Magical Madness Mafia Day 5!

[Rikter]

huh what doesn't really strike me as suspicious anymore i'll just consider those joke votes for now.

Shadoweh's aggressive playing doesn't bother me at the moment.

Chaore and Serela I'll need to go back and reread later but I don't necessarily have a good feeling about either.

As for everyone else i'll think more about that later.

[Shadoweh]

Why IS Shadoweh a leading wagon? Let's look.

Zakeri: RVS
Hero999: Because Shadoweh thinks JOB is town.
Chaore: Oh my god you suck! >:C
capt.h: Because Shadoweh is being aggressive
Youkai Jesus: Needs to learn how to bold

Forgive me for not quaking in terror. At least this is better then the Just wagon.

@Shadoweh: I like how you still believe everyone to be a suspect when you've stated before that you believe J.O.B. was town formerly, then what makes a difference in player change? J.O.B. was already a town read for you. So why do you believe capt.h to be scum now? Its funny how a difference in play style makes you believe hes scum.

He's not, he's just being capt.h. You need a sense of humor, the joke was about UK calling people who vote her scum. His reasoning is still wrong. He's actually done this to me before though, in pretty much every game we've played together as town. I actually don't know what a capt.h scum would sound like, so I'm going to trust that town read for now and see if he finds someone else legitimately being scummy.
You're still voting me. Hmm. What do you think of Bardiche and Serela right now? You questioned them earlier, did you get any satisfactory answers from it?

Youkai Jesus, I'm going to charitably assume you have no idea what you're doing and are just assuming the policy lynch Shadoweh Day 1 discussion was serious. It wasn't, and even if it was, people would expect you to be looking for the other scums as well. There's plenty of material to read through even this early, give us your opinion on who is looking and who is bullshitting. Also voting for actual scum would be great.

That other guy isn't voting anyone either. >:C RIKTER. Why did you unvote huh what in the first place? Do you think he sounds like a good guy now or did you literally unvote him because no one else joined you? Don't just go with the crowd. Vote with your townie soul! Cut with some opinions but not a vote, don't take too much time thinking about it.

Let's see, I've got townie vibes from:

3. Shadoweh
6. NeoSerela - Debatable
7. capt. J.O.B
8. huh what
9. Hero999 - Debatable
12. Bardiche

And Rikter and Jesus currently strike me as too helpless to have help, regardless of how suspicious their actions are. Leaving with:

1. Zakeri - Hasn't posted yet for reals. Zaaaak I miss you already come be adorable for me :<
5. Polaris - There's something wafer thin about your content, and I think I can put a finger on it. You said everyone that posted earlier is a town read for now, but you're probing me. You don't seem like you actually have any reads or justifications for them. I want you to tell us why everyone earlier is town. Feelings and gut come from something you can explain if you look closely.
10. Dormio - You reversed your reads, here you were attacking me for an OMGuS on Chaore while voting for Serela, while here you keep Serela and exchange me for Chaore. Do want to know why. The earlier argument about rolefishing was bad, Day 1 rolefishing helps scum make the correct kills. You've made an argument about sharing info as town before though, so I consider this part a null-tell
11. Chaore - Keyore hasn't responded since earlier. Still scum. Still want to know how my moving from a jokevote is exactly like his keeping a vote on someone he feels less suspicious of.
13. ActionDan - Didn't like his first post, wanted to see what he would say later. Second post is much more Dan-like. My current problem with you is it feels like you're lurking. This is not a Dan-like state of being. You said your post with the case on Polaris is the introductory to a larger post, so where the heck is it? It doesn't take 24 hours to compile reads.

The problem with these reads is looking at the votes, all of my current suspects other then Chaore are attacking each other, so it's unlikely they're all scum together. Somewhere there's an error. Will figure it out with more input.

[ActionDan]

13. ActionDan - Didn't like his first post, wanted to see what he would say later. Second post is much more Dan-like. My current problem with you is it feels like you're lurking. This is not a Dan-like state of being. You said your post with the case on Polaris is the introductory to a larger post, so where the heck is it? It doesn't take 24 hours to compile reads.

Please hold on for a bit.  I'm starting to type it up now, after I did a through re-read this morning.  It will take at least an hour, probably two, and maybe three.   Last night I waited to try and play a game of dots and dota, the latter of which never happened  .   

[PX]

"I'm sure that meeting was just a coincidence. But if you layer an endless amount of coincidences on top of one another...
...I'm sure people pick one at random, and that becomes the path they travel."

