Justice Juice Mafia Thread I (NIGHT 3)

[Sky_Paladin]

People can have different opinions from me and still be right.  In the last game, I made several mistakes.  Merely disagreeing is of little value.  I'm looking for inconsistent behaviour at this stage. 

[Dormio Ergo Sum]

I don't particularly agree with that, since consistency is not consistent, but that's more an argument about play style or something.

[Kilgamayan]

Reading this thread is already boring. Too many useless words, too much newbie panic over darkninja hammers when people are at L-4 or L-5 or whatever.

##Vote: Validon YOU THOUGHT YOU COULD GET AWAY WITH JOINING A GAME WITHOUT GETTING SHOUTED AT HUH

#72 is my least favorite post of the game by a fair margin. The large wordy paragraph block is annoying to read and has the extra bonus of throwing out a bunch of pseudo-suspicions before concluding with no vote on anyone. It's built to look helpful without actually being helpful. Why bother just pointing out a bunch of bad things? You should be giving the rest of us reasons to look at something and potentially pursue.

Darkninjalphabet's entire posting history irks me but I can't tell how much of my disagreement with his ideas is based on not being able to communicate them properly due to phone posting.

[Shadoweh]

##vote dormio again for being meiya
okay no
But yeah all the things I can see are either A.Making a vote that I can explain but seriously do not believe in at all (Example:Dark taking obvious jokeposts seriously and doing silly stuff as a result) or B.In addition to being A, it relies on useless and easily-circular logic (Voting SB for saying Dark's posts are bad, voting PX for voting SB for saying Dark's posts are bad)
I'M JUST GOING TO KEEP VOTING MEIYA

As much as I hate to point it out, despite being a Godmother Meiya was Town. Are you actively voting for town, Serela?
I take pleasure in how Dormio makes new and exciting reasons to lynch me every Day 1, it's traditional. I supose I don't mind since it gives people something to do, even if it's punching me. I can take it, I'll eat all the pain you give me and spit it out good as new!

Sky P: That Day 1 episode you're talking about cleared them both as obvtown, so I don't know why you'd want to defuse it really. Letting people talk is important to getting reads on them.

[Polaris]

Probably gonna be parroting a lot of stuff :derp:

##Vote: Sky Paladin

For the banal yet completely valid reason that Sky Paladin is jokevoting when that is p. much done and over with.

I also agree with Kilga's post completely.

[Polaris]

I said "parroting a lot of stuff" but I ended up barely saying anything, oops ._.

[Polaris]

Oh yeah, and PX's vote is kind of "huh?" to me since it seems to be founded mainly upon playstyle differences with SB rather than actual scumminess. I would think the other two people he mentioned in his post were more worthy of a vote. PX what do you think about this?

[Polaris]

##Unvote
##Vote: Validon

Actually now that I think about it, I think Validon's paragraph post is a lot worse than Sky Paladin's frivolity >_> I might have just been self conscious about sheeping Kilga too much.

[Cheez8]

Noting Serela's refusal to make any real opinion of his own.
Also noting that I might be late for class.

For what it's worth, this post bothers me enough to suspect Dormio over anybody else right now. Guess I should start bringing my opinions up sooner.
This feels like a false accusation that could be interpreted as true if you aren't paying enough attention. Seems minor, but not as minor as everything else is.
I'll mull it over while I eat, I guess.

[DNAbc]

Logic bad means that i am scum? I am but attempting my best to at the very least fufill my quota for i get 4 hours of internet a day. On either phone or library computers no less. Did you even know i already took 2 minutes going through so far.

It was more guts less logic. Scum shadow is laughing off his sides right now seeing how everyone defended his minor slip without him actually needing to.

And this entire exchange now that i think about it is pure weird. Cheez somehow agreed with the point that joleposting seriously is scumtell. Yet all that time he was basically taking what he calss "a misinterpreted and wrong argument". This paradoxical defend was what made me scratch my head ao hard. Then i assumed hes an enthusisatic scum. Who is also bouncing around wagons. Then it apl makes sense.

