Magical Madness Mafia 2, The Horrible Finish (Mod and Scum lose)

[Conqueror]

Noob mod, fix your votecount. I see at least two mistakes off the bat.

I have no idea what you're talking about. As such, you require one less hammer to vote.

[Raitaki]

so he needs -1 hammer to be able to vote? i dont even

also conq i think he ruled that votes had to be on a separate line from anything else or something
if my post looks weird im currently maximally stoned from teeth removal pain typing is greatly hindered by holding and ice pad

[SirChaotick]

Ah, suspicion onto me? I shall wait for Conqueror's arguments.

As for Hero... not actively scumhunting? I'm... not sure what you mean, honestly. Do you mean I should be making concrete arguments against specific suspects instead of just reading everything? Or just not posting enough? I don't think I can do much about the second reason and I'm unwilling to focus on one person because I suspect it will make people angry at me.

In any case, I'm unsure of who to actively suspect. I can only think of Dan and (to a slightly lesser extent)Hero, for "not saying anything", but that's not an entirely valid criticism. Shadoweh is fairly inactive too and has already flung a lot of weirdness in the thread, so she's a slightly better suspect.
I do know there's better targets than Raitaki, so I'll change my vote now.
Bardiche is still town, and I have a strong reason to believe that Serela's town. Conqueror, although he votes me, is also town.
I am willing to vote any of the inactives. I wouldn't mind voting Rawr either for countering Raikaria's case with what could be described as a tantrum, but he does have some valid points.
Other people are floating somewhere in between.

[Dr Rawr]

Are me and shadoweh still scum?

As for you, you've not shown me otherwise.

On this specific point, maybe it's because I'm still not 100% convinced you're scum yet? I don't like you, and I would be happy to lynch you, and I lean towards you being scum. I'm not petty. I don't write you off as scum because you're annoying. I'd LIKE to see you get lynched, but I want what is best for the town, not my sanity.

fucking tsunderes
##Unvote

I accuse you of lurking. Nothing more.

I am not lurking now, thus your case is outdated and null. please try again!

Bonus BS points for it not even being an hour since you posted your defense for me to follow up on.

Im pretty sure ive mentioned these things prior to d2.

@Bard

3) Good question, try asking Raitaki.

why would i do that?

Defending yourself != case isn't solid. I'll disagree with any case on me calling me Scum, but that doesn't mean the others suddenly have unsolid cases

no but you cant deny the existence of the defense and believe that your case irrefutable. But seeing as there never was an actual case on me watevs

i feel as though if i make a case at 2:30am ill regret it

[Conqueror]

##Unvote
##Vote: Zakeri

Want Zakeri to explain his scumread on Bardiche since I read his first post of Day 2 and didn't get anything out of it. And despite rereading his posts several times I still don't get why he's voting Raitaki. There's a lot of conversation about Raitaki's posts but I don't know why Zakeri thinks Raitaki is scummy for doing what he does. Could you elaborate, Zakeri?

Also, don't know why Zakeri singles out Raikaria, Bardiche, and Nameless for the consolidation dance when I feel like I was one of the biggest wagon movers at the end of day one. It just reads like lazy thinking when he states that one of those three is supposed to be scum.


Shadoweh and Dan need to step up and read the game. I don't think either of them is scum (and in particular I have a decent strength town read on Shadoweh based on her play around her vengeful claim yesterday [fyi lynch her if she ever unclaims vengeful or if she gets to 3p or 4p lylo because it removes the possibility of her gambiting and if she's town puts the lynch in 100% confirmed town's hands]).

Indeed, the name of the game is to nitpick to find flaws in arguments.

No, the name of the game is not to nitpick at every argument and if you do you'll get into endless wall arguments with stubborn players (town or otherwise). It's to find mafia.

Be happy to be lynching Dan, Rawr or Raitaki right now, but since I don't want to have D2 end this quickly [C.C is still around, presumably, unless the C.C vote was once per game], I'll just use my vote as a lurker prod for now.

However, ActionDan is outright useless right now.

Look at it this way, if we remove the useless people, we prevent situations at the endgame where we have a few people with loads to use for and against them, and then these people with blank slates.