Henshin a Go Go Baby! The Seventh Votecount!
Shadoweh (5) - Zakeri, Hero999, Chaore, capt. h, Youkai Jesus
Chaore (2) - Shadoweh, Bardiche
Dormio (0) - huh what
ActionDan (2) - NeoSerela, Polaris
NeoSerela (1) - Dormio
Polaris (1) - ActionDan
Youkai Jesus (1) - huh what

Shadoweh is at L-2!
Not voting: Rikter
With 13 Alive, it takes 7 to lynch.
Day 1 ends in ~37.5 hours.

Here is your friendly reminder to NOT EDIT POSTS. There will be no more warnings.
Zakeri has been Prodded

[Chaore]

@Shadoweh: ? But... That's you trying to interpret my jokevote as a serious vote? No, literally you're only trying to make it different by making it seem like I had serious concerns on j.o.b.- If I did, I would be saying 'You're scummy because you're doing this' not 'Get your act together and start actually playing mafia, thanks'. You stuck to that jokevote despite voicing concerns and reads because you weren't certain enough to vote anyone, and I did the same- Yet you're voting me for it. This is why Bard is voting me, even. How did you make this mistake?

Tossing out meaningless townie reads you seem easily willing to toss aside at a moment's notice once you see a chance to get a vote is actually pretty scummy to me, even if you stress 'flexibility'. No, not all town reads need to be absolute, but you seemed too willing to dispose of them to me. And you demonstrated by instantly turning on me the moment I made a small misstep to town and didn't immediately vote you.

@Bard:

<Chaore> @8ball Does bard have a sense of humor?
<Chaore> ...
<Chaore> Keine?
<Keine-tan> I'm sorry, that was a serious question?

Your reading comprehension skills seemed to have stayed contact, I see. What I'm saying is that I speak harsher than I actually think. I wasn't actually 'TEN SECONDS FROM PUNCHING SHADOWEH TO THE MOON' but more going 'Okay, this is wrong, I want to see what Shadoweh has to say on this being wrong'. Maybe I just think a step behind you, but I want the answer before I throw the vote, or else I end up throwing my vote all around like a fish out of the sea.

@Capt h.: In #104 you say you dislike that Shadoweh is throwing attacks in every direction, but... You're actually kinda doing the same, having claimed Serela, Polaris, ActionDan, Huhwhat all 'suspicious' with small things and not following up. Why is your random fire method better?

At that, you admonish Shadoweh for her use of 'UK Hydra', yet I've brought Keine into every one of my posts and you've not said a thing about that, or about me in general, why am I different than Shadoweh or why am I not, and why did you think this was not worth note?

[ActionDan]

I feel we are entering a state of disarray.  Let's to try to straighten things out here.

I've done a complete reread.   Zakeri, Rikter, and Youkai Jesus have decided to be useless, and I'm ignoring their actions and people's actions concerning them.

Out of the rest, I have town reads on Chaore/Bard/Hero/Dormio  from strongest to weakest.

HuhWhat/Serela/Polaris/Shadoweh are scummy/suspicious although I have no clear favorite. 

I'm having trouble figuring out Capt.h, but I did a spittake.jpg when after calling out polaris, Capt.h calls me out using the exact same reasons as Polaris, whom Capt.h just criticized because Capt.h could not follow Polaris' said reasons for voting me.   Just tell me if I am understanding this correctly, and if you like or dislike Polaris still.

First things first.  Chaore, I did not have the slightest clue that you were referring to mass shadoweh votes  with the "edit."  I assumed people saw HW voting three times.  As for the "RVS vote with RNG," I maintain that it's bad practice, and was something I agreed with Dormio on, specifically this sentence:

The RVS stage may give town very little information, but deciding your RVS vote via. RNG denies town even that little piece of information.

I would not have voted you for that alone (but it doesn't bother me that Dormio did), although I did sour at the big text box.  So yes, an "unintentional misrep" it was.  Your posts afterwards are more than enough for a town read on you.

Shadoweh, your up first:  Your #36 has a few things I didn't like.    You mention Dormio and Dormio's vote but you do not give an opinion on Dormio himself.  The entire paragraph on Dormio looks like chaff, because I don't learn a thing from it, other than 'Dormio is weird' for thinking like a MSer... which means nothing, even though later you claim that Dormio is suspcious.  The question to JOB is useless and more filler, considering you think he's town regardless, so the question shouldn't lead you to a different conclusion.   If were to follow your own logic; "My observation while being scum is that townies aren't actually that hard to find if you stop being suspicious of every small twitch they do and just use simplicity to look at their actions."  you might have been satisfied JOB's simplicity and be done with it especially since Hero999 later expressed the same opinion as JOB and it was obviously satisfactory, in that there was no need to question him about nulltells .  The main thing though is the question to HW about what he thought was bad about Chaore's post while not commenting on what I had to say.  Why bother asking the question if you don't care about the possible answer?  This is why I think your posts are not genuine and why I have a town read on Chaore (although his case diverges from mine here, after the "why you ignore dan" part).