If anything i would really appreciate if you can first assume shadoweh is scum. Then see cheez as paranoid scum swooping in to defend him.

I know the logic isnt really clear but at least i thought i should out whoever i have a strong read on. I want to havr you see the picture i amseeing but five minutes isnt wnough.

[DNAbc]

Voting onc ehome

[Validon98]

Ugh, sorry for the blocky paragraph, I was trying to get my thoughts down and in the process forgot how formatting works.

@SB: I know things change over the period of D1, I just would prefer to put my vote out when the discussion gets off of RVS topics, which it is appearing to do right now. Also D1 has always been a bad sort of day for me, because at that point I really don't know what to think. I prefer relying on hard evidence over reading cues from people's posts, and D1 has a distinct lack of hard evidence.

@Kilga: OF COURSE I DIDN'T THINK I WOULD I THINK EVERY GAME I'VE BEEN IN I'VE BEEN SHOUTED AT AT SOME POINT USUALLY BY SHADOWEH. :VVVVVVV
On a more serious note, my paragraph, again, was terribly formatted because I was just trying to get my thoughts down and sometimes that leads to me forgetting how to format things so that people don't get a headache reading it.

As for more recent developments, Sky_Paladin is earning some points in my book because of A- Simple mistakes on his part, and B- The only thing I had against him was the no lynch thing, which isn't an issue anymore so he's sitting completely null instead of leaning scum. Also, as for consistency, that tends to not be the best way to determine scum. Yes, it works sometimes, but I was yelled at acting different in Town Mafia and the same occurred with Raikaria in the last game. Both of us ended up being town. Not to say that it doesn't work, but it's not as reliable as other methods. Also jokeposts are jokeposts but that's not reason in my book to vote him.

Serela is Serela and while he hasn't said much, I wouldn't say that necessarily he is scum or anything. In other words, Dormio, there's nothing really new about Serela posting as he did.

SB needs to contribute more. All he has mentioned is RVS related stuff and yelling at me for not voting. Well excuse me, I don't have any real strong convictions yet. I'm reading a heavily null game from everyone here. The same thing with Polaris although he has showed a bit more diversity with his posts, although in both cases I would just imagine null.

Shadoweh is being Shadoweh, Dormio is being Dormio. Null on both, although I would like to see from scumreads from Dormio.

[Shadoweh]

I don't scumslip as scum. B| I don't post enough to make scumslips. And I get better sleep!

[Polaris]

Vaaaaaaaaalllllllliiiiiiiiiidoooooooooonnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnn is that all

[SB]

is polaris manix in disguise

[SB]

Validon uses too many words to say he has no real scumreads and yet he's asking me and Dormio to contribute more? What? He's also asking us over Serela who's done like nothing so yeah. Also agree with Kilga's analysis.

##Unvote
##Vote: Validon

Don't like how Darkninja is trying to draw up associative reads without a flip. Cheez wasn't the only one who thought your logic was horrible, does that make use all scum?

For what it's worth, this post bothers me enough to suspect Dormio over anybody else right now. Guess I should start bringing my opinions up sooner.
This feels like a false accusation that could be interpreted as true if you aren't paying enough attention. Seems minor, but not as minor as everything else is.
I'll mull it over while I eat, I guess.

To be fair Serela basically said that all of the votes were pointless and that everyone else got to the only "half-decent opinions" before he could. Actually thinking like that maybe he's paranoid scum who doesn't want to be seen as sheeping. Serela, specify your opinions please.

[Validon98]

Vaaaaaaaaalllllllliiiiiiiiiidoooooooooonnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnn is that all

Is that all in what way? As in my thoughts? I am honest when I say I don't have any major convictions on anything right now. I guess I didn't really say anything about the argument between Cheez and Dark, although I did mention earlier I do think Dark is being very tryhard, though I read that null.

Cut: @SB: You're right, Serela has done nothing and I would like him to contribute more as well, it's just that I went into meta mode and assumed it was just Serela being Serela. Honestly I want to see more out of anyone who hasn't really said a lot.