In addition, focusing on lurkers and non-contributers early makes the town more efficient. There are less distractions.  Mafia won't pick off the useless parts of the town, they'll pick off the useful townies. This also gives us time to collect information to use later in the game to help us find the mafia. Like it or not, D1 isn't a great time to find mafia, especially with the odds. Usually the best thing to do is lynch a lurker on D1, and, in this situation without a mafia nightkill, and the possible threat of C.C's vote, might be prudent today.

No, we're not doing policy lynches. Voting someone JUST FOR LURKING is a bad idea on any day unless you have reason to believe all the other options are town, and even more so if you don't have a scumread on the lurker. Parking your vote on the lurker is just as bad if you have other scumspects. So could you explain why you want those three targets lynched (I'm particularly interested in Raitaki)?

Don't know what to think about rawr; I like his defense and his points against Raikaria but I want to here more about other people.

Serela is probably town but needs to get his act together.

Don't have a problem with hero; his post on SirChaotick prompted me to reread the slot and upon reread I agree. His scumhunting is very passive (he spends most of the time voting for "people who haven't done stuff" beyond the initial Bardiche vote) and he's removed from the general discussion.

I'm unwilling to focus on one person because I suspect it will make people angry at me.

If you happen to be town, this is a pretty terrible stance to take because it means you never have to take any stances. Your goal as town is to find and lynch scum; how are you supposed to do that without focusing on your targets?

Anyway, I dislike his opening post on D2.

Zakeri is looking good enough and even if there was a case for him on D1(which there wasn't much of) I'm unwilling to hang him.
Raitaki... gah, he's getting my vote right now for jumping on townread Zakeri.
Serela is town, Conqueror is also fairly town.

I would like an explanation of 1) the townread on Zakeri, 2) why you're voting Raitaki for jumping on Zakeri when you mentioned Raitaki as a townread D1, and 3) why I'm fairly town even though I also jumped on Zakeri and made a huge defense of Raitaki in the meantime, as that should make me either scum by the same standards as Raitaki or Raitaki's scumbuddy. There's just a lot of weak and unsubstantiated reads in this ISO and I want everyone to read this and give me an opinion.

I am willing to vote any of the inactives.

Name said inactives, and additionally, what do you think of the active players?


Willing to lynch either Zakeri and SirChaotick; vote goes back on Zak instead of SirChaotick because he gets a very slight newbie pass.

[Conqueror]

EBWOP: To elaborate on the SirChaotick read, I can see him as newbscum who, having never played as town before, doesn't know how to fakescumhunt as scum and so he doesn't want to either anger townies by making cases on them or bus his buddies. And so we get what he have here, where he basically suspects the inactive players because they can't/won't fight back.

[Dr Rawr]

HMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM

@Hero999 i know you unvoted me d1 just to consolidate on a lynch but what are you thoughts of me now? makin me sad that you didnt mention me. also im going to need you to wake up and answer this

Also i have this urge to test actiondans claim.....

well w/e reads because of unvote and stance changes
town
conq
me
shadoweh
actiondan mostly the claim, mostly the claim, i see no reasons to think otherwise, also the lack of nk on him...
IHNN town though tbh i dont actually read your posts, i just ctrl-f and see if its relevant to me. reason being is that you make mistakes that bother me some times. but yea leaning more town
bardiche
raikaria

not town
everyone else - reasons that im sure i can think of later

[Raikaria]

*Mumbles about Rawr missing the point of my beef against him again, which is his REACTION to my lurking accusation*

Anyway, there's more than that to consider right at this instant.

Firstly:

##Unvote

Now, I don't have super amounts of time, so I'll write up about why I see these people as this later. As in, significantly later-after all my lectures.