Jeez this is taking forever.  I'm gonna steamline this from now on.

This post has a huge glaring problem.  So you realize that HuhWhat is inconsistent.  Yet, you are only concerned about what he does with his vote, not whether he's scum or not based on A) his answer to your previous question or B) the apparent inconsistency.

clarify:did I read this right? You said Chaore was obvtown or did you mean to put another name there?

Actually eff it.  I've spent 4 hours making this post re-reading this game 5 times over.  I can't resist the gratification to post this.  Opinions on HW/Serela/Polaris forthcoming.

[ActionDan]

@Shadoweh: ? But... That's you trying to interpret my jokevote as a serious vote? No, literally you're only trying to make it different by making it seem like I had serious concerns on j.o.b.- If I did, I would be saying 'You're scummy because you're doing this' not 'Get your act together and start actually playing mafia, thanks'. You stuck to that jokevote despite voicing concerns and reads because you weren't certain enough to vote anyone, and I did the same- Yet you're voting me for it. This is why Bard is voting me, even. How did you make this mistake?

This is precisely what I think about the "Chaore is scum b/c he didn't switch votes."  Expect I think Bard looks a lot more town even though Bard and Shadoweh share this particular argument.

[GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em]

##Unvote
##Vote Youkai Jesus

[GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em]

I still think we should be looking into the people who have less presence (although this is not an attempt to propagate D1 LALu, before somebody tries to twist my words into that).

I disagree that YJ's posts look like they're coming from somebody who has no buddies. There's not enough content to actually be read into at this point. However, I think her choice to jokevote on a decently-sized wagon when serious discussion is going on has scum intent, because she's pushing for a lynch while trying to avoid attention. Even her jokevote being on a "policy lynch" makes it seems like she's trying to blend in with the rest of the crowd. Newbie passes are silly, and on a related note, Rikter would do well to post some scum reads instead of town reads. Newbscum have an easier time generating posts about who they think is town, so I don't think we should ignore the possibility of him as scum before he actually talks about who he thinks is scum and why.

Polly irks me because he seems to be sitting on minimal content while not actually engaging in any of the active discussions unless somebody prods him for opinions. As a result, he looks rather passive. Additionally, his main case looks more like a question to Dan rather than a reason for finding Dan scummy, so it'd be nice if he could restate it, as well as explain why he currently thinks that Dan is the best target for a lynch.

I agree that Shadoweh borders into fluffy territory sometimes, but I don't think it's a scummy kind of padding so much as her general personality, and I still think her wagon is awful. However, I do get the impression that a lot of the votes on her come from flailing townies rather than opportunistic scum. Hero and capt. h should restate their cases and explain their priorities, because their reasons for voting are rather weak.

I want to hear from Bard now that more people have posted. He earlier acted as if he had narrowed his targets down to two people, back when half the playerbase hadn't even made serious posts. Does he still think that Chaore and Serela are the only people he wants lynched? I think that narrowing down one's suspects so soon is a bad idea, as it makes it easier for the discluded scum to survive.

I haven't forgotten about Dormio, but it's hard to actually press him due to timezones, and I'm more interested in YJ right now.

[capt. h]

In response to Chaore, if I were to name a difference between her random fire method and mine it would be that while hers has a great deal of interrogation in it, it's very disconnected from her scum picks. While she did make a case on Chaore, her interactions with other players made it hard to guage whether or not she thought any other player she talked to was scummy or suspicious. At the time she first named her scum picks, she didn't really provide arguments and named 5 people (plus the newbs):

Does it look like I'm not scumhunting, or that I'm hydraing with UK today? >_>
According to my rules of the Three Scummies, the obvtown would be Chaore (ignore the huge wagon) or huh what, the obvscum would be let's say Dormio or Dan, and the third lurkerscum would be one of those people who have only posted once, like the newbs or Zakeri. Hence why I'm questioning them, so they have something to answer when they come around.

