one can toss aside whenever, it isn't what you can call willful or purposeful sacrifice made to disadvantage anyone else, on the contrary, it is there with the best of intentions for everyone else. Regardless, my point is that is is a PART of a person, an attribute, no different from, say, a personal who has an inability to be conclusive, someone who is always two-minded about everything, someone who has a difficult time trusting other (oh hi paranoia), someone whose complicated thought cycle always leads them to come to really far-fetched and unrealistic deduction/conclusion. It's just who they are, who we are. People's personalities and attributes will inevitably affect the overall effectiveness of scumhunting depending on what they are exposed to, a principle is no different in that respective.
This does nothing to address Serp's concern that your principles are going against the core rule and mechanic of MotK Mafia, which is to play to win the game you're playing.
If you intentionally sacrifice performance or tactical ground in a current game in the name of getting an advantage in future games, then perhaps this is not the site for you.
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I'm pretty sure he's saying he refuses to tell a lie out of principle, not because it's in any way beneficial to him. I think willfully choosing to play the game at a disadvantage is different than just being bad in some way, since you can try to avoid being paranoid or coming up with unlikely scenarios or whatever, but you're free to play how you like, reV. I think you should take the game less seriously, though. Don't have a panic attack because someone called you a liar and people voted for you, that's dumb.
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I admit I'm taking this statement at face value, not having the opportunity presently to go over the topic with a fine-toothed comb.
reV, you admit that your principles require you to sacrifice your performance in the current game to get an advantage in later games. That goes about as directly against the spirit of the game as is possible.
If this statement is factually incorrect, then I will revise my own.
It is also worth noting that the parallel drawn to "newbies put their faction at a tactical disadvantage" is a false one because newbies are still theoretically trying their best to win the game for their team, however misguided they may be. It's a case of making an active choice to hamper your team vs. making an unconscious and mistaken choice that hampers your team.
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If you intentionally sacrifice performance or tactical ground in a current game in the name of getting an advantage in future games, then perhaps this is not the site for you.
Though if I hear this one more fucking time, I might have to murder someone. It seems like everyone on this site thinks Principle is just some piece of crap I conveniently gave to myself for the benefit of myself, and I am free it toss it the fuck around like the piece of crap it is. What is so hard to understand about principle being who you are? Are YOU willing to break your own principles, go against your own personal moral values and ethics just so you can perform better in a game? Are you? Principles like mine certainly come with a cost when it comes to silly games like this, so you can call it a "sacrifice", just not an actively chosen one. I still very much perform at my best, I still very much play to win. Think of it no less than a mental impairment or disability. Would you deny someone entrance to the game if that is case? Is the inability to lie that severe that you have to continuously antagonize someone for it? I mean, have I been a complete failure in the game? Have I shown zero potential at the game? Have I screwed the game up because of it?
Principles are not active choices unless it's a life threatening situation, but I suppose that depends on how one values his/her principles. So, hey, if you don't value your principles, that's your problem, don't make mine.
I think you should take the game less seriously, though. Don't have a panic attack because someone called you a liar and people voted for you, that's dumb.
I really don't take the game that seriously, it's for fun and entertainment, after all. I certainly SHOULDN'T have been upset about it, but as explained, things played out in an extremely upsetting manner for me and regrettably, it was hard to hold back my frustration. It's reeeeaally not just about how people called me a liar and voted for me, you know, it's really the situation, the scenario, etc etc etc, I'm really not that bad a sore loser. =_=
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Rev. You have morals and principles on the internet. We dont think principle is a thing to throw around, but god damn if your going to play a game at least play it right. Hell if your honest in a mafia game, chances are you'll be lynched. And what sacrifice? You stayed till the damn end of the game. That's quite the feat especially for someone as "honest" as you.
Protip: Dont freak the fuck out when you lose and you were being honest. If you want to cry about it, go ahead, its none of my concern, nor most likely others concern.
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Medium is of no relevance, much like how it doesn't excuse anyone from acting like an utter tool over the net.
And I'm referring to Suwako's point of it being me sacrificing performance for my principles.
And I weep at your inability to understand my frustration at the end of that game, is it so hard to put yourself in others' shoes?
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This conversation is officially going nowhere fast.