Town:
Shadoweh
Bardiche
IHNN
Myself
Conq

Null:
ActionDan [Not done enough]
DrRawr [Not done enough except shout at me]
Hero999 [Not done enough]

Scummy:
Raitaki [Came to this conclusion because he's not really... scumhunted at all. D1 he was basically cheerleading, and his highlight was worrying about C.C. D2, it's the same]
Serela [That... whole exchanged with Bard while I was catching some z's... what the hell. Voting someone still for ED1 stuff, when they've long since changed their opinion? Seems like he wants bard lynched nomatter what]
Zakeri: [Similar reasons for Raitaki. Had some hot air coming out, and a few comments that are semi-useful... but he's not actually hunted scum]

Newbie:
SirChaotic [I think his lack of scumhunting is more lack of experience]

I'll go into more details about this mess later, when I'm done with my Uni stuff, but for now:

##Vote: Serela

That exchange with Bard was bad. Really, really bad.

[Shadoweh]

*sneezes*
I'm not lurking I'm just big boned! Or something. Reading is hard but at least it's working now. The reading I mean. I'm skipping over Bard's argument with Serela because I think they're both town and making me laugh doesn't help my scumhunting skills.

Conq's original points about Zakeri strike me true, it's pretty odd for him to just tunnel one person, and most of the justification seems to be 'because he's attacking me for dumb reasons'. Uh, okay Zak, but how does that make him scum instead of a regular townie?

I left for a while. You guys sure are quick. And no one died! 

I feel like voting ActionDan, but that claim is still troublesome.
Zakeri is looking good enough and even if there was a case for him on D1(which there wasn't much of) I'm unwilling to hang him.
Raitaki... gah, he's getting my vote right now for jumping on townread Zakeri.
Serela is town, Conqueror is also fairly town.
IHNN is slightly leaning town. Still, reason for voting Bard?
I feel like throwing a vote on Shadoweh or Hero. That'd be easy, quick and completely justified on the grounds of being pretty useless. They're low priority right now though, and I don't know how much it'd matter.
Rawr is slightly suspicious for his unexplained vote on Raikaria. Who is leaning town right now. He probably has an explanation coming though.
As for me... I guess I might be suspected for not saying much? I was away for the previous seven pages though.

##Vote Raitaki

1) Congratulate the Doc/Whatever = Bed
2) This tries to sound like a post with reasoning but it's basically 'x seems townie or y seems scummy'
3) The reasoning for throwing a vote on Shadoweh or Hero sounds like musings I would post in a scum QT. "That person seems useless, I should hit them up." Pro-Tip, if you vote someone and make a case about it it matters, but you're giving off the tone you don't want to make waves.
4) You're basing your vote because he's voting your townread when he's not the only one voting that townread, and you don't give reason for the townread in the first place. Conq who also seems to hate Zakky-chan gets an 'is town' badge.

Actually it kind of sounds like you think Zak and Conq are the strong townie players and you want to lynch suspicious people orbitting around them. The lack of a Bard read is suspicious because after what looked like some kind of tracker claim you'd think you'd say something about him. But hey it's wrong to think about who your scumbuddiees are before you flip.

##Vote: Sir Chaotick And especially for not being named Chaotix which would be 100% cooler.

For those of you still consuming too much of my alcohol stash and thinking my scum team bff's would throw a vote on me when I almost died from it, kindly insert sharp objects into your lower blowholes. For Serela I suggest taking those floating eyes of his and sticking them up there.

I don't know why Rawr is getting any attention. At all. You're treating him like he's trolling you when he's plainly answering your questions. IHNN is still Townie Boyscout #1 to me. Not sure about Raikaria yet but will resolve later etc. Will read more and update with more thoughts.

[Raikaria]

And now I'm back and have more than 20 mins to post:

Why Serela's exchange was bad:

Shadoweh has posts like that look very townie for multiple reasons and the Vengeful thing, but then otherwise is mostly terrible, which makes me :C. On the upside if we lynch her and she's town, that means she actually is vengeful, so at least we'd get a vig out of it? The mod vote thing is weird, but I wouldn't throw scum gambit ++ off the possibility list either, like really

You say Shadoweh looks very townie, and then you just write everything else off a 'terrible' and consider lynching her.  Terrible what? Terrible Play? Scum-looking? What about everything else makes it so 'mostly terrible'?

To me this looks like you're saying 'Shadoweh looks town but I'm willing to lynch her because if she's vengeful we get a shot out of it'.