Haha, I don't take long to think when I'm not making stuff up. <.<

 Lots of attacks and interrogations everywhere, very little clear on whether she thought they were scum and why until her last post, where she created a list of 5 "not townie vibes". 5 players she reached by eliminating the townies from consideration. In retrospect, I guess her play would be explained by her hunting for townies rather than hunting for scum, since she typically referred to players based on "town cred" rather than in the context of "scummy". It's still bad, because scum are much better at finding townies than town since they already know who town is, although I admit UK does admit to hunting townies instead of scum on day 1.



Shadoweh's usage of her fake UK hydra is much more scummy than Chaore's use of Keine. Shadoweh used it as a justification for her play, for one. She also used it to add thoughts on players that we normally would not be able to attribute to her because they came from "UK":

UK, quiet, we can't change our vote to Dormio just because he's hating on us. No, not even because he didn't banter with us about voting blocks, we don't know if he would be all serious buisness as scum! Yep, still got a town read on JOB. Doesn't mean I like him any more then usual. I didn't say I think Dan is town, you want a punch in the nose? The part about arguing for the sake of arguing applies to Rikter, not JOB. You're not reading me very closely.

Now Chaore, if you started posting Keine's reads in the thread I would find you to be scummy. But you haven't, nor are you using your hydra as a justification for your play.

[capt. h]

EBWOP:

While she did make a case on Chaore, her interactions with other players made it hard to guage whether or not she thought any other player she talked to was scummy or suspicious. And when she finally did first name her scum picks, she didn't really provide arguments and named 5 people (plus the newbs):

[Dormio Ergo Sum]

@Youkai Jesus #113: Do NOT edit your posts.

So when I say I'll post again soon I shouldn't underestimate what RtD does to my brain.

@Shadoweh #121: So, uh, I dropped a case on you because it didn't make sense to myself when I was trying to make it at the time. This is reversing my reads, how? Also, I like how you word it as though in my #85 I did not mention Serela at all before voting for him.
@Hero999 #116: I call misrep on the part about me only defending myself.
Anyway.
Dislike the people with low content, but whatever. Forgetting that certain players are even in the game. Oh well.
Dislike Shadoweh. Dislike Serela.

Still hate Shadoweh's #50. It still reads like an OMGUS to me, and she refused to really address ActionDan either. She later says that the fact that she ignored ActionDan and was not voting for him should tell us that she believed him to be town. But, when she has given reasoning for all of her other reads, why did she fail to mention ActionDan?
For what Shadoweh said about trying to create a learning experience for the newbs, she sure isn't being newb friendly in her #121. She says that she dislikes Dan's first post, and calls his second post "much more Dan-like" as well as disliking him for being in a "not Dan-like state of being". For someone who wanted to help newbs learn how to argue and such and is giving every newb a newbie town pass, using meta arguments like the one against Dan sure does seem to contradict your intentions.

Dropping case on Chaore, don't really have anything against him.

Serela defending Chaore is still a thing I dislike.


Also, @mod:

<10> When you die, stop posting. You may make a single "Bah!"/"Frak you!"/etc. post in the thread. You may not include game content in this post. In addition, once you are dead, please do not discuss the game with anyone other than the Mod until the game is over, as this makes the mod's life easier.
<16>  Any rules after this one takes priority over other rules, other than Rule 0.
<17> Dead people may post during the day, but not vote.

Are there any limitations on what the dead may post?

[PX]

NeoSerela has been prodded. No change in votes, proceed as normal.

[capt. h]

Dormio, it would be far easier to read your posts if instead of only referencing the post number you wish to mention, you posted a link to the post or a quote of the part of the post you disliked. If I understand correctly, your current point on Shadoweh is that she ignored Dan earlier in the game, and then came back using meta on Dan?

And if I understand correctly, the reason you are voting NeoSerela is because he defended Chaore and because he told you role speculation is bad.

##Unvote
##Vote Dormio

At first I was willing to dismiss the role speculation as bad play, but frankly, you talk more about why Shadoweh is scum than your primary lynch target, who you are voting for partially because he said that role speculation is bad. Role speculation is bad. I'm confused why you think NeoSerela is worse than Shadoweh, considering how much more evidence your Shaodweh cases contain.

Don't like how Dan kind of left us hanging. 4 equally bad scum picks is too many, and if they're equal he has the flexibility to switch on a dime when whe finally does get back. I'd like him to decide which his picks (Huh What, Shadoweh, NeoSerela, and Polaris) is worst. He needs to show his hand; the sooner, the better, cause it's getting close to time to make the wagons.

[Serela]

I'm baaaaack. Did'ja miss me?

Youkai Jesus:You know that stuff Shadoweh said about you in #162? Yeah that's basically my opinion on Jesus, too.