Also I'm probably just going to shut up now, I have nothing to add to the conversation and writing more at this point would just be me pointing out the obvious. >.<

[Serela]

Serela, specify your opinions please.

I wasn't talking about other's opinions as much as ones I could be attempting to have myself (and why I wasn't interested in any of them)

it's a kind of stupid post to make and I probably should have just waited until later, but the issue is I had made a post right before that before I seriously went through the thread >_> So I had become obligated to do something (it would have been much worse to not post afterwords!)

I'm def. gonna look through the new stuff before I go to bed though and try to create real opinions

[BT]

Votecount 1.4

Validon (2): Kilgamayan, Polaris, SB
CF7 (1): Sky_Paladin
Shadoweh (1): Dormio
PX (1): CF7
SB (1): PX
Darkninjaabc (1): Shadoweh
Dormio (0): Serela

Not Voting: (3) Darkninjaabc, Validon98, Cheez8

It's 7 votes to lynch. Deadline in 53.5 hours.
(Countdown)

[Sky_Paladin]

Well, to be honest, I thought both PX and Mirai voting for Shadoweh right off the bat was kind of suspicious.  I didn't want to vote for PX because they hosted the last game.  Mirai has been posting a lot too but it's mostly been..uh...padding the word count.  Normally I would think scum wouldn't want to get that kind of attention but behaving in a 'townlike behaviour' to try and throw off suspicion is a strategy, too. 
The votes for Shadoweh came in right at the start before anybody had really said anything, so they could easily be called joke votes.  Except Dormio's vote is still there.  Maybe they thought "Lets try and lynch a skilled player" but when there wasn't a bus, PX switched off. 

I don't know, maybe it's just a coincidence.  But it's the only semi-scum reading I've got. 

##unvote
##vote Mirai

Also, it seems Serela's vote counts for 0?  I guess we're not a democracy~

[Polaris]

@Validon: It's just disappointing that you can say so many things without voting. Is there really nobody you find suspicious?

Hopefully Cheez can also get back to us with a vote too.

I'm def. gonna look through the new stuff before I go to bed though and try to create real opinions

but Serela, by that point you will have already been torn to pieces.

[Serela]

but Serela, by that point you will have already been torn to pieces.

To my utter joy people's reactions have been "it's just serela being serela"

...I mean, meta excusing bad play would be terrible, but I think when the game's still practically in rvs it's excusable enough ;_;

Also I'm not the only one who's vote isn't counting if you look at that votecount! POLLY WHAT DO YOU THINK WE SHOULD MAKE OF THIS

[SB]

Well, to be honest, I thought both PX and Mirai voting for Shadoweh right off the bat was kind of suspicious.  I didn't want to vote for PX because they hosted the last game.  Mirai has been posting a lot too but it's mostly been..uh...padding the word count.  Normally I would think scum wouldn't want to get that kind of attention but behaving in a 'townlike behaviour' to try and throw off suspicion is a strategy, too. 
The votes for Shadoweh came in right at the start before anybody had really said anything, so they could easily be called joke votes.  Except Dormio's vote is still there.  Maybe they thought "Lets try and lynch a skilled player" but when there wasn't a bus, PX switched off. 

I don't know, maybe it's just a coincidence.  But it's the only semi-scum reading I've got. 

##unvote
##vote Mirai

Also, it seems Serela's vote counts for 0?  I guess we're not a democracy~

You don't really get a lot from RVS votes since they're usually not serious (or a crumb if there's a night 0 but there wasn't in this case) so I don't think you can really analyse that too much. 

Validon's response to accusations is to stop posting, which doesn't fly with me. Dormio should get a new vote when he's out of class.

[Validon98]

@Polaris: Okay, well looking at everyone else, PX is really one of the few people I haven't mentioned, and... not much else to say about him either. I'm in that strange state where a whole lot has been said, but nothing is blatantly scummy enough for me to pursue a vote. This is why I just want to hold off until more stuff has actually happened, then pick apart the new stuff. Until then, I don't have much else to say that isn't already obvious.