As I said before, I can confirm Shadoweh is town. Considering that was the first thing I said D2 after wanting her lynched D1, that suggests that something happened during the night that convinced me Shadoweh is town, right? I'm not going to go into the reasons, or even who's action confirmed it for me, but if I suddenly flipped my opinion overnight...

Bard's quote on Zak about the interpretive consolidation dance makes me giggle. I almost went "oh wait two of these three people are my town reads" but then I recalled in the next sentences Zak says why he thinks they're town too and that Bard is scum, so I went back to my happy sunflowers.

Oh I got cut by Bard I see! I just got to the end here. Psh, if nothing else, what I had on you when I was voting you D1 should be enough to justify my vote now; although for obvious reasons, addressing your further posts is of course required.

Although I'm having some trouble doing so.

The only thing that really comes to mind here is "It feels like Bard is saying a lot of stuff, but that almost all of it is kind of unimportant in the end" and then on the DrRawr stuff idk since I'm flipflopping all over there as well, so that part is kind of null to me, could easily see it as town or scum. All in all I haven't really seen a single thing from Bard this game I actually think is town looking, and enough stuff that just touches me in a bad place that I really want him lynched. Maybe I can explain this better after I get another nights rest (Ahahaha as if I can actually sleep at night anymore ;_;) but this is kind of adequate maybe? Questions might help if there are any to be asked.

This... isn't even justification for why you voted Bard. Indeed, when Bard pressed you on voting him/her for ED1 stuff, you didn't refute it, in fact, you're still voting Bard... for ED1 stuff.

So nothing since ED1 has happened to make you think of anyone as more scummy that what Bard posted at the start of Day 1? Seriously?

Most of the reads you give you don't even give actual reasons either. The Shadoweh thing makes no sense, you admit you're flipflopping on Rawr, you hardly say anything on Hero and Zakeri...

Combined is not giving me a very good impression of you at all. Especially with the bard vote and the 'I think Shadoweh is town because of stuff like this but let's lynch her anyway because I'll just call everything else 'terrible' and not elaborate at all' opinion.

[Shadoweh]

Despite yesterday I'm still not convinced Hero is a bad target though. From what I've skimmed he isn't any more useful today then he was yesterday. Probably the only thing I disagree with Conq about. But we can still get married if you want! We can make a Super High School Level Couple together![/b] Seriously though don't see how his passive scumhunting is good and still think he's being pressganged into content.

Ah, suspicion onto me? I shall wait for Conqueror's arguments.

As for Hero... not actively scumhunting? I'm... not sure what you mean, honestly. Do you mean I should be making concrete arguments against specific suspects instead of just reading everything? Or just not posting enough? I don't think I can do much about the second reason and I'm unwilling to focus on one person because I suspect it will make people angry at me.

Despite what people say they don't actually care about posting 'enough'. It's the first part people want. Specific suspects is not one person. If you think someone is scum, which is why you would be making concrete arguments on them, you shouldn't care if it makes them angry, because they are scum and making the scum team rage is half the battle in winning.

In any case, I'm unsure of who to actively suspect. I can only think of Dan and (to a slightly lesser extent)Hero, for "not saying anything", but that's not an entirely valid criticism. Shadoweh is fairly inactive too and has already flung a lot of weirdness in the thread, so she's a slightly better suspect.

Besides the fact that it isn't true? Do you have any problems with the things they are saying? Do you think they're active lurking? I mean I'm even ignoring the easy fruit sitting there about 'flung a lot of weirdness' in this argument and coming up with things to say about you, would it be so hard for you to do the same?

I do know there's better targets than Raitaki, so I'll change my vote now.

Hey omae you forgot to actually do something here. Find a reason to vote besides 'inactive or angry but is kind of right'.

Cut: Thanks for the extremely specific and slightly creepy endorsement there skipper. Glad to know it took an attempted assassination and a night action for people to get that idea. Hear that scumteam, I'm confirmed town, you should totally shoot me tonight.

[Hero999]

@Hero999 i know you unvoted me d1 just to consolidate on a lynch but what are you thoughts of me now? makin me sad that you didnt mention me. also im going to need you to wake up and answer this

No interest, don't see much in the way of scumminess anymore.