Rikter is being ;_; because he's incredibly unhelpful regardless of whether he's town or scum. Zak doesn't exist, which is sadly standard Zak play, but still ;_;

Huhwhat's posts are coming off as town and scum read at the same time. It's making me realize that due to all the games I've missed (and Huhwhat seeming to die fast pretty often), I actually don't know what Huhwhat meta is at all, because that would probably fix my problem here. Maybe I should go imitate Shadoweh and read every single game Huhwhat's been in. To be honest, I'm never going to get around to doing that, so instead I'm going to wait for my brain to make sense before deciding on whattles.

Capt.h, regardless of how much you might want it to be, Shadoweh doing shenanigans roleplaying about being a hydra with UK is not something that's scummy (Maybe if she had been seriously suggesting she was, but PX said hydras were banned anyway). Not saying that the rest of your case is bad, though. I actually don't remember what it is, anyway.

I'm starting to feel like Dan is being Dan (Wait, but I don't know Dan meta either. Fuck.) okay nevermind lets just move onto talking about someone else entirely. Also
##unvote
There's just something about Dormio that's wrong. I can't pinpoint it. Not even vaguely pinpoint like I did with Bremm last game. It's just lots of little details based on other little details that build up into a scum read but aren't really things that can be put into words without not looking like a case, at all.

...actually, wait a second, now I don't know who to vote :c They're all lurkies or people I'm unsure about or Dormio.

...okay, after rereading again, Dormio is still the only person who I feel good about voting right now :c
##Vote:Dormio

(This post is bad and I feel bad)
oh cut by capth WHY ARE YOU NINJAING ME ON WANTING TO VOTE DORMIO

[Shadoweh]

Chaore, when you post a bunch of paragraphs on other people, along with something like this:

@J.O.B.: Please stop following people blatantly. I've entirely answered you by responding to Dan. I should never be able to do that. You're no longer a newbie. Act like it.

About the person you're currently voting, it's generally assumed you are not in fact jokevoting anymore and have moved your vote to srs time.  Are you honestly trying to tell me this didn't sound like you had legitimate suspicion of him? But okay, let's play it your way. My reason was I wasn't sure who to choose yet. You had a pretty obvious choice. Why'd you wait? I don't think it's a small misstep to say you look like you're waiting to see which way the winds blow especially since I'm pretty sure I caught you doing this before. My townie reads are not meaningless and if you're curious I can justify every one. (last time I tried this though I had Yuan and Iffrita as obvtown >.> )

Incidentally people compared me to UK long before we ever talked. You guys are too used to me hugging you until you forget I exist. Today is WAKEUP TOWNIES Day. It's kind of insulting that you won't vote me for Days when I'm scum coasting by, but the minute I'm town in your face you all actually want to lynch me.. oh god. This is turning into IRC Mafia @_@

Answering Dan's post here. Dan, you have a town read on Chaore because I'm attacking him? Or because he has a good case on me? Facepalm worthy. Saying Dormio is weird means I don't think he's thinking like Dormio. Considering I wasn't sure enough in post 36 to vote anyone you shouldn't be surprised my thoughts are inconclusive. And I always question my reads. The only way to verify someone is still acting like you thought they were is to poke at them. How does huh what's opinion on Chaore correlate to me pretending to ignore you? These two things have nothing to do with each other.

Uh, by post 59 I thought huh what was town and I was asking him why he didn't understand my case. So you're right, I wasn't trying to determine if he was scum. I think huh whatty in general gets confused easily.

No Dan, you're reading that correctly. There are always three Scum, one that looks like obvtown, one that looks like obvscum, and one that lurks off the radar somewhere in neutral territory. I'm saying Chaore is the Obvtown Scum.

Oh great, so everything else is still something you'll Get To Later. How do you expect me to feel about you after that, Dan? I'm just going to keep an eye on you for now. I can't say what I think about your MISREPOMGKILLITWITHFIRE post will be unbiased at this point.


Hey speaking of people who are trying to make me biased against their posts, capt.h. You can attribute all those thoughts to me, you silly duck. I don't have multiple personality syndrome. Scum are better at finding townies and I've been stuck as scum for freaking ever, so I'm trying to use the same logic to find scum through Process of Elimination. I imagine UK would tell you she hunts townies for a reason. And it is usually obvious who certain townies are. (Is anyone ever surprised by the Night 1 kill?) I'm not really hunting for town. By questioning everyone I'm going to get back more town answers just because there are more town then scum. Mmm, you're still town though. Who are my partners and will you bus one of them with me instead?

huh what keeps saying alot of what I'm thinking, besides the newbies. I don't think if Jesus had buddies that they would allow him to derp his way onto the main wagon, is the thing. A wagon on Polly sounds like a grand idea though. I'm feeling less inclined to knock out Chaore when he's got decent content to look over later. And considering the easiest way to avoid the Day 1 lynch is to just say nothing Day 1, I have no problem with LAL any time of the day. I think we're way too soft with the lurkers at this point, it's become a bad MOTK habit.