Cut: @SB: My response is to not really post anymore for now because again, not much else to say that isn't "EVERYONE IS NULL RIGHT NOW" at the moment. I'll get back to you once there's more for me to look at.

[Cheez8]

...I chose a piss-poor time to eat dinner.

And this entire exchange now that i think about it is pure weird. Cheez somehow agreed with the point that joleposting seriously is scumtell.

False. When did I do that?

Yet all that time he was basically taking what he calss "a misinterpreted and wrong argument". This paradoxical defend was what made me scratch my head ao hard. Then i assumed hes an enthusisatic scum. Who is also bouncing around wagons. Then it apl makes sense.

If anything i would really appreciate if you can first assume shadoweh is scum. Then see cheez as paranoid scum swooping in to defend him.

Oh boy. I'd be worried for myself except I'm pretty sure nobody's buying your argument that Shadoweh is scum, so this is completely invalid.

As for everything else, on the one hand I'd like to see more out of Validon but on the other hand he has a point about how much null-reading there is. How's this, Validon: What can you tell us about people who you think aren't null reads?

I've got a few people I'm deciding between, and I'll talk more about them soon but I feel like responding to this first is a good idea.

[Polaris]

@Validon: Ok but you better know that we're going to lynch you if you don't start scumhunting at some point 

@serela: obviously your vote is worth just as much as your puny existence. how does it feel to live such a miserable life ufufufu

[Cheez8]

Oh right and those votecounts are weird. Don't know whether I should be bothered by that but I'm not right now.

[Cheez8]

Alright, so there are a couple people I'm inclined to suspect more than others right now:

Validon: I really do understand how there's not much to go off of, and preferring more solid night action info, but... don't you at least have opinions, or people you take with more grains of salt than others or something? It almost seems like you're afraid to form an opinion, honestly, though I'm hoping that'll change by the time I'm finished with this post. (Nope, didn't happen yet. Too bad.)

SB: Couldn't tell you why. I guess it's because his posts seem... well, very self-assured, if I'm being perfectly honest. Not sure why that would be something I distrust, except maybe it makes me feel like people are being played or distracted from certain parts of arguments because of it. I can't really support this very well though which is a sign that SB is very good at being scum and we should lynch him now! That, or I'm barking up the wrong tree entirely.

Dark: I want to think he's a misguided townie but he just doesn't stop.

Dormio: It's still something small and I get how I could be wrong here, but bringing up a point against Serela for not having forming an opinion at a time when there generally weren't good opinions to form is a bit iffy to me. Mostly because I was basically in the same boat at that point, and seeing someone called out for that made me indignant or something.

People also seem to have opinions on Paladin but for whatever reason I can't get a good read on him.

It's not like these are very strong, but I have to start somewhere. Validon's the one I'm wariest of right now though, so I'll rest my vote on him until he says something new.

##Vote: Validon

[Kilgamayan]

Anyone wanna step up and volunteer themselves as Polaris' scumbuddy responsible for talking him into that vote turnaround? <_<

Cheez, why aren't you voting for Dormio right now?

Willing to pencil Darkninjalphabet in as town for the time being, his thought process looks genuine even if I disagree with the conclusions and then some with the justification.

"X being X" is not contributing, especially when it is used multiple times in reference to different people. Many other people have also already pointed out for me that Validon's response to my accusation that he was not saying meaningful things was to continue not saying meaningful things so I won't repeat them beyond acknowledging it here. I would keep my vote where it is EXCEPT...

I like how multiple people have fewer votes than names attached. FOR SCIENCE! ##Unvote, ##Vote: Kilgamayan

SB are you Carthrat in disguise ?_?

Cut by another Validon vote. Not sure I like it being a parrot when I wanted to see where Cheez's Dormio suspicions would go, as much as I can't disagree with Validon votes right now.

[Polaris]

Excuse you Kilga I make my own decisions.

* Polaris hairflip[/url]