As for Hero... not actively scumhunting? I'm... not sure what you mean, honestly. Do you mean I should be making concrete arguments against specific suspects instead of just reading everything? Or just not posting enough? I don't think I can do much about the second reason and I'm unwilling to focus on one person because I suspect it will make people angry at me.

@Chaotick: 1) Like Shadoweh said, you are really doing nothing to help town actively. The point of mafia is to find "scum" out of a mob of people who you don't know who to suspect.
2) Look to Shadoweh's points because I doubt I can phrase it any better.
3) Same as above.

...
@Raikaria: Why do you feel the need to base so much of your content on C.C.? because holyshit you are like the only one to continuously talk about C.C. this C.C that. Why the hell are you trying to make us all focus on that specific point. What is your goal of continuously telling us this?
why do you love C.C. so much and not me?

[Raikaria]

@Raikaria: Why do you feel the need to base so much of your content on C.C.? because holyshit you are like the only one to continuously talk about C.C. this C.C that. Why the hell are you trying to make us all focus on that specific point. What is your goal of continuously telling us this?
why do you love C.C. so much and not me?

How am I basing so much of my content on C.C? None of my content is based on C.C. I'm not accusing anyone of using her, or basing any of my arguments off the vote D1. I just remind people that we may need to worry about that vote. It's something we need to keep in our minds.

Personally I don't want what nearly happened to Shadoweh to happen today.

[I have no name]

I'd make a longer post now but no time and no internet for at least another 5 hours.

I'll re-read more in-depth in that time and move my vote but until then I think I'm leaning Chaotick.

[Dr Rawr]

For Serela I suggest taking those floating eyes of his and sticking them up there.

hawt

[SirChaotick]

...Okay, now I'm just plain frightened.

...because I can't truly refute the criticisms. Indeed, I'm trying to hang back and attack the easiest targets, which are the ones who don't contribute much. Although I guess that includes me. But let me try: if I can't convince people otherwise, I guess I can just state my role...?

EBWOP: To elaborate on the SirChaotick read, I can see him as newbscum who, having never played as town before, doesn't know how to fakescumhunt as scum and so he doesn't want to either anger townies by making cases on them or bus his buddies. And so we get what he have here, where he basically suspects the inactive players because they can't/won't fight back.

I am unsure of the meaning of "bus", and I doubt a bus is a verb, but whatever.
How is this not applicable to a newbie town? I may as well be newbtown who doesn't know how to actualscumhunt as town and so he doesn't want to make cases in people because he knows he isn't going to do it watertight - as I did before. And so we get what we have here, where he basically suspects the inactive players because they're easily identified as less useful, regardless of whether they're scum or not.

If you happen to be town, this is a pretty terrible stance to take because it means you never have to take any stances. Your goal as town is to find and lynch scum; how are you supposed to do that without focusing on your targets?

Anyway, I dislike his opening post on D2.I would like an explanation of 1) the townread on Zakeri, 2) why you're voting Raitaki for jumping on Zakeri when you mentioned Raitaki as a townread D1, and 3) why I'm fairly town even though I also jumped on Zakeri and made a huge defense of Raitaki in the meantime, as that should make me either scum by the same standards as Raitaki or Raitaki's scumbuddy. There's just a lot of weak and unsubstantiated reads in this ISO and I want everyone to read this and give me an opinion.
Name said inactives, and additionally, what do you think of the active players?

Whuh? Wha? Crap... this is a tall order.
 I can't say I really disagree with my reads being weak and unsubstantiated. They are. It's true. I have no excuses. Or wait, I do: inexperience and lack of time. It's simply really tough to keep track of all arguments at the same time to incorporate them into a whole, and it takes a long time. I daren't just take one person's arguments because I'm afraid of tunnel vision, but I don't have enough time to analyse a lot of them.

Nor do I have enough time to refute all of... ah, who am I kidding, they can't be refuted. Screw it. It's all true.

I'll try to come back next post with a proper reading on the most discussed persons right now. (I know that's me, but you know what I mean) See y'all in a moment.