Still hate Shadoweh's #50. It still reads like an OMGUS to me, and she refused to really address ActionDan either. She later says that the fact that she ignored ActionDan and was not voting for him should tell us that she believed him to be town. But, when she has given reasoning for all of her other reads, why did she fail to mention ActionDan?

No, I didn't. I said I found his post null and wanted to wait to see what else he posted. Find me somewhere I said Dan was town. It does not exist.

For what Shadoweh said about trying to create a learning experience for the newbs, she sure isn't being newb friendly in her #121.

The part where I dismiss them for obviously not having any help posting? My opinion is still that they need to learn to post reads to convince people not to lynch them. My questions are more for their benefit then my own.

She says that she dislikes Dan's first post, and calls his second post "much more Dan-like" as well as disliking him for being in a "not Dan-like state of being". For someone who wanted to help newbs learn how to argue and such and is giving every newb a newbie town pass, using meta arguments like the one against Dan sure does seem to contradict your intentions.

When Dan posts I expect a certain level of pro-townness from him, the kind that made me want to shoot him in the face every time he spoke for the last two games. What are you even accusing me of here? Yes, I said that, do you find it scummy and why? You're just reporting my actions and demonizing me, and you're not even reporting me truthfully. Oh, and you're voting Serela.

Cut by a few votes the Dormio way! Wow does the time fly by. I wouldn't mind joining if this wagon takes off, or going back to Chaore if people stop drinking the koolaid, but I'd still rather vote for Polaris. I recall he has trouble making things up as scum and he might as well not exist right now. Sliding by is a scum trait.

##Unvote
##Vote: Polaris

[GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em]

No Dan, you're reading that correctly. There are always three Scum, one that looks like obvtown, one that looks like obvscum, and one that lurks off the radar somewhere in neutral territory. I'm saying Chaore is the Obvtown Scum.

Ugh, this is bad theory. If the scum team actually fits into a mold, then that's bad play on their part, because it makes them more predictable and easier to find. Scum wants to be obvtown, obvtown and obvtown, not to fit into some specific set. Assuming that scum are playing poorly is a good way to get steamrolled by underestimating them. Good counterexamples would be GDC (where both scum were lurkers), CotA (where all scum were obvtown-ish until they got outed by PRs), and Werewolf (where no scum fit into any archetype, although Zak was obvscum if you ask UK).

I don't think if Jesus had buddies that they would allow him to derp his way onto the main wagon, is the thing.

We don't know what's going on in the scum quicktopic. It's entirely possible that newbscum would post something silly earlygame without consulting their buddies due to a mistake, or post in the thread before checking to see what their buddies have to say.

Also, why Polly instead of Dormio? You seem to have more reasons to suspect Dormio from your post, but I can't tell if you think he's scum or just think he's silly. Personally, I wouldn't mind either lynch (though Dormio looks worse than Polly), but still find YJ's behavior to be unsettling and feel the need to hear more from them before considering any other wagons.

[GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em]

... Oh wow, I just realized I somehow skipped Dormio's post. <_< That explains a lot about what Shadoweh was responding to.

Dormio, why are you cheerleading the main wagon while parking your vote on Serela, who you have a significantly weaker case on anyway? That's awful, especially given that the Shadoweh wagon itself is rather shaky (not going to lie, capt. h's case seems really silly to me, as if he's reading into meta and jokes too much. Still want to hear from Hero though).

[Polaris]

Can I just pull the "cases on town are scummy" card lol whatever :L

huh what and Serela were cool because their posts flow well and don't feel forced or scum-motivated and are agreeable in general. I think Chaore vs. Shadoweh is a town-town argument?Shadoweh's vote makes sense from her point of view, but as an observer I think that there was a small case of misinterpretation or something. It's also partially gut, which I can't elaborate too well, but that was why I was "probing" (as Shadoweh puts it) because I thought I was missing something.  Bard is a little iffy because I don't really like his vote on Chaore (something I actually overlooked the first time), so I'll reconsider and look over him again. Hero999 is trying, which is pretty town for (if I am not mistaken) a relatively new player.

As for Dan, I'm still waiting on his response to me. My initial vote on him was just pressing him because of his reactions that I found to be strange. Also his pseudo-case on Shadoweh is a little weak (in that I don't particularly see how anything he mentions makes Shadoweh look scummy) so I'm a little annoyed at how he hasn't elaborated on his other scumpicks (that is to say, "leaving us hanging", as capt. h nicely puts it). Also I don't like how everyone just gives Dan, like, a pseudo-meta-clear or something. :L

I've already mentioned Dormio earlier and nothing has really changed although I do want him to restate his case on Serela because I'm joining capt. h on the "why are you voting him again" thing. :L

Lurkers aaaaaaaaaaa

cut: wow Shadoweh way to cut me with a vote for "not posting" as I was making a post jeez

[GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em]

Oh wait.

Dislike the people with low content, but whatever. Forgetting that certain players are even in the game. Oh well.

<_____<
This is the worst throwaway line ever.

##Unvote
##Vote Dormio

Congrats, you're worse than YJ again.

cut

[PX]

I am the bone of my sword
Steel is my body, and fire is my blood
I have created over a thousand blades
Unaware of loss, nor away of gain
Withstood pain to create weapons, waiting for one's arrival
I have no regrets. This is the only path
My whole life was Unlimited Blade Works

The Eighth Servant! Gilgamesh Votecount!
Shadoweh (3) - Zakeri, Hero999, Chaore, capt. h
Chaore (1) - Shadoweh, Bardiche
Dormio (3) - capt. h, NeoSerela, huh what
ActionDan (1) - NeoSerela, Polaris
NeoSerela (1) - Dormio
Polaris (2) - ActionDan, Shadoweh
Youkai Jesus (0) - huh what

Not voting: Youkai Jesus, Rikter
With 13 Alive, it takes 7 to lynch.
Day 1 ends in ~27.5 hours.

[GMOFucker: Makin' GMOs To Fuck 'Em]

I didn't realize we had so little time left. I find it kind of irritating that no real apparent lynch targets have appeared at this point in the day. We had better actually get our asses in gear and get a majority on somebody, otherwise I will be greatly displeased.

[Shadoweh]

I'm here, not much has changed. I know, why aren't there good targets when Polar is right there saying things like:

huh what and Serela were cool because their posts flow well and don't feel forced or scum-motivated and are agreeable in general. I think Chaore vs. Shadoweh is a town-town argument?Shadoweh's vote makes sense from her point of view, but as an observer I think that there was a small case of misinterpretation or something.

Their posts flow well and they don't feel forced and stuff and what the hell is this. And the 'misinterpretation or something'. As an observer, could you tell us where you saw this misinterpretation or explain where you got any of this fronm your point of view at all? These aren't really opinions you can be held to because it's unclear how you got to them.

Lurkers aaaaaaaaaaa

The pot should not wave accusingly at the kettle.

This is a majority lynch game, isn't it? Yeah it is. I'll be here to move to Dormio if need be, but I want to see more pressure on el Waffle Capitan here. And less on me, you silly scum.

[Polaris]

Jeez reached computer curfew and now I can only respond by phoneposting. Shadoweh, I'm terribly sorry that my ED1 town cases didn't totally blow you away but you can't expect me to write essays for everybody. I'll respond as best as I can tomorrow. >_>

[capt. h]

Rikter, Zakari, and Youkai Jesus -

I want 3 new votes, one from each of you, on the players you think are scum. It would be very bad if we were forced to fold because there weren't enough active voters to reach a majority.


Polaris -

Are you pressure-voting Dan, or are you voting Dan because you think he's the scummy?

And for that matter, you said Dormio was awkward, but you never said it was scummy. Do you find Dormio scummy?

Who do you think is scum?

[capt. h]

EBWOP:

Polaris -

Are you pressure-voting Dan, or are you voting Dan because you think he's the scummiest?

[Shadoweh]

I messed up the tags on that post so hard ;_;
Polaris, I'm not having any trouble writing essays myself. So maybe I do have those kinds of standards. @_@
I forgot those guys still weren't voting. Come on newbies help us make a wagon on some scum!

[WHMZakeri]

Alright, jokes are off the counter.
##Unvote: Shadoweh

Bardiche's case on HW was terrible, and his (admittedly not-so-) sudden jump onto the Chaore wagon accents this as scummy. the case is tailor made to attack HW for following a nulltell meta. Not only that, but I'm positive HW had to use this very same argument as town in a previous game as well (Too lazy to read through a dozen games to check) .  I also disagree with the case on a fundamental level, since HW's way of writing, to me, has less to do with subliminal messaging, and more to do with the Critical Thinker's attempt to keeping statements accurate. As I've said before, absolutes are always wrong.
I also have Bardiche down as the bullheaded type, so the fact that he backed down immediately sends me warning signals. The leap onto the Chaore wagons seems like he's realized his case on HW wouldn't fly, and leaped onto a safe wagon.