[SirChaotick]

Although I am willing to say now that Chaotix is a horrible name in every possible objective sense.

[ActionDan]

Serela was by far one of the strongest if not my strongest town read D1.

So I'm not sure why people are looking there.  Did she make a big ol' poopy post about bard and people are taking sides?  <--- if so, (actually I know so) try not to get caught up in the madness to much.

I thought Zak was town D1, so I think I'll be reading him again with all this suspcion thrown his way.

I have a feeling im not going to change my mind on that one.  well maybe.

[Serela]

You say Shadoweh looks very townie, and then you just write everything else off a 'terrible' and consider lynching her.  Terrible what? Terrible Play? Scum-looking? What about everything else makes it so 'mostly terrible'?

To me this looks like you're saying 'Shadoweh looks town but I'm willing to lynch her because if she's vengeful we get a shot out of it'.

As I said before, I can confirm Shadoweh is town. Considering that was the first thing I said D2 after wanting her lynched D1, that suggests that something happened during the night that convinced me Shadoweh is town, right? I'm not going to go into the reasons, or even who's action confirmed it for me, but if I suddenly flipped my opinion overnight...

I said Shadoweh has like one or two posts that look townie.

I didn't think I really needed to elaborate on why her other posts are terrible because a lot of other people have already had that opinion far before now? The modvote thing is for the most part the reason people got off her.

You changing your mind about whether Shadoweh is town or scum =/= confirming Shadoweh is town, by the way. Because you aren't confirmed town either. ...although you're a strong town read of mine, admittedly, so :T (I didn't really remember you saying anything of the sort, by the way, although it sounds vaguely familiar. If you did, then, fine, I guess I'll keep going with the modvote thing being a town clear, whatever.)

Dan:Raikaria doesn't know I'm a loony so I figure that's why, I mean I can totally see why it'd look really scummy if you aren't familiar with me

I'm having to grudgingly admit the Bard wagon isn't going to go anywhere today. I can't manage to make a very coherent case on him, the other person voting Bard is turning into the big wagon of the day, and a whole bunch of people have Bard on their town read list. I still want Bard lynched, but I figure I'm going to have to look at other options for now and go back to Bard when I get more reasons to convince people he's scum. That being said, I only just woke up, so I'll figure this out ~*~later~*~. With a quick look at the player list though (And these opinions are covered in my big post earlier that made Bard have an aneurysm) , I guess Dan, Rai, and Rawr are my other worst reads, with Zakeri being my weakest town read. (The Dan thing is, well, a thing though, because of his current situation where he's super lurking but seems to be legitimately not having time to post, so augh)

[Serela]

I guess Dan, Rai, and Rawr are my other worst reads

raitaki*

your names are so similar ;_;

[Raikaria]

If you need to abbreviate how about Karia and Taki?

Anywho, not much else in developments. I'll me my vote where it is, because, admittedly, I still do think bad about Serela because of Bard rant. I have a day off tomorrow so I can really get into the gritty then and try and hammer out something.

You changing your mind about whether Shadoweh is town or scum =/= confirming Shadoweh is town, by the way. Because you aren't confirmed town either. ...although you're a strong town read of mine, admittedly, so :T (I didn't really remember you saying anything of the sort, by the way, although it sounds vaguely familiar. If you did, then, fine, I guess I'll keep going with the modvote thing being a town clear, whatever.)

True, but it's a strong indicator that something happened to prove it to me. By all means, don't take anything I say at face value. You're not supposed to do that.

[PX]

The Fifteenth Votecount - FUS RO DAH!

Raitaki (2) - Zakeri, SirChaotick
Bardiche (1) - Serela
Zakeri (3) - Raitaki, Bardiche, Conq
SirChaotick (2) Hero999, Shadoweh
Serela (1) - Raikaria

Not Voting - Everybody else

With 12 alive, it takes 7 to lynch.

||||||||||||||||||||||||||| 52%

[SirChaotick]

For anyone impatient with me: I had to interrupt my reading with homework and I'm only about halfway through. It's really hard to remember the specific arguments and keep them from degrading into a vague feeling of town or scum. I'm working on it!

[I have no name]

@Chaotick: bussing is when 1 scum pushes another scum.
Additionally, don't worry about pissing people off, if you suspect someone: show it.

Right now my priority of lynch targets is Raitaki-->Chaotick-->Bard.

I don't know why people are voting Zakeri,

If you need to abbreviate how about Karia and Taki?

I seriously read that as Kairi.  Meaning DIE RIKU DIE MWHAHAHAHAHA
##Vote: Raitaki

But that'll make Sora sad

[SirChaotick]

Where the hell did my post go?

Anyway, I wanted to say I'm going to overanalyse the debate between Zakeri and Raitaki tomorrow. They can hardly be of the same alignment, so it should be a productive exercise.

I promised reads, but my scumbag mind is drawing a blank after reading for over an hour, plus I'm not at liberty to select my own bedtimes. So until then, ladies and gentlemen of the kaleidoscope.

[Bardiche]

So I've calmed down from raging! Hurrah!

Why are there 9 out of 12 votes in play? Rawr, IHNN, Dan?

I decided to sheep Conqueror who is my strongest Town read so far, and I read Zakeri in detail. I really should've done that before but ~*tunnel vision*~.

One thing I start off with is Raitaki's question to Zakeri, quote:

Also, you're having a conspicuous lack of examining people other than Shadoweh, Raikaria and ActionDan.

To this, Zakeri's response is that, quote:

Yyour list of people I'm investigating seems short. It's missing Hero (the guy I'm voting for and have been question) and Bardiche, to name a few.

This is curious, because it mentions me... and Zakeri's previous post mentioning me was here, where he says tryhard Bard is a quality of Bard being Town. Why then this sudden untelegraphed jump to say you're investigating me when you're... not? No mention of me other than the "tryhard more likely to be Town" and "I'm investigating Bardiche". I assume investigating is equal to I have suspicion of.

Moving into Day 2 you... say you don't have a case on Raitaki other than "consolidation of lynch" in a game where Days have variable lengths. To be sure it is a point I can agree on, but let's move on. Day 1 content is very low.

His post here constructs a Strawman argument: There are three people who are suspicious and one of them is likely Scum. Then you deconstruct the argument by saying two of them are Town, leaving the conclusion that the third must therefore be Scum. He leaves out this conclusion though, and it seems like a curve ball tossed negligently to look at later.

Also
>Serela
>Consistent Logic
:V :V :V :V

Ultimately, I'm just not very impressed with his fluid reads, which aren't telegraphed and could just as well be made up on the spot. The bucket list of three "doing a consolidation dance" seems picked rather arbitrarily, and selecting three people, then suggesting one of them must be scum, then stating two are likely Town, it seems absurd that he doesn't follow up on the logical conclusion that the last remaining person must be Scum. Instead, Zakeri clings to a vote on Raitaki for the above mentioned lack-of-case-but-consolidation-early-in-Day thing. In the end, his strongest reads (according to him) are based on lynch consolidation, with the bucket list being a weird thing to hold against people nearing Day end. 6% in a battery is impossible to equate to time, and a panicked move to consolidate lynch strikes me as a null tell. Obviously Scum will panickly consolidate a lynch to seem Town, and Town will panickly consolidate a lynch because they do not want to No Lynch.

The entire crux of my argument is that his scum bucket list is built on faulty foundation and improperly argumented to hold, and it is his chief argument of scumminess anywhere in the entire game.

##Vote: Zakeri


I'm dropping Rawr as a case due to lack of interest and a re-read of Zakeri makes his case much more tangible.

tl;dr Rawr is totes cool, pls lynch Zakeri

[Shadoweh]

Also, after reading Zakeri's posts and with my role in hand I'd probably be willing to die for him. ♥ very sexier person, no must lynch or make very sad Baron Vladmu, who is Baron of Sexy♥♥ and know when person not sexy♥♥.

The entire crux of my argument is that his scum bucket list is built on faulty foundation and improperly argumented to hold, and it is his chief argument of scumminess anywhere in the entire game.

##Vote: Zakeri

Bard, what are you doing?