Shadoweh's Scumteams theory on page 2 (I like to use 50 posts per page, since it makes games seem shorter) strikes me with horror. The fact that this is the way she took it with the name three scum quip also worries me greatly considering she was the one who used it on Serela first. I don't feel like going into why mentioning scum teams before scumflips are bad. I also don't like how Bard and Hero suddenly give Serela flak for her's top three scum picks. It feels like Shadoweh and Friends are just trying to distract town with the manuver, and picking on Serela as a result. Not only that, but the amount of buddying between Bard and Shadoweh reminds me of that one game of Assassin that Dormio won when the Quicklynch on Shadoweh failed due to being the King.

Also, I really hate how she gave JOB a clear, but then said Capt H turned into scum. You gave JOB a clear for being Useless Town, right? What changed with Capt H, other than the fact that he dropped the useless part?

Regarding Polaris vs. Dan, I don't see anything wrong with Dan's logic regarding Polaris. On top of that, Polaris seems kind of avoidy, and I can't figure out what he's trying to blame on Dan.

Dormio's posts are incredible hard to read. I had to reread the post where he voted NeoSerela, because I couldn't even see the part where he stopped talking about why Shadoweh was worthy of a vote. Could you please clearify why you're voting for NeoSerela again?

still want to vote Shadoweh. I'd be okay with a Dormio or Polaris Lynch. I doubt I could drum up a wagon on Bardiche, since Hero was the only other person to even look in his direction. not willing to vote Chaore since he feels like Scum's intended mislynch.
##Vote: Shadoweh

[Shadoweh]

Hooray, Zak posted! Now he can get onto a real wagon and.. oh. It's gonna be that way, huh?

Shadoweh's Scumteams theory on page 2 (I like to use 50 posts per page, since it makes games seem shorter) strikes me with horror.

Why?

The fact that this is the way she took it with the name three scum quip also worries me greatly considering she was the one who used it on Serela first.

..Why? I never pursued Serela over this.

I don't feel like going into why mentioning scum teams before scumflips are bad.

-.- No, if you're going to vote me over this you better come back here and tell me what the hell you're thinking, Zak. Shadoweh and Friends? You don't like me bringing up a scum team, but you're calling me scum with Bard and Hero and even assigning me blame for their actions. Actions which I don't support, picking on Serela is like kicking a puppy.

Not only that, but the amount of buddying between Bard and Shadoweh reminds me of that one game of Assassin that Dormio won when the Quicklynch on Shadoweh failed due to being the King.

You mean the time everyone knew I was confirmed town but started a wagon on me anyway? Good analogy.

Also, I really hate how she gave JOB a clear, but then said Capt H turned into scum. You gave JOB a clear for being Useless Town, right? What changed with Capt H, other than the fact that he dropped the useless part?

I clarified this here. I'll even quote the relevant part for you.

He's not, he's just being capt.h. You need a sense of humor, the joke was about UK calling people who vote her scum. His reasoning is still wrong. He's actually done this to me before though, in pretty much every game we've played together as town. I actually don't know what a capt.h scum would sound like, so I'm going to trust that town read for now and see if he finds someone else legitimately being scummy.

My obvbuddy Hero made the same misconception. Actually it sounds like you're okay with Hero later, did you forget you had a suspicion of him? I don't like how you made the exact same serious read as him, especially since it's something I'd already answered.

You even want to lynch the same wagons as me, you realize if I'm scum that would make both Dormio and Polaris town right? I'm not even going to look again at wanting to make a Bard wagon, hands off my waifu. Your reads are the three most likely people to gain a wagon. Can we make an 11th hour wagon on Zakeri? Holy hell I finally understand why all the townies jumped on Pamela. Okay, seperate plan. Come bus my buddies with me Zakky-chan. Then you'll have time to make a ~*second*~ post and we can pretend this one never happened.

[Shadoweh]

Actually thinking on it, looking at my two choices and the Tree Stump rule, I'd rather clear up suspicion on Dormio then Polaris. I have faith Dormio would be more useful as a confirmed town. Chaore would be even better but apparently I've put a pox on lynching him today. -.-That doesn't change that I'd prefer to send Polaris to hell on a scumminess standard first though, but I'm surprised no one else has pondered this.