[Shadoweh]

I would say something about Mr. Chaotix who is apparently not a Sonic fan but despite having read my post he chose not to address anything I asked of him and instead flounder in being terrible. Well okay then.

[Conqueror]

He obviously changed his mind after rereading. I'll get to the rest of this page and an explanation for IHNN in a bit. Chaotix and Zakeri can easily be scum together as well as individually.

I want to draw attention to Dan first though. I still haven't heard an explanation from him for why he would claim Lynch-Only Beloved Princess so early when there was no pressure to claim. Dan isn't stupid with roles; he knows how to use roles creatively (see his fake PGO claim in Kamen Rider) and effectively but the circumstances of his early claim are anti-town in the extreme because it gives scum information they don't need to know and remove the pro-town possibility of Dan being NK'd, especially as Dan knows he's going to be inactive. Basically all his early claim does is prevent people from wanting to lynch him, when the proper way to play the role would be to not claim until under threat of lynch. I could see the possibility of a town dan fakeclaiming beloved princess, but then I don't know why Dan would be randomly suspicious of IHNN's miller claim for ~*flavour reasons*~.

tl;dr I can see Dan's claim as a gambit to prevent people from wanting to lynch him while he skirts by with minimal content. I've historically been able to read Dan pretty well even when he does post minimal reads; the ones he's posted so far are crap and I don't get the town vibe I usually get from his posts. He'd be my third choice of lynch after Zakeri and Chaotick.

[WHMZakeri]

All My blue pikmin are getting killed. I hate the submerged cave.

umm, in news that's actually relevant, I'm still trying to find stuff to pin down on Raitaki.
Yes, a majority of the reads I had during day one were of townies. The only one of those reads that survived transition to day 2 was Raikaria, though

The reason I haven't explained my Bardiche case is because the only real thing I can hold against him (that isn't a gut feeling) is the fact that he was the chokepoint in deciding whether Dormio or Raitaki got lynched at the end of the day. If I were to take my case against Bardiche as seriously as people are asking me to, I'd have to take it as fact that Raitaki is Mafia-scum, and since I do, I might as well be voting for him instead.

I realize my case on Raitaki is shit, and I've been rereading him over and over to find a way to present everything neatly, but I'm having trouble finding new issues to address with it besides the fact that he's pushing a weak case on me. Of course, I'd love to point at the fact that he hasn't produced anything else, but that doesn't look like it's going to stand up to his absence.

Since everybody is considering Chaotick the obligatory newbie, I'm working under the assumption that this isn't Raitaki's first game.
1. Even if the Battery drains at an alarming rate, there was still more than 50% left when he checked the gauge. I somehow doubt that you can attribute his cheerleading Raikaria as "just going for consolidation".
2. I'm having trouble understanding why Raitaki's case against me is still valid a. On day 2, and b. when it's the only read he's provided besides Shadoweh (Obsolete) and ActionDan (safe option).
3. The C.C. thing still reads weird to me, because when I first saw it, I parsed it as the mod voting. I will admit I've only seen one or two episodes of Code Geass and didn't realize that C.C. was a character, but I agree with Nameless that I think the assumption has more to do with role related reasons.

I looked over Conq's day one, and he's right about being part of the dance thing I brought up. I excluded him originally because I somehow convinced myself that his insistence on switching everyone to Dormio meant that he never voted for Rawr with everybody else which isn't true. I'm not seeing very much scum intent in his day 2 posts either, so I'm dropping the null-scum read I have on him. That said, I'd rather not follow through with my Consolidation dance claim anyways, since it's a sleepy-stupor, roundabout way of just saying that I had a gut feeling that Bardiche might not be as genuine as he wanted those posts to read like.

There's still nothing good to say about ActionDan. If people are adamant about not giving me Raitaki's flip, I'll gladly take his instead.

Also, I'm going to preemptively admit that I'm ignoring Chaotick, Dr. Rawr, and Hero999 because they weren't on the Dormio wagon, and see no reason to do so unless they are a major consolidation wagon, or if someone comes out with role-based evidence for why Raitaki can't be mafia.